• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100

when he kills the mob boss it isn't red, it is white
It's only white when he brings in the Mob Boss. It's red when he stops time before he brings in said Mob Boss.
What? NO, i didn't said that, i said that he can develop new powers.....i never claimed that he developed new haxes by altering his Time Skip, i don't even know how you got that from what i said
You necessarily must have, as the Dimension ability didn't exist for Hit until Epi.72.
Isn't "cage of time" said in the anime? if none of them are named, then that is ok, my point doesn't really change much without this little detail
No, it isn't. Hit just says "I'll put you in a time prison." (No caps.) It's only called Cage of Time in the Latin American Dub, apparently.
wdym? if i have a cake, of course i can eat it
Trruuuue.
seriously tho, the said problems i brought up "no one, not even Goku and Hit notice anything different between Hit's normal Time Skip and the supposed different version he supposedly developed in the middle of their fight" between others......not sure why you would ask me to read above when that has nothing to do with the problems i was talking about in the part you are responding
Again, literally Hit comments his Time Skip has improved. And Goku can't react to it when he literally is frozen.
and in the profile we have statements of him "getting stronger as his stance improves", also the whole point i gave of him vs SSJB and SSBK20 Goku, he factually HAS to have gotten stronger and faster else his clash with Goku makes no sense
No. That statement was about Time Skip. As I literally linked.
how is me pointing out that nothing treats the first instance of time travel time skip and the later on supposed time stop instance of time skip any different from one another me being incredulous? please point out my incredulity here, i can't see it
Because there's no evidence or logic to it. It's just "That seems wrong. So no."
Hit saying why changed his Skip doesn't change nor impossibilitates that his power rose as well, else why would Beerus, who can feel power levels via Ki sensing, say that he got stronger?
So did you not look at Piccolo, Vados, or Whis? Which he confirms? His power simply didn't rise. Also, Beerus was talking about Time Skip, because Hit changes his stances in reference to Time Skip. As I linked.
which is contradicted by him innitially getting overwhelmed by Base Blue Goku only to keep up with Blue Kaioken 10x Goku, which he innitially got blitzed by mind you, so if he doesn't grow in power in any capacity.......how do you explain?
He says he's overwhelmed without Time Skip. Which he then improves, and gets by. So, no. Also, Time Skip effectively nullifies any speed advantage, which is why Dyspo had to hit him prior to it's activation, not in the midst of it.
exept she never says that he is using the Time Skip there, but it is rather using the TIME he stored FROM said skips, there is a key difference there, he using the after effects of one technique to use for another technique, not that he is using the Time Skip itself
Time Skip is called Time Skip because of the fact he skips and stores time, one, but TWO, the Time Dimension he makes is ALSO called Time Skip because of this, and ALL he is DOING is SOLELY TARGETTING JIREN. There is NO OTHER DIFFERENCE. THUS, NECESSARILY, it MUST be TIME SKIP. ANY argument otherwise is just you not agreeing because there wasn't an explicit statement writing out what should be plainly obvious.
i see, i got confused by your wording is all, glad we could clear that up
Same.
dunno, it has been a time skip(no captions, i am not talking about the technique this time) between the U6 saga and their second rematch, so he must have figured out another ways to manip time, this is a classic time skip anime stuff where chars gain new abilities of screen, i don't need to prove what is stated to us
This is literally headcanon to handwave the literal WoG, his own statements, the statements after in the ToP, etc. in favor of Vados.
that is impossible since, outside of that Vados statement that would contradict this notion, both Hit and Goku say that he isn't using his Time Skip at all in their rematch, yet you are saying that all of his time abilities are the Time Skip, despite the fact that Goku, Vados and Hit himself say otherwise
...
Dude.
You literally just agreed the Dimension Shift is Time Skip, as it was stated in the ToP. Goku and Hit are commenting on Dimension Shift. Thus, one of these two data sets are wrong. However, given Hit CONFIRMs it is Time Skip in the ToP, that would take precedence. Also, it's simply more evidence that Time Skip is an umbrella term, like I've been claiming.
those would be both just inconsistencies with the narrative, as when those were introduced it was very well established that they were not the time skip at all
And given more answers favor EVERYTHING except Vados, SHE'S the outlier and should be written off. NOT vice versa. Hell, in 111 when Hit does the Phantasm to avoid a punch, Jiren calls it Time Skipping. Whis then does the VERBATIM SAME EXPLANATION as Vados (the pocket dimension. So more evidence they fall under the same name, as it is merely an application of his root ability.)
the fact that he shows new abilities, and that it is stated to not be his time skip, i already proved it
You didn't prove anything? What scans? What evidence? All you've done is said "No, Vados said-" to everything, even when she's being blatantly contradicted.
no, Hit, the guy who has the power, says the same as her, they AREN'T the time skip, and Vados was proven right in her explanation as what she described is what Hit did against Goku in that fight
No, she was contradicted. And also, even if we were to say she was retconning past events with her explanation (like Servantis did with Kevin 11 in OV), this would then be retconned by Toei Statements/Word of God.
i am talking about all the other points i showed before of how illogical that would be to everything this improvement is said to do + the "reaction to it" argument, you can't grab each sentence and separate on their own, you have to look at the whole
Again, lack of reaction means little. Especially since the only person who can react to it, did, and even claimed he was a Time Stopper when he reappeared later.exempt for Goku, Vados and Hit himself in the rematch
Vados' testimony is worthless (she's contradicted) and both Goku and Hit are contradicted later in the ToP, where Hit confirms it is Time Skip.
unless he gets faster when he improves, which as i stated, it is something that HAS to have happened for the clashes he has with Goku to make sense
He was able to adapt to Jiren's and Dyspo's attack speed and patterns without actually being as fast as them, so no. Similar to Roshi, his raw technique carries him, as verbatim said in U6VU7.
he time travels dude, he just time traveled to outside of the Beam's range + the speed amplification thing i keep saying that he has, you can't disconsider that since it is also an important point i am bringing
There is no speed amp.
we don't know that, we never see his face as Hit is hitting him unlike before, which he also didn't made a move at all to counter as Hit was attacking him, it just makes it seem like the speed raising is more likely, as it would be a matter of Goku being unable to react to him
Goku's face doesn't need to be seen? We know Goku's body reacts normally without seeing his face in all previous shots, like the .2 second barrage. Hell, even that moment makes little sense, because when Time Resumes Goku is back in his stance-Because he never left it. Then he keels over.
there is no "filler" in DBS Anime, not in the sense that would invalidate it in anyway at least, oh and also it isn't just her, Hit and Goku himself say otherwise, and the anime is priority, if outside sources contradict it, then it gets priority
Obviously it's a whole continuity it's own, but it's not apart of the main story. Answered the last bit already.
nope, those are my sincere feelings and thoughts towards this matter
Then your sincere feelings are literally injecting headcanon into events and ignoring verbatim statements. Hell, it's ironic-You're using Vados ONE statement to disprove a feat, but you won't let several statements disprove Hit's "increase in power." (that never happened). Literally self-contradictory logic.
 
even when hit uses his pocket dimension to hide vs jiren, at the top, champa and vados say that he is using time skip.

the same one he used against his and Goku's revenge
 
It's only white when he brings in the Mob Boss. It's red when he stops time before he brings in said Mob Boss.
Which then it is white again once he uses the dimension shift and time skip against Dyspo in the tournament, either way, the colors are not exactly consistent

You necessarily must have, as the Dimension ability didn't exist for Hit until Epi.72.
......i don't see how this answer what i said, when did i said that he had altered his Time Skip to do all of these other effects? At max i said he developted new abilities

No, it isn't. Hit just says "I'll put you in a time prison." (No caps.) It's only called Cage of Time in the Latin American Dub, apparently.
huh, well good to know, i am from latin america, so that must have been a confusioj on my part

Trruuuue.
yumy

Again, literally Hit comments his Time Skip has improved. And Goku can't react to it when he literally is frozen.
......again, don't see how this answer the part you are quoting, i have pointed other more likely posibilities based on facts we knew happened (hit jumping from bellow SSJB level to SSJBK level) idk why you are repeating this again on this part

No. That statement was about Time Skip. As I literally linked.
"His stance evolves as >he becomes stronger<"
That last one is talking about Hit's strenght, which is consistent with him seemingly growing to KK10xB level

Because there's no evidence or logic to it. It's just "That seems wrong. So no."
There is evidence, logical inconsistencies and statements i presented, you may not agree with them, but that doesn't mean they don't exist

So did you not look at Piccolo, Vados, or Whis? Which he confirms? His power simply didn't rise. Also, Beerus was talking about Time Skip, because Hit changes his stances in reference to Time Skip. As I linked.
which as i said, doesn't matter for the fact that Beerus said he fot stronger, the Bkk point i will say again later since you adressed it

He says he's overwhelmed without Time Skip. Which he then improves, and gets by. So, no.
which then he keeps up with Goku, which even normal kaiken was enough to blitz him completely, and then later on he reacted to several of Goku's attacks and harms him with his own despite being overpowered by blue alone earlier

Also, Time Skip effectively nullifies any speed advantage, which is why Dyspo had to hit him prior to it's activation, not in the midst of it.
It quite literally doesn't, Goku's predictions show as much since he can move in conjuntion to Hit's Skips to hit/counter him, which he complements when going Blue and asking Hit if he can keep up with his speed

Time Skip is called Time Skip because of the fact he skips and stores time, one, but TWO, the Time Dimension he makes is ALSO called Time Skip because of this
exept that himself and Goku said otherwise, and it is called Time Skip because it skips time, then Hit can store the time that is skiped and then manipulate it

and ALL he is DOING is SOLELY TARGETTING JIREN. There is NO OTHER DIFFERENCE. THUS, NECESSARILY, it MUST be TIME SKIP.
No? Don't see how him using the time he stored to target jiren would mean that it is the Time Skip

ANY argument otherwise is just you not agreeing because there wasn't an explicit statement writing out what should be plainly obvious.
Except we have explicit statements that it isn't

Cool

This is literally headcanon to handwave the literal WoG, his own statements, the statements after in the ToP, etc. in favor of Vados.
Says you ignoring his own statements that corroborades with Vados', also.......it isn't headcanon, he showed new stuff he didn't do before, therefore he developed new abilities.....what is so weird about that?

...
Dude.
You literally just agreed the Dimension Shift is Time Skip, as it was stated in the ToP.
No, i said i would have agreed if it wasn't for this evidence saying otherwise

Goku and Hit are commenting on Dimension Shift. Thus, one of these two data sets are wrong. However, given Hit CONFIRMs it is Time Skip in the ToP, that would take precedence. Also, it's simply more evidence that Time Skip is an umbrella term, like I've been claiming.
Why would 2 statement of the ToP get more precedence over 3 statements from when the ability was introduced?

And given more answers favor EVERYTHING except Vados, SHE'S the outlier and should be written off. NOT vice versa. Hell, in 111 when Hit does the Phantasm to avoid a punch, Jiren calls it Time Skipping. Whis then does the VERBATIM SAME EXPLANATION as Vados (the pocket dimension. So more evidence they fall under the same name, as it is merely an application of his root ability.)
good and all but, she can't be an outlier when Hit himself and Goku say otherwise, also in that scene nothing stops Hit from doing botj at the same time, one to avoid and the other to Hit jiren, which he fails as Jiren does like Goku and intercepts Hit mid skip, even then, again, why would the ToP take precedence over the arc where the Ability is introduced? This would also null Goku's statement of the Time Skip not working on him as, if you want to count dimensional shifting as Time Skip, then it would be contradictory as it has worked on Goku

You didn't prove anything? What scans? What evidence? All you've done is said "No, Vados said-" to everything, even when she's being blatantly contradicted.
all the other evide i brought? The other scans with statements? Pointing out situarions that favor said statements? Pointing out logical problems with your proposal? Like, this is a classic way to try and desmolorize your oposition "you didn't prove anything therefore i am right" but it doesn't work when i have proved my point, it just so happens that you don't agree with the proofs, which i am sure you must feel about me as well

No, she was contradicted. And also, even if we were to say she was retconning past events with her explanation (like Servantis did with Kevin 11 in OV), this would then be retconned by Toei Statements/Word of God.
Which have less credibility than the show itaelf, which takes precedence, also it is says that Time Skip stops time as a main function, which is conteadicted by the very first time it is used, also why do you keep ignoring the Hit and Goku statements i sent and keeps focusing on Vados'? Looks deaingenuous if you ask me

Again, lack of reaction means little. Especially since the only person who can react to it, did, and even claimed he was a Time Stopper when he reappeared later.
huh? No? I assume the one you are talking about is Goku, which he never says that, can you be more clear what you are referencing here?

exempt for Goku, Vados and Hit himself in the rematch
Vados' testimony is worthless (she's contradicted) and both Goku and Hit are contradicted later in the ToP, where Hit confirms it is Time Skip.
Vados is never contradicted after her statement, Hit's usage in the U6 saga is the one being contradictory to what it is said in later sagas, which you seem to be ok with using retcons as argument, in which case this "retcon" is never once contradicted later in the series

He was able to adapt to Jiren's and Dyspo's attack speed and patterns without actually being as fast as them, so no. Similar to Roshi, his raw technique carries him, as verbatim said in U6VU7.
which is not true since he straight couldn't see Goku moving due to the spees difference when he used basic Kaioken, which Goku then amped by 10x and then Hit is able to follow him with his eyes, briefly stay ahead of him in a chase and block several of his attacks, even clashin with his kamehameha directly

There is no speed amp.
there is

Goku's face doesn't need to be seen? We know Goku's body reacts normally without seeing his face in all previous shots, like the .2 second barrage.
which in this case also did once Hit punched his head, if you want to use that

Hell, even that moment makes little sense, because when Time Resumes Goku is back in his stance-Because he never left it. Then he keels over.
So the ability is self contradictory in its effects in usage is what you mean?

Obviously it's a whole continuity it's own, but it's not apart of the main story.
It is part of the main story, there is no "side quest" when all of it is canon

Answered the last bit already.
Wait did you? Legit question

Then your sincere feelings are literally injecting headcanon into events and ignoring verbatim statements.
I Could say the same to you, but let's keep it chill ok?

Hell, it's ironic-You're using Vados ONE statement to disprove a feat, but you won't let several statements disprove Hit's "increase in power." (that never happened). Literally self-contradictory logic.
I am using several statements and not only Vados', saying otherwise is nothing but a lie, and you also ignore the statements that he did increased in power, and the whole situation with SsjBK10x that proves it, with your logic also self contradicting itself
 
Okay I have a strange but honest question for you guys: Were you ever introduced to a band because of Dragon Ball AMVs or, if you're from the West, the American soundtrack of the Z era movies which included a number of rock and heavy metal bands in them?

I got introduced to the band Disturbed because of movies like Lord Slug and Cooler's Revenge, these scenes in particular being some of my most cherished Dragon Ball memories of all time. And even if some would argue that rock doesn't match the tone of the series, seeing the heroes or villains beating the shit out of each other with metal playing is raw as ****.
 
Honestly, on the topic of the hit, there is more evidence and support that time skip has different uses, such as stopping time, skipping time, and can create dimensions.

and the first time the ability was introduced it was called time skip, which stops time for 1 tenth of a second.

like at the top where Vados mentions that Hit uses time skip in every fight he has hit,

and Goku's vs hit is more of a clarification that the punch didn't use time skip or the time stop derived from it, since it doesn't work on Goku.
 
Okay I have a strange but honest question for you guys: Were you ever introduced to a band because of Dragon Ball AMVs or, if you're from the West, the American soundtrack of the Z era movies which included a number of rock and heavy metal bands in them?

I got introduced to the band Disturbed because of movies like Lord Slug and Cooler's Revenge, these scenes in particular being some of my most cherished Dragon Ball memories of all time. And even if some would argue that rock doesn't match the tone of the series, seeing the heroes or villains beating the shit out of each other with metal playing is raw as ****.
See, I'm in the unique position where my dad simply loved Dragon Ball and rock music, so I had all the bands and songs in my head AND the sick fights from movies in my head, as totally separate experiences. Of course, I didn't actually know them all, so he introduced me to any new ones I heard in a film. Like 10's by Pantera from the original Broly movie.
 
"Dragon Soul" is genuinely my least favorite opening theme in the entire franchise.
I prefer Kai's Ocean dub opening.
I mainly like it because of the dubbing in my country.


I like the voice more.

And there are some slightly different parts.

Like, "Dokkan Dokkan" was like, "Fly, come on, come with me!" (I'm using google translator)

And the "命に変えても守るよ" part it went like this "I will take you to the blue sky between the clouds"

As well as other cute things.
 
We gave Jiren resistance to the power of destruction for being able to defeat Toppo and Belmond, but can't we do the same for Zeno with the statement that no one can defeat him?

Why exactly?
Void Manipulation, Existence Erasure, Soul Destruction and Limited Spatial Manipulation (Stated to be able to best Toppo and Belmod in battle, and for them not to be able to beat him means he would have to resist the Power of Destruction to resist their attacks and bypass their Power of Destruction aura like Vegeta does)
 
We gave Jiren resistance to the power of destruction for being able to defeat Toppo and Belmond, but can't we do the same for Zeno with the statement that no one can defeat him?

Why exactly?
He is already Faster than everyone else and can Erase them before they do anything, also by that logic, why stop with them? why not give him resistance to everything in verse? Poison, all diseases, Radiation, Mind Manipulation, etc? like, you can try, people tried to argue before, didn't worked
 
He is already Faster than everyone else and can Erase them before they do anything, also by that logic, why stop with them? why not give him resistance to everything in verse? Poison, all diseases, Radiation, Mind Manipulation, etc? like, you can try, people tried to argue before, didn't worked
He couldn’t see Dyspo fight.
 
Btw I asked on the translation thread regarding the king kai statement and it turns king kai was talking about goku physically moving ahead by few seconds rather then mental

Post in thread 'Official Translation Requests Thread (New forum)' https://vsbattles.com/threads/official-translation-requests-thread-new-forum.107531/post-6525526

Post in thread 'Official Translation Requests Thread (New forum)' https://vsbattles.com/threads/official-translation-requests-thread-new-forum.107531/post-6525521
 
Btw I asked on the translation thread regarding the king kai statement and it turns king kai was talking about goku physically moving ahead by few seconds rather then mental

Post in thread 'Official Translation Requests Thread (New forum)' https://vsbattles.com/threads/official-translation-requests-thread-new-forum.107531/post-6525526

Post in thread 'Official Translation Requests Thread (New forum)' https://vsbattles.com/threads/official-translation-requests-thread-new-forum.107531/post-6525521
This is only in the context of predicting the enemy.

The phrase "何秒か先を読んでおったそうじゃな" has nothing to do with physically forcing yourself into the future

Mainly because "を読んで" seems to be "read". About the reading seconds into the future thing.

But my colleague who understands Japanese is off so I ask later.
 
Back
Top