It has to be this way...

[Twellas]

Well yeah. Jack himself stated in MGS4 that he gives no ***** about dying.

it's not just that he's brave, he has fear inhibitors. In the game we are told by Sam that all the opponents we faced had fear inhibitors and when we hear their thoughts we see that they are actually scared out of their minds but they still fight and shit-talk Raiden. Since Raiden had to turn off his pain inhibitors it's safe to assume he also has fear inhibitors

 

[KGiffoni]

People in Grappler Baki who are far below Yujiro have very good stamina feats. Doppo Orochi can keep fighting with everything on the picture + a popped eye, god, when Dorian cut his hand off he just punched with the stump that was left.



Btw how is he passing through Yujiro's passive aura?

 

[Twellas]

None of this is even remotely comparable to Raiden, who back in MGS4 (his MGS4 body is completely obsolete compared to his MGR one) could fight with both his lungs and heart pierced and both his arms cut off. And it won't come to a stamina struggle because Yujiro goes down in one, at best two hits

 

[SpookyShadow]

...and he actually survived being crushed by Outer Haven

 

[Twellas]

People in Grappler Baki who are far below Yujiro have very good stamina feats. Doppo Orochi can keep fighting with everything on the picture + a popped eye, god, when Dorian cut his hand off he just punched with the stump that was left.



Btw how is he passing through Yujiro's passive aura?

Through not being able to feel fear as well as outranging it

 

[KGiffoni]

I see.

 

[Twellas]

My vote is for Raiden, in case it wasn't clear enough already

 

[KGiffoni]

BTW how does a computers thought process have a unconciousness?

Iirc yes, but really really small

I could be wrong tho

The fact Raiden is a cyborg and not a complete robot just makes it more probable that he does

 

[KGiffoni]

Now that Yujiro is bloodlusted he can exploit his illusion creation w/ sense manip too

Put that on top of a massive skill advantage w/ analytical prediction should make up for the speed difference

Voting Yujiro if i haven't

 

[Twellas]

Honestly your explaination of the 0.5 s goes completely in the face of what we are actually told about it and it's completely different but whatever, let's not derail since, as I said, the 0,5 is irrelevant

 

[SpookyShadow]

Illusion Creation? I don't know if that's useful

Depends how it works

 

[KGiffoni]

Makes you perceive impacts, lights, even stuff like smells and tastes all without them actually existing

It's pretty good imo

 

[Twellas]

I really doubt that it's gonna have any relevance and remember, the fight starts with Raiden slashing at Yujiro at 10x+ speed, unless Yujiro can counter that somehow the fight ends right there

 

[SpookyShadow]

I don't think Jack has senses on humans level to let that work on him.

In MGS2 as a human he already had enhanced senses due to nanotechnology inside of him (mainly vision) and in Rising he has dealt with Blade Wolf who can make himself invisible, Sam who can create afterimages et cetera

 

[Twellas]

and i REALLY don't understand this concept of Yujiro's skill making up for the speed difference, how is skill (or whatever hax of his you want) gonna save him from a 1 hit KO coming right at him that is at absolute least 5 times faster than he can move and react?

 

[KGiffoni]

Predicting it + knowing the easiest way to dodge it via skill.

 

[Twellas]

Prediction isn't going to help you dodge something that is several times faster than you are, the fact that you PHYSICALLY can't move fast enough to dodge it still stands, and it's not a single attack, it's a barrage from all directions, even if Yujiro manages to dodge one several others are gonna come right after that one from a whole other direction.

 

[Twellas]

Seriously, it's like saying that a martial arts master's skills are gonna help him dodge a point-blank gunshot: yes, he know it's coming, yes, he knows how to dodge it effectively, but nothing is gonna change the fact that the bullet is gonna come out before he can even move

 

[KGiffoni]

If he knows when the bullet is coming out he can dodge very easily actually lol

 

[Schnee_One]

Robots don't have senses they analyse information, senses are moot

0.5 useless for reasons I already went over

 

[Moritzva]

Raiden FRA, 0.5 doesn't make sense in the first place, much less against computers.

 

[Schnee_One]

Voting Raiden for all of my reasons given

 

[CrimsonStarFallen]

Raiden FRA too.

 

[Twellas]

If he knows when the bullet is coming out he can dodge very easily actually lol

i mean, no, but whatever, the point still stands that even if you see a faster attack coming it doesn't change the fact that you physically cannot move fast enough to get out of the way

 

[KGiffoni]

If he knows when the bullet is coming out he can dodge very easily actually lol

i mean, no, but whatever, the point still stands that even if you see a faster attack coming it doesn't change the fact that you physically cannot move fast enough to get out of the way

If you see it even 5 seconds before it happening you have more than enough time to go out of its trajectory

 

[KGiffoni]

Anyways Raiden FRA because i don't think Yujiro can pull it off for minutes straight

 

[SpookyShadow]

Jack FRA

 

[Mister6ame6]

Raiden FRA

 

[Twellas]

aaand i think that's grace, 7 votes

 

[SpookyShadow]

Yujiro lost to Jack twice lol

 

[Twellas]

guess we can add this to Raiden and Yujiro's profiles

 

[KGiffoni]

You have to wait 24 hours

 

[Schnee_One]

Lol two losses from the same character

 

[BakiHanma18]

Again, y'all seem to not understand what 0.5 actually is. 0.5 will always work, as it is an effect applied to Yujiro. Yujiro skips reaction, Raiden's reaction is instant, so 0.5 makes their engagement even. So this all comes down to Raiden getting absolutely blitzed by Yujiro. FLS would still bring Yujiro to a point to where if something was barely outspeeding him, he can now hit it with a full-on tackle. That said, 10x isn't "barely", but if Baki can blitz Musashi with the Jab, or Katsumi can blitz Pickle with the Hitless Blow, Raiden is getting tagged by a FLS into HB or Jab. Now, type 2 is an issue, but how good is his type 2, because we seem to be forgetting that Yujiro still massively outskills Raiden and has over 100 notable skills and techniques

 

[SpookyShadow]

 

[BakiHanma18]

or reference on FLS

- Base Pickle (Can blitz Jack and matched SOO Baki albeit he is slower)

- Deinonychus (Faster than Pickle)

FLS allows Base Pickle to outspeed the Deinonychus, who's speed rating is literally given due to being able to outspeed Pickle

and for the Hitless Blow, a Hypersonic Katsumi who scales below Doppo blitzed Pickle who scales below Baki, and he did it 3 times

So we have a passive aura that can cause physical damage, blitz level speed amps to match Raiden, and skill advantage, still not seeing how Raiden takes this

 

[BakiHanma18]

Yujiro blocks and deflects strikes in character so that's immediately out, even then the gap isn't even that massive which I also debunked previous thread

He's not in-character, he's blood-lusted

AP gap or skill gap? I'm not sure if the AP gap after Raiden's revision, but the skill gap is leaps and bound insanely huge

 

[BakiHanma18]

@Baki

Yeah see the issue is that none of those has a stated multiplier, you can just go around slapping random numbers on amps that way and this was explained to you and Kf by Earl and Risci. At best those are unquantifiable amps that you can stack.

Katsumi blitzed Pickle: fact

Pickle outsped Deino: fact

I don't have exact numbers or multipliers, but using simple logic is still applicable, no? Pickle is outspeeding some faster than him, that one is meh, but Katsumi is literally BLITZING some considerably faster. Logic dictates that in using both in tandem, a 10x speed gap would at the very least be considerably more manageable with the skill gap as it is

 

[BakiHanma18]

Musashi and Baki aren't in the top 5 either, neither is Pickle yet they weren't instantly dispatched due to the skill difference. And if I genuinely felt like arguing for Jack he'd be a top tier on that list.

And if you read the OP, you'd know that only 1 person per verse is allowed, and no, from what I've seen, he might make top 10

 

[Schnee_One]

Also this: "...Bloodlusted characters fear nothing, and won't hesitate taking injures if it leads to a higher probability of winning a battle." and as we said, 1 hit from an HF blade is game over for Yujiro