Zenless Zone Zero Discussion Thread

[PandaCooler]

Actually, has anybody calc'd Nicole's Ether bomb?

I'm pretty sure the teasers/Demos are canon.

So this should be something to make note of

 

[Naito-desu]

The explosion looks like it takes up both lanes which would roughly be 7 meters (taking into account the average width of a two-lane expressway), so roughly in the ballpark of 9-B to 9-A because using explosive yield calcs would yield a pretty low value but if it destroyed those cars it can go higher

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

9-B~9-A ZZZ is where I've had them in mind for the cast.

I'm pretty sure the teasers/Demos are canon.

I'm sure they can be taken as canon.

Anby's that you linked includes part of the events of the prologue that led the CH involved with the Red Fang gang and getting stuck in that Hollow in the first place.

And the others can be taken as stuff that happened before like Grace's or even during the main story but in their own time like Koleda and Ellen.

 

[Jimmy.robinson.5099]

Finally got around to playing the newest update. Wish I knew anything about calcs and scaling so that I could help make profiles...

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Same...

Best I can do is just "lowballing" the stuff by what I see and making a rough guess where they are and via scaling/statements.

 

[Naito-desu]

I can help with the calcs if needed it's how I've been estimating all the feats we've had lol

 

[Naito-desu]

Rewatched the campaign again to gather feats and it's a shame that most of the important tidbits are in the TV mode.

 

[Infinity_Dragon]

Rewatched the campaign again to gather feats and it's a shame that most of the important tidbits are in the TV mode.

A feat that stayed in my mind from my play through was First form Dead End Butcher easily destroying walls from a distance to reach the Cunning Hares.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Rewatched the campaign again to gather feats and it's a shame that most of the important tidbits are in the TV mode.

Probably. I forgot some stuff happens in TV Mode cuz it's on the corner of my screen xD

But some stuff also do happen in cutscenes like this

A feat that stayed in my mind from my play through was First form Dead End Butcher easily destroying walls from a distance to reach the Cunning Hares.

Even though it's in a sort of comic-style way, but we at least get shown the damage happening to get an idea.

 

[Naito-desu]

I can estimate the size of the hole based on the New Eridu metro, just need to get a wall and I think we're good?

Need a consensus but does it look like two or three layers of walls were broken?

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

I can estimate the size of the hole based on the New Eridu metro, just need to get a wall and I think we're good?

Need a consensus but does it look like two or three layers of walls were broken?

I can clearly see two walls broken down.

I would think there's three? But the space between the CH's and DEB is hard to make out with the way the panel cutscene is drawn. If I had to be safe, I'd say two walls are down but again, it's hard to kinda tell and even for a non-calc guy like, I'm really eyeballing it based on the width of the wall closest to CH's and sorta comparing it to the space leading up to the DEB's side of the walls.

 

[Mand21]

How strong are the verse feats currently? Do any character have pages? Sorry for showing up out of nowhere.

 

[Naito-desu]

I've compiled and roughly calculated some, we're looking at Small Building level so far for Agents of the verse. Haven't done speed yet, though.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Small Building ZZZ is where I see them at tops atm, with probably Miyabi and the Voidhunters (at least the ones more combat-oriented) being higher.

Speeds more unknown I guess? Everyone is superhuman of some extent, others moreso than another.

The ones to come to mind being:

Spoiler

• Soldier 11 being able to deflect and parry bullets both in her Agent story and character teaser animation.
• Grace being able to react to and outrun/keep up with machine gun fire in her Agent story.
• Miyabi doing some burst-speed like movements, and I think this is something she can do with or without her Shikigami like thing with her if I'm interpreting her 1.5 interlude cutscene right.
• Billy perceiving a bullet in slow mo in his animation trailer (Only a perception based feat, he didn't really dodge it or anything though that's either because he was focused on monolouging that whole time or just didn't have the speed to move out of the way had it really been directed to hit him. Probably for both reasons if anything. If anything else, it could be a really big outlier)
• Caesar has her char demo fighting and moving around while dodging gunfire.
• Ellen's char demo has her deflecting bullets, and Ellen in the main story proper has her also cutting down flying RPG's/mini missiles(?) as well as maneuvering around them while they're in flight.
• Qingyi in 2.5 interlude cutscene has her deflecting crossbow bolts.

These are the ones that come to mind when it comes to speed.

 

[Mand21]

I've compiled and roughly calculated some, we're looking at Small Building level so far for Agents of the verse. Haven't done speed yet, though.

Is 9-A for run of the mill fodder, or 9-A for the strongest agents?

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Depends on who counts as "fodder" and as "top agents".

 

[Infinity_Dragon]

I think 9-A will count for most, even the “weaker” members of most of the current Factions as they all fight as a team and I doubt the difference between the weakest and strongest is as big as a tier difference at the moment.

The only fodder in know will be regular Ethereals and maybe most higher end Elite human enemies as I don’t think I’ve seen anything that puts the say strongest human Elite/Boss enemy as comparable/superior to say a Guardian mech or a strong Ethereal such as Dulluhan.

The only Faction I’m unsure has 9-A or above scaling is PubSec as I can’t remember if Zhu Yuan and Qingyi defeated any notably tough Ethereals while chasing that one guy in the story and the Jane story mainly dealt with human enemies if I recall correctly.
Have yet to do Qingyi agent story so I don’t know if she has a notable feat there.

 

[Jimmy.robinson.5099]

I think 9-A will count for most, even the “weaker” members of most of the current Factions as they all fight as a team and I doubt the difference between the weakest and strongest is as big as a tier difference at the moment.

The only fodder in know will be regular Ethereals and maybe most higher end Elite human enemies as I don’t think I’ve seen anything that puts the say strongest human Elite/Boss enemy as comparable/superior to say a Guardian mech or a strong Ethereal such as Dulluhan.

The only Faction I’m unsure has 9-A or above scaling is PubSec as I can’t remember if Zhu Yuan and Qingyi defeated any notably tough Ethereals while chasing that one guy in the story and the Jane story mainly dealt with human enemies if I recall correctly.
Have yet to do Qingyi agent story so I don’t know if she has a notable feat there.

Depends: how heavy is a Bangboo? Because Qingyi might have a decent lifting feat depending (keyword: MIGHT).

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

I think 9-A will count for most, even the “weaker” members of most of the current Factions as they all fight as a team and I doubt the difference between the weakest and strongest is as big as a tier difference at the moment.

The only fodder in know will be regular Ethereals and maybe most higher end Elite human enemies as I don’t think I’ve seen anything that puts the say strongest human Elite/Boss enemy as comparable/superior to say a Guardian mech or a strong Ethereal such as Dulluhan.

The only Faction I’m unsure has 9-A or above scaling is PubSec as I can’t remember if Zhu Yuan and Qingyi defeated any notably tough Ethereals while chasing that one guy in the story and the Jane story mainly dealt with human enemies if I recall correctly.
Have yet to do Qingyi agent story so I don’t know if she has a notable feat there.

Yeah, this is what I figure. The Cunning Hares (Nicole/Anby/Billy) all fought the DEB Ethereal together, even onto its empowered form which the fact they're even still standing and able to fight means they all have to be pretty tough even if they did it as a team.

Same. Regular Ethereals are constantly beaten by the Agents regularly and I'd imagine maybe some human enemies can to even if they can go in and out of the Hollow to do stuff. Although there isn't anyone that particularly stands out outside of someone like Razor and this one new guy Pompey (hypothetically speaking).

PubSec (at least the one of Zhu, Qing, and Seth), they didn't really fought any Ethereals afaik. Just human enemies and all. Same for the Jane side story event. There is that Razor guy and all but even he got beat by Seth and Jane working together.

Qingyi's Agent story isn't any different. The only other notable thing is her carrying a bunch of Bangboo out of the Hollow, and I believe that's also while she was gradually losing power to be active in getting out of there too. Not sure if that means much but she did something notable for that one towards the end.

 

[Sooshirohl]

how would you guys rank the factions in terms of overall strength? i think it's pretty safe to say that at least as of right now, pubsec is probably the weakest seeing as how they're the only faction who didn't have to deal with fighting a cracked out ethereal. narratively i think ZZZ's setting up section 6 to be the strongest namely cause of miyabi and the fact that they're constantly fighting against nivenah, but outside of that, i think all of the factions are actually pretty relatively close in strength.

the dead end butcher probably has the best on screen showings which helps the cunning hares but victoria housekeeping also seemed very confident in their ability to dispatch of them. belobog has some crazy physical monsters with ben, anton, and koleda, and the sons of calydon are also pretty strong in their own right. i guess if i had to rank them right now i'd probably go with

section 6 > victoria housekeeping >= cunning hares > belobog heavy industries > sons of calydon > pubsec

there's also the possibility of obol squad being pretty strong too considering soldier 11 should at least be relative to anby but we literally know nothing about them yet so can't really say anything there

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

I'd say put Belobog and Cunning Hares as = and that's pretty much it. Mainly that the Belobog Construction Gang DID fight that "Sacrifice" Monster when it merged with three of their (at least what I see) finest machinery, and we do know ofc Anton being able to stop a charging machine and Ben OHKO that same machine.

I do think Public Security gang COULD be stronger but insofar, all of their dealings have been with human criminals (tough ones, but still human) so they're unfortunately low on the ladder pole atm.

Section 6 is definitely the strongest of the playable (at the time of this post) factions we got not only with Miyabi being a Voidhunter and her colleagues being not so inferior as they also fight with her, but they're pretty much one of the main fighting forces constantly thrown into what's pretty much Ground Zero for ZZZ's general setting.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

New teaser just dropped owo

Summary:

• Yanagi special episode (Basically just like the Jane Doe/Pub Security side story)
• Lighter Agent story addition
• A bunch of new events
• Additions to existing gameplay and rewards

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

On a sidenote, I just had the thought to recheck 2.5/Public Security story, and Zhu Yuan and Qingyi DO in fact actually fight some Ethereals while chasing after a criminal.



2:25 onwards

They fought the bigger type Ethereals, and later on a bunch of normal Ethereals.

So the playable Public Security units are strong enough to also handle Ethereals themselves. But I would think they're still the weakest if not that weak to everyone just because they've yet to fight something potent like the transformed Pompey and that one particular Ethereal Lighter one punched and then easily fought with Caesar and Billy, the Twin Ethereals that seem pretty tough for Victoria Housekeep, the DEB Ethereal the Hares fought, the Sacrifice fused machined Belobog fought, or much less the Nineveh and other Ethereals Section 6 and other possible units fight.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Some Yanagi stuff



Harumesa Drip marketing. Moving animation is here, which is used for chars like Qingyi, Caesar, Burnice, etc. to indicate an Agent is an S rank.

He's also, if I got the symbols right, an Electric Attacker.

Man if I can get myself another electric attacker, I'd be golden. Anton's really been carrying me on that front for electric attackers xD

 

[Sooshirohl]

just got finished with yanagi's special episode and it was great. i really love the interactions and dynamic between section 6, and the premise of the episode was pretty cool too. was really nice to see section 6 shine, espeicially yanagi and miyabi, both of them were really cool in this episode. the episode also gave us some pretty good feats for section 6 characters (mainly miyabi and yanagi)

Spoiler: SPOILERS FOR THE YANAGI SPECIAL EPISODE :

- Soukaku mentions that oni livers have "detox functions" which lets her eat food that's gone bad
- Miyabi slices a piece of candy into four pieces as it's thrown from behind her by Harumasa
- Yanagi reacts to a sudden attack from Soukaku and manages to hold her back
- Yanagi knocks out Soukaku, Miyabi, and Harumasa with quick strikes
- Yanagi moves several feet in an instant and stabs a monster through the chest
- Yanagi throws her naginata across a gap and it lands hard enough to puncture the floor and slightly crack it
- Miyabi cuts up multiple ethereals simultaneously and in doing so also precisely cuts a raindrop clean in two
- The timeline is a bit confusing but I think the implication is that Miyabi was fighting off monsters and ethereals for an entire day straight with seemingly little rest
- Miyabi also sprains her hand holding herself back from attacking Yanagi which also implies that she was fighting nonstop while injured
- I'm not sure if the implication here was that Yanagi was actually slowing down time or if the cutscene was emphasizing how fast she reacted. In either case, she dodges a point blank attack from a Miyabi clone and cuts her. The resulting force of the attack creates a shockwave that slightly damages a (virtual) building and also momentarily halts the rain
- Miyabi recovers from being turned into a bangboo and then proceeds to blitz a clone of herself that was about to attack Yanagi
it's important to note that although all of these feats take place in a virtual world, things like object weight and the character's physical characteristics seem to mirror the real world, as soukaku says that it "feels just like the outside world," harumasa comments on the candy having a realistic weight, and miyabi commenting that her weapon feels perfect.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

In case anyone didn't watch this yet. Another world-setting build to ZZZ.

 

[Woomica]

In case anyone didn't watch this yet. Another world-setting build to ZZZ.

omg blood in hoyoverse games!?

 

[Sooshirohl]

omg blood in hoyoverse games!?

ZZZ has a higher age rating than the other hoyoverse games iirc which is why the in game stuff is more explicit (blood, cursing, etc.)

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

On a sidenote, I also just finished Yanagi's special episode. It's nice to see even an "elite squad" like Section 6 has their own quirks. The meme of Yanagi being a mom, especially with her char animation teaser is so real.

just got finished with yanagi's special episode and it was great. i really love the interactions and dynamic between section 6, and the premise of the episode was pretty cool too. was really nice to see section 6 shine, espeicially yanagi and miyabi, both of them were really cool in this episode. the episode also gave us some pretty good feats for section 6 characters (mainly miyabi and yanagi)

Spoiler: SPOILERS FOR THE YANAGI SPECIAL EPISODE :

- Soukaku mentions that oni livers have "detox functions" which lets her eat food that's gone bad
- Miyabi slices a piece of candy into four pieces as it's thrown from behind her by Harumasa
- Yanagi reacts to a sudden attack from Soukaku and manages to hold her back
- Yanagi knocks out Soukaku, Miyabi, and Harumasa with quick strikes
- Yanagi moves several feet in an instant and stabs a monster through the chest
- Yanagi throws her naginata across a gap and it lands hard enough to puncture the floor and slightly crack it
- Miyabi cuts up multiple ethereals simultaneously and in doing so also precisely cuts a raindrop clean in two
- The timeline is a bit confusing but I think the implication is that Miyabi was fighting off monsters and ethereals for an entire day straight with seemingly little rest
- Miyabi also sprains her hand holding herself back from attacking Yanagi which also implies that she was fighting nonstop while injured
- I'm not sure if the implication here was that Yanagi was actually slowing down time or if the cutscene was emphasizing how fast she reacted. In either case, she dodges a point blank attack from a Miyabi clone and cuts her. The resulting force of the attack creates a shockwave that slightly damages a (virtual) building and also momentarily halts the rain
- Miyabi recovers from being turned into a bangboo and then proceeds to blitz a clone of herself that was about to attack Yanagi
it's important to note that although all of these feats take place in a virtual world, things like object weight and the character's physical characteristics seem to mirror the real world, as soukaku says that it "feels just like the outside world," harumasa comments on the candy having a realistic weight, and miyabi commenting that her weapon feels perfect.

Spoiler

Yeah, it's about right. Though I should note that Harumasa also attacked Yanagi around the same time as Soukaku attacked her, though it's hard to tell what she did in response but I assume by how she was positioned there to blocking Soukaku's attack that she simply dodged out of the way.

IDK what Yanagi did either. She either slowed down time or maybe even made herself faster like some of speed boost. The key sign of that is the clock-like mechanism on her naginata that was moving as she made her move while the Miyabi clone was in mid-action.

In either case, we could take that these feats they've done should be something they also can do in the actual world. The clone Miyabi doing that slash thing even seems to fit in line with what Miyabi did back in 1.5 or the Section 6 segment we had in first meeting them.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

The daughter of Vergil for ZZZ is here bois owo

Anomaly type char, Miyabi Hoshimi. The Voidhunter.

Also if you noticed, the element symbol is different. Guess she was supposed to be ice, but I don't recall it being like that so it might be a new element we're having.

If it's new, this would make Miyabi our exclusive and new element type char.

 

[Sooshirohl]

On a sidenote, I also just finished Yanagi's special episode. It's nice to see even an "elite squad" like Section 6 has their own quirks. The meme of Yanagi being a mom, especially with her char animation teaser is so real.

Spoiler

Yeah, it's about right. Though I should note that Harumasa also attacked Yanagi around the same time as Soukaku attacked her, though it's hard to tell what she did in response but I assume by how she was positioned there to blocking Soukaku's attack that she simply dodged out of the way.

IDK what Yanagi did either. She either slowed down time or maybe even made herself faster like some of speed boost. The key sign of that is the clock-like mechanism on her naginata that was moving as she made her move while the Miyabi clone was in mid-action.

In either case, we could take that these feats they've done should be something they also can do in the actual world. The clone Miyabi doing that slash thing even seems to fit in line with what Miyabi did back in 1.5 or the Section 6 segment we had in first meeting them.

Spoiler

yeah, on a rewatch, i noticed that harumasa also shot at yanagi as soukaku attacked her, but i'm not really sure where he aimed at. i guess either he missed his attack or yanagi simply dodged like you said, not really sure.

also not really sure what the implications of yanagi's attack was either. i guess we'll have to wait for more lore stuff about her to see if it's actually time slowing/acceleration. the fact that the cutscene emphasized the clock itself makes me think it's one or the other but who knows

yeah like i said despite the feats all taking place in the virtual world they should still be valid, considering all of section 6's comments on the realistic feel of the virtual world. and like you mentioned, miyabi's feats in the virtual world align pretty well with the stuff she's shown capable of in the real world so i definitely think they're worth taking into consideration

i'm particularly curious about yanagi dissipating the rain momentarily and miyabi blitzing a clone of herself, those both seem like pretty impressive feats to me. miyabi slicing a raindrop in half also seems pretty impressive although you could argue it was just a byproduct of her cutting up the ethereals.

 

[Sooshirohl]

The daughter of Vergil for ZZZ is here bois owo

Anomaly type char, Miyabi Hoshimi. The Voidhunter.

Also if you noticed, the element symbol is different. Guess she was supposed to be ice, but I don't recall it being like that so it might be a new element we're having.

If it's new, this would make Miyabi our exclusive and new element type char.

the new element symbol is definitely interesting. leaks said she was ice anomaly but i don't see why they'd make the ice symbol different unless it was something new. maybe like an ice subclass of sorts? i remember seeing people speculating that she could be a fire character so maybe like a ice-fire element of sorts would be really cool

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

the new element symbol is definitely interesting. leaks said she was ice anomaly but i don't see why they'd make the ice symbol different unless it was something new. maybe like an ice subclass of sorts? i remember seeing people speculating that she could be a fire character so maybe like a ice-fire element of sorts would be really cool

There's a ZZZ leaks subreddit (really, Reddit is just as much a hotbed for leaks than Twitter is if not much so that I've noticed lol) that Miyabi MIGHT be the first dual element by being ice and fire. Both make sense cuz I remember reading about her being an ice type, and my guess for fire has to do with that weird floating eye thing that's with her when she fights.

If it's true, then I can assume she has a similar playstyle like Yanagi but element wise where she normally fights with ice but once she uses her EX skill or ultimate she does fire. But it's hard to say.

The symbol is literally there on ZZZ's official drip market of her and unless it was a weird design mistake, they wouldn't present it as such so we'll see when she drops in 1.4.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Hmm, I think we'll have to wait until Miyabi's beta demo drops.

Spoiler

There's stuff talked about in the leaks reddit that her element may still be ice but it's a special element type she has where she applies both ice and "frost" type damage. So there's no duel element we have for Miyabi, but her potential for ice/anomaly-centered teams seem to be pretty good depending how they really are.

Personally I'd like it if she were an attacker cuz this game seems really high on making anomaly characters, but I guess I'll take what I can get (If only I tried enough to get Ellen Joe )

 

[Naito-desu]

Welp guess I'm skipping Lighter for now. Miyabi seems like a really must-pull so I'll start saving now.

Btw, do we consider gameplay feats or just lore/cutscene feats? I may have to start calcing the speed of some of the characters for profiles now

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Btw, do we consider gameplay feats or just lore/cutscene feats? I may have to start calcing the speed of some of the characters for profiles now

Depends. What is included in gameplay feats? Like dodging lasers and stuff?

Cuz some of the enemies you encounter use lasers or shoot laser-like beams at you. Other times you have automatic gunfire shot at you, and then stuff like RPG's or crossbow bolts also things fired upon you.

If there's also things like AP related, I suppose there's things like breaking down weakened walls like Yanagi's special episode shows (albeit that was in a VR world, but they are meant to closely resemble things from the real world so maybe?).

Otherwise, I was thinking we'd scale them based on lore and cutscenes + scaling if they got nothing notable from there.

 

[Naito-desu]

Weakened walls is probably just Wall level which isn't all that impressive compared to present feats in the game.

I was just interested more or less in some of the weapons so I'll do some digging and see what that's all about.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Yeah otherwise it's not really that much needed.

I was just interested more or less in some of the weapons so I'll do some digging and see what that's all about.

That'll be a toughie there too. Their official weapons info that ZZZ post about them (like on Twitter, the official ZZZ page) don't really tell you a whole lot about what they can do besides what material they're made or just some fluff. Caesar's sword and shield are pointed out as being made out of ether alloy, Qingyi's a modified riot baton to make it a tri-staff, and Yanagi's the same as Caesar's but more light-weight to carry.

The most notable one I got just off of the weapons card is Zhu Yuan's and even there, they just tell you what sort of ammo or firing mechanism she can do with like fire ether buckshot and have homing projectiles among other potential firing methods.

 

[Sooshirohl]

Depends. What is included in gameplay feats? Like dodging lasers and stuff?

Cuz some of the enemies you encounter use lasers or shoot laser-like beams at you. Other times you have automatic gunfire shot at you, and then stuff like RPG's or crossbow bolts also things fired upon you.

If there's also things like AP related, I suppose there's things like breaking down weakened walls like Yanagi's special episode shows (albeit that was in a VR world, but they are meant to closely resemble things from the real world so maybe?).

Otherwise, I was thinking we'd scale them based on lore and cutscenes + scaling if they got nothing notable from there.

i think both are fair to be considered. like for example, characters like ellen in game are shown able to react to and deflect gunfire, which is something she's also been shown to do in cutscenes, and characters like grace are also seen dodging machine gun fire both in game and in cutscenes. for the most part gameplay of characters seems pretty consistent with what they're capable of in lore/cutscenes, and i think casual bullet dodging + the ability to break stuff like small walls and crates serves as a baseline. then you can use more impressive feats from lore/cutscenes to go from there

 

[Naito-desu]

We do know that they're also able to fight robots made by Belobog specialized for demolition so that's also a strong supporting statement for 9-A. I'm mostly trying to figure out the mechanism of some of the enemy weapons and see if I can get a speed rating from those