Marvel DeMatteis Word of God Revision

[Robo432343]

This isn't about tiers tho. It more of if we can use WOG as one of the requirements in addition to the comics

Yes, and using WOG leads to that king of tiering. Its a domino affect

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

As Excel said, this thread isn't about tiering. It's about determining if the WoG can be used so I can do an actual Tier thread sometime in the not so distant (maybe a few days to a week at most) future. No matter what Tier 1 is a thing if that was a concern. Like, even with barebones assumptions Tier 1 is legit. There are also still DeMatteis' Comics I still need to read through to ensure I'm not missing anything that'd drastically change everything (like that one description of Avatar Eternity I almost missed where he's described as completely beyond all dualities & concepts to the point he's actively refers to them as limitations, but unsure exactly what that results in due to FAQ Rulings and such).

 

[Excellence616]

Bump

 

[Excellence616]

Bump

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, I also much prefer to only scale from in-story information, especially given that DeMatteis does not actually own Marvel Comics as a whole.

Well,I still maintain the above viewpoint.

 

[Excellence616]

Bump

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Seems to me like the WoG statement got rejected.

 

[Excellence616]

Seems to me like the WoG statement got rejected.

Yes, I also much prefer to only scale from in-story information,

Fact is that as long as the WoG doesn't go against the DeMatties style of work i don't see anything there to reject.

especially given that DeMatteis does not actually own Marvel Comics as a whole.

Yes but He still wrote for Marvel. Different authors has their different styles of writing especially when it comes to things like concepts of Gods, Cosmology etc.

 

[Excellence616]

Bump

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I think that our current long-term plan is to separate Marvel Comics cosmology by eras rather than by authors, but if somebody can figure out a workable and sensible way to separate it by the most prominent authors instead, feel free to send me a private message.

 

[Gasper]

Bump

 

[Excellence616]

Bump

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

There should be a Cosmology split here. There shouldn't a reason to conclude how Matteis interprets God to match anything of Marvel.

So saying it's an aspect of TOAA is very contradictory to that idea. This Nexus is written differently from the Nexus of Reality. I think a split is somewhat necessary. That's my two cent.

 

[Excellence616]

There should be a Cosmology split here. There shouldn't a reason to conclude how Matteis interprets God to match anything of Marvel.

So saying it's an aspect of TOAA is very contradictory to that idea. This Nexus is written differently from the Nexus of Reality. I think a split is somewhat necessary. That's my two cent.

This will handle part of the split. Every writer has their own interpretation of God.

 

[Excellence616]

Bump

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

You can argue and it's very heavily implied if not blatantly obvious that all his interpretations of God from all his comics are intended to be one and the same. I was tempted to go that route since it's extremely simple but crossscaling is a mother so I didn't want to try.

 

[Antvasima]

The problem is that we cannot split off DeMatteis alone. We would have to identify the main cosmologies established by different writers within Marvel, including Mark Gruenwald and Al Ewing, and then split off each of them into a separate cosmology after performing the necessary research.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

If we are doing it by Writer than DeMatteis being his own thing, with his own interpretation of God supported by his own works, both Word of God , Interviews, and in comics, then there really shouldn't be a problem then. It's not like I'm trying to say it applies to all of Marvel. It only applies to his works, which is consistent only if you don't try to blend his ideas with other writers.

 

[Antvasima]

But other Marvel Comics writers likely also built cosmologies that do not truly fit with each other in terms of scale or nature.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

But other Marvel Comics writers likely also built cosmologies that do not truly fit with each other in terms of scale or nature.

The problem is for the most part they add from previous understanding. Al Ewing almost set the standards for Cosmology. Matteis's writing is nearly different and essentially makes his own canon.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I think that a project that involves myself needs to be done to investigate if the Gruenwald and Hickman/Ewing cosmologies truly fit with each other, for example.

 

[Excellence616]

But other Marvel Comics writers likely also built cosmologies that do not truly fit with each other in terms of scale or nature.

That's the reason for the split because different ideals and cosmologies

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, I agree in theory. I just think that we should set up a structure for at least splitting into Gruenwald, DeMatteis, and Ewing/Hickman cosmologies, rather than focus on one of them alone, before we begin.

 

[Excellence616]

bump

 

[Excellence616]

Yes, I agree in theory. I just think that we should set up a structure for at least splitting into Gruenwald, DeMatteis, and Ewing/Hickman cosmologies, rather than focus on one of them alone, before we begin.

Agreed, it's better that way. We should do the splitting based on Writers ideas rather than Year

 

[Excellence616]

Bump

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Hm so it seems our views on what exactly to do aren't entirely disproportionate. Honestly depending on what happens it either makes what I'm doing easier or just adding a few extra steps. If adding it into another era is the way to go I just have to add whatever Era is wrapped up with DeMatteis' Cosmology and edit some reasonings. If we do separate it by which cosmologies/stories fit better into their own sections then I already did a lot of the legwork (aside from reading a few Spider-Man DeMatteis Comics which I'm unsure would change anything but would be shocked beyond belief if it does)

 

[Excellence616]

Hm so it seems our views on what exactly to do aren't entirely disproportionate. Honestly depending on what happens it either makes what I'm doing easier or just adding a few extra steps. If adding it into another era is the way to go I just have to add whatever Era is wrapped up with DeMatteis' Cosmology and edit some reasonings. If we do separate it by which cosmologies/stories fit better into their own sections then I already did a lot of the legwork (aside from reading a few Spider-Man DeMatteis Comics which I'm unsure would change anything but would be shocked beyond belief if it does)

Cosmology based on Writers ideas rather than Era will be better and easier

 

[Antvasima]

Agreed, it's better that way. We should do the splitting based on Writers ideas rather than Year

It seems more accurate, yes, but it will require lots of preparation work.

 

[Excellence616]

It seems more accurate, yes, but it will require lots of preparation work.

Exactly

 

[Antvasima]

So do we have any volunteers for initiating such a project?

 

[Excellence616]

bump

 

[Antvasima]

So do we have any volunteers for initiating such a project?

@Eficiente @Qawsedf234 @SuperAPM @Firestorm808 @EmperorRorepmeTwo @Ehnkr2beboh @Elizio33 @MarvelFanatic119 @catzlaflame @Lightning_XXI @Deagonx @Vasco @Eseseso @Marvel_Champion_07 @LuciferX @Excel616 @Immortalgodd @LephyrTheRevanchist @ByAsura

Would any of you be interested in helping out with research to split Marvel Comics' cosmology by the most prominent writers who respectively defined it? Mark Gruenwald, Al Ewing, J.M. DeMatteis, and possibly others.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Would any of you be interested in helping out with research to split Marvel Comics' cosmology by the most prominent writers who respectively defined it?

Marvel cosmology isn't my best subject. So I don't think I'm the best help for defining writer era cosmology.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. That is very unfortunate, but thanks anyway.

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Marvel cosmology isn't my best subject. So I don't think I'm the best help for defining writer era cosmology.

Same here tbh

 

[Antvasima]

Well, we would mainly need help with gathering research results here, not necessarily already known pre-knowledge.

 

[Gasper]

I can probably help if you want.

 

[Antvasima]

Thanks a lot. It is extremely appreciated.

I will write down your username in a list for this project.

 

[Antvasima]

Are you also interested in helping out, Excel616 and VeryGoofyToddler?