Barragan Vs Law

[Deceived3596]

Just like i stated in the Composite Hollow Vs Composite One Piece thread.

I'm creating this thread so people who still wan't to debate this point has an out-lit to do so since i'm banning this point (And the Sonido Point) in the Comp H Vs Comp OP thread.

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SBA
Stats Equalized (Attack Potency, Durability and Speed)
No Reiatsu Crush GG

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Baraggan Louisenbairn

Vs

Trafalgar Law

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Room gets Aged and AppleLord's Graph becomes true: Arc7Kuroi, AppleLord

Room doesn't get Aged and Nightmare stays in school: MonkeyOfLife

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Baraggan can age abilities, nothing states that Room is immune to being aged to infinity, I don't see why Room doesn't get aged here. Count me for the false king of Hueco Mundo.

 

[Kachon123]

Baraggan can age abilities, nothing states that Room is immune to being aged to infinity, I don't see why Room doesn't get aged here. Count me for the false king of Hueco Mundo.

Room isn't something physical, or something that seems to have an age?

 

[Loyd]

oh i missed out on some heated debate

i don't think its physical but if law placed a room down does it have a timer or can it last forever?

 

[AppleLord]

Barragan still solos.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

You would need to affect or slow law to age ROOM

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Obs haki + ROOM destroys... That is something law does at the beginning

 

[T2KBaka]

Actually I do agree with arc, I haven't seen anything about room's age being eternal, if law dies or is KO'd it's gone.

Room isn't something physical, or something that seems to have an age?

Kido isn't always physical either.

You would need to affect or slow law to age ROOM

That's one way, but I don't see why the actual ROOM itself can't be affected by respira. I saw your arguments earlier, but I wasn't really convinced.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

That's one way, but I don't see why the actual ROOM itself can't be affected by respira. I saw your arguments earlier, but I wasn't really convinced.

The room itself has no reason to age... Law is the one keeping it open, why would it affect something that's not supposed to age and something that can't be interacted with even to those who can touch intangible beings? Room can always be open depending on the user, you would need to target the user.

Kido is literally a thing that is stated to age

Plus is something he can interact with....


Also law will know that he can age things via precog, law is quite intelligent and can come up with a plan to defeat him. Voting law

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Monkey it's on you to prove that Room doesn't age not the other way around. Baraggan yeets out a Respira tsunami and KOs Law.

 

[Loyd]

Room is listed as spatial manip its not physical has barragan aged away something like that?

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Monkey it's on you to prove that Room doesn't age not the other way around. Baraggan yeets out a Respira tsunami and KOs Law.

Sure... ROOM is a type of space

The psychic Trafalgar Law
He is the leader of the strange space, ROOM.
"ROOM" is an enigmatic space that is divided into several parts.

A type of Space can't be aged.

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Monkey it's on you to prove that Room doesn't age not the other way around.

And no, it's on you to prove he can age something that can't be interacted with, to even people that can interact with intangibles.


Edit: Oh yee, arc you know Japanese I think. Could you translate it? What does divided into several parts/layers even mean?

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

A type of Space can't be aged.

We actually can’t say that for certain. We don’t know what will happen when the universe ends/if it ends, meaning that even space may have an expiration date.

And no, it's on you to prove he can age something that can't be interacted with, to even people that can interact with intangibles.

I’ve got no comment here more or less. I can’t claim to be a super well versed with OP, but it sounds like you’re overselling the fact that of course people aren’t running around grabbing at air (unless you’re Whitebeard).

Edit: Oh yee, arc you know Japanese I think. Could you translate it? What does divided into several parts/layers even mean?

You can send me the scan to my discord but I’m rather busy with university atm so I can’t promise a timely response.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

We actually can’t say that for certain. We don’t know what will happen when the universe ends/if it ends, meaning that even space may have an expiration date.

Well he has never been shown to be able to age space itself, assuming he can is quite NLF and he even states things that get old is what he affects, space doesn't get old

I’ve got no comment here more or less. I can’t claim to be a super well versed with OP, but it sounds like you’re overselling the fact that of course people aren’t running around grabbing at air (unless you’re Whitebeard).

Armament haki can interact with intangible things.... Not only that but law himself can interact with spirts/souls yet he can't affect his ROOM.

Someone who can alter and interact with reality didn't even try to do anything against law

You can send me the scan to my discord but I’m rather busy with university atm so I can’t promise a timely response.

Nah, it's ok. I can find someone else

 

[T2KBaka]

The room itself has no reason to age... Law is the one keeping it open, why would it affect something that's not supposed to age and something that can't be interacted with even to those who can touch intangible beings? Room can always be open depending on the user, you would need to target the user.

Kido is literally a thing that is stated to age

Plus is something he can interact with....


Also law will know that he can age things via precog, law is quite intelligent and can come up with a plan to defeat him. Voting law

Just because you say room doesn't have a reason to age, doesn't mean it's proof tho. I can say room has no reason to not age. You need to prove that room is supposedly eternal. If anything we see evidence against this since Law dying or being KO'd stops it.

Even with precog, he's weaker than Barrigan and slower. I would like to see anything saying something about room being eternal. If not, then I have no reason to believe that barrigan can't age it.

Kido is also intangible as well (depending on what it is), so barrigan aging room doesn't seem to far fetched.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Just because you say room doesn't have a reason to age, doesn't mean it's proof tho. I can say room has no reason to not age. You need to prove that room is supposedly eternal. If anything we see evidence against this since Law dying or being KO'd stops it.

Even with precog, he's weaker than Barrigan and slower. I would like to see anything saying something about room being eternal. If not, then I have no reason to believe that barrigan can't age it

he has never been shown to be able to age space itself, assuming he can is quite NLF and he even states things that get old is what he affects, space doesn't get old

 

[Loyd]

.

It doesn't really matter barragan doesn't have a feat of decaying space iirc and all stats are equal

 

[T2KBaka]

he has never been shown to be able to age space itself, assuming he can is quite NLF and he even states things that get old is what he affects, space doesn't get old

Yeah you got a point there actually, if it's just space then I guess Barrigan can't do it since it would be an NLF.

In this case then, he Sonido's behind law, touches him, and decays him

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

In this case then, he Sonido's behind law, touches him, and decays him

Law Precogs and attacks first..

 

[T2KBaka]

Law Precogs and attacks first..

His precog isn't as strong as Luffy's or Katakuri's, regardless his attacks can be dodged, like how Doflamingo dodged them. Although I do see Barrigan just standing there and trying to tank it. So it could go depending on how Barrigan acts.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

regardless his attacks can be dodged, like how Doflamingo dodged them.

Doflamingo has superiors obs haki, is faster and resists laws devil fruit abilities

 

[T2KBaka]

Doflamingo has superiors obs haki, is faster and resists laws devil fruit abilities

That's also true, I guess in this situation the speed advantage doesn't matter since everything is equalized.

 

[PrinceofPein]

I agree with monkey saying barragan can age space is a big NLF

 

[AppleLord]

On the original post, I already debunked space not been able to age and @MonkeyOfLife conceded. He left the conversation and never replied to my arguments. Besides he failed to prove that the Room technique was eternal. Room having a time limit means is not eternal. Otherwise, Room AoE would still be up in the same space today and affect anyone who enters it. Barragan ages “time” on anything that can age. Is not NLF, is just his power.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Stop. Being. Biased.

He can't age space itself without proof... He names things that can grow old and die, Space doesn't get old

Also when did I concede?

I left the conversation many times because I'm not gonna waste my time trying to prove his ability won't work on room when the thread was hollows vs one piece

Besides he failed to prove that the Room technique was eternal.

Don't need to

Barragan ages “time” on anything that can age. Is not NLF, is just his power.

Space don't age.

 

[AppleLord]

So no scans for Room been eternal? Respira. GG

Room can't resist/tank respira aging without proof.

 

[PrinceofPein]

So no scans for Room been eternal? Respira. GG

Room can't resist/tank respira aging without proof.

I think you are the one that needs to bring proof that barragan can age space itself something he can’t as far as I am aware

 

[AppleLord]

I think you are the one that needs to bring proof that barragan can age space itself something he can’t as far as I am aware

I already provided proof in the other thread that space can age. No one here has provided proof that Room is eternal. Space has a long life span but space was created and has been aging since its creation and atoms are destroyed and others continue on to fuse with others and continue strectching space. All space is made of, density of particles, predominantly a plasma of hydrogen and helium, as well as electromagnetic radiation, magnetic fields, neutrinos, dust, and cosmic rays age. Even gas, dust, a wind of charged particles from the stars, light from stars, cosmic rays, radiation left over from the Big Bang, gravity, electric and magnetic fields, and neutrinos from nuclear reactions. All of this can age. Barragan power is "time" and Room is shown to not be eternal. It has a "time" limit. Fictional example: Law can't active Room in chapter one of One Piece on Cake Island and we go and visit Cake Island on chapter 3,000 and find out the Room Law left there killed some people when they walked in the area he left it in. Room is limited by Law's stamina. Matter of fact, room doesn't even kill people, bruh, even if it affects Barragan it won't do anything. Respira doesn't need hand gestures it comes from his mouth, body, axe, etc. Barragan also doesn't have a heart.

 

[PrinceofPein]

and do you have scans of barragan aging space?

 

[SnookB]

and do you have scans of barragan aging space?

It exists in the Bleach they read. Clorox.

So no scans for Room been eternal? Respira. GG

Room can't resist/tank respira aging without proof.

Barragan's respira needs to "touch" things to age them. It needs to touch Kidou and riatsu techniques because it's made of an energy that Barragan can interact with. His aging ceased the second soifon's arm was removed, and his aging doesn't deteriorate the air around him, or the air itself. Everything he names is technically tangible and ages, deteriorates or flits away. Devil fruits house "elements" and "abilities", they aren't "things that have abilities exclusive to them", they carry the representative of an ability.
Law's fruit creates a "Spherical SPACE". It's intangible. It goes through walls without effect, goes through targets without effect, and even through Haki, which should literally stop it because HAKI COUNTERS THAT. Yet Room isn't effected.
Room itself is a space. The ABILITIES IN IT are Law's creation, yes. Room doesn't need to resist it because Room IS. NOT. THERE.
Room is just a space. An intangible space. Room isn't there, the bubble is just an effect that shows its AOE. I don't even care about this debate but you're either not knowledgeable or intentionally ignorant to the fact that you refuse to see how redundant your claim sounds.

YOU said it yourself, right? "Space" is composed of aging things. AIR is also just hydrogen, carbon dioxide, etc.. All things that aren't eternal. So prove everyone wrong the easiest way:

A scan of Barragan aging Space itself. Or at the very least the atmosphere around him with Respira.

If it exists, then the logic of air aging works on Room and I concede.

 

[AppleLord]

It exists in the Bleach they read. Clorox.



Barragan's respira needs to "touch" things to age them. It needs to touch Kidou and riatsu techniques because it's made of an energy that Barragan can interact with. His aging ceased the second soifon's arm was removed, and his aging doesn't deteriorate the air around him, or the air itself. Everything he names is technically tangible and ages, deteriorates or flits away. Devil fruits house "elements" and "abilities", they aren't "things that have abilities exclusive to them", they carry the representative of an ability.
Law's fruit creates a "Spherical SPACE". It's intangible. It goes through walls without effect, goes through targets without effect, and even through Haki, which should literally stop it because HAKI COUNTERS THAT. Yet Room isn't effected.
Room itself is a space. The ABILITIES IN IT are Law's creation, yes. Room doesn't need to resist it because Room IS. NOT. THERE.
Room is just a space. An intangible space. Room isn't there, the bubble is just an effect that shows its AOE. I don't even care about this debate but you're either not knowledgeable or intentionally ignorant to the fact that you refuse to see how redundant your claim sounds.

YOU said it yourself, right? "Space" is composed of aging things. AIR is also just hydrogen, carbon dioxide, etc.. All things that aren't eternal. So prove everyone wrong the easiest way:

A scan of Barragan aging Space itself. Or at the very least the atmosphere around him with Respira.

If it exists, then the logic of air aging works on Room and I concede.

Intagibilty to Bleach character is fodder. Episode 1 souls have intangibility. How can you claim it can't age because is "space" yet you say it isn't made of the stuff "space" is made of that do age. Can you provide a scan of what "space" is Room made of so I can provide a scan of Barragan aging it? Otherwise, is a barrier until proven otherwise. Hashi's barriers are like Orihime's shields and they are intangible to intagible beings, yet Orihime and Barragan can affect it.

 

[SnookB]

Intagibilty to Bleach character is fodder. Episode 1 souls have intangibility. How can you claim it can't age because is "space" yet you say it isn't made of the stuff "space" is made of that do age. Can you provide a scan of what "space" is Room made of so I can provide a scan of Barragan aging it? Otherwise, is a barrier until proven otherwise. Hashi's barriers are like Orihime's shields and they are intangible to intagible beings, yet Orihime and Barragan can affect it.

They're still made of energy Barragan can interact with using respira.

I'm not putting words in your mouth here:

All space is made of, density of particles, predominantly a plasma of hydrogen and helium, as well as electromagnetic radiation, magnetic fields, neutrinos, dust, and cosmic rays age. Even gas, dust

Space is made out of things that eventually run out.
And so is air.
So
Scan of Barragan aging air or the atmosphere, so we can safely believe you about him aging Room's space. No need for overcomplication and constant back and forths, all you need is a single scan and we'll all be wrong.

 

[AppleLord]

They're still made of energy Barragan can interact with using respira.

I'm not putting words in your mouth here:


Space is made out of things that eventually run out.
And so is air.
So
Scan of Barragan aging air or the atmosphere, so we can safely believe you about him aging Room's space. No need for overcomplication and constant back and forths, all you need is a single scan and we'll all be wrong.

How do we know Barragan can't age air? No one can stand close to him and live long enough to find out air is not been aged. So that argument is not a good counter-argument. You said it yourself, "he can age anything that can age".

Law can’t affect things he can’t see and Barragan is a soul. Can Law see souls?

 

[Kazuma_kuwabara]

Voting Law because "Room" sounds cooler than "Respira"

 

[AppleLord]

Putting Room and Respira aside, Barragan can still counter Room - Spiritual Awareness (Can see invisible spirits and objects), Immortality (Type 2: Barragan can survive after having half of his head blown off), Self-Sustenance (Type 1 & 2: Barragan had most if not all of his Skin, Muscles and Internal Organs aged away, including his brain while in Resurreccion but can still function perfectly without them), Limited Spatial Manipulation (Gran Rey Cero is so powerful that it disrupts the surrounding space), Can take his reiryoku and exert it as reiatsu, Dimensional Travel and Portal Creation with Descorrer, BFR (With Caja Negación), Time Dilation (Can reduce the speed of any target which comes near him with Senescencia), Corrosion Inducement, Durability Negation and Age Manipulation (Can accelerate the age of whatever he touches, causing the appropriate damage which comes with aging. Can age and deteriorate every object around him in Resurrección. Can dissolve Kidō using Respira), Regeneration (Low with Resurrección), Soul Manipulation (Arrancar and Hollows can extract and consume souls), Forcefield Creation (Over Age and Time manipulation. He has a different power covering the surface of his body that repelled his own power), Invisibility, Non-Physical Interaction (Can harm and interact with intangible spirits and objects), Overwhelming Aura (Spiritual pressure can passively induce ailments ranging from paralysis to fear inducement),

Barragan has many ways of countering Room without Respira. Room doesn't even kill its target.

 

[SnookB]

How do we know Barragan can't age air? No one can stand close to him and live long enough to find out air is not been aged. So that argument is not a good counter-argument. You said it yourself, "he can age anything that can age".

Law can’t affect things he can’t see and Barragan is a soul. Can Law see souls?

A: did he name air
B: Does he have a showing of aging air, considering IT'S ALL AROUND HIM and he should be leaving pockets of vacuums if not full on distortions and big holes of void in the space he exists in
If not, then there's your answer.

Law can effect souls. We see it as he swaps the straw hats souls via Jinkaku Ishoku Shujutsu. Yes it's called "personality" swap, but he clearly literally switches the characters ENTIRELY to be in other characters' body, even have their consciousness, not just changes personalities.
Law should have at least life sensory via kenbunshoku, as we see Usopp seeing the life energy of Luffy, Law and Sugar before locking on them, and he shouldn't be better than Law considering Usopp had JUST UNLOCKED IT when he did that.

Now here's a question
If Barragan died via his respira subject being teleported into his body, what stops Law from
"Room"> "Shambles" a rock inside Barragan's body and he gets done over like he did in the canon?

 

[SnookB]

Putting room and respira aside for the lack of evidence? I'll assume that's conceding. Like I said, I didn't want to debate Law vs Barragan, just Respira vs Room. If there's no evidence of it doing what it should do to interact with Room, then that's that.

 

[AppleLord]

Putting room and respira aside for the lack of evidence? I'll assume that's conceding. Like I said, I didn't want to debate Law vs Barragan, just Respira vs Room. If there's no evidence of it doing what it should do to interact with Room, then that's that.

You do know it in his profile that Barragan can interact with "intagible objects" like Room.

 

[AppleLord]

A: did he name air
B: Does he have a showing of aging air, considering IT'S ALL AROUND HIM and he should be leaving pockets of vacuums if not full on distortions and big holes of void in the space he exists in
If not, then there's your answer.

Law can effect souls. We see it as he swaps the straw hats souls via Jinkaku Ishoku Shujutsu. Yes it's called "personality" swap, but he clearly literally switches the characters ENTIRELY to be in other characters' body, even have their consciousness, not just changes personalities.
Law should have at least life sensory via kenbunshoku, as we see Usopp seeing the life energy of Luffy, Law and Sugar before locking on them, and he shouldn't be better than Law considering Usopp had JUST UNLOCKED IT when he did that.

Now here's a question
If Barragan died via his respira subject being teleported into his body, what stops Law from
"Room"> "Shambles" a rock inside Barragan's body and he gets done over like he did in the canon?

He said all that can age which you also stated. And air ages. Don't back track on your own words. The author not drawing it or mentioning it is irrelevant to the fight where it wouldn't had even matter going with Respira's range. Nobody would had been affected by it.

He needs to deactivate Room for that move. Room puts things inside a green barrier square thingy.

 

[SnookB]

You do know it in his profile that Barragan can interact with "intagible objects" like Room.

Keyword on "objects", not open spaces. Interacting with intangible things made out of reishi or intangible techniques like Kidou is a NAMED THING meant for the Shinigami he's fighting.
Interacting with space is different. Again. No proof.

He needs to deactivate Room for that move. Room puts things inside a green barrier square thingy.

"Shambles" needs Room to work. If Law notices Respira is erasing everything, he'd teleport a rock that's under Respira effect into Barragan's body and that's that.
Before you say "he doesn't send attacks back", we saw him re-teleport bullets back at their senders as well. His abilities within Room are so potent they can ignore durability and even operate on a molecular level to remove entire viruses from people.
Barragan has no means of resisting his own Respira, or avoiding it getting popped inside his body instantaneously.