Order 106(centimeters) [Sannin Revision - Part II]

[UchihaSlayer96]

Hey everyone. I hope ya'll are having a wonderful day.

I'm going to keep this short and sweet. This is the sequel to the Jiraiya overhaul I did a couple of weeks ago. Today we're revising Tsunade, and with this, I'll have revised my top 3 favorite characters in the verse: Itachi, Jiraiya, and Tsunade. I guess I'll quit now?
You guys know the drill by now. I revised and rewrote essentially everything on that profile, so there's no point in detailing each individual change when I can just link the Sandbox that has the new profile. For comparison, here's the current profile.
The only things that weren't meaningfully changed were the ratings, as this is not a statistics revision. However, I did rewrite her Speed and LS sections because they were God awful, but the ratings won't be affected for the time being. Well, actually, that's a bit of a lie because I did also add her accepted LS calc that's been on the verse page for about a year now. The reason I did this is that absolutely nobody scales to Tsunade in terms of LS. Maybe 100H Sakura would scale, but I'll get to Sakura soon enough with her own overhaul not too long from now. The point is that this doesn't have any real massive ramifications for the scaling, so I thought it was okay to add in this revision, even though it doesn't really aim to revise stats or scaling.

And, yeah, that's really about it. Do let me know if there's anything I should change, add, or remove.

With that being said, let's get into it!

Agree (for two MASSIVE reasons): LordTracer, Excel616, Damage3245, AnimesFreak2, XSOULOFCINDERX, Nierre, EmperorRorepmeTwo, Deceived3596
Disagree (because you're a morbid hoe):
Neutral (n0 ballZ):

 

[LordTracer]

Since I already looked over this a few times, I’m gonna disagree now just to be a nuisance

Jk, the revised profile is fantastic, nice work putting all of this together.

 

[Excellence616]

I agree

 

[Damage3245]

As someone who cherishes the bolded/bullet point style of listing abilities, this sandbox makes me very happy.

Rest of the profile looks good too.

 

[AnimesFreak2]

Looks good bro

Agree

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Damn that looks nice, great job buddy!

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Thanks fellas, I really appreciate the kind words.

 

[Nierre]

Her Byakugō quote goes so incredibly hard dude.

Love the respect for Tsunade you put on the profile, great great job.

 

[Deceived3596]

for two MASSIVE reasons

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

Agreed, nice work

 

[Deceived3596]

Outside of the funni "big booba" stuff. I'm fine with the revised profile overall, I believe some small changes can be made to make it visually more appealing (like separating resistances to a separate tabber instead of having them with her abilities), but outside of this I don't have any disagreements currently. I still need to look over her intelligence rating and justifications, but that's about it. I have already checked everything else and I'm fine with that stuff.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I believe some small changes can make it visually more appealing (like separating resistances to a separate tabber instead of having them with her abilities)

Sure, I suppose this can be arranged. I'll handle it tomorrow.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

From a cursory inspection (gonna be honest, I ain't reading allat), it looks good, though I think stuff like "able to" is used a bit too much, and idk about implying that Tsunade's feats against Orochimaru are him at his normal level even if it's not outright stated. Also think the fact that she "tagged" a Madara who was admittedly playing with the Kage is rather flimsy, and the combo she did with Ay isn't really concrete enough to use it to scale her low end relative to him as they didn't attack somultaneously or anything, it was one after another with an unclear timeframe (especially not if a combo as blatant as KCM Minato~BSM Naruto isn't accepted )

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Looks great.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Cooked, I agree.

 

[Arkenis]

The reason I did this is that absolutely nobody scales to Tsunade in terms of LS

Tsunade's feat is just strength, Third Raikage, Hashirama, Madara, should also scale.

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

Yes

 

[NaruRiasUzumaki]

Congratulations, you played yourself but seriously aside, look so good to me. And I agree with OP's stated

 

[karo_senpaii]

I mean why not just slap sub rel for her?

 

[LordTracer]

I mean why not just slap sub rel for her?

Dude, seriously?

The only things that weren't meaningfully changed were the ratings, as this is not a statistics revision.

 

[karo_senpaii]

Dude, seriously?

Ah sorry I missed that

 

[KaydeeX]

Profile looking good like her b****
Anyways I Agree

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Tsunade's feat is just strength, Third Raikage, Hashirama, Madara, should also scale.

Nope. They really shouldn't.

I mean why not just slap sub rel for her?

Like Tracer said, because this isn't really meant to be a revision for the stats. It's more of a "I'm gonna massively improve the quality of the profile" type of project.
But, to give you a more satisfying answer, we're going to revise speed for everyone pretty soon. Not only will a lot of the scaling change, but essentially all of the currently used values will be replaced as well. So using the current values in revisions just feels pointless since they'll be removed soon, anyway. A lot of them are also wrong and outdated, so yeah.

From a cursory inspection (gonna be honest, I ain't reading allat), it looks good,

Thanks ig.

though I think stuff like "able to" is used a bit too much,

Only when it's warranted, imo.

and idk about implying that Tsunade's feats against Orochimaru are him at his normal level even if it's not outright stated.

I didn't really make any claims regarding that on the profile itself. I only added the feats in a very matter-of-fact type of way, exactly as they happened. But, realistically, none of the Sannin were at their best in this fight. Orochimaru was missing his arms and Ninjutsu, Jiraiya was unable to manipulate chakra properly and was nerfed in general by Tsunade's drug, Tsunade was rusty, exhausted and used up a lot of chakra to heal from her previous injuries, etc. But objectively speaking, there's no proof that Orochimaru was physically weaker in this fight, which is why I made no claim as such. That's about it.
Also, her AP justification is the same as it's been for months now. I didn't actually change it for this revision lol.

Also think the fact that she "tagged" a Madara who was admittedly playing with the Kage is rather flimsy,

It's not, it's just a literal fact, like you said. For it to not be valid, you'd have to prove that Madara was holding back his speed and reactions here, which you cannot do.

and the combo she did with Ay isn't really concrete enough to use it to scale her low end relative to him as they didn't attack somultaneously or anything, it was one after another with an unclear timeframe (especially not if a combo as blatant as KCM Minato~BSM Naruto isn't accepted )

Which is accounted for by the fact that I already mentioned she's slower than Ay in the justification. But she did, in fact, perform a combo attack with the guy. Let's not pretend that it took her any relevant stretch of time to hit Madara after Ay reached him. (It's not accepted for the AP side due to reasons that are outlined on Minato's profile. You may disagree with those reasons, that's fine, but they have absolutely nothing to do with this thread. However, I can tell you with a high degree of confidence that Minato will definitely scale relative to BSM Naruto in speed, at least)

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Thanks ig.

Only when it's warranted, imo.

I didn't really make any claims regarding that on the profile itself. I only added the feats in a very matter-of-fact type of way, exactly as they happened. But, realistically, none of the Sannin were at their best in this fight. Orochimaru was missing his arms and Ninjutsu, Jiraiya was unable to manipulate chakra properly and was nerfed in general by Tsunade's drug, Tsunade was rusty, exhausted and used up a lot of chakra to heal from her previous injuries, etc. But objectively speaking, there's no proof that Orochimaru was physically weaker in this fight, which is why I made no claim as such. That's about it.

Isn't it usually the case that the form of a character is mentioned in feats?

Uhhh I mean just the fact that he was missing chakra from his arms means he for sure had some level of a nerf, it's just uncertain how much.

Also, her AP justification is the same as it's been for months now. I didn't actually change it for this revision lol.

Fair enough

It's not, it's just a literal fact, like you said. For it to not be valid, you'd have to prove that Madara was holding back his speed and reactions here, which you cannot do.

Which is accounted for by the fact that I already mentioned she's slower than Ay in the justification. But she did, in fact, perform a combo attack with the guy. Let's not pretend that it took her any relevant stretch of time to hit Madara after Ay reached him.

Welp that's a bit much to get into for what is like you said not a stat revision so I'll save my arguments

(It's not accepted for the AP side due to reasons that are outlined on Minato's profile. You may disagree with those reasons, that's fine, but they have absolutely nothing to do with this thread. However, I can tell you with a high degree of confidence that Minato will definitely scale relative to BSM Naruto in speed, at least)

Lightened Ay level Tsunade for BSM level Minato, sounds like a fair trade to me

 

[Padaruyos]

Profile is AMAZING!

Also that LS calc. Maybe it can also apply to Six Paths level characters unless the 8 Tails Naruto LS calc is already higher than that.

 

[TheRustyOne]

I have issues with that Tsunade Lifting Strength calculation.

It was discussed in this old thread which was agreed to be put on hold. But my problems with the calculation haven't changed.

I have no opinions about the sandbox outside of that.

 

[Arcker123]

Agree

 

[Arkenis]

Nope. They really shouldn't.

Third Ay went blow for blow with Gyuki, Madara and Hashirama are physically stronger than her. Whats the issue with them scaling above her in physicals? Ya even have KNO naruto calc as Class T, why wouldn't people scale off that then? This ain't bout the crt really so it's wtv ig but characters should definitely be upgraded from this.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Is everyone else seeing this?

 

[LordTracer]

Is everyone else seeing this?

He did that intentionally because you’re not allowed to use the tier categories in a sandbox

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

It was discussed in this old thread which was agreed to be put on hold. But my problems with the calculation haven't changed.

I'm not the best when it comes to calcs, so I'm not sure how you want me to proceed here. Do you want to have that discussion regarding the validity of the calc here? Or should I just remove it and wait until its handled elsewhere? I guess I'm partial to the latter solution, since this really isn't supposed to be a stat or calc-related revision. I only added it because I thought it was accepted.

 

[Damage3245]

I guess remove it for now and wait for it be resolved elsewhere is the best solution.

 

[Nierre]

He did that intentionally because you’re not allowed to use the tier categories in a sandbox

Why is that

 

[Damage3245]

Why is that

Because then it would add sandboxes to the category for tiers, which is just for actual pages.

 

[Nierre]

The more you know.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Snip

I agree with Damage on this matter.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Sure, that's fine. I'll remove it for the time being.

 

[Godernet]

The new page really does look clean.

Slayer FRA

 

[MinatoSparkle]

1. Wait a sec, I just realized the Ay feat is the opposite of what's said on the sandbox, he was actually made heavier at the moment he attacked Madara, so at best she'd scale to a nerfed Raikage's speed.
2. What happened to bro's pfp

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

1. Wait a sec, I just realized the Ay feat is the opposite of what's said on the sandbox, he was actually made heavier at the moment he attacked Madara, so at best she'd scale to a nerfed Raikage's speed.

I see what you mean, but I'm not sure I agree.
Onoki only makes Ay super heavy at the moment of impact. He does this to maximize both speed and power. So, basically, Onoki makes Ay super light, Ay uses his amped light-weight Shunshin to gain massive speed, and at the last second right before impact (or perhaps even at the moment of impact, kinda like he does here), he makes Ay super heavy in order to maximize his punching power. This strategy maximizes both aspects responsible for producing Force, which are mass and acceleration. Low-key, it's insane that Tsunade's still stronger than an Ay who's amped by such a degree, she really is HER.
The same result would not be achieved if Ay was being made heavy the whole way, or even half of the way to his target, as that would likely massively hamper his speed, which we know is a major contributing factor behind his punching power.

So, in short, Ay is only made super heavy at around the moment of impact. Him getting to Madara would still be under the effects of lightened mode (We literally see him using his Shunshin on his way to Madara), so getting heavy at the last second wouldn't really affect his overall speed in that moment, meaning everything I said for Tsunade would still stand.

2. What happened to bro's pfp

I was about to change it, so I deleted the old one, but then had a brain fart and forgot to actually add the new one lmao. Oopsie.