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Actual YGO card game discussion thread: Firewall did nothing wrong
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No, the ultimate meme is OTKing a Final Countdown player turn 19 :^)
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"I do not agree that splashability and consistency are themselves indicative of degeneracy in yugioh, the main feature in my view is removing player interaction which Zoo was not guilty of outside of arguably fusion sub."
You forgot rising the ceiling, which is a major factor when 99% of the time that means making a "nope" board.
You forgot rising the ceiling, which is a major factor when 99% of the time that means making a "nope" board.
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It has to be a dark fiend your opponent owns so you can't do something like give them Radian and attack it, but using lair of darkness + DNA surgury would work
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You can just give them something with Summon Sorc
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FTFYFirst Witch said:
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Oh yeah, I gotta look into that one. Maybe you can't give them the monster with Summon Sorc in which case this card is even worse lmaoPaChi2 said:
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What's the most controversial card y'all would want at 3?
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Snatch Steal. OTKs for days.
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Gryphon is gonna be a problem, I swear. When the time comes I hope it's the big Knightmare who takes the hit and not Curious or Beatrice. There's literally nothing I like about Gryphon...a floodgate that sets another floodgate that is at its best when you're also functionally floodgating your opponent with an extra link. Think about it: the extra link is the most fair part of this scenario. I dislike this card as much as I dislike Gumblar.
Snatch Steal is controversial because of the mythos behind the one format where it was brought back and then banned immediately after. Its brokenness has become more and more exaggerated over time while the game has progressed to a point where it's not more broken than many many cards currently at 3.
Painful Choice is just absurd buuut I definitely understand wanting it back. Imagine playing ABC and sending each piece, mali, and destrudo or something silly like that.
Unsurprisingly, my top picks are like Grass and TGU, maybe Avarice. Graff, Cir, and Beatrice are controversial but at the end of the day while there are many players who don't want those cards at 3, very very few players actually believe it would break the game. Some people think multiple Beatrice would but even with that, even with 3 Mali, a deck designed to turbo multiple Bea is much weaker than it sounds on the face of it..I might put a couple to a few hours into building a decklist to show what I mean. There are so many garnets that you need a high deck count but not enough power cards to justify it. You'd be better off playing Danger Sekka BA with no defensive cards and a Thunder Dragon engine. Wait, maybe I'll build that lol.
Also, back on controversial cards on the F/L list, I do have a soft spot for pre-errata Chaos Emperor Dragon.
Snatch Steal is controversial because of the mythos behind the one format where it was brought back and then banned immediately after. Its brokenness has become more and more exaggerated over time while the game has progressed to a point where it's not more broken than many many cards currently at 3.
Painful Choice is just absurd buuut I definitely understand wanting it back. Imagine playing ABC and sending each piece, mali, and destrudo or something silly like that.
Unsurprisingly, my top picks are like Grass and TGU, maybe Avarice. Graff, Cir, and Beatrice are controversial but at the end of the day while there are many players who don't want those cards at 3, very very few players actually believe it would break the game. Some people think multiple Beatrice would but even with that, even with 3 Mali, a deck designed to turbo multiple Bea is much weaker than it sounds on the face of it..I might put a couple to a few hours into building a decklist to show what I mean. There are so many garnets that you need a high deck count but not enough power cards to justify it. You'd be better off playing Danger Sekka BA with no defensive cards and a Thunder Dragon engine. Wait, maybe I'll build that lol.
Also, back on controversial cards on the F/L list, I do have a soft spot for pre-errata Chaos Emperor Dragon.
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Yata would do absolutely nothing until one day some archetype is released that makes it a massive problem
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YA-TA! YA-TA! YA-TA!!
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Nor does his entire archetype.
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I think it's very well designed, also this is happening
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Cherubini is coming to TCG in May!!!
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Dunnos bout Noodlefiba
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Good.
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Personally, I'd like it if Null Nun never came to TCG.
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Honestly, I like Null Nun as a card.
I just don't like it when they make good archetype support cards OCG exclusives.
I just don't like it when they make good archetype support cards OCG exclusives.
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That would be ideal.
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FINALLY!
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Yeah, so I'm not gonna lie I don't like Null Nun as a card in general. It makes going second worse and would seem to benefit the best decks and the worst decks at the expense of viable rogue but the real reason I think it should stay in OCG is because of the current TCG end of match procedures. Conceptually, I'm not a fan of cards remaining OCG exclusives especially over long periods of time but this specific card is going to cause so much toxicity and further encourage stalling. Honestly, I'm unironically considering siding Reficule in BA because the BAs, Dangers, Gallis, etc.. just special summon themselves so it probably wouldn't be tough to go for the kill that way especially with Dangers (and I'm currently running 3 Jackalope, 3 Snek, and 2 Nessie) and Sekka's Light drawing me into more cards. It's the kind of thing that just sounds silly on the face of it but just might actually be good. People thought playing Gammas was bad when the idea was first being floated around and we all know how damn good that card is.Litentric Teon said:
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I mean, I'm still with PaChi here, I don't think OCG or TCG exclusives should be a thing, at all. We already get things later than them. It doesn't make sense for people to get stuff late and be limited in what they get.
I like Null Nun because, unlike Maxx C, it doesn't give you any actual card advantage. It's always a neg one when you use it unless you're playing something like aroma. All it really does is stop an OTK. It honestly can help any deck. It stops slower decks and control decks from being OTKd. And helps those same OTK decks stay in the game against other OTK style decks. Life points are typically just used as a resource nowadays anyway. And seeing how certain decks can consistently pump out over 8000 attack a turn, if they take the challenge they'll probably wipe out a good portion of that life anyway. I like the design of this card more than maxx C. Maxx C was such blatant advantage that if you didn't win that turn, you were practically guaranteed to lose. With Null Nun, worst thing that happens is that you have a crap ton of life points. Which, while it is a resource, doesn't change the number of cards in your hand, aside from the obvious neg one. So if someone opened a brick, now they have less cards to break that brick. And no maxx C to undo that brick for them. And if they opened amazing, now they opened slightly less amazing because they have null nun, but they probably can't get OTKd, so they'll likely get an extra card when they draw next turn. We'll see how it turns out, but I like the rather unique design.
I like Null Nun because, unlike Maxx C, it doesn't give you any actual card advantage. It's always a neg one when you use it unless you're playing something like aroma. All it really does is stop an OTK. It honestly can help any deck. It stops slower decks and control decks from being OTKd. And helps those same OTK decks stay in the game against other OTK style decks. Life points are typically just used as a resource nowadays anyway. And seeing how certain decks can consistently pump out over 8000 attack a turn, if they take the challenge they'll probably wipe out a good portion of that life anyway. I like the design of this card more than maxx C. Maxx C was such blatant advantage that if you didn't win that turn, you were practically guaranteed to lose. With Null Nun, worst thing that happens is that you have a crap ton of life points. Which, while it is a resource, doesn't change the number of cards in your hand, aside from the obvious neg one. So if someone opened a brick, now they have less cards to break that brick. And no maxx C to undo that brick for them. And if they opened amazing, now they opened slightly less amazing because they have null nun, but they probably can't get OTKd, so they'll likely get an extra card when they draw next turn. We'll see how it turns out, but I like the rather unique design.
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LP are just used as a resource and typically they don't matter if you're not in time but all of a sudden, it becomes an issue if you're giving your opponent 35k and now need 3+ more turns to kill them. OTK decks run out of steam pretty quickly and all the decent ones have SOME sort of play to make going first and establish interruption, that's how they stay in the game and in any case, you'd never play this in an OTK deck because it's a card that does nothing for your wincon and is only good if you're in a losing position or both you and your opponent have it in hand. I don't even think the card is that good especially not now with Sky Striker and Altergeist so prevalent...it also does very little to Gumblar handloop (it buys you time but not enough to compensate).
Anyway, as I've said already..my huge issue with the card has to do with end of match procedures. For that reason I'd honestly rather have Maxx "C" back lul
Anyway, as I've said already..my huge issue with the card has to do with end of match procedures. For that reason I'd honestly rather have Maxx "C" back lul
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Honestly, that seems less of an issue with the card, but more of an issue with the end of match procedures. It seems to make more sense just to hold issue with the end of match procedures, lol.
I'm not sure about Maxx C coming back, lol. Guess we'll see.
I'm not sure about Maxx C coming back, lol. Guess we'll see.
