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UchihaSlayer96

He/Him
VS Battles
Thread Moderator
10,901
14,204
Yo everybody!
It's been a while. I know I haven't posted any CRTs in a hot minute, but after so many major revisions in such quick succession (Bijuu thread, top tiers, Itachi overhaul, etc), I needed a bit of a break. Plus, I had a lot going on IRL as well. So, yeah, I put this off for a long time, but it's finally ready.

Similar to the Itachi overhaul, this revision aims to completely revamp Jiraiya's profile. I'm not gonna bother writing down the individual changes made because.....well, I've quite literally remade the entire profile. His P&A section was completely redone. Same goes for the Intelligence, weaknesses, stamina, and range sections. I even redid his quotes, added references and scans to his age. The whole nine yards. The only things I didn't really change all that much were his stats sections, since those were either already revised (in the case of AP, SS, and Dura), or are pending future revisions (Speed and LS). However, I did still improve the justifications for those a bit. Of course, I left the ratings as is, since this isn't a stat revision, but I added references, scans, and improved the wording on justifications and whatnot.

So yeah, here's the current profile. And here's the sandbox with all of the proposed changes for how the profile should look like. I feel like most of it is pretty straightforward stuff, but of course I'm open to any and all suggestions for improvements. Feel free to voice any disagreements you may have, obviously.

Before we begin, there's just one small thing I'd like to get out of the way.

So, this might end up being completely irrelevant to most of you, but I still want to mention it just in case because it's something that's personally bothered me for some time. So this is for anyone who may have had similar thoughts to myself, I guess.
I always found it weird how we gave Jiraiya the Sensory abilities associated with Sage Mode when he never directly showcased them, and to add insult to injury, he seemingly couldn't even detect Pain when he was hiding inside his invisible chameleon. However, since then I've given it much thought and done a lot of research, and I decided to give him (or let him keep, rather) these abilities. Here's my reasoning for that:
Simply put, I believe that the chameleon, and those hiding inside it, have a resistance towards sensory-types. Leaving Jiraiya aside for a moment, Fukasaku and Shima were also unable to detect the chameleon or Pain, and they needed to use Shima's Tongue Trap to sniff out the chameleon. Now this ability isn't like normal sensory powers because it's not reliant on chakra in any way, but rather it detects its targets through scent. Why is this relevant? Well, Fukasaku and Shima are both perfect Sages. They have absolutely flawless mastery over Sage Mode, and have an unparalleled understanding of Senjutsu. They were also directly stated and shown to have sensory abilities. The point is that even if we were to argue that Jiraiya may be missing these abilities due to having an imperfect Sage Mode, the same couldn't possibly be said for Ma and Pa. There's also more evidence for the chameleon having resistance to ESP. During Nagato's fight against Naruto and Bee, KCM Naruto was caught off-guard by an attack from Nagato who was hidden inside the chameleon. Naruto had the ability to detect attacks in advance by sensing negative emotions and harmful intentions, yet he didn't see this attack coming at all.
Circling back to Jiraiya and his "imperfect Sage Mode", the only thing we're ever told regarding that is that he had issues with gathering and maintaining Nature Energy. This mostly manifested in the form of him having more frog-like features when entering the form, but it was never really implied in any way that he was missing any of the abilities or perks associated with SM. He was in a proper Sage Mode after all. So when we consider the fact that we have a perfectly plausible explanation for his only "anti-feat", and combine it with the fact that he should realistically possess these abilities, I think it's fine for him to keep them. That's about it, really.

Also, massive thanks to @Wrath_Of_Itachi for providing me with a bunch of the scans I used. Muchas gracias, buddy.

With that out of the way, let's discuss!

Agree: Wrath_Of_Itachi, KingTempest, Arcker123, LordTracer, DarkDragonMedeus, Testarossa002, Kidkinsey, Excel616, Deceived3596, LephyrTheRevanchist , LordGriffin1000
Disagree: UglyKid (M3X)
Neutral:
 
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I'll go through the blog later.
 
Wasn’t Jiraiya caught of gaurd by the asura path who said a whole sentence and took his arm?
Well, again, the same thing happened to Ma and Pa. So this is either an insane Stealth Mastery feat for Pain, or just PIS, since Kishimoto was just delivering payoff for the earlier exchange where Jiraiya told Nagato not to let his guard down earlier in the chapter.
Also it's not really unique for characters with ESP, or even precognition, to get caught off guard or tagged. It happens all the time in fiction. Nothing really unique to Jiraiya here.
 
Well, again, the same thing happened to Ma and Pa. So this is either an insane Stealth Mastery feat for Pain, or just PIS, since Kishimoto was just delivering payoff for the earlier exchange where Jiraiya told Nagato not to let his guard down earlier in the chapter.
Also it's not really unique for characters with ESP, or even precognition, to get caught off guard or tagged. It happens all the time in fiction. Nothing really unique to Jiraiya here.
It’s just a bit hard to believe especially since the sage mode senses is pretty good be able to sense the chakra of an entire village and sense enemy attacks. Wasn’t he also surprised that their were six pains and that they survived? Pretty sure he would have sensed that or Nagato chakra when he was stabbed by the rod.
 
It’s just a bit hard to believe especially since the sage mode senses is pretty good be able to sense the chakra of an entire village and sense enemy attacks. Wasn’t he also surprised that their were six pains and that they survived? Pretty sure he would have sensed that or Nagato chakra when he was stabbed by the rod.
Not really, since the Pains were inactive up until the moment they were summoned after the others were revived. Also, again, this is also an anti-feat for Ma and Pa (who should definitely have these like I said), so it really is nothing more than just the usual fiction being fiction. Characters with far more insane ESP abilities have been caught off guard and tagged before, it's not that deep. As for getting stabbed with the rods thing, Jiraiya was literally in a separate dimension at the time lmao, there's no reason he should be able to sense him anyway. Also Naruto didn't passively sense Nagato's location when he was stabbed, he was actively looking for Nagato at that point and purposely tracked him down. Jiraiya didn't even know Pain was being remotely controlled yet at that point.
Finally, Pain just has consistently insane Stealth.
 
Well, I'm happy it got done. I agree with pretty much everything. Though I'll agree to disagree on your views regarding Pain just having that level of stealth in regards to sneaking up on Sage Mode J. I won't deny the modes sensing capabilities but that moment was sus as hell and off guard just doesn't do it for me so I'm going to say PIS is all I can admit to.
 
There were a few, but they all went miraculously smoothly lol. I think you'll find all the necessary context in the OP of the thread I linked earlier.
Ok I'll check it out, I personally disagree but maybe I'll be convinced

A couple things though, not directly related lmao I apologise, but do you think Jiraiya is 6-C physically? I think the "physically" vs "technique" thing should apply more holistically unless he's 6-C all around similar to Suigetsu only being 6-C via Tate Eboshi. Jiraiya can certainly box with Biju via ninjutsu but not like punching their lights out like Tsunade.
 
Ok I'll check it out, I personally disagree but maybe I'll be convinced

A couple things though, not directly related lmao I apologise, but do you think Jiraiya is 6-C physically? I think the "physically" vs "technique" thing should apply more holistically unless he's 6-C all around similar to Suigetsu only being 6-C via Tate Eboshi. Jiraiya can certainly box with Biju via ninjutsu but not like punching their lights out like Tsunade.
I think he's on the spectrum. He's not as physically strong as Tsunade, but he's on a similar level to that tier overall, with his Ninjutsu obviously being the great equalizer.
 
I think he's on the spectrum. He's not as physically strong as Tsunade, but he's on a similar level to that tier overall, with his Ninjutsu obviously being the great equalizer.
Eh, I don't see it

This means that in taijutsu Base Jiraiya is going to ragdoll Hebi Sasuke, Sick Itachi, Kisame, Might Guy, Kakashi and so on, I think that's quite a stretch

Bare in mind Guy was able to hurt Jiraiya with one of his weaker kicks compared to his stronger kick on Kisame which did no damage, and both were caught off guard
 
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Eh, I don't see it

This means that in taijutsu Base Jiraiya is going to ragdoll Hebi Sasuke, Sick Itachi, Kisame, Might Guy, Kakashi and so on, I think that's quite a stretch

Bare in mind Guy was able to hurt Jiraiya with one of his weaker kicks, though Jiraiya got caught off guard
It really isn't. Kisame is confirmed as inferior to Jiraiya. Hebi Sasuke is confirmed as inferior to Orochimaru, who Jiraiya scales to. And Itachi at that point was inferior to Hebi Sasuke, both physically and in terms of regular Ninjutsu, due to his illness reaching its apex.

Anyway, we're really derailing this thread lol.
 
It really isn't. Kisame is confirmed as inferior to Jiraiya. Hebi Sasuke is confirmed as inferior to Orochimaru, who Jiraiya scales to. And Itachi at that point was inferior to Hebi Sasuke, both physically and in terms of regular Ninjutsu, due to his illness reaching its apex.

Anyway, we're really derailing this thread lol.
Sure, all these characters can be inferior to Jiraiya, and Jiriaya can beat them, but that doesn't mean Jiraiya can ragdoll them in taijutsu. That's quite an odd claim considering a kick from Base Guy can harm Jiraiya...
Bare in mind Guy was able to hurt Jiraiya with one of his weaker kicks compared to his stronger kick on Kisame which did no damage, and both were caught off guard
Guy is superior physically to Jiriaya for sure.

We can stop here but just something to consider
 
I do have a couple of notes.

I don’t know why the first stage of the Chūnin Exams should be mentioned. As of Boruto, we know that not every Chūnin exam goes by the same stages and the one we see in Part I doesn’t requires you to actually be able to get the answers right or copy efficiently, just not quitting at the end like Naruto did.

Also, the mention of how Shikamaru and Kakashi weren’t able to decipher the code it’s off. And it’s because it had to do with Jiraiya's tendencies to write "Ta" similar to how a nine would look like. This was deliberately made so only Naruto would’ve known, as he spent time reviewing his novels during his training. Also, whereas I do see it as a very good memory feat, I don’t think it really means that Jiraiya remembers essentially everything he ever has seen.
 
I do have a couple of notes.

I don’t know why the first stage of the Chūnin Exams should be mentioned. As of Boruto, we know that not every Chūnin exam goes by the same stages and the one we see in Part I doesn’t requires you to actually be able to get the answers right or copy efficiently, just not quitting at the end like Naruto did.
The exams may not have been perfectly identical, but they were always similar enough in structure as we saw in the Itachi novel (as it included the same Written Exam, Forest of Death, and individual battles structure). We know Minato also went through these same stages, because Itachi was competing against his records. So that's proof that they're mostly the same across several generations of Shinobi.
It may have changed in Boruto, but that's to be expected because a lot of the institutions and policies changed after the 4th War, and after Naruto took over.

As for your other point, sure, you don't need to solve the exam, but there's no real indication that Jiraiya pulled the same thing Naruto did, since he is far more intelligent than Naruto after all (even if he acts otherwise a lot of the time).
Also, the mention of how Shikamaru and Kakashi weren’t able to decipher the code it’s off. And it’s because it had to do with Jiraiya's tendencies to write "Ta" similar to how a nine would look like. This was deliberately made so only Naruto would’ve known, as he spent time reviewing his novels during his training. Also, whereas I do see it as a very good memory feat, I don’t think it really means that Jiraiya remembers essentially everything he ever has seen.
I didn't say they couldn't decipher his message at all, I said that they struggled with it a little bit, which goes to show how much thought went into it at a moment when he was so compromised.
And it is absolutely a ridiculous memory feat. To be able to remember specific words, letters, paragraphs, and page numbers in a whole ass novel while stabbed, dismembered, bleeding out, etc is astounding. He shouldn't even be able to think in such a state, let alone come up with that type of thing.
I can personally attest that a deep cut can cause excruciating pain and make it hard to think straight for a while. I can't imagine how bad it'd be with what Jiraiya went through.
 
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