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Regarding Bleach's Soul Crush In VS Match Ups

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That's like saying a beam of soul destroying energy can destroy anybody's soul even if it doesn't hit the opponent? The aura needs to make contact with someone in order to affect them. Someone having a stronger aura would naturally not be affected by it in the first place for the soul hax to take place.



doesn't the physical body by the nature of mood bypass auras ? why is a reiatsu spiritual aura kept the same as a physical aura ? so you're damaging the soul with this, but an energy unrelated to the soul is blocking it? it doesn't happen between bleach characters because either spirits or characters who don't even have contact with a spirit without high spirit power are blocked, so don't be silly, according to me dec
 
I had not yet watched that movie, so it was an honest misunderstanding from the scan that was posted. But it's a good thing you did that, people only resort to attacking others when they feel their arguments don't hold water.


Changing the terms doesn't change how the mechanism works. He said that when two spiritual forces collide, the weaker absorbs the impact. And that Ichigo's spirit energy attack through his sword was weaker than the spirit energy leaking out of him subconsciously.
The energy that is released outside the body is reiatsu. It's an aura. What happens to an aura that meets another greater aura? It gets negged.


That's like saying a beam of soul destroying energy can destroy anybody's soul even if it doesn't hit the opponent? The aura needs to make contact with someone in order to affect them. Someone having a stronger aura would naturally not be affected by it in the first place for the soul hax to take place.
Given that you just blatantly hand waved half my post, I'm going to do you one better and hand wave your entire post.

Not like you actually ever had a coherent argument anyway.
 
Wrong , and quite badly at that .

Quincies don't release energy at all , and yet they are not soul crushed by shinigamis or hollow.

You need a strong soul to resist your soul getting crushed, no ammount of energy will ever counter that .

You continue to be confused on how bleach work.
Factually untrue, not only are you completely misunderstanding what Kenpachi said, but it's just straight wrong anyway.

Quincy emit virtually zero Reiatsu and aren't Soul Crushed

Or a more recent example, the Hollows in the latest chapter of Bleach, they're directly stated to not even emit Reiatsu and they don't get soul crushed.

You've already expressed your clear lack of knowledge regarding Bleach in other CRT's, so I'm going to give you some advice and tell you to quit trying to act knowledgeable about things you don't understand
How about when yhwach soul crushed bazz. In the novels it's also stated he soul crushed haibel. When they Quincy fist invaded they had mapped their spiritual pressures and said it was equal to or greater than a captains
 
Would that affect this thread? Like, would the range of the ability =/= potency of the ability?
By default, yes, and even then the increase in potency would be unquantificable more often than not, let alone it no longer being assumable that a character can concentrate such power to a single target.
 
How about when yhwach soul crushed bazz. In the novels it's also stated he soul crushed haibel. When they Quincy fist invaded they had mapped their spiritual pressures and said it was equal to or greater than a captains
Yhwach isn't an ordinary Quincy, hence why it's listed on his profile

And he's actually demonstrated soul crushing people, as you pointed out, unlike any other Quincy.
 
Didn’t keep up with the thread past the part about the mechanics and extent of the mind hax (subtle suggestion vs entire rewrite) but it got me thinking. How would we treat a case where numbers is the defining factor in a verse rather than the extent of the mind hax? Example, A can completely dominate and alter the mind of one person but because B can give subtle suggestions to 10 people, the verse considers B to be more powerful than A in terms of mind hax. Would we say that B can overcome the resistance of C (from another verse in a thread) if it’s based on resisting something similar to A? Or would we go by how the site considers A’s feat to be > B’s?
 
Didn’t keep up with the thread past the part about the mechanics and extent of the mind hax (subtle suggestion vs entire rewrite) but it got me thinking. How would we treat a case where numbers is the defining factor in a verse rather than the extent of the mind hax? Example, A can completely dominate and alter the mind of one person but because B can give subtle suggestions to 10 people, the verse considers B to be more powerful than A in terms of mind hax. Would we say that B can overcome the resistance of C (from another verse in a thread) if it’s based on resisting something similar to A? Or would we go by how the site considers A’s feat to be > B’s?
Assuming numbers involved do relate to potency of the ability, and they're indeed capable of (This can't be assumed) concentrating all of such power to a single individual and raise such power accordingly, it'd be unquantificable, so I'd just say it's inconclusive unless there's a more direct comparison in-universe over B's potency to determine if it can bypass a resistance on the level of what A's does, which is explained to be the case here, in which case I'd say that B's mindhax can indeed bypass the same kind of resistance A can, although unquantificably higher as said before in terms of potency, and this is assuming both mindhax abilities work the exact same beyond numbers and the before-mentioned aspects.
 
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I always saw the potency of Soul Crush as the effects. Like Arrancars would be able to literally bring their opponents to their knees, and then Aizen is able to outright destroy the soul.
 
we have feats of yammy crushing a soul with resistance;bringing it the the verge of death, with his passive casual reiatsu, not even wanting to do it.

A soul without resistance receiving the full brunt of a RC possesing characther in battle mode(actually exerting his full reiatsu) would mean instant death.

And with resistance bypass now counting much more than before , reiatsu crush have became much much stronger than before given the dozens of examples of reiatsu crush bypassing the defenses of characthers wich already no selled the reiatsu of another characther, wich himself no selled the reiatsu of another etc ,etc.

I still disagree completely with bobsican's mind/soul manip rework as i think he made insanely more complicated than before for little benefits, but in the case of reiatsu crush , his rework buffed it immensely.

Now RC have all three categories of judging soul hax strengh really high:
numbers : from hundreds of millions to infinite with the latest feats.
resistance bypass : a very long chain of resistance bypass scaling.
potency : can induce many effects including death or erasure.

And even tho the effect is passive , it's linked to their energy, can be increased/decreased at will and can be focused on a single characther.
 
Per the revision numbers are no longer necessarily relevant, affecting countless beings doesn't mean that countless power is also applied to each individual subject, nor does it mean that the user can concentrate all of such power to a single target (And raise it accordingly).
As usual, (citation needed).
 
Per the revision numbers are no longer necessarily relevant, affecting countless beings doesn't mean that countless power is also applied to each individual subject, nor does it mean that the user can concentrate all of such power to a single target (And raise it accordingly).
As usual, (citation needed).
So, for a character to resist Soul Crush, they would need to show that they resisted having their soul disintegrated? So even if a character were to survive hax that affected thousands of souls, it would still be below having their soul disintegrated?
 
pretty much yeah.

but even that won't be enough. Because some characther can even easily resist RC that would kill others. Honestly , the resistance bypass scaling chain of RC will have to be made accuratly , but it's going to be massive .
 
It also depends on how such thousands of souls were affected.
If it was in the exact same way (being desintegrated), and such increase of numbers do relate to potency, while also including the capability of the user to concentrate such power to a single target, then it'd be superior, but still unquantificable if this increase can't be related to a proper resistance level, and thus unusable beyond how the verse treats it, like as we do with unquantificable stat amps and the like.
 
Ok, so this is what was added to the Hax page, so we should be able to come up with a conclusion for this thread.

Note 2: When judging the potency of hax-based abilities such as Mind Manipulation and Soul Manipulation, and the resistance against them, there is a variety of factors to be potentially considered. Such as the mechanisms involved, how many people the power can affect, whether it has demonstrated to break through resistances, how great the effects are, etc.

These factors need to be examined with the mechanism in mind, to determine if they actually demonstrate potency. For example, for a mind-controlling gas simply affecting more people with it, by using lots of the gas, would not indicate an increase in potency of the gas as simply more of it was used. The effect couldn't be accumulated to be as strong on a single target as it is on all affected individuals summed up.

Whether a power can overcome a resistance against it based on certain feats has to be determined by comparing the various factors at play. For example, a resistance can be overcome by Mind Manipulation with higher potency in any factor, if the resistance is equal, less or unknown in all other factors. When it comes to resistance that is above the Mind Manipulation in some factors, while the Mind Manipulation that is superior in other factors, one has to see on a case-by-case basis whether a convincing argument can be put forth. Otherwise, such a situation will have an inconclusive result.

How the mechanism of the power (Such as the before-mentioned Mind Manipulation) interacts with the mechanism of the resistance is, of course, also relevant.
 
Ok so I just want to make sure I've wrapped my head around this correctly, and this is hypothetical btw:

Character A from verse 1 resists a 10 person mind-wipe.
Character B from verse 2 can wipe 20 people, has a verse mechanic that allows them to concentrate their abilities on single targets, and we know it applies to their mind manip. There are no feats overcoming resistance (no one was able to in-verse).
Under the current changes A would resist B's mind manip because the difference is unquantifiable?
 
Ok so I just want to make sure I've wrapped my head around this correctly, and this is hypothetical btw:

Character A from verse 1 resists a 10 person mind-wipe.
Character B from verse 2 can wipe 20 people, has a verse mechanic that allows them to concentrate their abilities on single targets, and we know it applies to their mind manip. There are no feats overcoming resistance (no one was able to in-verse).
Under the current changes A would resist B's mind manip because the difference is unquantifiable?
Hmmm, are u saying that B can do a 20 person mind wipe on one person? But the verse itself hasn't shown resistance feats?
 
Ok so I just want to make sure I've wrapped my head around this correctly, and this is hypothetical btw:

Character A from verse 1 resists a 10 person mind-wipe.
Character B from verse 2 can wipe 20 people, has a verse mechanic that allows them to concentrate their abilities on single targets, and we know it applies to their mind manip. There are no feats overcoming resistance (no one was able to in-verse).
Under the current changes A would resist B's mind manip because the difference is unquantifiable?
Yes, surprisingly, like how we treat stat amps that are unquantificable and there's no way to know if they even overpower significantly someone that was otherwise on the same level of the user, for example.
If there's a way to correlate B's higher potency to resistance bypassing it'd be another story, but as it is currently? Eh...
 
Huh... That sounds like it breeches NLF territory.
Character A would be resisting a level of potency they've never encountered.

For instance, some verses have forms of invulnerability that function as hax in-verse, but this site always limits it's degree of durability to whatever highest AP it was been shown/stated/scaled to be superior to. For good reason.
 
The problem is that such potency can't be measured for that kind of purpose in the first place.
We don't go around grabbing an unquantificable stat amp and saying it lets the user stomp those that were on the same level as it otherwise if there's no feats or implications to claim it's that high in comparison to begin with.
 
We don't call it a stomp, but we do denote it as Higher because by definition is has to be a greater effect.
If two have a comparable effect, then one verse brings another instance of that effect but acknowledges it as completely superior, that in itself would be the implication that pushes the potency above the resistance of the other example.
 
If that's the case, then yes, but simply being "higher" doesn't necessarily means it's going to bypass the resistance, as simply put, potency and resistance layers simply don't correlate, as it was explained in the thread that implemented that rule. Invulnerability is treated differently as it directly relates to AP and Durability in a way, while hax abilities like soul manip don't to begin with.
 
I think being the combination of 5 souls combined for example should give you 5 layers of resistance and someone affecting will get 5 or 6 layers of potency
 
Imagine given Gon these abilities in a fight against Ichigo just because you need to equalize it so he doesn’t get Reiatsu crush.

Giving Reiatsu to Gon will also give him:

Soul destruction
Stun
Fear
Hax negation
Chikaku
Phantom Pain
Reiatsu vents (block them and he explodes from the inside out)
Reiatsu weakness (meaning someone like Uryu can completely attack his soul and remove his powers for good by destroying their soul. Byakuya did the same thing to Ichigo)
Soul Manipulation resistance
 
Im gonna give my opinion, but I think that characters that have strictly spiritual energy, which maybe has connection to the soul (such as Naruto or Dragonball character). Should resists it, if and only if they have enough AP.
But only because they have spiritual energy, so a fair connection with bleach can be made forcefully To ignore soul hax Layer.

But just being stronger or by tier or having magic, is not a reason, (such as Saitama or character that use magic or weird form of energy like one piece character not related to the soul) so they need soul hax resistance feat To the same level. Even if equalisation take palace.

this is the only solution I can see, because straight up equalise everything and give resistance is dumb. We don’t make it for other novel or verse that use soul hax.

TLDR: soul crush is always the same for every verse, so they need resistance, but verse with strictly spiritual energy and no other form of energy, can resist it via AP due to a forced connection.
 
DBZ has some good soul manipulation resistance, but Naruto soul manipulation resistance feats are poor. Very low tier.
 
thats not even a good soul resistance feat, as hakai is baseline
Do you know that Naruto and DB soul resistance are literally the same level right?
Better than anything shown in Naruto. Hakai is from the Gods that stomp the Naruto verse, and one of Naruto's best Soul resistance on panel is pulling the soul back into the body with its own hands. That is barely a resistance at all. He didn't resist it, he force it back with his hands but I am been generous and given them that feat. Six Path users don't resist TSB soul "destruction" which is brought into question to not even be that. The Six path users are just immune to it if we are been generous. We all know it just nulls the Edo and didn't do anything to Minato's soul but keep his soul hands trap in the Edo's hands on the ground.
 
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Better than anything shown in Naruto. Hakai is from the Gods that stomp the Naruto verse, and one of Naruto's best Soul resistance on panel is pulling the soul back into the body with its own hands. That is barely a resistance at all. He didn't resist it, he force it back with his hands but I am been generous and given them that feat. Six Path users don't resist TSB soul "destruction" which is brought into question to not even be that. The Six path users are just immune to it if we are been generous. We all know it just nulls the Edo and didn't do anything to Minato's soul but keep his soul hands trap in the Edo's hands on the ground.
you know that the AP of the soul destroyer doesn't matter right?
 
Better than anything shown in Naruto. Hakai is from the Gods that stomp the Naruto verse, and one of Naruto's best Soul resistance on panel is pulling the soul back into the body with its own hands.
Actually, no, chakra was accepted currently as Soul, and TSB does erase chakra, aka erasing souls, and TSB users resist that
 
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