• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Top 10 Strongest Non-Smurfs for Every Tier Continuation

Status
Not open for further replies.
That doesn't really tell me anything important though.

Like, sure, it's passive, but if it has no feats of cancelling passives like madness or feat hax, how is he going to survive?

What are some feats he's done?
I mean, for one fear and madness hax wouldn't help, as Mamoru doesn't need to control his ability. It's passively active and he couldn't stop it if he wanted to.

That aside, the thing you missing is that his infinite luck also modifies the past. Basically, he doesn't need to deal with Echidna, because she retroactively will have died in a freak accident before the battle even started. To defeat him she would have to have had a 0% chance of not dying/getting incapped at some point before the fight.

If Jean can apparently get past madness hax then social influencing should be no issue.
Social influencing isn't resisted via mind hax resistance, though.

Anyway, I could see their social influencing take down Echidna. It's passive vs. passive, but Echidna can turn hers off and given the social influencing probably will.
 
Social influencing isn't resisted via mind hax resistance, though.

Anyway, I could see their social influencing take down Echidna. It's passive vs. passive, but Echidna can turn hers off and given the social influencing probably will.
I don't see it taking down Echidna. They will immediately just trying killing themselves. Madness and fear stuff seems a lot more potent to me than some charm.

Echidna has resisted charm auras at a level that is essentially passive empathic and perception hax since she is unaffected by Camilla's Authority of Lust which captivates people so hard they would ignore themselves dying. Really don't see that social influencing working on her at all.
 
Last edited:
I don't see it taking down Echidna. They will immediately just trying killing themselves. Madness and fear stuff seems a lot more potent to me than some charm.
Honestly, I have my doubts that that actually always immediately happens. Like, does she life in total isolation to prevent people from constantly offing themselves?

That said, people fall in love with Teruhashi faster than she herself would know how to kill herself. And Echidna has healing, meaning whatever small damage a teenage girl could do to herself that fast, will be healed by Echidna's own hands the moment she is captivated by her.

Echidna has resisted charm auras at a level that is essentially passive empathic and perception hax since she is unaffected by Camilla's Authority of Lust which captivates people so hard they would ignore themselves dying. Really don't see that social influencing working on her at all.
Those are mind effects, though. Not social influencing. The ability of preventing someone from supernaturally messing with your mind doesn't prevent natural charisma. You can still like someone with mind hax resistance.
 
Honestly, I have my doubts that that actually always immediately happens. Like, does she life in total isolation to prevent people from constantly offing themselves?

That said, people fall in love with Teruhashi faster than she herself would know how to kill herself. And Echidna has healing, meaning whatever small damage a teenage girl could do to herself that fast, will be healed by Echidna's own hands the moment she is captivated by her.


Those are mind effects, though. Not social influencing. The ability of preventing someone from supernaturally messing with your mind doesn't prevent natural charisma. You can still like someone with mind hax resistance.
Carmilla's Lust Authority does the whole charm and captivation thing but stronger.

Carmilla captivates people, making them so absorbed in watching her that they forget how to breathe, lose all sense of awareness to the point they wouldn't notice if someone stabbed them or if they were burning...

This is just the natural effect of her authority.

And, social influencing may be different from mind/empathy hax on the surface, but at a higher level it is almost indistinguishable and works essentially the same way as a passive empathic hax.

Seriously, what's the difference between a charm/social influencing aura that makes people immediately do anything for you, and passive empathic hax?
 
I would like to suggest the Year-300 Heroes for the bottom of 5-C (so #6), in their "Mankai (YuYuYu)" keys.
All 6 of them possess Type 8 Immortality and Invulnerability to any physical/bodily harm below universe level.
The wording I suggest for the list is:
Characters from Yuki Yuna is a Hero (Year-300 Heroes)
 
Last edited:
Carmilla's Lust Authority does the whole charm and captivation thing but stronger.



This is just the natural effect of her authority.

And, social influencing may be different from mind/empathy hax on the surface, but at a higher level it is almost indistinguishable and works essentially the same way as a passive empathic hax.

Seriously, what's the difference between a charm/social influencing aura that makes people immediately do anything for you, and passive empathic hax?
The difference is the mechanism. And that's always what one needs to go by when looking at how abilities interact. Just because the result of two abilities is similar, that doesn't mean you can resist them via the same ability. (e.g. spatial intangibility and ghost-like intangibility need different abilities to be circumvented, despite both making intangible on the surface)

Mind manipulation supernaturally manipulates the mind. So if you are protected from anyone forcefully changing how your mind works, you are good to go. However, being protected from mind manipulation wouldn't mean that you can't still find someone sympathetic. You can still think someone is beautiful and be stricken by that.

Being completely immune to social influencing would mean that you are essentially incapable of ever liking anyone, period. Because social influencing is nothing but the normal act of making someone like you. Just taken up to 11. There is no supernatural power involved and your mind in essence works as it should. It's just that the natural attraction towards beautiful things is abused in this case.
 
I know a character who has resistance to social influencing, but he is quite sentimental
That's why I said immunity, not resistance. If you just resist it you can of course still like people. The point was to demonstrate how social influencing is an extension of just regular social relationships and how a mind resistance wouldn't really be expected to have an influence on how you make friends or lovers.
 
The difference is the mechanism. And that's always what one needs to go by when looking at how abilities interact. Just because the result of two abilities is similar, that doesn't mean you can resist them via the same ability. (e.g. spatial intangibility and ghost-like intangibility need different abilities to be circumvented, despite both making intangible on the surface)

Mind manipulation supernaturally manipulates the mind. So if you are protected from anyone forcefully changing how your mind works, you are good to go. However, being protected from mind manipulation wouldn't mean that you can't still find someone sympathetic. You can still think someone is beautiful and be stricken by that.

Being completely immune to social influencing would mean that you are essentially incapable of ever liking anyone, period. Because social influencing is nothing but the normal act of making someone like you. Just taken up to 11. There is no supernatural power involved and your mind in essence works as it should. It's just that the natural attraction towards beautiful things is abused in this case.
In the case of the characters mentioned, the charm they have is not due to an "act."

It's passive. Meaning, it is merely a byproduct of their existence. A natural aura of sorts that affects those who so much as look at them and immediately changes what those people think of them.

An empathic manipulation aura not only produces this same effect, but it is the same exact mechanism. It is a byproduct of their natural aura/presence/character that also immediately changes what people think of them.

Maybe I would understand the difference if you were trying to say the mechanism was via an act of manipulation, but that can not be the case if it's a passive charm.

Being so beautiful that you instantly, without any action or effort, make anyone who looks at you a love slave is 100% a supernatural power and I do not see a difference between it and the empathic manipulation that I brought up.

Imo that really shouldn't just be "social influencing," at that point it is just empathic manipulation.
 
In the case of the characters mentioned, the charm they have is not due to an "act."

It's passive. Meaning, it is merely a byproduct of their existence. A natural aura of sorts that affects those who so much as look at them and immediately changes what those people think of them.

An empathic manipulation aura not only produces this same effect, but it is the same exact mechanism. It is a byproduct of their natural aura/presence/character that also immediately changes what people think of them.

Maybe I would understand the difference if you were trying to say the mechanism was via an act of manipulation, but that can not be the case if it's a passive charm.

Being so beautiful that you instantly, without any action or effort, make anyone who looks at you a love slave is 100% a supernatural power and I do not see a difference between it and the empathic manipulation that I brought up.

Imo that really shouldn't just be "social influencing," at that point it is just empathic manipulation.
As much as it looks similar, it just functionally is not that. There is no supernatural power that alters the mind here. It's just beauty. It's passive, because you can look at beauty all on your own.

There hence is also no aura. Teruhashi has an aura, but that's a completely separate thing.

The result is similar, the mechanism is not. You're basically saying that powernull of supernatural powers / magic should be able to negate pressure points that make humans explode, because such pressure points are not realistic.
Yeah, they are not realistic. But that doesn't change that the fundamental nature of the technique is not supernatural. I even know a character with such social influencing where it's specifically spelt out that it's in no way supernatural.

Just because it's ridiculous doesn't change what it is.
How would that passive Social Influencing work if the one attacking is 4 kilometers away?
Well, if the one attacking can see how beautiful the target is, it would make little difference. If the attacker couldn't percieve them it might become a problem.
 
Last edited:
the mechanism is not
You've yet to prove how the mechanism is not the same.

You have only falsely equivalated my argument to something I am absolutely not saying.

Just because you or an author claims a blatantly supernatural ability isn't supernatural, it doesn't change this:

It's passive. Meaning, it is merely a byproduct of their existence. A natural aura of sorts that affects those who so much as look at them and immediately changes what those people think of them.

An empathic manipulation aura not only produces this same effect, but it is the same exact mechanism. It is a byproduct of their natural aura/presence/character that also immediately changes what people think of them.

They are doing the same thing to produce the same effects.

I don't know why you are acting like social influencing isn't meant to also affect the minds of others. How else would you influence them?

The difference between social influencing and empathic manipulation is that SI is usually an active capability done through acts of talking, manipulating, persuading, etc.

But if you get rid of that part and just make it some passive thing that influences emotions directly and potently, that is just empathic manipulation:

The ability to influence feelings and emotions.
 
woody woodpecker stomps garou in 5-A? he has passive plot hax
Possibly.

Woody has immortalities and regeneration, can resist Garou's passive aura, and from what I've talked to supporters IT SEEMS that Garou couldn't copy more supernatural stuff than this universe thing.

But I'm busy with another game with Woody and possible updates for him.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top