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Goku vs. Garou (Martial Arts Battle)

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Epiccheev said:
For example: I'd say the Goku who beats Cell can tie with Goku in general skill, but if they were to fight Garou has stuff like Roaring Aura Sky Ripping Fist, wich can beat an opponent equal to garou with a graze and turn their bones into dust with a direct hit.

At this point the opponent doesn't have to just be as skilled or even more skilled than Garou, he needs to absolutely skill stomp him to the point he can`t even land a graze on them, and with Fa Jin, wich is a long ranged AOE technique wich directly damages organs that passes through objects and people you would need some way to counter it.
So i`d say post Cell Goku beats garou in general skill, but UI Goku can beat him in a pure martial art fight by lol dodging everything and cancelling Fa Jin with Kiai (assuming Kiai can cancel it) or just overwhelming him to much for him to use it.
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Ah I see, DBZ for both.
 
Epiccheev said:
In your opinion what is the strongest Goku Garou can beat in Skill (as in not really a fight, just purely comparing quantifiable skill feats) and the strongest Goku Garou could beat in a fight(with all his fancy martial arts hax fatored in)?
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With Cosmic Garou, I’m inclined to go with DBZ buu saga Goku but I doubt others share that sentiment. But I’ll side with them if they make good arguments.

After OG Dragonball, all Goku did was just keep fighting and training. Improving his existing skill sets from OG DB over time. He did create the dragon fist.

edit: wait for you mean stats equal for the second question?
 
Epiccheev said:
For example: I'd say the Goku who beats Cell can tie with Goku in general skill, but if they were to fight Garou has stuff like Roaring Aura Sky Ripping Fist, wich can beat an opponent equal to garou with a graze and turn their bones into dust with a direct hit.

At this point the opponent doesn't have to just be as skilled or even more skilled than Garou, he needs to absolutely skill stomp him to the point he can`t even land a graze on them, and with Fa Jin, wich is a long ranged AOE technique wich directly damages organs that passes through objects and people you would need some way to counter it.
So i`d say post Cell Goku beats garou in general skill, but UI Goku can beat him in a pure martial art fight by lol dodging everything and cancelling Fa Jin with Kiai (assuming Kiai can cancel it) or just overwhelming him too much in close combat for him to use it.
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Lol your example is the most accurate answer. UI Goku is far too much for Garou to handle. So post Cell Goku is fine. In a fight, stats equal will still be post Cell.
 
Arnoldstone18 said:
With Cosmic Garou, I’m inclined to go with DBZ buu saga Goku but I doubt others share that sentiment. But I’ll side with them if they make good arguments.

After OG Dragonball, all Goku did was just keep fighting and training. Improving his existing skill sets from OG DB over time. He did create the dragon fist.

edit: wait for you mean stats equal for the second question?
Click to expand...
Yeah, the current restrictions imposed on both. a.k.a when Goku can skillstomp Garou to the point he can't even land a graze while trading blows and cancel out Fa Jin. Cosmic Garou seems to be an upscale in skill, specifically copying and understanding of martial arts, but idk how much of what he does is actually skill and what part starts being pure hax.
 
Epiccheev said:
when Goku can skillstomp Garou to the point he can't even land a graze while trading blows and cancel out Fa Jin.
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He can't do that. What are you talking about 💀
Epiccheev said:
Cosmic Garou seems to be an upscale in skill, specifically copying and understanding of martial arts, but idk how much of what he does is actually skill and what part starts being pure hax.
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It's all Martial Arts. The only thing God gave him was the knowledge of all forces in the Universe and the stats to withstand. It was stated that he could do that via Martial Arts if he had the means to do so.
 
Epiccheev said:
Any specific point in DBZ for both?
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In terms of skill feats, stuff like mastering multiple types of ki attacks, which is more difficult than regular martial arts, using ki with martial arts is enough for me. He also had training from master martial artists, divine beings, and so on and so forth just in DBZ.
As for the hax, I guess the Buu saga. Everything I just mentioned but better. I think it would more difficult for Goku in DBZ yes, but if we said current Goku then I don't think Garou has a chance.
 
After the next OPM chapter releases Garou is gonna get 5-C, 5-A (or High 5-A), and High 4-C keys so he'll be able to have official matches with OGDB and Z Goku
 
FluffyCreatureZ said:
I agree that garou beats Goku in skill until the cell saga. After that, it's up in the air until super, where I have Goku's back.
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I 100% agree with this opinion. I'd say Cell is a major turning point in skill when it comes purely to DBZ Goku. Post Cell Goku beats Garou, but definitely not a sweep. first stage UI Goku with no drawbacks and such + unlimited time limit is where i say he can very confortably pull off the second win condition of absolutely skill stomping Garou to the point no feint or small mistake/luck can make Garou win even with martial art hax.
DB Super Goku without UI can also do it, but definitely not low diff to the point he'd win 10/10 times.
So for me:
Surpasses Garou in skill: post cell Saga Goku
Beats Garou most of the time with martial arts hax factored in: DB Super Goku without UI
Beats Garou 100%/skillstomps to absolute: 1st form UI Goku without drawbacks/time limit and beyond
 
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Epiccheev said:
I 100% agree with this opinion. I'd say Cell is a major turning point in skill when it comes purely to DBZ Goku. After Cell Goku beats Garou, but definitely not a sweep. first stage UI Goku with no drawbacks and such + unlimited time limit is where i say he can very confortably pull off the second win condition of absolutely skill stomping Garou to the point no feint or small mistake/luck can make Garou win even with martial art hax.
DB Super Goku without UI can also do it, but definitely not low diff to the point he'd win 10/10 times.
So for me:
Surpasses Garou in skill: post cell Saga Goku
Beats Garou most of the time with martial arts hax factored in: DB Super Goku without UI
Beats Garou 100%/skillstomps to absolute: 1st form UI Goku without drawbacks/time limit and beyond
Click to expand...
This is fine
 
Epiccheev said:
In your opinion what is the strongest Goku Garou can beat in Skill (as in not really a fight, just purely comparing quantifiable skill feats) and the strongest Goku Garou could beat in a fight(with all his fancy martial arts hax fatored in)?
Click to expand...
Put any Goku up, he slaps all of them
 
Epiccheev said:
Yeah, the current restrictions imposed on both. a.k.a when Goku can skillstomp Garou to the point he can't even land a graze while trading blows and cancel out Fa Jin. Cosmic Garou seems to be an upscale in skill, specifically copying and understanding of martial arts, but idk how much of what he does is actually skill and what part starts being pure hax.
Click to expand...
Yeah. Goku’s UI skillstomps to the point Garou can’t even land a graze.

Before UI Goku DBS.. is still vastly above Bang in skill. And bang was capable of only being grazed by that attack. Bang and bomb should downscale in skill from pre Tournament of Power Master Roshi. Master Roshi gave up on teaching Goku since Goku has mastered everything from Roshi with a glance. Goku also improved and created moves from what Roshi taught him too and other battles.

And we still have the predicting a time stopper, and a plethora of skills and techniques to stomp Garou. And Alllll that training and battle experience.

So Garou undeniably beats DBZ Goku, loses to Super Goku, absolutely obliterated by current Goku.
 
Granola who was vastly superior in speed to Goku was in severe shock when he realized Goku had 0 openings regardless of the gap in speed.
 
Just noticed how much wanking people have done to Garou. Some things oh Goku can't do but Garou can? And people have lowballed Goku's abilities so damn much. Points for Goku had to be readdressed countless times for people to still not understand. Are people so far in a way desperate to shit on DB characters or what? Like holy hell man shit's crazy.
 
ToughAsToenails20 said:
Just noticed how much wanking people have done to Garou. Some things oh Goku can't do but Garou can? And people have lowballed Goku's abilities so damn much. Points for Goku had to be readdressed countless times for people to still not understand. Are people so far in a way desperate to shit on DB characters or what? Like holy hell man shit's crazy.
Click to expand...
Or maybe people just have different opinions because there’s no objective metric for comparing skill
 
OPM fandom seems to like to shit on DB the most, considering it as what OPM would become if it went wrong. So i get why it's hard to admit a mainstream character like Goku would beat a character like Garou who is notably high in the ranks of the wiki when it comes to top skilled martial artist.
That being said, while Goku oftenly gets very downplayed, for some reason everyone is fine with Zoro skillstomping most swordsmen in the wiki and being like top 6 most skilled swordman in vsbattles as a whole.
 
Epiccheev said:
Snek solos all ficiton with CQC
Click to expand...
T̵h̵e̵r̵e̵'̵s̵ ̵a̵ ̵g̵u̵i̵d̵e̵ ̵s̵t̵a̵t̵e̵m̵e̵n̵t̵ ̵t̵h̵a̵t̵ ̵s̵a̵y̵s̵ ̵C̵Q̵C̵ ̵h̵a̵s̵ ̵n̵e̵a̵r̵ ̵i̵n̵f̵i̵n̵i̵t̵e̵ ̵p̵o̵t̵e̵n̵t̵i̵a̵l̵ ̵c̵a̵n̵ ̵c̵a̵n̵ ̵c̵o̵u̵n̵t̵e̵r̵,̵ ̵a̵d̵a̵p̵t̵ ̵a̵n̵d̵ ̵a̵t̵t̵a̵c̵k̵ ̵i̵n̵ ̵n̵e̵a̵r̵l̵y̵ ̵i̵n̵f̵i̵n̵i̵t̵e̵ ̵w̵a̵y̵s̵
N̵i̵g̵h̵-̵I̵n̵f̵i̵n̵i̵t̵e̵ ̵S̵k̵i̵l̵l̵ ̵T̵i̵e̵r̵.̵ ̵W̵i̵t̵h̵ ̵l̵i̵k̵e̵ ̵1̵5̵ ̵u̵p̵s̵c̵a̵l̵e̵s̵.̵ 🗿
 
Maverick_Zero_X said:
Or maybe people just have different opinions because there’s no objective metric for comparing skill
Click to expand...
honestly, there kinda is to a pretty great extent to objectively discern skill. But sure, if you want to play that card, fine by me.

Infact your logic only applies to those that are relatively close in skill. UI ***** on Garou to the point where you can’t play this card

This is why… below is my reply to @Phoenks and @Bernkastelll. Both ignored it cuz they don’t really give af

Then prove it has evolved past Adult Goku and Master Roshi’s level of IR, besides UI and MUI.

Adult Goku feat before UI: BoG arc, Goku’s body subconsciously predicted that Beerus was going to attack and moved out of the way before Beerus could attack. Goku was confused as to why that happened, Beerus explained to Goku that it was due to his fighting prowess allowing him to react instinctively.

Master Roshi’s feat: performed an instinctive reaction feat greater than Battle of God Goku’s feat with Beerus. Someone Goku has far surpassed is capable of reacting to Jiren who Goku is struggling with. His Instinctive reaction was stated by Whis to be similar, yet a Far Cry from Ultra instinct’s capabilities.

Prove Garou has surpassed those two very impressive feats which are a way below baseline Ultra Instinct.

If you bullshit your way out of this one you still have to prove Garou covers the gap between those two feats and UI. Then prove Garou covers the gaps between Goku improving UI sign over time, then another gap where Goku masters UI, then you will have to keep bullshitting your way past his UI improvement thanks to Goku’s training with Merus in the Moro Arc, BS your way past the UI that decimated Moro, who copied UI and other fighters, Then you have Granola arc where Goku incorporates UI into his Base and improves it further with his transformations. (Granola became the strongest in the universe, He first attacks Goku and Vegeta with a weaker clone that is faster than them, attacks them, attacks them at full strength. Then Gas comes along and becomes the strongest in the universe to surpass Granola’s speed and strength to attack) an improved version of MUI Allowed Goku to keep up with Granola’s clone’s attacks (the clone is stronger and faster than both Goku and Vegeta), Goku improves, beats up the clone gets distracted and gets taken out by a sneak attack. Later on he wakes up and further improves to surpass the clone, and the real deal to match another character named Gas who is faster than Granola.


There is no way you can get Garou above Master Roshi and it’s not even possible to bullshit your way into these layers of UI.
Don’t disappoint me
Click to expand...
So now that I’ve given my opinion, I think I’ll just watch from the sidelines.

and troll
 
Chariot190 said:
T̵h̵e̵r̵e̵'̵s̵ ̵a̵ ̵g̵u̵i̵d̵e̵ ̵s̵t̵a̵t̵e̵m̵e̵n̵t̵ ̵t̵h̵a̵t̵ ̵s̵a̵y̵s̵ ̵C̵Q̵C̵ ̵h̵a̵s̵ ̵n̵e̵a̵r̵ ̵i̵n̵f̵i̵n̵i̵t̵e̵ ̵p̵o̵t̵e̵n̵t̵i̵a̵l̵ ̵c̵a̵n̵ ̵c̵a̵n̵ ̵c̵o̵u̵n̵t̵e̵r̵,̵ ̵a̵d̵a̵p̵t̵ ̵a̵n̵d̵ ̵a̵t̵t̵a̵c̵k̵ ̵i̵n̵ ̵n̵e̵a̵r̵l̵y̵ ̵i̵n̵f̵i̵n̵i̵t̵e̵ ̵w̵a̵y̵s̵
N̵i̵g̵h̵-̵I̵n̵f̵i̵n̵i̵t̵e̵ ̵S̵k̵i̵l̵l̵ ̵T̵i̵e̵r̵.̵ ̵W̵i̵t̵h̵ ̵l̵i̵k̵e̵ ̵1̵5̵ ̵u̵p̵s̵c̵a̵l̵e̵s̵.̵ 🗿
Click to expand...
CQC is a stupid name and Metal Gear more like Metal Gay. 🗿
 
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