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8-B Brackets Round 11

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Dargoo_Faust

Dargoo_Faust

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Eleventh round of the 8-B Brackets Begins! The winner of the last round was Let Dahaka, or at least Metro Man was disqualified.

Current Standings

Hub

The contenders for this round are the Itsuwa, submitted by DontTalkDT, and Ouma Kurogane, submitted by FirePhoenixearl.

Any of Ouma's magic/attacks above 8-B are restricted. Speed is equalized, battle takes place in the spellbreak map, 10 meters apart.

Itsuwa is 27.68 Tons, I think Ouma is 43 Tons being 1/10th of that feat.

Itsuwa - 1 (DontTalk)

Ouma Kurogane - 3 (Fire, Litentric, Zara)

Incon -

LN Vol 8 illustration 06
2423caf8b26bdaf7e91412fc8ea31958
 
eh bugger it. I'll cast the first stone.

Ouma's main stuff is creating barriers and making himself invisible. His stat amping helps but unless it is quantifiable it isn't a huge advantage.

Depending on the usage of her explosion manip, Itsuwa could have a direct counter to invisibility- that is, just bombariding the area to kingdom come. Since this is the haxless bracket I assume mind manip is either shit-tier or OoC so I will be ignoring it. Healing is a possible match to barrier creation since it allows repair of damage whereas forcefields prevent it.

All in all I consider it close but, and this is assuming stuff takes roughly the same amount of actions to perform, I think I hand it to explodey girl. An 8-B size explosion vs invisibility should be a victory for the former.
 
I guess it depends on how in character it is for Itsuwa to just blow everything up. If she can't see Omua, then would she actually just blow up everything randomly in the hopes of hitting him?

If not, it seems more likely that he gets close and absolutely destroys her in CQC.

I also wouldn't say stat amping isn't helpful, as it allows him to more easily react to and outpace the explosions. This also helps if it's in character for her to just blow up everything regardless of whether or not she knows the opponent is in the vicinity.

Not voting yet, but giving thoughts.
 
I'd usually start poking people to vote here like DontTalk and Firephoenix, although since I'm at work now I can't really post anything significant.
 
Can someone confirm the 43 tons ranking being correct?Just asking to be sure. Next we have to debate what Ouma can even use. Kusanagi would be restricted, 'cause Low 7-C.

His wind barrier apparently also seems to have Multi-City Block level+ feats, so his wind magic should probably indeed be restricted entirely.

Mr. Bambu said:
Since this is the haxless bracket I assume mind manip is either shit-tier or OoC so I will be ignoring it.
Click to expand...
Mandala: A diagram with complex patterns that makes one think about the nature of the universe and the principles of the gods. When the patterns are rearranged it allows for the user's desired image to be sent to the viewer's head. In short: an illusion magic, though it can also be used to insert ideas into an enemy's mind such as "My curse spell has been analyzed and a countermeasure could be used to turn the curse back at me, so I won't use it".
Her mind manipulation is good enough to give an opponent stupid ideas, but that's it. That said, illusions are a good counterpart for invisibility.


Another thing to point out is that Itsuwa operates under ecchi-anime logic. That is, due to the Damage Transfer Charm her clothing are destroyed before she takes larger physical damage. Until she's nude she can probably more or less tank what Ouma dishes out.

Seven Blades of Seven teachings are ideal to find an invisible opponent.


Gonna give a better response later today, 'cause I gotta go to uni now.
 
So her mindhax doesn't allow a win but it does draw attention and distract. Interesting, that would also work heavily in her favor.
 
43 Tons is from the person being 1/10th as powerful as someone with a 430 Ton feat.

Firephoenix would have to confirm this, however.
 
I'll wait until someone else shows up to vote.
 
I believe Ouma borderline stomps here.

1. Ouma is superior to 96.76 tons from being a 10th ofthis feat. So even through AP that makes it almost a stomp.

2. Ouma's forcefield is what he always starts with and it makes him heavier, and more durable. Ikki Kurogane's 8-B could BARELY pierce the forcefield and that's with his strongest attack. All other attacks were getting completely negated including ones from Stella Vermillio before she went balls to the walls with 8-A AP. The forcefield is not a literal forcefield btw, it's just a really REALLY dense layer of air that prevents most attack from reaching Ouma's skin so it can be bypassed with enough AP but it cannot break as the air will reform itself.

3. 8-B explosions are nothing new to Ouma, trust me Stella Vermillio tried and her explosions far surpass Itsuwa's.

4. If push comes to shove, Ouma will just release the forcefield (Tenryuu Armor) which will release the dense wind creating omni-directional winds which blew away even a 8-B Stella Vermillio (would have blown her far beyond the ring if the bars hadn't been there), but that's not all. Releasing the tenryuu armor means Ouma just got serious, and by that i mean his stat amp kicks in. He fights in a restricted form due to the dense air he has around him, when that's gone he starts blitzing people who were faster than him like Stella and he also started physically destroying Stella who showed to be stronger than him before this amp (by destroying i mean he literally just started blitzing and kicking her into the walls, a literal stomp until she went 8-A).

5. Under normal circumstances Ouma would usually open up with Vacum Blades (invisible air slashes), so that would take care of the clothing part along with Oxygen Manipulation.


@DT

Nah his barrier is not any higher than 8-B (I mean his barrier is 8-B, likely 8-A same as how his physical stat is, but since we'r assuming 8-B Ouma, his barrier would be 8-B as well).

And a weaker kusanagi would still be usable. Dargoo said that Low 7-C abilities were restricted and as i explained, Kusanagi is as strong as he wants it to be (unless it's the 3rd shot which will be weaker).

I not only vote Ouma, but i believe he almost stomps here. His FAR superior AP (almost 4x) and durability along with the air forcefield basically remove win conditions for Itsuwa. Even her Illusion Manip won't be any good against his oxygen manip (cus he only needs to activate it, not keep it up all the time). That + the fact that a LOT of his attacks wouldn't care about illusions (like defensive wind magic, or tenryuu release). I believe that i've covered all of Itsuwa's arsenal.
 
Before getting to anything else: @Dargoo what does restricted mean?

Does restricted mean he does not get to use this techniques or that he holds back with the power of them until they are 8-B?
 
Well i don't think it makes sense that restricting a low 7-C attack, would restrict 8-B versions of it. Kusanagi itself doesn't have a set AP limit, it's dependant on how much magic he puts on it. It's just the full power Kusanagi that has a set AP, which we can restrict.
 
I don't think Ouma stomps through AP alone. It's like a 4-5 times difference. But I do think he takes it for phoenix's reasons. Ouma not only has good long ranged options, but those options can easily help him close the distance and just destroy in CQC through skill alone, regardless of AP (considering she's only a little over 2x baseline). Itsuwa would be overwhelmed up close.

That being said, isn't only 8-A AP restricted? Would 8-A forcefields be allowed?
 
Well Dargoo said Stone Walls are not allowed, and a 8-B dude with a nigh-invincible 8-A forcefield is a bit eh...you know. xD

That's 2 for ouma then.

Though i do believe 4x difference is a quite big AP advantage. Counting in his several omni-directional attacks, defenses and stat amp (speed and AP). If not a stomp then i feel like this is pretty decisive for Ouma.
 
I restricted any use of abilities that would surpass 8-B. From the sound of it if his forcefield negates other 96 Ton attacks it should just be 8-A even regularly, which would be restricted in this case.

Ouma's AP is still kind of a mess to work with, as if I'm not mistaken "Low 7-C with Magic" means that his magic is normally Low- 7-C, meaning that restricting any non-8-B attacks would just remove his magic from the fight.
 
Not exactly. A 96 ton Ikki could still pierce it with his intetsu. He passed the air barrier and got to Ouma's skin (which means he bypassed the 8B forcefield).

Not exaclty. His strongest ability (Kusanagi) in it's absolute strongest form is low 7-C. Not even other Kusanagi's are Low 7-C. As Ouma himself stated Kusanagi's strength drops by the 3rd use (to about 8-B level the characters could actually neg it).

Other stuff like Oxygen manip don't have AP obviously.

Vacuum Slashes were cut by Ikki using Raikou (8-B ikki).

So to sum up, no. It's not his magic attacks that go up to low 7-C, it's only his full power Kusanagi, anything else is fair game by the rules. You can even check the calc of low 7-C ouma, it is done specifically on Kusanagi. So basically:

Vaccum Slash is 8-B

Forcefield is 8-B

Only Full Power Kusanagi is Low 7-C. So restricting anything Low 7-C would only restrict full power Kusanagi, the amount of mana he puts into Kusanagi affects the potency.
 
@Firephoenixearl: Didn't you mention him tanking Stella's attacks with the forcefield?

That aside, as said, if his wind magic isn't low 7-C his profile needs to be changed first. Cause by current profile it is.
 
DontTalkDT said:
@Firephoenixearl: Didn't you mention him tanking Stella's attacks with the forcefield?
That aside, as said, if his wind magic isn't low 7-C his profile needs to be changed first. Cause by current profile it is.
Click to expand...
Yes stella, he tanked her hits "UNTIL" she went 8-A on him and brutally destroyed him.

Depends, the calc for low 7-C is still with Kusanagi, and as the profile says:

Kusanagi (µ£êÞ╝¬Õë▓Òéèµû¡ÒüñÕñ®Ú¥ìÒü«Õñºþê¬ lit., Moon Severing Sky Dragon's Talon): Ouma's strongest Noble Art. By condensing his magic into Ryuuzume, Ouma can compress the surrounding air into his Device,
 
His profile should state Low 7-C with Kusanagi then, not Low 7-C with wind magic.
 
If that is the consensus amongst the people that know the series do that. I will get to debating once that is done (or soon, whatever comes first).
 
Im the only one who has read the novels (from what i know). And Ouma is a novel character.

Anyway for now we agree Ouma takes this?
 
>it's not his magic attacks that go up to Low 7-C

>profile says Low 7-C with magic

why can't people just make more comprehensible profiles
 
Uhhh...

So let me understand.

Dude has forcefields that the strongest attacks of a 8-B could barely pierce. He can also remain invisible with this forcefield on.

When forcefield goes off, he gets a Speed Amp to the point of blitzing people that were faster than him. He also gets so strong his opponent had to jump a tier to defeat him handily.

Maybe I am not used to the brackets, but I feel unsure how "fair" Ouma is for these brackets.
 
LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
Uhhh...

So let me understand.

Dude has forecefields that the strongest attacks of a 8-B could barely pierce. He can also remain invisible with this forcefield on.

When forcefield goes off, he gets a Speed Amp to the point of blitzing people that were faster than him. He also gets so strong his opponent had to jump a tier to defeat him handily.

Maybe I am not used to the brackets, but I feel unsure how "fair" Ouma is for these brackets.
Click to expand...
....yeaaa.
 
He's still nothing that op. I mean the high 8c brackets had the beheaded as fair, ouma is a baby to him. Besides he's just physically strong for his tier, he's got like no hax besides the basic invis which he doesn't airways rely on. So there's nothing making him exceptionally unfair. Just a strong and durable dude. He's also pretty have cus fun fact: even though he looks skinny af he actually weights around half a ton due to his skin and none density xD
 
Dargoo Faust said:
>it's not his magic attacks that go up to Low 7-C

>profile says Low 7-C with magic

why can't people just make more comprehensible profiles
Click to expand...
Code: 
Wait did i say that? I must have said it wrong, i meant not ALL magic attacks are low 7c.
 
To be fair, it's mostly just because he's high into his tier. That's like saying Haru isn't fair because another 7-B couldn't get through melforce's repulsion when Haru is like 2 megatons away from being 7-A.

Ouma just has really good AP, and is superior to another 8-B with solid AP. His statistics amplification doesn't seem to be anything insane, but rather, something that enhances his already insane sword skill. His forcefields seem like they can be beaten either with danmaku or piercing attacks, which I'm sure many characters have. Repeatedly bombarding his barrier would likely get through it, it's just that Ouma isn't going to be standing still while it's happening.
 
Firephoenixearl said:
Wait did i say that? I must have said it wrong, i meant not ALL magic attacks are low 7c.
Click to expand...
No, his profile says that.

Fix this plz
It's rather annoying when you're arguing one thing on this thread and the profile says another thing, just saying. And if Ouma's profile needs to be CRT'd or reworked I'd rather just not have him in the bracket because it will be a chore to debate him.
 
Yeah, Ouma is fair. Everything mentioned is AP and a tiny bit of versality.

Anyone remember the 7B brackets? Haru Glory would have ap stomped over half of the entire bracket, this in comparison is fair.
 
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