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maou gakuin no futekigousha Upgrade from 2-A to low 1-C
- Thread starter ImmortalDread
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Honestly, i not have time for few day, i will create my own CRT for the scalling
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@Dread It's your CRT, what do you think?
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The thing is, I asked Ultima yesterday tonight if the CRT is on his agenda, and he said yes.
5D is accepted by two staff members and one neutral staff member, no need to discuss further for it, but 6D is controversial one, and we need Ultima to review it.
In the meanwhile, I was thinking that @Peak suggestion is an outstanding one, but I doubt Ultima will do downgrade on his own for the verse.
5D is accepted by two staff members and one neutral staff member, no need to discuss further for it, but 6D is controversial one, and we need Ultima to review it.
In the meanwhile, I was thinking that @Peak suggestion is an outstanding one, but I doubt Ultima will do downgrade on his own for the verse.
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Introduction
As you guys know, Maou Gakuin cosmology is presently at the 2-A tier.
The good news (bad news for haters) is that we got more scans/statements/shreds of evidence for a good possibleness of a low 1-C tier (5D- possibly 6D to be precise)
Cosmology Overview
Credits for the picture/cosmology go to me @Dread
This is how the cosmology looks like in The Misfit of Demon King Academy Series. You can zoom in to view bubble World and Militia World.
Currently, this is what it looks like:
There are 99+ layers in the silver sea. All layers are of the same size. Here is the thread that evaluates our cosmology for 99+ x baseline 2-A (currently one of the strongest 2-As in a wiki)
- 1 realm (sanctuary) is 2-A (contains countless infinite timeline/space-time continuums)
- 1 Azure Sky = countless realms
- 1 bubble contains countless infinite black sky + Azure lane = countless 2-A
- 0 layer contains infinite bubbles Worlds
- 1-99+ layers = countless up to infinite Bubbles
Note: For more info, here is the cosmology page
Low 1-C (5D) rationalization
「各々の神域は、世界の縮図。世界の根源の上限が決まっているように、ダ・ク・カダーテの火露の数は決まっていて、この神域の花の数も決まっています」
"Each sanctuary is a microcosm of the world. Just as the upper limit of the root of the world is fixed, the number of fire dewdrops in da ku kadate is fixed, as is the number of flowers in this sanctuary."Every sanctuary (realm) is just a microcosm of the bubble. And microcosm is microscopic, miniature, a copy of a larger place, a small unit. So that world is very limited by a bubble and treated only as subsets of it, and make bubble is infinitely greater in all parts of the universes (sanctuary) because universes are only a small unit in the infinite bubble. It also means every sanctuary has the same, similar structure.「各々の神域は、世界の縮図。世界の根源の上限が決まっているように、ダ・ク・カダーテの火露の数は決まっていて、この神域の花の数も決まっています」
"Each divine domain is a microcosm of the world. Just as the upper limit of the source of the world is fixed, so is the amount of fire dew in Da Ku Kadate, and the number of flowers in this divine domain."
The future world is also a sanctuary. There are countless realms, but the black sky itself is infinite in size and is not bound by the real world.ミーシャが目の前を指さす。
鮮やかな蒼穹に星のように散りばめられているのは、黄金の火山や白色の湖、いばらの大地、車輪のような街など、色とりどりの様々な風景だ。
「ここが神々の蒼穹。見えている風景は、どれも神域」
エンネスオーネの芽宮神都や、ナフタの限局世界と同じものだ。
確かに、どれもこれも、凄まじい魔力を発している。
Misha points out in front of him.
Scattered like stars across the brilliant azure sky are a variety of colorful landscapes, including golden volcanoes, white lakes, thorny lands, and wheel-like cities.
"This is the azure sky of the gods. Every landscape you see is a divine realm."
It is the same as the budding divine city of Ennesione and the limited world of Nafta.
Indeed, all of them emit tremendous magical power.
There is nothing in-between countable infinity and uncountable infinity, so something that is stated to be bigger than the former would result in the latter by necessity. This applies to Maou Gakuin's case, as Kandaquizorte (a 2-A structure) was stated to be small compared to the Bubble.
In math terms
Microcosm - Wikipedia
I read your scans and everything and I still don't understand the 5-D in it, you explained it in form of 5-D with the subset and all but I'm not just convinced with the 5-D. Staffs might have agreed but can you clarify more to me.
And the word Microcosm has other meanings apart from Microscopic and since the Crt is still on, i hope no problem right?
Peak
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no problem, I gave this suggestion because the topic was getting derailed many times so maybe this makes it difficult for Ultima, but I think having a summary of the points presented for Ultima this problem can be solved
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The thing is I have added the summary in my OP and everything there.
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Basically, the 5-D comes from having the "future world" a 2-A realm (contains infinite futures) being stated to merely be a microcosm (small part, miniature copy of a larger place).Microcosm - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
I read your scans and everything and I still don't understand the 5-D in it, you explained it in form of 5-D with the subset and all but I'm not just convinced with the 5-D. Staffs might have agreed but can you clarify more to me.
And the word Microcosm has other meanings apart from Microscopic and since the Crt is still on, i hope no problem right?
Yes, microcosm has other definitions but in this case it has to be referring to its size, structure. It can't be referring to any other definition as they have literally nothing to do with space time.
Its impossible to be bigger than 2-A while remaining 2-A yourself. A 2-A structure is basically a small part of a greater whole hence the 5-D rating for the bubbles
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Dw Tatsumi, if he truly read everything, he would see the quote in the last thread that explains why it is 5D.
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But being a small of part of a greater whole like 2-A to Low 1-C is kinda of stretch to just assume so as even a 2-A can contain an infinite 2-A structure.
And yeah it can just mean small tbh I'm not convinced with 5-D.
I'm pretty sure when it comes to definition Wikipedia is rated higher even .org are rated more than .com websites when it comes to things like this. It's not impossible actually
An Omniverse is 2-A without further context and contains other 2-A(infinite multiverses) those also contain infinite universes(2-A) your FAQ said something like this also about it being range incase such a structure got destroyed.
A 2-A can be part of a greater whole that's still 2-A.
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You are arguing against wiki standards, tbh. You can create a separate CRT for this and ask why it is like that.
Preferably, read the whole thread once again (the quote from staff is recommended as well).
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Can you tell me what particular standard so I can check on it. I skimmed through as it's much that's why I particularly referred to the revision you created.
Did I say anything wrong or that needs correction?
I believe destruction of infinite multiverses(2-A) and destruction of infinite universes/infinite multiverse(2-A) is the same thing according to this platform or has it changed?
I don't think it's 5-D from destroying a structure that contains a 2-A without further context and especially how Low 1-C is defined.
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Without further context? A whole thread and you say no further context? I will stop replying
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TL.DR.. You haven't read the thread or/nor doesn't know how the tiers and standards works here. Tf has omniverse have to do with maou.
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Mrkism is prevalent within the MGNF supporters and detractors it seems....
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I said so cause a structure that contains a 2-A without additional context is still 2-A as it could still be a greater 2-A.
I did actually and you guys aren't replying, okay I'd reword it better. Infinite multiverses(4D) is 2-A>>>>Infinite multiverse/Infinite universes(4D) still 2-A. Containing a 2-A structure doesn't necessarily mean Low 1-C that's my point.
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- #662
Your point is against Wiki standards, can you stop derailing the thread?
Something bigger than as structure 2-A as 2-A is low 1-C. You really did not bother reading anything in the thread and continue derailing here.
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I'm not derailing as the discussion is still on the revision.
A structure bigger than a 2-A isn't necessary Low 1-C, I don't see that anywhere even the FAQ called it a range feat as destruction of infinite universes and infinite multiverses is the same here. I did that's why I asked questions on it which Tatsumi gave .
Can you link me to where it's stated a structure bigger than 2-A is straight up Low 1-C? Cause I don't see that anywhere
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I already linked it in OP, the fact is only that you did not bother reading it.
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Maou sanctuary (2-A) are microcosm of the world that share the shape, same form, and characteristics of the militia world and infinite timelimes. There are countless sanctuaries and those countless 2-A structure fall into the "subset" standard of the tier system which quality for tier 1.
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Although I personally think something larger than 2A shouldn't automatically be low 1C
To pass your argument you have to make a crt to change the wikis standards
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What he's saying goes against our standards, he's just making his own assumptions.
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If that is the standard, then you can put me down for agree to 5-D.
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An infinity that contains another infinity does not mean the first one is strictly bigger. As we know, the set of rationals encompasses the set of integers (which is countable infinite) and the latter encompasses/contains the set of naturals as a subset (also infinite), but the three are still all the same size. None of them are uncountable. Subsets don't inherently mean smaller size, as said logic does not work when you are taking infinite size into account. As for brane cosmology, you'd need more than just that. Kandaquizorte qualifies because it actually specifies that it is smaller, instead of just being a conventional subset of the same cardinality. Subset of infinite sets is covered in set theory as well (it's literally a set). And this same logic would apply to MG since it's also about subsets of infinite cardinalities.
This is why "bigger than 2-A structure as 2-A" is not possible. Please avoid derailing, guys.
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Oh damn brother, we had been this through the whole time, I even added these standards at the bottom of thread, why no one really bother reading everything till end.
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Ya, anyways. I will be adding votes later or idk. Let's stop derailing right now, or I will request thread moderator.. to delete the messages.
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Actually it's not an assumption it's in the platform Faq.
What I've been saying correlates with what's on your platform FAQ and I've made a question and answer discussion on it as now it's confusing.
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And it is in wrong thread, please reduce derailing, or I may request from Ant deleting your messages and ban thread.
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So, summarizing all that, each Bubble World contains an infinite amount of timelines, as well as an infinitely large space (The Black Sky) enveloping them, of which the entire set of timelines is just miniature version? I've seen the discussion where 2-A was accepted, and I'll admit that the reasoning for the rating itself seems a bit questionable, based on my skimming of it at least, but this is not the thread for this, so I'll just push it aside for now.
Regardless, if what I just described is an accurate summary of how each Bubble World works, I am fine with Low 1-C for them. It does seem like the whole thing about the Black Sky being infinite isn't really literal, and moreso talking about how it is constantly expanding and growing in size, but that wouldn't really impact the upgrade anyway, I don't think.
However I disagree with the Silver Bubbles being a level of infinity above that: They're described as "evolved" forms of the Bubble Worlds, but as far as I can tell, we are never told what exactly this evolution entails: Bubble Worlds being "unborn" here doesn't seem to be a literal descriptor but just a way to say that they are not entirely developed due to the lack of some entity imposing order on them, evident fron this excerpt: "The bubble world is an unevolved small world. In the Silver Sea, it can be said to be an unborn world, because the Bubble World does not have a Chief God and Sovereign."
Regardless of that, though, I'd be fine with the Silver Sea being considered a 6-D space. From the looks of it, it's described as encompassing all of the bubble worlds and as infinitely large compared to them, and they're even called "small worlds" on account of that (Correct me if I'm wrong here), so, yeah, I don't have a problem with deeming it to be another level of Low 1-C at least.
Regardless, if what I just described is an accurate summary of how each Bubble World works, I am fine with Low 1-C for them. It does seem like the whole thing about the Black Sky being infinite isn't really literal, and moreso talking about how it is constantly expanding and growing in size, but that wouldn't really impact the upgrade anyway, I don't think.
However I disagree with the Silver Bubbles being a level of infinity above that: They're described as "evolved" forms of the Bubble Worlds, but as far as I can tell, we are never told what exactly this evolution entails: Bubble Worlds being "unborn" here doesn't seem to be a literal descriptor but just a way to say that they are not entirely developed due to the lack of some entity imposing order on them, evident fron this excerpt: "The bubble world is an unevolved small world. In the Silver Sea, it can be said to be an unborn world, because the Bubble World does not have a Chief God and Sovereign."
Regardless of that, though, I'd be fine with the Silver Sea being considered a 6-D space. From the looks of it, it's described as encompassing all of the bubble worlds and as infinitely large compared to them, and they're even called "small worlds" on account of that (Correct me if I'm wrong here), so, yeah, I don't have a problem with deeming it to be another level of Low 1-C at least.
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Also, since I am aware, and I have future sight, I will be begging you guys that no one of you need to derail here.
Please, only verse supporters and staff members can chat now. Thanks for understanding (also avoid spamming)
Also, I requested thread moderator to delete irrelevant/unneeded comments. Please, don't derail, you can comment in my wall if you want anything.
Please, only verse supporters and staff members can chat now. Thanks for understanding (also avoid spamming)
Also, I requested thread moderator to delete irrelevant/unneeded comments. Please, don't derail, you can comment in my wall if you want anything.
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