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DCEU Shazam should be High 7-A (please someone move this to Content Revision)

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DarkDragonMedeus said:
I'm not sure why Shazam is as low as 8-C, but I don't think it's assumed Shazam is above Doomsday though I don't think he should be too much weaker.
Click to expand...
Because while Shazam has scaling potential all of his feats are magnitudes lower then scaling to the top and god tiers would actually imply. He doesn't meaningfully interact with the top tiers and is currently confined to his own scaling pocket whom all mostly have feats in this range. Wait for Black Adam and Shazam 2 before discussing upgrades.

As for this; the OP is blatantly ignoring the fact that neither Supes and Doomsday were at full strength when the nuke hit so at best this would make Shazzy High 7-C or so which is ignoring how this is basing an entire AP rating off an offhand line of dialogue from the arrogant supervillain Dr. Sivana. I agree Billy will likely scale higher but we shouldn't be using such loose reasoning to upgrade him.

This would be like making Base Thanos 5-C because he's stated "as the strongest being in the universe" based off Ego before Infinity War or Endgame came out; it simply is absolutely ridiculous. Again, I'm not saying he won't, I'm saying accepting that as absolutely the case now is arguing a case with evidence that no one has actually seen yet since the sources of that evidence has yet to even come out into cinemas with could either make or break this hypothesis.

Everything else we have is
  1. A one off statement which we are accepting as extending all the way to nukes
  2. A one off statement no one else could beat Sivana (hyperbolic as hell)
  3. A mention he's empowered by Gods even though Power Source should not equal output and that's ignoring the fact most of said Gods are featless with the exception of Zeus who is currently >> everyone else in the verse alongside Ares
Like if this was arguing based off guidebooks saying he's that strong or something I'd be fine with that but no it's not and I have no idea why this is currently getting the acceptance it is
 
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Hellbeast said:
Because while Shazam has scaling potential all of his feats are magnitudes lower then scaling to the top and god tiers would actually imply. He doesn't meaningfully interact with the top tiers and is currently confined to his own scaling pocket whom all mostly have feats in this range. Wait for Black Adam and Shazam 2 before discussing upgrades.

As for this; the OP is blatantly ignoring the fact that neither Supes and Doomsday were at full strength when the nuke hit so at best this would make Shazzy High 7-C or so which is ignoring how this is basing an entire AP rating off an offhand line of dialogue from the arrogant supervillain Dr. Sivana. I agree Billy will likely scale higher but we shouldn't be using such loose reasoning to upgrade him.

This would be like making Base Thanos 5-C because he's stated "as the strongest being in the universe" based off Ego before Infinity War or Endgame came out; it simply is absolutely ridiculous. Again, I'm not saying he won't, I'm saying accepting that as absolutely the case now is arguing a case with evidence that no one has actually seen yet since the sources of that evidence has yet to even come out into cinemas with could either make or break this hypothesis.

Everything else we have is
  1. A one off statement which we are accepting as extending all the way to nukes
  2. A one off statement no one else could beat Sivana (hyperbolic as hell)
  3. A mention he's empowered by Gods even though Power Source should not equal output and that's ignoring the fact most of said Gods are featless with the exception of Zeus who is currently >> everyone else in the verse alongside Ares
Like if this was arguing based off guidebooks saying he's that strong or something I'd be fine with that but no it's not and I have no idea why this is currently getting the acceptance it is
Click to expand...
What about the "Was said to be the only one strong enough to stop Sivana, despite the existence of other heroes such as Superman"
 
chosen said:
What about the "Was said to be the only one strong enough to stop Sivana, despite the existence of other heroes such as Superman"
Click to expand...
I believe I mentioned that; Supes wasn't mentioned by name and that's still taking the highest interpretation of the statement as absolute fact. We'll likely get Supes scaling anyway but this is not how we do it
 
Hellbeast said:
I believe I mentioned that; Supes wasn't mentioned by name and that's still taking the highest interpretation of the statement as absolute fact. We'll likely get Supes scaling anyway but this is not how we do it
Click to expand...
O wait missed that part
O well
He should for sure get high scaling after Black Adam and shazam 2 at least
 
I disagree for 2 reasons. One, we can't assume that man-made weapons = all weapons including nukes. Otherwise, we would have 7-B Homelander since its stated that "There is no weapon on Earth that could hurt him". You would have to prove that it is consistent with his other feats. And 2, the nuke is likely, not High 7-A, since their world mirrors ours, it should be 7-B at best, considering the Superman that got crippled was still weakened by Kryptonite, and Doomsday technically tanked it.
 
RanaProGamer said:
I disagree for 2 reasons. One, we can't assume that man-made weapons = all weapons including nukes. Otherwise, we would have 7-B Homelander since its stated that "There is no weapon on Earth that could hurt him". You would have to prove that it is consistent with his other feats. And 2, the nuke is likely, not High 7-A, since their world mirrors ours, it should be 7-B at best, considering the Superman that got crippled was still weakened by Kryptonite, and Doomsday technically tanked it.
Click to expand...
Hmmm, I see what you mean there, though that's not why Homelander isn't 7-B

Within the context of The Boys, we agreed on a thread that given how much care is put into the story and political themes of the show, it doesn't actually make sense that they'd test a nuke against him since that'd more than likely cause some issues. The statement regarding that may have come from Madelyn, but the page for Homelander even states it's most likely exaggerated and her safety was very much so at risk in that situation.

Regarding Shazam, however, he's got something to stand on
 
Bernkastelll said:
Nukes are man made weapons, so, yeah, we can, and if u have problems with homelander, bring it to another thread
Click to expand...
I don't have an issue with Homelander, I'm saying consistency wise, we don't have 7-B Homelander since he got incapacitated by 9-A characters. In this case, neither Shazam nor Sivana have feats that high to suggest High 7-A.
 
Pretty sure the reason Shazam Doesn't have any feat is cuz he isn't "haha destroy Mountain time"
Idk about captain
 
I mean I guess I could settle for 7-B for now, since looking back, none of the 9-B to 8-C destruction feats seemed to harm either Shazam or Sivana.
 
Vizer04 said:
Why not High 7-A?
Click to expand...
Cuz neither Supes nor Doomsday were High 7-A at that point, Supes was heavily weakened by kryptonite and he only went back to full strength after getting sunlight. Doomsday after getting nuked proceeded to get stronger and then fought WW and peak Supes. So 7-B seems the most reasonable by real-world standards for nukes. I mean Supes went from High 7-A to getting knocked out by 9-A attacks from Batman due to kryptonite, so he didn't recover all of his strength up until after he received sunlight.
 
Bernkastelll said:
Not an anti-feat, as it was Sivana who throwed him, but when several cars crashed into Shazam, he wasnt hurt, meaning that it was Sivana strength that hurt him
Click to expand...
Except Sivana has no feats above this level that implies he’s as strong as this thread argues

Again wait for the sequels to come out dude; were arguing off evidence that isn’t out yet
 
Hellbeast said:
Except Sivana has no feats above this level that implies he’s as strong as this thread argues
Click to expand...
He doesnt need ''''feats'''' as he has statements, and your ''anti-feat'' is not even real in first place
Hellbeast said:
Again wait for the sequels to come out dude; were arguing off evidence that isn’t out yet
Click to expand...
The evidence can be found in Shazam movie, man made weapons are unable to hurt them
 
Hellbeast said:
Because while Shazam has scaling potential all of his feats are magnitudes lower then scaling to the top and god tiers would actually imply. He doesn't meaningfully interact with the top tiers and is currently confined to his own scaling pocket whom all mostly have feats in this range. Wait for Black Adam and Shazam 2 before discussing upgrades.

As for this; the OP is blatantly ignoring the fact that neither Supes and Doomsday were at full strength when the nuke hit so at best this would make Shazzy High 7-C or so which is ignoring how this is basing an entire AP rating off an offhand line of dialogue from the arrogant supervillain Dr. Sivana. I agree Billy will likely scale higher but we shouldn't be using such loose reasoning to upgrade him.

This would be like making Base Thanos 5-C because he's stated "as the strongest being in the universe" based off Ego before Infinity War or Endgame came out; it simply is absolutely ridiculous. Again, I'm not saying he won't, I'm saying accepting that as absolutely the case now is arguing a case with evidence that no one has actually seen yet since the sources of that evidence has yet to even come out into cinemas with could either make or break this hypothesis.

Everything else we have is
  1. A one off statement which we are accepting as extending all the way to nukes
  2. A one off statement no one else could beat Sivana (hyperbolic as hell)
  3. A mention he's empowered by Gods even though Power Source should not equal output and that's ignoring the fact most of said Gods are featless with the exception of Zeus who is currently >> everyone else in the verse alongside Ares
Like if this was arguing based off guidebooks saying he's that strong or something I'd be fine with that but no it's not and I have no idea why this is currently getting the acceptance it is
Click to expand...
Completely agree with this. Giving Shazam Top Tier status and ratings because of some doubtful statements is a no no. Dude has only one movie and no feats. Wait for Black Adam and Shazam 2. Even a "possible" or "likely" ratings is ridiculous.
 
M3X said:
Completely agree with this. Giving Shazam Top Tier status and ratings because of some doubtful statements is a no no. Dude has only one movie and no feats. Wait for Black Adam and Shazam 2. Even a "possible" or "likely" ratings is ridiculous.
Click to expand...
He has some of Zeus' power.
 
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