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Cataloging Tier 4 and Up Post-Crisis Feats

Alan Scott checks out.
The 50 Keplar Supernovas one is actually much less impressive if ISL is taken into account
Well, obviously not a real black hole, but he is outwrestling a baseline 4-B attack
The "Universal statement" is exclusive to Wally's true Infinite Mass Punch that would have been a suicide attack. But the Relativistic Mass Punch that Superman scales from comes from an outdated calculation. Matt's version was something multiple calc group members agreed Gwyn's calculation was more accurate. Although there was another re-calc that got like 2 kilofoe iirc.
John Stewart also checks out yeah.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Alan Scott checks out.
The 50 Keplar Supernovas one is actually much less impressive if ISL is taken into account
Well, obviously not a real black hole, but he is outwrestling a baseline 4-B attack
The "Universal statement" is exclusive to Wally's true Infinite Mass Punch that would have been a suicide attack. But the Relativistic Mass Punch that Superman scales from comes from an outdated calculation. Matt's version was something multiple calc group members agreed Gwyn's calculation was more accurate. Although there was another re-calc that got like 2 kilofoe iirc.
John Stewart also checks out yeah.
Click to expand...
What ISL?

The "true" IMP is the same one speedsters use, Superman too. There's also more statements of it being infinite mass than white dwarf star
 
ISL stands for Inverse Square Law. For example, imagine an insect surviving a speeding car; the insect doesn't fully scale from the impact because only a very small portion of the kinetic energy actually struck the insect. Same applies to Superman surviving supernovas.

Actually Superman can't perform the real Infinite Mass Punch because he lacks the "Infinite Kinetic Energy" required to do so. There are some writers who called the Relativistic Mass Punch the Infinite Mass Punch but they aren't quite the same. What all speedsters use instead is the Relativistic Mass Punch, the one that's only 4-B.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
The 50 Keplar Supernovas one is actually much less impressive if ISL is taken into account
Click to expand...
Actually... no.

The story itself states that Superman only took the initial neutrino burst in its full form, which would nuke it down to 99% the original power of the explosion (IIRC actual IRL neutrino bursts nuke away 99% of the actual yield, which means Superman only gets hit with 1% of that energy. AKA Superman would only be High 4-C, also the actual ball of radiation right behind that neutrino burst would kill Superman and effectively fry him if the Lanterns didn't save him.

DarkDragonMedeus said:
But the Relativistic Mass Punch that Superman scales from comes from an outdated calculation. Matt's version was something multiple calc group members agreed Gwyn's calculation was more accurate.
Click to expand...
That's what Superman scales to ATM, the corrected 1 kiloFOE IMP. Which Flash also scales to when he keeps his KE under check with the Speed Force. Otherwise without limitations he is High 3-A as per his page.

DarkDragonMedeus said:
Although there was another re-calc that got like 2 kilofoe iirc.
Click to expand...
That's Post-Flashpoint, New 52.
 
I believe Amelia calc'd some other Green Lantern feats that wield decent 4-B to 4-A results but ATM I think we treat Lanterns being well above Superman so not sure if Supes would scale to those.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Actually Superman can't perform the real Infinite Mass Punch because he lacks the "Infinite Kinetic Energy" required to do so. There are some writers who called the Relativistic Mass Punch the Infinite Mass Punch but they aren't quite the same. What all speedsters use instead is the Relativistic Mass Punch, the one that's only 4-B.
Click to expand...
Scans?

KLOL506 said:
I believe Amelia calc'd some other Green Lantern feats that wield decent 4-B to 4-A results but ATM I think we treat Lanterns being well above Superman so not sure if Supes would scale to those.
Click to expand...
He's stronger than almost all of them
 
KLOL506 said:
Actually... no.

The story itself states that Superman only took the initial neutrino burst in its full form, which would nuke it down to 99% the original power of the explosion. AKA Superman would only be High 4-C, also the actual ball of radiation would kill Superman and effectively fry him.
Click to expand...
Well, tanking 1% of it or 0.5 Foe is still much less just not something like comparing his body to the surface area of an actual star/supernova. But fair.
KLOL506 said:
That's what Superman scales to ATM, the corrected 1 kiloFOE IMP. Which Flash also scales to when he keeps his KE under check with the Speed Force. Otherwise without limitations he is High 3-A as per his page.
Click to expand...
That's more or less what I mostly said save...
KLOL506 said:
That's Post-Flashpoint, New 52.
Click to expand...
Nvm on that point then.
 
XXKINGXX69 said:
Scans?
Click to expand...
Same scan as the one where Flash performs the feat against Zoom.

XXKINGXX69 said:
He's stronger than almost all of them
Click to expand...
Eh, no. Hal Jordan is undoubtedly stronger than Superman at peak (Prolly due to some Tier 2 Lantern shenanigans). Most other Lanterns scale to him. IIRC we had a CRT declaring the Lanterns to be well above Superman at their peaks and having some additional Tier 2 justifications as well.
 
XXKINGXX69 said:
Scans?
Click to expand...
It was discussed multiple times on multiple threads. And it was FanofRPGs who did most of the research but it should be on some of the archived threads.
KLOL506 said:
I believe Amelia calc'd some other Green Lantern feats that wield decent 4-B to 4-A results but ATM I think we treat Lanterns being well above Superman so not sure if Supes would scale to those.
Click to expand...
Well, both Superman and Green Lantern have variable tiers depending on battery like charges; Solar radiation in Superman's case and Green Lanterns ring being charged by the corps + their Willpower. Not sure about the 4-A stuff being accepted but some galaxy level and above feats are extremely unity dependent. Usually, a single Green Lantern is only capable of 4-B stuff. Though it is fairly consistent for Hal Jordan to be above Superman given he single handedly lifted a planet sized Spectre when the combined might of Superman, Wonder Woman, Shazam, Martian Manhunter and many others couldn't.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
Well, both Superman and Green Lantern have variable tiers depending on battery like charges; Solar radiation in Superman's case and Green Lanterns ring being charged by the corps. Not sure about the 4-A stuff being accepted but some galaxy level and above feats are extremely unity dependent. Usually, a single Green Lantern is only capable of 4-B stuff. Though it is fairly consistent for Hal Jordan to be above Superman given he single handedly lifted a planet sized Spectre when the combined might of Superman, Wonder Woman, Shazam, Martian Manhunter and many others couldn't.
Click to expand...
Isn't it necessarily based on their willpower more than their battery charge tho?
 
Confluctor said:
How and why?

If anything, this is LS feat at best. And not a really good one either - compared to the scaling he has at least
Click to expand...
LS scales to AP for Superman. He was the one preventing it from growing large enough to consume the solar system
 
And can someone move this to content revision? The purpose of this is to list more feats on their profiles for consistency and to see if they can get higher into 4-B
 
It would be best to wait for all the relevant information to be collected prior to making a full proposal on the CRT thread.
 
XXKINGXX69 said:
LS scales to AP for Superman. He was the one preventing it from growing large enough to consume the solar system
Click to expand...
Why don't you calc this mini black hole, which was too small to do any damage, calc it, and then find a proper LS value for supes, eh? At least it will be better than the current scaling.
 
Confluctor said:
How and why?

If anything, this is LS feat at best. And not a really good one either - compared to the scaling he has at least
Click to expand...
Lifting strength and AP are statistics that can be intertwined. Physically preventing something from growing big enough to consume a solar system should count for both. I'm not really following this logic.
 
CosmicWreck said:
Lifting strength and AP are statistics that can be intertwined.
Click to expand...
I am well aware
CosmicWreck said:
Physically preventing something from growing big enough to consume a solar system should count for both. I'm not really following this logic.
Click to expand...
Yes, I know that, but can you calculate the mass of this small black hole? If not, then it's not usable. And I don't think you will get anything as impressive as even stellar LS from this tiny almost non existent black hole.

Also, if you don't feed the black hole anything, how would it even grow? That's essentially wahts happening here.
 
Confluctor said:
Why don't you calc this mini black hole, which was too small to do any damage, calc it, and then find a proper LS value for supes, eh? At least it will be better than the current scaling.
Click to expand...
Its LS equivalent to pushing back an attack that can destroy the solar system. And it was too small because Superman was restraining it
 
No, the burden of proof is on you to prove superman was holding back a black hole that weighed more than an entire solar system.
 
johns feat isn`t 4B. He just recreated the matter in the solar system. The GBE of that is High 4C when including the sun.
 
XXKINGXX69 said:
Where does it say it has to absorb things to destroy the solar system?
Click to expand...
It literally comes from the "memories" of that black hole, if it instantaneously devoured the solar system then Superman wouldn't have said anything about cities being ripped apart or continents being destroyed. If it really was instant, then Superman would have literally seen nothing.
 
Another_Council said:
It literally comes from the "memories" of that black hole, if it instantaneously devoured the solar system then Superman wouldn't have said anything about cities being ripped apart or continents being destroyed. If it really was instant, then Superman would have literally seen nothing.
Click to expand...
I didn't say it was instant
 
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