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Relooking at Mario's stats

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Is no one going to look at the Japanese 64 scan?!

I'm working on a rough translation but I'm up if anyone will try translating too
 
I mean the FOP comparison doesn’t work anyway, in that show it was firmly established as just a comic.
In SM64, no such evidence exists for it just being a painting. So considering that you can walk around in it just fine, combined with Maverick’s scan, it is ridiculous to call it just a painting.
 
So it's a Nintendo Power Guidebook I see.

Kinda hypocritical to simultaneously want to use it while also requesting the original JP translation for the actual game.
 

クッパはパワースターをあつかってかべやえのなか　にカイプツのくにをつくろうとしています。スターあとりかえして。 - Jisho.org

jisho.org jisho.org

There were some phrases that Jisho didn't recognize like "カイプツ" I roughly interpreted as "Sir Koopa/Bowser is using the power stars to work inside the walls and paintings and mend them do his image. Go get the star back!
 
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Hagane_no_Saiyajin said:

クッパはパワースターをあつかってかべやえのなか　にカイプツのくにをつくろうとしています。スターあとりかえして。 - Jisho.org

jisho.org jisho.org

There were some phrases that Jisho didn't recognize like "カイプツ" I roughly interpreted as "Sir Koopa/Bowser is using the power stars to work inside the walls and painting to mend them do his image. Go get the star back!
Click to expand...
We just been over this above, if you're going to translate this on sites like these do single word by word cause these free translate sites can't do full sentences. Or better yet contact a translator.
 
Okay hold on the video literally says they're just in outer space, Brobot's feat seems completely invalid.
image0.png
 
Eficiente said:
I'll later call many staff to fix the page in accordance with the standards of the wiki, leaving no room for doubts like this.
Click to expand...
Do whatever you want, but the burden of proof is on you that there was space already existing in those paintings.

Creation:

"The ability to create anything from nothing."

Eficiente said:
The world Bowser was creating in the paintings and walls was a singular one, so other places transporting Mario into said world doesn't work as evidence of said world not being in the paintings and walls.
Click to expand...

So... yes, you agree Bowser created the world or what? Wasn't your argument that it doesn't scale to AP? How does the number of worlds counter that?
 
Being 3-D while inside of fiction doesn't make it less fictional, likewise walking around dreams and minds of other while 3-D doesn't make that real nor any character creating those areas would be able to do the same in real life. If anything, that guide saying that the places Mario goes to are "like paintings from the outside" reaffirms they're not being a real place. The guide also isn't lying anyway, yes they do look like paintings from the outside, but then wow hey you can go in them, normal paintings don't do that.
 
That guide above also refers to the areas as "magical painting worlds" right before having the quote given above, has nobody even saw a verse where going into fiction still has people being 3-D like in real life? I legit can't think of a series where this isn't a thing, at the moment.

Edit: Then, on the same page and still talking about those worlds, the guide says that "It's assumed that Bowser, with the power of the Stars at his disposal, intends to extend his reach over the real world." It then goes on to point out wacky, inapplicable beliefs the silly people in Mario think Bowser could do with that, but those places being magical painting worlds not part of the real world was stated as a general fact. @Matthew_Schroeder @DarkDragonMedeus @Dino_Ranger_Black @Ryukama Would you guys like to say a word? Because I think we should just remove the feat right now as we have evidence to spare on it being false, the in-game text, visuals and guide confirm it and everything would need to have been miraculously mistranslated to an absurd degree to be a legit feat, at which point it has nothing to do with what our profiles claim.
 
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Maverick_Zero_X said:
Okay hold on the video literally says they're just in outer space, Brobot's feat seems completely invalid.
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Maybe I'm not reading this right, where was that stated? "The gravitational laws of space" wasn't Luigi saying... Outerspace, like every other character. It also feels odd how beating Brobot just instantly makes it all go away.
 
Eficiente said:
Being 3-D while inside of fiction doesn't make it less fictional, likewise walking around dreams and minds of other while 3-D doesn't make that real nor any character creating those areas would be able to do the same in real life. If anything, that guide saying that the places Mario goes to are "like paintings from the outside" reaffirms they're not being a real place. The guide also isn't lying anyway, yes they do look like paintings from the outside, but then wow hey you can go in them, normal paintings don't do that.
Click to expand...
Worth bringing up that these spaces could very well be smaller than they appear to be even with stellar objects in them. Big Boo's Haunt is confirmed to be a small cage with toys inside that Mario shrinks to go inside of, and it has a moon inside it that cannot be real. Another example is Tiny-Huge Island, where we know how big it is depends on which painting you enter, and yes they are not two separate worlds since they are connected by a pipe and we know that the way you enter the top of the mountain in one level is by one of the worlds directly affecting the other.

Hell, one of the stages is literally just the sky above the castle, Dire Dire Docks is connected to the sewer/moat system of the castle, one is just the castle's aquarium, etc. Basically the case for immersion is pretty strong, if not just one of those "a space within a space" sort of deals. Mario needs to get smaller in both breadth and height in order to fit (in regards to BBH at least as one example) after all.
 
The issue is that those are a selective few. Using Tiny-Huge Island is an awful example, the pipes only changes the island size, not the space around it. It doesn't contradict Wiggler being able to see stars at night. It also doesn't take into account that there are levels where Bowser was stated to be the one making the world itself. Also we're not counting the castle aquarium, that's a secret star in which Bowser has no influence over. The ones you selected do have cases, since Mario literally falls from the sky. Others however, yeah, Bowser made them.
 
Ok... why are you personally worried about it? From a personal level.
 
unknown.png

to create - Jisho.org

jisho.org jisho.org

Looking at the scan and the link the Japanese verbs for "to create" うみだす, つくりあげる, or つくりだす, おこす do not appear here. Only つくろう which means to fix
 
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my main point was that we see a celestial object in one of these levels and it explicitly is not real (AND these levels, including a painting level, is not the scale we want it to be for it to be a big feat)

but also if the first english screenshot is what we have for Bowser creating them, why are we even using that as evidence? Toad says "paintings" and "walls" (plural) but then says "world" (singular) so even the english version was suspicious to begin with. If we use this combined with what we know in say, Bob-Omb Battlefield, where King Bob-Omb was given a power star by Bowser, "create" is likely not literal even in the english translation (and judging by the rough translation work above, it may very well be the case that its not literally creating something anyway as suspected) since all Bowser is doing is causing more chaos and giving power to people he allies himself with to hold power. Seems pretty pointless to me if Bowser just decided to create several worlds with their own histories and backstories somehow which he also decided to only have himself hold any sort of indirect rule in these worlds by making a random middleman (the bosses he gave power stars to) if his main goal in this game is literally just domination (remember how he says he hates that peace is returning to the world at the end of the game)

i have a gripe with the fact that all these feats are just starry sky feats interpreted in such an overly simplistic way meanwhile, even if the opposition conceded every single point, the fact remains that none of these feats are as simple or straightforward as the profiles make them out to be.

that being said i don't see why all special stages get special pleading anyway (not that i was even using the aquarium as a miscellaneous example for no reason, it was to point out that these places are connected to the castle, same with Tick Tock Clock for example which is literally a clock and a main course)
 
I asked for a translation for the King Boo scan here.

“This is a space that was created by the incredible power of King Teresa (King Boo’s japanese name) in a place from outside this world! Are you brave enough to fight there?”

So the Illusion-thing was an English-only mistranslation. I think King Boo’s feat is safe.
 
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I'll need to comeback later to address the other stuff. But glad to know King Boo's feat is legit.
 
I have no problem with King Boo's feat being legit, my problem is scaling this to people when he needs a power up to do it. It's just circular scaling.
 
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