Trafalgar Law vs Zagred

[ThanatosX]

No his words don’t need to be heard. Otherwise everyone would’ve discovered his identity long before his plan was complete.

Why did you ask so many questions about the character and still decide to vote given the lack of knowledge on Zagred.

Also all of what you typed in favor of Law assumes Law has knowledge on Zagred or the fact that Zagred is just going to stand there and do nothing. Debates that are in this manner are my pet peeve.

I am not sure, but if you are angry just because I think that Law wins than I don't know what to say. I just wanted to share my opinion on a match I consider interesting, nothing more. I gave my vote (which was not a vote for how I usually give them, if I vote I usually say "I vote for..." or "Voting..." but I understand why it was interpreted as such) using the information given in the thread, like anyone else who vote. The votes are not even being counted, so I honestly don't see the problem. If that vote makes you this angry than I will retract it, but it doesn't change the fact that I am convinced that Law still wins.
I honestly wanted to just make that comment and leave but since so many users replied to me I think I need to answer some stuffs.
First of all, not replying to you but another one, the starting distance is 4km, not 1km. From the SBA page: "The characters start as far away from each other as the highest range of the fighters is, but a maximum of 4 kilometers. For example, if one character has a range of 10 meter and the other has a range of 20 meter they start 20 meter apart. However if the range of one character is 10 meter and the range of the other is 5 kilometer, they start only 4 kilometer apart. If extreme advantages are generated via this distance to one side, a balanced alternative should be discussed in the thread." Law range with Rooms is "Kilometers", plural, not a kilometer, and his Rooms can grow as big as an explosion of tens of kilometers (the one that hit Big Mom, just for reference). So, since his range with Room is of kilometers, the starting distance would be of 4 kilometers.
Also, is there a standard for Regen being different if it's biological or magical? It's the first time I hear such a thing, and honestly I don't agree with since Regeneration is Regeneration regardless of it's nature, but if it's an actual standard I suppose that I will have to agree with that.
Now, replying to the message I quoted previously, the point is not about his words needing to be heard. It was one of the points, but I already guessed it wasn't the case honestly. The more important point was the part about his words needing to spread. Was he ever put in a condition in which his words weren't allowed to go out of a restricted area and his magic still worked regardless? That was the point, and in my opinion if it doesn't have the feat to work than that would be a good incap method. And I repeat in my opinion, since this matches are obviously hypotetical and no one know what would actually happen.
Also, he obviously wouldn't lead with that, but Law is extremely smart, and this mixed with the Haki will allow him to understand that the opponent is using words to attack and act accordingly. If someone says something and this something becomes real, it's honestly the most logical connection to make, even without the Haki part.
And yes, all of this is assuming that he have some kind of knowlogeable, albeit limited, of Zagred thanks to the Haki. Since that allows him to see the power of the opponent, if he sees someone far stronger than him he will act fast and be extremely cautios of what he does.
And also yes, while I know that Zagred wont stay there to do nothing, the fact that he have to say words to attack is a huge disadvantage in a situation in which he have little room to act. If he is spatially cut thanks to ranged attacks, than he will obviously be stunned by it for a moment, something that will allow Law to quickly get close to him with a Shambles (teleportation, basically). Thanks to that, he was able to take by surprise even those with an advanced Haki Kenbun-shoku, and since Zagred will require to say a word to counter him, he will have a really small window to act before Law will use his attack instead, and I personally don't think he will have the time to act in time.
As other small notes, Law was able to use the awakening several times during his fight against Big Mom, and was still able to fight despite that, and the awakening uses a huge amount of energy compared to regular Rooms attacks. I don't see him running out of energy quickly.
Also, to avoid certain attacks like danmaku he can also use Shambles to change his position with Zagred himself, as seen against Doflamingo, and he can do that as many times as he wants, even to avoid eventual summons' attacks.
As said before, while I still think Law takes this, I retract my vote if my vote for some reason made some people angry, this way it wont be counted in a eventual vote tally. And with this I go away and wont reply further. Getting too many replies already makes me anxious, and in general I don't like to participate too much in matches because of this, but since it's an interesting match I wanted to give my opinion on it and I think it's fair to at least some answer to the many replies I got. Now I actually go away. See ya.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Here. Law's Kenbun also scales to the likes of Beginning of Timeskip Luffy and should scale above Pre-Timeskip Zoro's senses.

That isn’t comparable to a storm of blade. That’s not even danmaku to begin with

Also I never contested Kenbun’s efficiency, all I said is that you still need skill to dodge what you see coming which clearly isn’t shown in what you sent.

Is there proof that it would work on Law's spatial abilities such as Kroom and Amputate?

Why wouldn’t his reality warping work on things that can clearly be seen? Anything he wants to negate he can say it and it will be negated from reality.

Law resists deconstruction via Haki.

Cant find it on Haki page, I was also told by a supporter that it doesn’t. KT even refused to answer my question which is sus in of itself.

So how does Law/Haki resist matter and spatial deconstruction.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

if you are angry just because I think that Law wins

So out of everything I typed this is what you got from it . No, I am not angry and I don’t care who you think wins, I just think your arguments sucks cuz it doesn’t account for what Zagred will do.

Ngl this makes me wonder if I would get a proper response once I get around your whole post.

 

[Arnoldstone18]

I

It looks like the half of these weren’t even in response to me so I guess that lessens my work.

Now, replying to the message I quoted previously, the point is not about his words needing to be heard. It was one of the points, but I already guessed it wasn't the case honestly. The more important point was the part about his words needing to spread. Was he ever put in a condition in which his words weren't allowed to go out of a restricted area and his magic still worked regardless? That was the point, and in my opinion if it doesn't have the feat to work than that would be a good incap method. And I repeat in my opinion, since this matches are obviously hypotetical and no one know what would actually happen.

Zagred’s words don’t need to be spread otherwise they will be heard and that would’ve ruined his plans. That’s my point.

Obviously when you say “spread” to me it means the sound of his voice needs to cover an area for it to have an effect on that area right?. I’m saying No. and that if that was the case that those who are within the area can hear him when he was undercover at a time.

I’m just saying he can use his magic at his normal range by simply whispering so it’s not sound based range but magic range. If Law can restrict the range of his magic, no problem but I doubt there’s something like magic in One Piece let alone restricted by Law.

Also, he obviously wouldn't lead with that, but Law is extremely smart, and this mixed with the Haki will allow him to understand that the opponent is using words to attack and act accordingly. If someone says something and this something becomes real, it's honestly the most logical connection to make, even without the Haki part.

Zagred has an open grimoire and a trident. I don’t think Law will make a great guess to assume Zagred’s magic is just him speaking into reality. The First thought on Law’s mind would be that Zagred is a demonic Wizard with a spell book. Maybe he will eventually figure it out??? Idk I doubt it but let’s assume he eventually does, he can’t really do anything that Zagred won’t defend against easily with his RW. Keep in mind in Black Clover, a whole squad of legendary and elite mages were needed to take on Zagred with one of them being able to negate magic. This is just Law, one sole target that Zagred can focus on. So no tricks, no distractions, no getting double teamed with speed blitzing movements, just one man he can spam on.

Since that allows him to see the power of the opponent, if he sees someone far stronger than him he will act fast and be extremely cautios of what he does.
And also yes, while I know that Zagred wont stay there to do nothing, the fact that he have to say words to attack is a huge disadvantage in a situation in which he have little room to act. If he is spatially cut thanks to ranged attacks, than he will obviously be stunned by it for a moment, something that will allow Law to quickly get close to him with a Shambles (teleportation, basically).

What’s the range of his Haki senses and how can Haki sense magic power? Devils don’t feel pain so how would he be stunned by attacks that aren’t even life threatening to him. You haven’t properly explained why speaking into reality is such a huge disadvantage? You haven’t accounted for Law having to deal with those attacks first. Infact I don’t even see Law getting the opportunity to attack because Zagred loves to make it difficult for his opponent. He could say “storm of blades”, then as soon as Law tried to do something about them, Zagred says “vacuum wall” or “break apart” to break the ground to throw him off, then “iron spears”. That’s why I asked @Kachon123 for the skills Law has shown against even baseline danmaku much less this shithousery Zagred will unleash on him. Cuz I know Law will see all this coming, but he definitely wouldn’t have the skill to deal with them.

Point is Law can’t capitalize on someone just speaking so casually. Zagred can easily negate any attack Law gets off in the hell he’s in with “disappear” or “vanish” or he can defend with his trident that even affects space. And Zagred can easily teleport within range to continuously affect Law. Not to mention the sea of life sucking monsters that would be everywhere. So getting close to Zagred is a bad idea when he has that trident, those monsters and his words like “get back”.

Also, to avoid certain attacks like danmaku he can also use Shambles to change his position with Zagred himself, as seen against Doflamingo, and he can do that as many times as he wants, even to avoid eventual summons' attacks.

I see, clever way of dealing with danmaku but Zagred can just turn the blades back on Law or just make Law return to his spot. The swords hitting Zagred isn’t a problem, he can always command himself to be healed rather than his natural way.

As said before, while I still think Law takes this, I retract my vote if my vote for some reason made some people angry, this way it wont be counted in a eventual vote tally. And with this I go away and wont reply further. Getting too many replies already makes me anxious, and in general I don't like to participate too much in matches because of this, but since it's an interesting match I wanted to give my opinion on it and I think it's fair to at least some answer to the many replies I got. Now I actually go away. See ya.

Do not retract your vote. I just wished you engaged in debate before voting. If you still think Law wins no problem.

Like I said I wasn’t angry. I just didn’t like your first post where you only told me what Law can do this and that without considering any factors as though a fight can go perfectly that way. Then just voted off of that.

 

[XDragnoir]

No it doesn't. It negates regeneration that is boosted from normal regeneration,

Non-natural and boosted mean pretty much the same here in this context, so it doesn't change much.

which Zagred's would fall under.

Why? His regen comes from his physiology as a demon, it's not boosted by anything like Marco's regen is by the Reincarnation Flames (or whatever is the name of his blue fire).

 

[Arnoldstone18]

Zagred doesn’t even need his physiological healing. He can just command himself to heal.

Not like Haki can negate magic anyway.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Non-natural and boosted mean pretty much the same here in this context, so it doesn't change much.

Bro, why it says non natural is because it's an Amp regen and not a regen you're born with, that's the only reason... Otherwise it's amped natural regen that regenerates the body

That isn’t comparable to a storm of blade. That’s not even danmaku to begin with

Either stops everything in its place or teleports them away

 

[KingTempest]

Law switches his soul with a frog gg I will not elaborate

 

[XDragnoir]

Bro, why it says non natural is because it's an Amp regen and not a regen you're born with, that's the only reason... Otherwise it's amped natural regen that regenerates the body

Yeah, which doesn't apply to Zagred as his regen isn't amped.

 

[MonkeyOfLife]

Yeah, which doesn't apply to Zagred as his regen isn't amped.

ok? Never talked about him

also why'd kachon say he does?

 

[speedster352]

Zagrad fra