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More staff input can be gotten, unless the discussion is actually already over and I missed that.
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Request for Indexing Hax Layering/Smurf Hax on Profiles
- Thread starter Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
- Start date
- Status
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It is quite telling that the people more interested in this change are precisely the people that interact on Vs Threads, and those that oppose it are people that have shown total disdain or disinterest in them.
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Damage, in the future, please at least add "imo/in my opinion" or something similar at the end so it doesn't come off as it's the whole site. Thanks. The reputation of the site in the eyes of the masses is bad as it is, and the last few days hasn't helped a lot.
And for everyone else, let's just put this aside for now and return to the topic at hand.
And for everyone else, let's just put this aside for now and return to the topic at hand.
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@Confluctor; Okay, will do.
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
She/Her- 9,828
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- Thread starter
- #286
Moving on from that, while I don't necessarily oppose DT's solution, my issues with it still stand and I would like to further discuss what we would do about them.
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Don't try to revive the issue again, Livinmeme. Seriously. It's done. Just focus on the thread at hand.
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Peeking my head in here and I’m a bit lost. What’s the current summary of the discussion from all parties?
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
She/Her- 9,828
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- Thread starter
- #289
General consensus seems to be that listing what hax are layered/higher-dimensional on individual character profiles is a good idea. The main issue now is how we index that. My suggestion is to put it in the P&A section (eg; Mind Manipulation (5 layers, 1-C; [justification here]). DT's suggestion is to just elaborate on each ability and its layers/smurfiness in the NA/T section. I outlined my personal issues with that solution in the post above, and have yet to receive a response to it.
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Hm, I’m just responding to that summary.
Imo, I like the Type system in P&A, as it’s been easier to read, and can work for Layer. I personally have been aiming to elaborate in Notable Attacks/Techniques sections for justifications of all of the abilities in my works.
Tho, I can understand if the concern is since a number of users in the community find it unimportant or too much work for them to fill out NA/T, a lot of profiles with layers can have empty justification or justifications are too large to fit in P&A. There are a lot of profiles on the site that don’t have their NA/T filled out, but their P&A is fat.
Imo, I like the Type system in P&A, as it’s been easier to read, and can work for Layer. I personally have been aiming to elaborate in Notable Attacks/Techniques sections for justifications of all of the abilities in my works.
Tho, I can understand if the concern is since a number of users in the community find it unimportant or too much work for them to fill out NA/T, a lot of profiles with layers can have empty justification or justifications are too large to fit in P&A. There are a lot of profiles on the site that don’t have their NA/T filled out, but their P&A is fat.
Bobsican
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An issue that quickly comes to mind when using the NA/T section for this is that, well, layers and smurfness are neither notable attacks or techniques per-say by themselves, and so it feels rather forced and non-intuitive to list such stuff there.
At the very least that should be the standard (more specifically listed so in the Standard Format for Character Profiles or so) if we want to at least keep some consistency for the sake of easing finding such information to begin with.
At the very least that should be the standard (more specifically listed so in the Standard Format for Character Profiles or so) if we want to at least keep some consistency for the sake of easing finding such information to begin with.
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We do have an Explanations (Optional) section, if it does not fit in NA/T. Would you suggest making Explanations less optional, as in, the same tier as NA/T?
Bobsican
He/Him- 21,625
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I'd suggest to restrict mentions/explanations of hax layers and the like to such section for the sake of making such information consistent to find across profiles that'd need them, yeah, the Explanations section fits way more this stuff than the NA/T one, especially to avoid inconsistent wordings for broad abilities that aren't restricted to a single attack/technique with layers and so on.
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
She/Her- 9,828
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- Thread starter
- #294
Sure, that works. Bobsican's reply seems like the best solution to me, and I hope it's close enough to DT's solution for him to accept it.
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That’s basically what happens already, it’s just that the debaters have to argue the layers first
FantaRin_The_First
Username Only- 4,059
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Hmm. Your idea sounds entirely reasonable, Fuji. Count me in the agree section... If my vote of agreeing counts for anything anymore, considering that this is in the staff discussion of the forum.
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Your vote would still be part of what is representative of what the people here think and you can still present your own arguments and viewpoints.
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Yes, I have a high degree of trust for Damage's overall reliabIlity.
Yes, especially as Tiktok is basically just an efficient means for the CCP to harvest personal or even dangerous data from all people that use their app, along with further destabilising all comparatively democratic countries as an extra bonus.
However, that is enough derailment regarding that topic. Let's get back on track please.
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Topic is already back on track.
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Okay. Sorry about that then.
FantaRin_The_First
Username Only- 4,059
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Excuse me for this, but people talk about Vs. Battle Wiki on Tiktok!? ... Sorry for the out-of-topicness.
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
She/Her- 9,828
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- Thread starter
- #307
Are we going with @ElixirBlue's proposal, which is to use the explanations section when necessary? I still have issues with using the NA/T section, which is something that was never addressed.
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Negatively well-known (don't get me wrong, but this is what the majority say on TikTok)
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Yeah, I was thinking of that as well but this also makes me think of Twitter negativity which apparently has a tendency of actually helping what is being criticized there.
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No, generally everywhere. TikTok, Twitter, Quora, Reddit…etc. Vs Battle is not really positively famous. I am sure it is due to a strict moderation (staff opinion values higher than members) <--- the argument for example I found.
I guess we need a new CRT for wiki improvement and take every critic seriously (if it is serious meant). Furthermore, I am sure a lot of members have complaints about certain things.
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
She/Her- 9,828
- 12,447
- Thread starter
- #312
Can we please get back on topic lmao
There is no possible way to please everyone when it comes to VS debating. For every prominent verse, you will find people arguing for every possible statistic under the sun, with the same character ranging from street level to outerversal depending on who you ask. From an outside perspective, we are either wankers or downplayers, so there is no way we can please everyone (nor should we). VS debating is highly subjective, so we simply need to do the best we can under the rules we have imposed on ourselves.
There is no possible way to please everyone when it comes to VS debating. For every prominent verse, you will find people arguing for every possible statistic under the sun, with the same character ranging from street level to outerversal depending on who you ask. From an outside perspective, we are either wankers or downplayers, so there is no way we can please everyone (nor should we). VS debating is highly subjective, so we simply need to do the best we can under the rules we have imposed on ourselves.
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Last response to this (and we go back to our main topic, and I am incredibly sorry)
-- > You really did not get my point. What I am trying to say is that the opinion of staff is always highly valued over members. (From an outside perspective)
We can talk about it privately over DM if you want to disagree with this.
Otherwise, let us go back to the main topic.
Scottycj256
He/Him- 1,770
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welp i guess sentiment against the wiki is invalid because "tiktok bad", yall heard it here folks
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Still with the tiktok thing... Weren't you told to drop that issue?
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
She/Her- 9,828
- 12,447
- Thread starter
- #316
For the love of god can we please just decide on how we should index layered/smurf hax.
Anyways, the three options as of now seem to be:
-List them in the P&A section (13; Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara, Livinmeme, Dread, Bobsican, Scottycj256, FantaRin_The_First, Kirbonic_Pikmin, Panache_X, DueDate8898 [prefers using explanation section on profiles that have it], TheGreatJedi13, ActuallySpaceMan, Nehz_XZX, AbaddonTheDisappointment [last 4 also fine with explanation section])
-List them in the NA/T section
-List them in the optional explanations section (3; Antvasima, DontTalkDT, Agnaa)
Neutral (2; ElixirBlue, Muchacho_mrm)
I'd like to take a vote on which option is preferable, given that the general consensus is that indexing this information is a good idea.
Anyways, the three options as of now seem to be:
-List them in the P&A section (13; Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara, Livinmeme, Dread, Bobsican, Scottycj256, FantaRin_The_First, Kirbonic_Pikmin, Panache_X, DueDate8898 [prefers using explanation section on profiles that have it], TheGreatJedi13, ActuallySpaceMan, Nehz_XZX, AbaddonTheDisappointment [last 4 also fine with explanation section])
-List them in the NA/T section
-List them in the optional explanations section (3; Antvasima, DontTalkDT, Agnaa)
Neutral (2; ElixirBlue, Muchacho_mrm)
I'd like to take a vote on which option is preferable, given that the general consensus is that indexing this information is a good idea.
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Prefer P&A section. NA/T section is horrible idea.
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How many votes do we need to apply these changes?
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