Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,251
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I need to sleep, i will return way later
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I think goku uses instant transmission as saiyans can't survive in outer space.Further proof: It is more difficult for Goku to teleport from Beerus' planet to Earth (even though both Beerus' planet and Earth reside within the Living Realm) compared to teleporting from King Kai's palace (residing within the Outer Realm) to Earth and vice-versa - This is plainly at odds with what is being proposed because, if the Living Realm and the Outer Realm were indeed separate space-times/dimensionally separated etc. it should be more difficult (unquantifiably so too) to sense Ki across and teleport from King Kai's place to Earth than from Beerus' planet to Earth
A bunch of these scale to 2-C due to multiple Universal realms, others scale to feats "transcending space and time"Separated universes also count as Low 2-C structures, if you can show they exist in their own space-time, Low 2-C isn't limited to just timelines.
Its the same reason why characters like Kratos, Dante, Odin (only for his 2-C, not his 2-A) and Hades are Tier 2 despire have no feats related to affect timelines.
I think you meant to say "can't"I think goku uses instant transmission as saiyans can survive in outer space.
How do you disprove the separate space-time statements thoughA bunch of these scale to 2-C due to multiple Universal realms, others scale to feats "transcending space and time"
Also, the separate realms in DB are not separate universes
By noting that not all separate space-times are equal and we have to look at it on a case by case (verse by verse) basis. I don't even really agree that the different realms in DB are truly separate space-timesHow do you disprove the separate space-time statements though
And by the way, this is my argument, basically :How do you disprove the separate space-time statements though
The U7 is a space time, since its called a universe, stated to be based on ours [Which is a space times-]. Universes by default are space timesThe way I understand it, Low 2-C structure = 1 timeline. Multiple separate space-times is actually a 2-C structure. BoG didn't have timeline stuff so it couldn't be low 2-C. In fact, all the separate realms within U7 belong to the same timeline
U7 as a whole. Including all the realmsThe U7 is a space time, since its called a universe, stated to be based on ours [Which is a space times-]. Universes by default are space times
No timeline destruction was happeningHow is Destroying the U7 (Space-Time) =/= Destroying a Space-Time?
Universe 7 is a space-time, BoG fight was going to destroy it, thats a basic Low 2-C scalingNo timeline destruction was happening
That's still arguably 3A based on how Universal destruction feats are quantified. I'm not super up-to-date with the distinction between 3A feats and Low 2C featsUniverse 7 is a space-time, BoG fight was going to destroy it, thats a basic Low 2-C scaling
I think the DB cosmology needs to be settled first before we can actually decide thatNo explicit destruction.
Simply saying "the entire universe was being destroyed" is not enough for Low 2-C without the mention of temporal damage, hence why I went the "affecting separate timespaces automatically involves the 4-D axis" route.
It's stated everything in the universe would get destroyed(everything is everything so includes time) and both beerus and goku so it's low 2-C with multipliers for goku.No explicit destruction.
Simply saying "the entire universe was being destroyed" is not enough for Low 2-C without the mention of temporal damage, hence why I went the "affecting separate timespaces automatically involves the 4-D axis" route.
Universe destruction is not treated as Low 2-C by defaultIt's stated everything in the universe would get destroyed(everything is everything so includes time) and both beerus and goku so it's low 2-C with multipliers for goku.
The whole macrocosm [U7]Is accepted as a space time in the wiki, thus destroying it significantly effecting it is a low 2-C featIt's stated everything in the universe would get destroyed(everything is everything so includes time) and both beerus and goku so it's low 2-C with multipliers for goku.
Except Goku can do that, he just has to lock onto a ki signature.And by the way, this is my argument, basically :
Claim : the Living Realm and the Outer Realm are dimensionally separate spaces which makes their simultaneous destruction Tier 2 because of the unquantifiable distances involved (due to being separate spaces)
Contradiction : Goku can casually teleport from King Kai planet (inside the Outer Realm) to Earth (inside the Living Realm) but he can't casually teleport from Beerus' planet (inside the Living Realm) to Earth (also inside the Living Realm)
Therefore, the quantifiable distance between Beerus'planet and Earth is greater than the unquantifiable distance between King Kai's planet and Earth, meaning that the basis of arguing Tier 2 is invalid
His point is that Goku can't do it casually, he can teleport from earth to king kai easily, but can't teleport to earth using base Gohan or gotenks who are much stronger than king kai from beerus' planet.Except Goku can do that, he just has to lock onto a ki signature.
Dont we know where beerus planet is exactly?His point is that Goku can't do it casually, he can teleport from earth to king kai easily, but can't teleport to earth using base Gohan or gotenks who are much stronger than king kai from beerus' planet.
I must make a correction here.Separated universes also count as Low 2-C structures, if you can show they exist in their own space-time, Low 2-C isn't limited to just timelines.
Its the same reason why characters like Kratos, Dante, Odin (only for his 2-C, not his 2-A) and Hades are Tier 2 despire have no feats related to affect timelines.
wasn't their already a thread and a blog created about the cosmology though?Cosmology thread first.
What you described is universal destruction but the wiki's standard is that universal destruction is 3-A not low 2-C. This CRT is trying to use the logic that since the afterlife and other realms in U7's macrocosm are separated, then that must mean they are effecting the entire time space because they are effecting the entire thing which proves it's tier 2. This is the counter argument.I'm hoping there's more to the counterarguments than that but I don't recall seeing anything that can actually debunk the crt
Contradiction : Goku can casually teleport from King Kai planet (inside the Outer Realm) to Earth (inside the Living Realm) but he can't casually teleport from Beerus' planet (inside the Living Realm) to Earth (also inside the Living Realm)
Therefore, the quantifiable distance between Beerus'planet and Earth is greater than the unquantifiable distance between King Kai's planet and Earth, meaning that the basis of arguing Tier 2 is invalid
I thought 3-A was just destroying everything that's INSIDE a single universe, not including the space-time of itWhat you described is universal destruction but the wiki's standard is that universal destruction is 3-A not low 2-C. This CRT is trying to use the logic that since the afterlife and other realms in U7's macrocosm are separated, then that must mean they are effecting the entire time space because they are effecting the entire thing which proves it's tier 2. This is the counter argument.
which wouldn't be, wellI thought 3-A was just destroying everything that's INSIDE a single universe, not including the space-time of it
That is correct. And the wiki's standard is to assume that any universe destruction with no mention of time is 3-A.I thought 3-A was just destroying everything that's INSIDE a single universe, not including the space-time of it
while that is trueThat is correct. And the wiki's standard is to assume that any universe destruction with no mention of time is 3-A.
They consider all universe busting statements to be 3-A if they have no mention of time. High 3-A is if the universe is infinite. I do agree that universe busting should be considered low 2-C by default though.while that is true
there is a difference between destroy the universe and destroy the ENTIRE universe
entire universe statements are according to their logic, considered high 3-A unless it's an outlier or something
and DBS has multiple universe sized spaces, which would be part of the universe
this fits the low 2-C description perfectly, I literally can't think of a more obvious way to prove low 2-c ngl
Y'know, I'm curious: is this standard dropped in favor of a higher rating when the fictional universe in question has its own unique structure?What you described is universal destruction but the wiki's standard is that universal destruction is 3-A not low 2-C
If it says the entire thing, then no it’s not 3A. However, doesn’t otherworld have a different flow of time. Then there’s the room of spirit and time, which should definitely be it’s own dimension and shit. I think Low 2C is fine. (Y'know, I'm curious: is this standard dropped in favor of a higher rating when the fictional universe in question has its own unique structure?
Like, if a verse had a universe that housed a bunch of higher-dimensional constructs (let's use fifth-dimensional as an example; DC), would destroying that universe still just be 3-A because those higher-dimensional constructs weren't explicitly mentioned?