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Probably the Grimm thread. Stuff about their speed and justifications, fixing some APs like the Sphinx and Leviathan, and adding Body Puppetry for Salem and Additional Limbs for The Hound.
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RWBY Vol 9 General Discussion Thread: Multiverse Of Therapy
- Thread starter Spinoirr
- Start date
Probably the Grimm thread. Stuff about their speed and justifications, fixing some APs like the Sphinx and Leviathan, and adding Body Puppetry for Salem and Additional Limbs for The Hound.
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Has the universal gods stuff been made into a thread yet?
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Nope. Should probably be the last thing imo, cause how controversial it’d be. Better to fix the profiles and add the abilities before then.
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Anyway. Does anyone know when that thread will be made?
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Would like this to be addressed as well.
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Oscar doesn’t solely use the cane to make shields. He is capable of doing it without the cane, as he did while falling from Atlas.
As for the amp, I can see the merit, but at the same time it’s a bit of an assumption considering the only things we are told and shown it being capable of are absorbing energy and releasing it as explosions.
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I mean, you know my love for RWBY buffs. I'd never really present a downplay without good merit. I'm also worried that the calc may have had some calc stacking in it.
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What do you mean by calc stacking?
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As in using Monstra's KE as a part of the calc.
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Ah okay. Just wanted to clear that up.
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Except this wasn't shown. If it was shown instead of needing to rely on looking at timeframes (Which are shaky still and not something that would have been considered by the team logically)
If it genuinely wasnt shown, then its an assumption, just by pure definition.
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I am allowed to think for myself of course, but yeah there is definitely a lot of assuming and questionable scaling with the two main examples being used on profiles right now. I think, way too much to be cementing these as completely accurate values, from just the two that had originally been shown.
We are generally assuming that Cinder broke Ozpin's forcefield, even though that has nevevr been shown and we are only relying on timeframes 'lining up' rather than physically seeing the feat or getting affirmation. Whether this wiki agrees with this or not, it is still always going to be an assumption made by pure definition, since we don't actually see this shield being broken.
The Centinel feat is also extremely questionable, as the point was clearly for the Centinels to dig into the very foundation the hardlight shield pillars were standing on, and break it down that way through their tunnelling (Letting gravity do the rest to remove that large chunk of rock mass). This was done specifically because the Grimm were going to have trouble breaking the hardlight shield physically, so they found a way to circumvent it by using Centinels to merely disturb its foundation in 2 spots. Its hard to believe Grimm of their calibur individually are Town level either way.
The Centinels also didnt survive whatever that meat-goo deviantart calc was since we see the Centinels actively emerge from the Goo afterwards, where they would still be in a liquid state, and ergo not treated physically.
As for the other calcs
-That one about Penny breaking the Hangar literally does not show Penny breaking anything, it was a ship unless im missing something and its super far away to even see what happened
-If the calc is merely for the Colossus' kinetic energy while moving, why is this being scaled directly to human-sized characters that couldn't effectively dent it other than delivering chip, shaking it slightly and could only immobilize it by exploiting its weak spots (And it was the only thing capable of killing the water godzilla grimm when everyone else just had to rely on silver eyes hax). At most it got tripped, and i remember we dont directly scale Weiss' dust usage to her physical AP.
-Cinder melting stuff i dont really see how it would scale physically but i probs have to look at that feat again
-It would be pretty hard to quantify scaling anyone to Vines' arms durability, since they've never been overpowered or broken before otherwise, and the explosion still killed him.
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It doesnt need to be shown. Assumption are completely fine to use as there is more than enough evidence to support the idea that that is what happened, not whatever you think happened. Your obsession with the idea of 'it doesnt matter how much evidence there is, if it wasnt blatantly displayed on-screen then it isnt valid' is incompatible with how this wiki tiers characters.
Never argued that hey did, i dont agree with using that as a feat
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Jinx i would legitimately love to see you try to apply this logic to any other popular verse on the wiki and see how far it gets you. Literally every verse on this site makes logical assumptions in their tiers because not every work of fiction is 100% blatant with feats.
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Not necessarily, Ozpin clearly couldn't spam hide in his shield, and the shield seems to be based around the magic he has rather than a semblance or smthn (They still havent explained Ozpin's semblance?)
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I dont know what this is supposed to mean? What other verse here relies on undescript timeframes to make such a major assumption like this?
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Yes, the shield is his magic, his own power. Oscar's shield is the same way only Oscar has less power than Ozpin both due to not being fully capable of wielding Oz's magic to its full potential as well as Oz losing power every time he reincarnates. Oscar's shield would be less durable than Ozpin's and yet Cinder broke through it
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I literally broke down the scene second by second for you proving that the timeframes align perfectly what the hell are you talking about
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There isn't really...a lot of evidence other than also assuming the timeframes line up, which is super shaky on whether that was ever their intention, and more just convenience in trying to say Ozpin's forcefield broke.
Idk why this is an obsession, but yeah this is a pretty major claim for something we just dont see on screen (Ergo we dont know if it was overpowered, the forcefield wasn't up when Ozpin got killed offscreen etc). Cause looked like the forcefield was withstanding all her maiden powered attacks pretty casually.
This still definitely seems like something that would need to actually be shown, cause from whats shown, Cinder wasn't even denting Ozpin's shield, and we know its relied on by finite magic.
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I mean like a descript Verse please, or feat that uses the same off-scene timeframe logic
Verses
vsbattles.fandom.com
These ones
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Yes and its still huge assumption work for trying to decipher how a fight happened/concluded completely off-screen. Imo at least.
Surely for accurate scaling we wouldn't just use this off-screen assumption and would rather want feats to go with it and justify moreso. Which there is, but it seems like there can be something said for all of them...
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Thought it was Ozpin taking over Oscar's body, and it was the last reserves of his stored up magic?
And again...we dont actually see Ozpin's forcefield break, it is merely being assumed, and from what i can tell, this is being compared to within two episodes so timing even then just becomes more shaky
Would Cinder have been able to oneshot Monstro in this case either? Cause we're now also saying the RWBY characters downscale from this same Maiden Cinder, who they were taking a few attacks from albeit of less intense power, but would have definitely died if they were hit with The Long Memory themself, and individually shouldnt be anywhere near the power of a maiden.
Like im not just being skeptical of this for the sake of it, it all generally seems to just not allign well. What happened to like, 8-B, 8-A RWBY which had decent defitive calcs that showed these feats on screen.
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Back to ignoring facts as usual i see. You literally dismissed the fact that the timeframes are perfectly aligned and that the sounds you hear from Oz and Cinder clashing in the background lining up perfectly with the on-screen fight we see as 'too convenient to be possible'. Its not shaky, its just you refusing to accept facts as facts.
Yes, i dont know why this is an obsession of yours. You could be putting your energy into actually fixing verses that are in desperate need of work, but you instead choose to devote all of your energy into pestering people and obstructing verses that are finally being cleaned up and fixed with your nonsense viewpoints.
Thats why its called a logical assumption. We look at all factors in surrounding the fight and piece together the most logical conclusion, that being that Cinder killed Oz by breaking through his forcefield when he jumped at her as it aligns perfectly with the timeframe. As i said before, using your logic of 'if we dont blatantly see it happen one specific way on-screen then it didnt happen and all context is irrelevant', the vast majority of feats on the wiki would be made invalid by default.
Nah, the thing that he stores is the kinetic energy within Long Memory, he still has latent magic that doesnt run on a set reserve its just that every time he reincarnates he gets a little bit weaker.
The only timeframe that it takes from a different episode is the few seconds shot of Jaune and Pyrrha running to the elevator, everything else comes from the timeframes of Oz and Cinder's fight and the outside perspective of the same fight from Jaune and Pyrrha's perspective in the same episode.
No, because Monstro has a calculated durability of 187 Megatons, over 60x higher than the durability of Oscar's shield. And yes, the cast downscales from the Maidens due to being able to harm them but overall being treated as generally inferior to them in power, not sure what that has to do with anything though.
Jinx, im sorry im the one who has to say this but i know it better than anyone since ive interacted with you for years, all you ever do is be skeptical for the sake of it, it is your entire personality. You exist solely to be a contrarian, all you do is annoy people who dont see things the one specific way that you do, because the way that you see things directly conflicts with how the sum total of this community thinks when it comes to basically everything. The 7-C and Low 7-B calcs are just as valid as the 8-B and 8-A calcs are, the fact that you bring them up is just proof that you are currently arguing solely from disbelief that the cast could be tier 7, that your viewpoint is that of 'i dont think RWBY should be above tier 8, so all of the tier 7 calcs must be wrong somehow'.
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No, i just know that the timeframes definitely wouldnt have been laser-alligned on the writers end, and the fact this is split across 2 episodes that dont establish the scenes or show Ozpins actual fate.
I think we're a bit too confident on calling something a fact when we dont actually see it happen on-screen and know Ozpin cant just hide behind a shield froever, especially when the shield was just no-selling Cinders attacks when it was on screen.
More like you're getting overly hostile at me wanting to ask questions and having a different viewpoint...
I dont exactly see why thinking seeing a feat being used to scale to something majorly that is just being assumed is 'nonsense' but eh.
So you perfectly put the fight and the Pyrrha Jaune scene together, even though there were multiple boom impacts that didnt happen till a final clash?
I think its just mental gymnastics to try and get the best possible result imo. No one else in RWBY downscaling from Cinder could even survive The Long Memory or break Oz' forcefield normally. If it were me, i'd try and find a bit more justification to ride this on since its still a basic assumption, and we know Ozpins forcefield is finite.
Kinetic energy? Its magic.
Its still finite so it stands to reason the forcefield cant just be held up forever. He's also not naturally stronger than a Maiden
I mean this is split between two episodes too, they would have needed to use that long ass lift. I can sort of see what you mean with the timeframes but again, it doesnt exactly mean that Cinder broke through Oz's forcefield, since its likely his forcefield didn't hold itself up in the end based on his own magic, and he was majorly overpowered in a physical sense.
Didn't Ozpins shield let him survive the impact of Long Memory?
No Weekly, i think you just need to realise that not everyone agrees with you, or is going to bow to your feet at every opinion you make. Cause you have been wrong before.
You've got this delusion that i'm just trying to spite RWBY, when its more i just could maybe...not agree with what you're saying? There is a lot of assumptions being thrown around, and i can tell there are many people here that just like the idea of stronger RWBY. If anything, RWBY would find better matchup value within Tier 8 tbh, theres a lot of interesting characters to debate when there arent a lot of assumptions being thrown about
The sum community, but just because a lot of people choose to follow the actual assumption (and have admitted to just liking the high-end) doesnt suddenly mean i have to follow along and think like you do.
I don't think the maincast of RWBY should really be 7-C based on scaling to the actual superpowers of the verse (Cinder, Ozpin etc) tbf no. The two reasons used to justifty now like Town level Centinel (Which i noticed you haven't commented on) and not breaking a forcefield definitely on screen makes me doubt these reasons. I also dont think you can logically scale the Colossus to the individual RWBY character based on a calc of its kinetic energy (Via its massive size, something RWBY characters dont have).
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I dont remember his speech tbf, if it does then sure but its all derived from the magoc
I mean that goes against the massive power the maidens are meant to be, but i cant imagine the maidens being that much higher a tier than regular chars just cause they can be competed with. So yeah we can scale em to maidens, and maidens have legit storm feats but im just unsure about a lot of these justifications that are actually being used
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On the top of my head:
Pyrrha was able to compete and push back Cinder in their V3 fight.
Cinder was able to beat a maiden Amber.
The Ace-Ops were able to contend with maiden Penny.
Winter managed to hold off Cinder and survive her onslaught.
Weiss could do the same in V8, also without aura.
Pyrrha was able to compete and push back Cinder in their V3 fight.
Cinder was able to beat a maiden Amber.
The Ace-Ops were able to contend with maiden Penny.
Winter managed to hold off Cinder and survive her onslaught.
Weiss could do the same in V8, also without aura.
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Winter literally cut Maiden Cinder's arm off
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RWBY Volume 8 Episode 10: "I know how you feel but he saved my life. When we were tortured, he took it. So I wouldn't have to. He entrusted me with this, and the massive amount of power he had stored up in it. Kinetic energy that he spent lifetime after lifetime accumulating in the cane he built."
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Yes i know all the scaling points to Maidens, theres a lot of implications toward it. I'm just overall unsure on the actual tiering of the maiden's physically to justify 7-C, based on a few questionable calcs and the big assumption that Cinder actually broke through Ozpin's forcefield.
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Her Grimm arm off, that isnt protected by aura. And was clearly made a weakspot with Raven
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Cool, the shield still let him survive The Long Memory that would have killed everyone and Monstro tho
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Just becuase its not protected by aura doesnt mean its less durable than the rest of her body.
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Oscar needed the shield because he was beaten to near death, it didnt kill anyone else other than Hazel due to it directly hitting him, meaning the blast was at its full 187 megatons rather than 3, and Neo literally survived the blast from within Monstra without the bubble shield protecting her and she was completely fine
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Genuinely though this is kinda why i asked to talk to someone individually cause im not making another long ass thread, espeically when im not looking to downgrade shit. I just had questions, which have only confirmed why i dont agree with a lot of the points being made here, specifically
