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Ingame HP and Durability Level

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Sillyfox0

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So.... I just wanted to ask
Can i calculate durability using the hp?
Character A has 2000 hp
Character B deals 250 hp per hit and each hit is worth 15 tons of tnt
Would that make character A's durability 120 tons or 15 tons?
Like... If his durability is 15 tons wouldnt that mean that he gets one shot by the Character B's attack...?
So shouldnt it be 120 tons? makes sense overall.. Like... i have never seen a durability calculation based on hp... Always some "15 tons can survive Character B's attack)
Uh.... Why not use... Idk..." At least 15 tons, At most 120 tons"
 
No. We generally don't consider those applicable. They usually seem to be more of an expression of endurance and game balance, rather than something rigidly calculated out for characters' power levels.
 
Huh?
Agnaa said:
No. We generally don't consider those applicable. They usually seem to be more of an expression of endurance and game balance, rather than something rigidly calculated out for characters' power levels.
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A deeper explanation pls? If u say that for example character A's durability is 15 tons that would be wrong because that is at least, and its not at least because we know the exact overall durability which is at 120 tons which leaves us with: Character A | Durability 120 tons (Capable of taking exactly 8 hits from Character B, each hit from character B is worth ""15 tons")
 
As I said, we just don't take those numbers seriously as an expression of durability.

Firstly, because they're game mechanics primarily meant for balance rather than exact numerical representations of how strong characters are relative to each other.

Secondly, because it's more in line with stamina/endurance rather than durability.

So maybe to give a deeper explanation, we don't think we "know" that the character's overall durability is 120 tons, in such an example.

Taking 8 hits is not the same thing as taking a hit 8 times as strong. Chip damage, as is shown in video games where enemies with thousands of health can be taken down with enough 1 damage hits, does not exist in real life.
 
Yeah, game mechanics have always been wonky and don't always translate to what is scientifically accurate. Not to mention durability isn't to be mixed up with endurance/stamina nor should it be mixed up with survivability. We also definitely do not stack durability via being able to withstand multiple consecutive hits.

Likewise, it's common for attacks to inflict more damage less due to superior energy yield and due to have more well placed precision. In a lot of FPS games, the in game Sniper Rifle inflicts more damage to a target than rocket launchers or "Plasma weapons that can vaporize people" despite the former being 9-B and the other two being 9-A. Sniper Rifles fire a well placed bullet that is especially deadly if it sweet spots their vitals where as the others are more focused on spread damage. With the plasma rifle also being mostly heat/thermal energy when it could have little to no actual force/overpressure by comparison.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Yeah, game mechanics have always been wonky and don't always translate to what is scientifically accurate. Not to mention durability isn't to be mixed up with endurance/stamina nor should it be mixed up with survivability. We also definitely do not stack durability via being able to withstand multiple consecutive hits.

Likewise, it's common for attacks to inflict more damage less due to superior energy yield and due to have more well placed precision. In a lot of FPS games, the in game Sniper Rifle inflicts more damage to a target than rocket launchers or "Plasma weapons that can vaporize people" despite the former being 9-B and the other two being 9-A. Sniper Rifles fire a well placed bullet that is especially deadly if it sweet spots their vitals where as the others are more focused on spread damage. With the plasma rifle also being mostly heat/thermal energy when it could have little to no actual force/overpressure by comparison.
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Well. Terrarian has Dwarf star durability and the king slime can deal idk like 1 dmg to him and well 1 dmg off of a Dwarf Star is like idk continent level? Or am i wrong? 1/500
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Yeah, game mechanics have always been wonky and don't always translate to what is scientifically accurate. Not to mention durability isn't to be mixed up with endurance/stamina nor should it be mixed up with survivability. We also definitely do not stack durability via being able to withstand multiple consecutive hits.

Likewise, it's common for attacks to inflict more damage less due to superior energy yield and due to have more well placed precision. In a lot of FPS games, the in game Sniper Rifle inflicts more damage to a target than rocket launchers or "Plasma weapons that can vaporize people" despite the former being 9-B and the other two being 9-A. Sniper Rifles fire a well placed bullet that is especially deadly if it sweet spots their vitals where as the others are more focused on spread damage. With the plasma rifle also being mostly heat/thermal energy when it could have little to no actual force/overpressure by comparison.
Click to expand...
what about verses that use game mechanics in the story?
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Yeah, game mechanics have always been wonky and don't always translate to what is scientifically accurate. Not to mention durability isn't to be mixed up with endurance/stamina nor should it be mixed up with survivability. We also definitely do not stack durability via being able to withstand multiple consecutive hits.

Likewise, it's common for attacks to inflict more damage less due to superior energy yield and due to have more well placed precision. In a lot of FPS games, the in game Sniper Rifle inflicts more damage to a target than rocket launchers or "Plasma weapons that can vaporize people" despite the former being 9-B and the other two being 9-A. Sniper Rifles fire a well placed bullet that is especially deadly if it sweet spots their vitals where as the others are more focused on spread damage. With the plasma rifle also being mostly heat/thermal energy when it could have little to no actual force/overpressure by comparison.
Click to expand...
Also scientificially accurate or not 500 hp scales to a specific level and if a character slams half ur hp then hes half the level how would you personally comment and or counter that
 
Jeez
Character A has 500 hp and has a feat that puts his dura at 500 kilotons, Character B deals 250 dmg to Character A which makes his ap 250 kilotons, if agreed then people can scale off of hp, if disagreed then... why?
 
That is not how Durability works, its not accumulative: a character receiving N numbers of attacks of X AP does not mean the Durability of the character is X*N, and killing a character of Y Durability in M numbers of hits does not mean that the AP of such strikes is Y/M.
 
Antoniofer said:
That is not how Durability works, its not accumulative: a character receiving N numbers of attacks of X AP does not mean the Durability of the character is X*N, and killing a character of Y Durability in M numbers of hits does not mean that the AP of such strikes is Y/M.
Click to expand...
Nah that is crazy

We know exactly how much dmg Character B dealt to Character A and we know the exact hp&durability of Character A, which obviously puts Character B's ap at half the Character A's durability (we know the hp and dmg dealt on both)

Straight up 2 hits KILL Character A that is OBVIOUSLY Ap half the Character A's dura

How in the whole god damn world is that not true
 
Sillyfox0 said:
Nah that is crazy

We know exactly how much dmg Character B dealt to Character A and we know the exact hp&durability of Character A, which obviously puts Character B's ap at half the Character A's durability (we know the hp and dmg dealt on both)

Straight up 2 hits KILL Character A that is OBVIOUSLY Ap half the Character A's dura

How in the whole god damn world is that not true
Click to expand...
In order for something to be durability, they should normally need to be able to take more than two hits while suffering moderate damage at worst; depleting half HP is something I'd argue against AP fully scaling to durability. Physics is not linear in that regard and you can't chip damage an object like that IRL. It's not like in RL, that giving a trillion gentle punches could eventually pierce through a brick wall. We have a calculation of taking 15000 Joules to crush a cinderblock, it doesn't mean a thousand consecutive hits that are 15 joules would do the same; especially since 15 joules would do like 0 damage.

But that logic, all characters who take 0 damage from something defaults to High 3-A durability, which would be outrageous. And realistically, a 500 Kiloton attack does a lot more than 2x damage relative to a 250 Kiloton attack.
 
Example:
Character A survived a nuclear explosion, though has 50/100 hp left (the explosion is 50 kilotons).
Character B can significantly damage Character A, to be more accurate he deals 25 dmg per hit (can be viewed how much dmg by looking at Character A's hp)
That puts Character B's AP at 25 Kilotons.
And Character A's durability at 100 Kilotons.
 
Sillyfox0 said:
Example:
Character A survived a nuclear explosion, though has 50/100 hp left (the explosion is 50 kilotons).
Character B can significantly damage Character A, to be more accurate he deals 25 dmg per hit (can be viewed how much dmg by looking at Character A's hp)
That puts Character B's AP at 25 Kilotons.
And Character A's durability at 100 Kilotons.
Click to expand...
Not how it works, Character B's AP would be considerably more than 25 Kilotons normally, likewise, if character A's durability was 100 Kilotons, a 50 Kiloton attack would barely chip damage him. Character A's durability would be wayyyyyy less than 100 kilotons (You need to be able to actually survive the 100 kiloton attack to actually scale and take moderate damage at worst; 50% is massive damage, not moderate. In fact, I'd argue the durability isn't even 50 kilotons and a bit less.

And again, you're mixing up durability with endurance.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
In order for something to be durability, they should normally need to be able to take more than two hits while suffering moderate damage at worst; depleting half HP is something I'd argue against AP fully scaling to durability. Physics is not linear in that regard and you can't chip damage an object like that IRL. It's not like in RL, that giving a trillion gentle punches could eventually pierce through a brick wall. We have a calculation of taking 15000 Joules to crush a cinderblock, it doesn't mean a thousand consecutive hits that are 15 joules would do the same; especially since 15 joules would do like 0 damage.

But that logic, all characters who take 0 damage from something defaults to High 3-A durability, which would be outrageous. And realistically, a 500 Kiloton attack does a lot more than 2x damage relative to a 250 Kiloton attack.
Click to expand...

DarkDragonMedeus said:
In order for something to be durability, they should normally need to be able to take more than two hits while suffering moderate damage at worst; depleting half HP is something I'd argue against AP fully scaling to durability. Physics is not linear in that regard and you can't chip damage an object like that IRL. It's not like in RL, that giving a trillion gentle punches could eventually pierce through a brick wall. We have a calculation of taking 15000 Joules to crush a cinderblock, it doesn't mean a thousand consecutive hits that are 15 joules would do the same; especially since 15 joules would do like 0 damage.

But that logic, all characters who take 0 damage from something defaults to High 3-A durability, which would be outrageous. And realistically, a 500 Kiloton attack does a lot more than 2x damage relative to a 250 Kiloton attack.
Click to expand...
"But that logic, all characters who take 0 damage from something defaults to High 3-A durability"

That statement is not true nor related having invulnerability to physical damage would give 3-A dura but handling hundreds of hits that are idk planetary make a character planetary*100
|
And no way 500 hp that are 500 kilotons via a feat provide character B 250 kilotons ap via him damaging character A to such extent (250 dmg)
 
Most likely a dead end where i consider myself right and you wrong, and you consider me wrong and yourself right

How unfortunate
 
"500 Kiloton attack does a lot more than 2x damage relative to a 250 Kiloton attack."
Uh huh?
 
But anyway, for better understanding, this is the difference between durability or endurance.
  • Character A has an attack potency of 500 Megatons
  • Character B is able to not only withstand character A's attack but stand up and keep fighting; but get's KO'd or killed after 5 or 6 hits
  • Character C is able to do the same as Character B, but take up to 1000 hits
  • Character D is 100% immune to character A's attack and even getting punched billions of times doesn't change that, but he dies in one hit from an attack that's 500 Gigatons
  • Character E is able to survive a hit from Character A, but doing so knocks him unconscious.
Conclusions here is the following.
  • Character B's durability is 500 Megatons, NOT 2.5 to 3 Gigatons
  • Character C's durability is also 500 Megatons but has a lot more endurance/stamina than Character B, he does NOT have 500 Gigaton durability
  • Character D's durability is a lot higher than 500 Megatons, but a lot lower than 500 Gigatons, it's definitely NOT in the Teratons or Petatons or Infinite by your logic
  • Character E's durability would NOT even be 500 Megatons and would be considerably less.
In conclusion, it sounds like you're trying way too hard to oversimplify something that was never intended to be that simple in the first place. HP and defense state systems do not follow physics linearly and thus not a reliable way to guestimate random multipliers left and right.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
But anyway, for better understanding, this is the difference between durability or endurance.
  • Character A has an attack potency of 500 Megatons
  • Character B is able to not only withstand character A's attack but stand up and keep fighting; but get's KO'd or killed after 5 or 6 hits
  • Character C is able to do the same as Character B, but take up to 1000 hits
  • Character D is 100% immune to character A's attack and even getting punched billions of times doesn't change that, but he dies in one hit from an attack that's 500 Gigatons
  • Character E is able to survive a hit from Character A, but doing so knocks him unconscious.
Conclusions here is the following.
  • Character B's durability is 500 Megatons, NOT 2.5 to 3 Gigatons
  • Character C's durability is also 500 Megatons but has a lot more endurance/stamina than Character B, he does NOT have 500 Gigaton durability
  • Character D's durability is a lot higher than 500 Megatons, but a lot lower than 500 Gigatons, it's definitely NOT in the Teratons or Petatons or Infinite by your logic
  • Character E's durability would NOT even be 500 Megatons and would be considerably less.
In conclusion, it sounds like you're trying way too hard to oversimplify something that was never intended to be that simple in the first place. HP and defense state systems do not follow physics linearly and thus not a reliable way to guestimate random multipliers left and right.
Click to expand...
I aint talking about anything besides for hp, dmg, dura, ap

If Character B has an attack that deals 50 dmg, and has ap of 50 kilotons, If Character A withstands the attack, he is infact 50 kilotons in dura+, the more attacks he survives, the more durability he has, but, this is not invulnerability, we know the extra parameter called HP which tells us EXACTLY how many more hits until character A DIES, if character C has hp of 10, yes, he dies, but dont forget that hp in our case is equal to a specific amount of dura (we can test that by using B's attacks on more and more characters, finding out that hp, is indeed, equal to an amount of dura, if character D has hp of 201, he survives 4 of B's hits, and only at fifth dies, character C has durability of 10 Kilotons (since 1 hp=1 Kiloton) and so on and so on
 
HP is generally the amount of damage someone can stand before fall apart (although sometimes it can be more abstract), whenever Durability is the threashold that indicate how much energy is required to harm the character, they are not the same. How much attack is required to kill the character is not related to Durability, but rather endurance.
 
Last edited:
Antoniofer said:
HP is generally the amount of damage someone can stand before fall apart (although sometimes it can be more abstract), whenever Durability is the threashold that indicate how much energy is required to harm the character, they are not the same. Hpow much attack is required to kill the character is not related to Durability, but rather endurance.
Click to expand...
"Durability is the threashold that indicate how much energy is required to harm the character"

A human can harm a A Mountain by punching it, denting it a molecular bit, Human Mountain level?
 
Sillyfox0 said:
"Durability is the threashold that indicate how much energy is required to harm the character"

A human can harm a A Mountain by punching it, denting it a molecular bit, Human Mountain level?
Click to expand...
"Durability is the property which guarantees the ability to withstand a certain amount of force."
10kt in dmg dealt to Character A by character B consecutively would mean 10kt durability, BUT, if we know the exact DMG and HP we can tell that Character A can actually handle 10 hits, making him 100kt in durability, no more
 
Sillyfox0 said:
"Durability is the threashold that indicate how much energy is required to harm the character"

A human can harm a A Mountain by punching it, denting it a molecular bit, Human Mountain level?
Click to expand...
... You do realize that in order to be mountain level you need to destroy said mountain right?
 
You treat the mountain as it were a character: despite being a mountain, its mostly made of stone, so to "harm a mountain" you just need AP enough to destroy stone (around the range of 9-C to 9-B), that humans may attain with certain tools; and even yet, there're few types of rocks that humans can't simply hope to harm without the use of explosives.
 
First_Witch said:
... You do realize that in order to be mountain level you need to destroy said mountain right?
Click to expand...
Yeah exactly durability = max amount of dmg a character can take if he (character) can take 10 hits of 10kt and 10 dmg HIS DURA IS 100KT AND NOT 10KT OR WHATEVER THEY ARE TELLING ME
 
Sillyfox0 said:
Subjective and etc
Click to expand...
daenerys-targaryen-smile.gif
 
Ok so whatever yall guys are saying if Character A has 10 dmg and 10 kt ap and hits character B (with 100 hp) 10 times character b has durability of 100KT and no less. That aint "at least 10 kt", obviously that would be 100kt. IM NOT talking about ENDURANCE, ONLY durability and ap with hp and dmg
 
Sillyfox0 said:
Yeah exactly durability = max amount of dmg a character can take if he (character) can take 10 hits of 10kt and 10 dmg HIS DURA IS 100KT AND NOT 10KT OR WHATEVER THEY ARE TELLING ME
Click to expand...
Son, a mountain dosnt have mountain level durability. Mountain level durability is the value equivalent to the destruction of a whole mountain. You can harm a mountain with explosives because the mountain has litetal stone level durability.

In order to harm a mountain level character, the attack has to be able output enough energy to DESTROY A WHOLE mountain
 
First_Witch said:
Son, a mountain dosnt have mountain level durability. Mountain level durability is the value equivalent to the destruction of a whole mountain. You can harm a mountain with explosives because the mountain has litetal stone level durability.

In order to harm a mountain level character, the attack has to be able output enough energy to DESTROY A WHOLE mountain
Click to expand...
Bro i aint arguing about that im arguing about 300 dmg on the terrarian's zenith having like Dwarf Star ap and some king slime with 2000 hp having... CITY BLOCK DURA? King slime can take a hit from the endgame terrarian. Dwarf Star level durability, but nah, stays city block, if 300 hp worth of dmg=Dwarf Star ap
Then 2000 hp is literally dwarf star level*6.66
 
Sillyfox0 said:
Ok so whatever yall guys are saying if Character A has 10 dmg and 10 kt ap and hits character B (with 100 hp) 10 times character b has durability of 100KT and no less. That aint "at least 10 kt", obviously that would be 100kt. IM NOT talking about ENDURANCE, ONLY durability and ap with hp and dmg
Click to expand...
As I said, Durability/AP is not accumulative: Killing a 100 Kiloton character in 13 hits does not means that the AP of the attacker is 100/13 Kilotons, and a character killing a character based in spawning hundreds of 24 Megatons attacks does not means that the defender has a Durability of hundreds of times 24 Megatons.

The second issue is that HP is an abstract measure and it does not means much by itself: stamina, endurance, luck, and even capability to dodge can be represented in HP. Men, in most games a character with 1 HP will not perform less than when it possessed 2500 HP, what makes you think that the character didn't receive real damage.
 
Antoniofer said:
As I said, Durability/AP is not accumulative: Killing a 100 Kiloton character in 13 hits does not means that the AP of the attacker is 100/13 Kilotons, and a character killing a character based in spawning hundreds of 24 Megatons attacks does not means that the defender has a Durability of hundreds of times 24 Megatons.

The second issue is that HP is an abstract measure and it does not means much by itself: stamina, endurance, luck, and even capability to dodge can be represented in HP. Men, in most games a character with 1 HP will not perform less than when it possessed 2500 HP, what makes you think that the character didn't receive real damage.
Click to expand...
I only talking about bare hp, dura | dmg, ap,

If the zenith deals 300 dmg and is Dwarf Star level, then anyone that can survive a hit of zenith is Dwarf Star level, and anyone below is simply Dwarf Star level-, at the VERY Max being 1/300 Dwarf Star level, which is still, idk, country level or sum?
 
Sillyfox0 said:
I only talking about bare hp, dura | dmg, ap,

If the zenith deals 300 dmg and is Dwarf Star level, then anyone that can survive a hit of zenith is Dwarf Star level, and anyone below is simply Dwarf Star level-, at the VERY Max being 1/300 Dwarf Star level, which is still, idk, country level or sum?
Click to expand...
You might say its "incomparable cuz its Dwarf star and something else is not that level" this is still power scaling character A surviving a hit from character b, (or capable of surviving half of the dmg) that used a tool with Dwarf Star ap, the endgame terrarian (via zenith) is still Dwarf Star level and his hit is in most cases surviveable, terraria verse being "Dwarf Star level or about" in most cases
 
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