One Piece: Wano Arc Part 1: AP Revisions; The Dawn

[CiscoTheSoto]

Just to be clear, all the God tiers are scaling to Issho's updated feat of 1 Petaton, right? I thought the previous calc for his feat was 2.84 Petatons, and one of Whitebeard's calcs was 1.2 Petatons. Was the Whitebeard calc just deemed invalid? It was probably addressed in the previous thread, but it was so long I might've forgotten.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

theres no proof, burden of proof is on u guys, so by default you assume it wasn't.

She is using Mortar on them, I showed it already. You're the one assuming she's using lesser versions of the attack when it's shown that she's using it (Usopp also says "not again", implying she has been using it during off screen).

If you think she's using something else for Nami specifically, then the burden of proof is on YOU.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Just to be clear, all the God tiers are scaling to Issho's updated feat of 1 Petaton, right? I thought the previous calc for his feat was 2.84 Petatons, and one of Whitebeard's calcs was 1.2 Petatons. Was the Whitebeard calc just deemed invalid? It was probably addressed in the previous thread, but it was so long I might've forgotten.

OP states values and calcs are NOT to be discussed here. It has nothing to do with Wano, and the thread where this was decided is already concluded.

 

[KingTempest]

Ul-Zugan (ウル頭銃ズガン Uru Zugan?, Literally meaning "Ul Head Gun"): Ulti jumps into the air and rears her head back before covering her forehead in Busoshoku Haki and slamming it forward into her target's head. The force of this attack is so extreme that some of Ulti's crewmates were heard comparing it to a cannon shot, likely to pulverize the target's skull.[46] The attack was first seen in use against Luffy, while Ulti was in her human form, and although it physically overpowered Luffy it did not cause him any notable injury.[46] In the Viz translation and Funimation subtitles, the attack is called Ulti-Mortar.

We don't use their wiki as god. We see her use Ulti Mortar on others without using armament haki, and we see

its not tho

Definitely is. Not saying the name doesn't make it a different attack.

Unless you have proof that she has different versions of it outside of the Mortar and Meteor, then it's pretty much Mortar

 

[Magmag]

She is using Mortar on them, I showed it already. You're the one assuming she's using lesser versions of the attack when it's shown that she's using it (Usopp also says "not again", implying she has been using it during off screen).

implying she used it on usopp again, no where does it mention nami.

If you think she's using something else for Nami specifically, then the burden of proof is on YOU.

no lol, this isnt a reverse uno situation, its on u.

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

OP states values and calcs are NOT to be discussed here. It has nothing to do with Wano, and the thread where this was decided is already concluded.

Gotcha. I didn't want to start an argument over which should be the value or calc, I just wanted to clarify some things.

 

[Magmag]

We don't use their wiki as god. We see her use Ulti Mortar on others without using armament haki, and we see

ur the one who said it is just a normal headbutt even though its not, its a named attack.

Definitely is. Not saying the name doesn't make it a different attack.

but once again burden is on u.

Unless you have proof that she has different versions of it outside of the Mortar and Meteor, then it's pretty much Mortar

I do have proof, my proof is that u have no proof nami was his by a mortar.

 

[KingTempest]

ur the one who said it is just a normal headbutt even though its not, its a named attack.

named attack ≠ special attack. Zoro's onigiri is stated to be a basic attack. Still basic.

Marco can use undying thistle without saying the attack name. Still the same exact move.
Kaidou can use boro breath without saying the attack name. Still the same exact move.

but once again burden is on u.

Burden of what? Proving that she has more than 2 headbutt variants?

I do have proof, my proof is that u have no proof nami was his by a mortar.

Imma ignore that.
She says "no more headbutts".

From what we know, Ulti's headbutts are mortars and meteors.

Ulti doesn't have headbutt variants outside of those 2. If she got hit by a headbutt, she got hit by a mortar.

 

[Eseseso]

Ok, but for my other questions:

1. Regardless, since Zoro with normal Buso (even without unleashing Enma) is 760 teratons, shouldn't his Asura still scale to 3x that?

2.

You ain't read the sandbox huh

DUDE, that's the reason I'm bringing it up.

But lemme rephrase it: Would Kanjuro scale to 1 petaton (or 1-6) with Kazenbo due to fighting Base Yamato?

3.

Could Drake scale to Apoo for forcing him on his guard, and for scaling above Blue scarf, and Blue scarfs scales above Maha, and Maha scales above Apoo since Apoo was scared of him?

4.Was Law hurting Kaido and BM due to his devil fruit the same way that people scale above Issho's Devil fruit?

5. Will we discuss the Cloud Splitting calc of Luffy and Kaido?

 

[GodlyCharmander]

implying she used it on usopp again, no where does it mention nami.

no lol, this isnt a reverse uno situation, its on u.

"No, you have to prove it"
"Well, she's been using Mortar on Usopp off screen, she has used a headbutt attack on Nami off screen, and she has no logical reason to purposely hold back on Nami specifically. So it's heavily implied, and based on basic reading comprehension and interpretation"

"IT'S NOT VALID, DOESN'T MENTION HER DIRECTLY, SCHKEEEEE!"

You are not worth the trouble with your stonewalling. We are scaling Nami's durability to the Mortar.

 

[Tetsucabrah]

When Page One briefly overpowered Sanji in Hybrid form he remarked how tough the suit was, which sorta implies he would’ve taken damage without it. Would that change anything?

 

[KingTempest]

@Eseseso

1. Ask emin

2. He scales to 1 PT

3. No. And who said he's above blue scarf.

4. Dude. He hurt Kaidou with a sword stab.

5. No.

 

[Eseseso]

I tentatively agree to scaling Usopp and Nami to the mortar, albeit I think downscaling would be best.

 

[KingTempest]

When Page One briefly overpowered Sanji in Hybrid form he remarked how tough the suit was, which sorta implies he would’ve taken damage without it. Would that change anything?

Just supports overpowering Sanji's hit. Doesn't really change anything

 

[Magmag]

named attack ≠ special attack. Zoro's onigiri is stated to be a basic attack. Still basic.

Marco can use undying thistle without saying the attack name. Still the same exact move.
Kaidou can use boro breath without saying the attack name. Still the same exact move.

they can but you have to see it to believe it as some people say...

Burden of what? Proving that she has more than 2 headbutt variants?

Imma ignore that.
She says "no more headbutts".

well u just answered it urself, "no more headbutts" therefore ulti simply headbutted nami.

From what we know, Ulti's headbutts are mortars and meteors.

Ulti doesn't have headbutt variants outside of those 2. If she got hit by a headbutt, she got hit by a mortar.

just a headbutt since nami doesn't specify and ur making an assumption.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Question: Will we have separate profiles or just new keys?

 

[Magmag]

"No, you have to prove it"
"Well, she's been using Mortar on Usopp off screen, she has used a headbutt attack on Nami off screen, and she has no logical reason to purposely hold back on Nami specifically. So it's heavily implied, and based on basic reading comprehension and interpretation"

heavily assumed interpretation

You are not worth the trouble with your stonewalling. We are scaling Nami's durability to the Mortar.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Question: Will we have separate profiles or just new keys?

I'm gonna guess new keys, based on the sandbox

 

[GodlyCharmander]

@KingTempest Please ignore Magmag, this is very blatant "stonewalling" behavior. (in quotes as they hold no actual power here). The evidence we've provided is sufficient.

 

[KingTempest]

I tentatively agree to scaling Usopp and Nami to the mortar, albeit I think downscaling would be best.

If Usopp needed 2 mortars to crack his skull and nose, there'd be no reason for downscaling

And the only reason why they scale to the base attacks is because they took the zoan ones, which would make them at least relative to their bases

they can but you have to see it to believe it as some people say...

we aren't "some people".

we've never took "it needs to be seen to be a specific move".

well u just answered it urself, "no more headbutts" therefore ulti simply headbutted nami.

just a headbutt since nami doesn't specify and ur making an assumption.

Ok.
So please list what makes a mortar different from a regular headbutt.

Question: Will we have separate profiles or just new keys?

Luffy's getting a new profile

@KingTempest Please ignore Magmag, this is very blatant "stonewalling" behavior. (in quotes as they hold no actual power here). The evidence we've provided is sufficient.

aight

 

[Eseseso]

It makes three of every version of his swords but Enma in general isn't any stronger on its own. It's ability to draw out Zoro's haki wouldn't be replicated and prior to the attack it still showed to only imbue it's aura on the one sword.

Excellent point, but since Regular Zoro with Buso but WITHOUT unleashing Enma is still 760 teratons, wouldn't Asura be 3x the 760 teraton value?

Or would it be Enma Zoro's 1-petaton value plus the power of 2 Buso Zoros (or 2 times 760 teratons, or 1520 teratons)?

 

[Tetsucabrah]

Drake scales to Blue scarf.
When we see the aftermath of their fight he’s all beaten up and admits Drake was tougher than expected.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

I'm gonna guess new keys, based on the sandbox

So there will be 5 keys for Luffy? Damn

 

[KingTempest]

Drake scales to Blue scarf.
When we see the aftermath of their fight he’s all beaten up and admits Drake was tougher than expected.

Scaling these guys to Apoo (or scaling Apoo to Zoro, or scaling Zoro to the Kaifu) is risky since it brings up the issue of the tobiroppo being inferior to the scabbards, which is broken if these dudes scale to this value

We can just say Apoo's too injured for these guys to have solid scaling

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Luffy's getting a new profile

Oh, right. Nice

 

[KingTempest]

Oh, right. Nice

mainly so people don't see the "Gear 5th Zoan DF Yonko beat Kaidou what's Haoshoku Haki" spoilers, but also because the last CRT cluttered the absolute mess out of his profile

 

[Tetsucabrah]

I mean I think Drake is just the strongest Tobi Roppo by a longshot so I personally don’t see the problem there

 

[KingTempest]

I mean I think Drake is just the strongest Tobi Roppo by a longshot so I personally don’t see the problem there

the fact that drake is a tobiroppo at all is an issue.

also, from what we know, he got hurt by Who's Who. So "strongest tobiroppo" isn't super supported from what I see

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Yes he did. Also it was implied that King couldn’t remain on the defensive because with Coating Zoro can cut him (well he can also cut fire but aside from that)

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[Magmag]

we aren't "some people".

we've never took "it needs to be seen to be a specific move".

gonna ignore that cuz u misinterpreted

So please list what makes a mortar different from a regular headbutt.

well considering its covered in haki in every circumstance shown.

 

[Tetsucabrah]

He was ganged up on by Queen, WW, and Hawkins and was shot in the back.
Jinbe was shot in the back by one of Who’s Who’s minions, does unnamed fodder scale to Jinbe now?

 

[Eseseso]

Scaling these guys to Apoo (or scaling Apoo to Zoro, or scaling Zoro to the Kaifu) is risky since it brings up the issue of the tobiroppo being inferior to the scabbards, which is broken if these dudes scale to this value

We can just say Apoo's too injured for these guys to have solid scaling

That's... actually a really good point, King. Especially since Zoro had just gone to town on Apoo.

Not to mention it'd put Queen above what he should be since he beat Drake.

Speaking of Apoo, shouldn't he scale with his DF to 1-petaton due to damaging base Luffy (who tanked attacks from Big Mom) and Zoro?

He also tanked a Punk Gibson from Eustass Kid, who is definitely 1 petaton.

Although we could also just say that Drake is unique from the other Tobiroppo since he could've be hiding his full power due to infiltrating.

 

[Damage3245]

the fact that drake is a tobiroppo at all is an issue.

also, from what we know, he got hurt by Who's Who. So "strongest tobiroppo" isn't super supported from what I see

I thought he was just harmed by Queen? We just see Queen with blood on his weapon and no sign that Who's-Who drew his weapon.

 

[Tetsucabrah]

Although we could also just say that Drake is unique from the other Tobiroppo since he could've be hiding his full power due to infiltrating.

I’m fine with this line of reasoning

 

[Eminiteable]

Excellent point, but since Regular Zoro with Buso but WITHOUT unleashing Enma is still 760 teratons, wouldn't Asura be 3x the 760 teraton value?

Or would it be Enma Zoro's 1-petaton value plus the power of 2 Buso Zoros (or 2 times 760 teratons, or 1520 teratons)?

Fine

 

[Therefir]

bajrang isn't 6-a no more

Not trying to derail, but it is.

One Piece: Gomu Gomu no Bajrang Gun

vsbattles.fandom.com

The changes proposed by the OP looks good.

 

[KingTempest]

gonna ignore that cuz u misinterpreted


well considering its covered in haki in every circumstance shown.

We have never seen it covered in Haki.
The only reason we know it's utilized haki once is because the vivre cards said so

He was ganged up on by Queen, WW, and Hawkins and was shot in the back.
Jinbe was shot in the back by one of Who’s Who’s minions, does unnamed fodder scale to Jinbe now?

Sanji got hurt by one of Black Maria's minions you never know atp

In all seriousness though, the difference is that these dudes are flat out in the same bracket as them.

If X Drake was stronger, he'd have Jack's position, which he doesn't.

I thought he was just harmed by Queen? We just see Queen with blood on his weapon and no sign that Who's-Who drew his weapon.

oof, forgot

Speaking of Apoo, shouldn't he scale with his DF to 1-petaton due to damaging base Luffy (who tanked attacks from Big Mom) and Zoro?

He also tanked a Punk Gibson from Eustass Kid, who is definitely 1 petaton.

Dude.
Read the Sandbox

Although we could also just say that Drake is unique from the other Tobiroppo since he could've be hiding his full power due to infiltrating.

I'm not comfortable with the assumption that people are holding back all because they're undercover

 

[KingTempest]

Not trying to derail, but it is.

One Piece: Gomu Gomu no Bajrang Gun

vsbattles.fandom.com

lower value than what they scale to regularly, but good support

The changes proposed by the OP looks good.

thank you

 

[Magmag]

We have never seen it covered in Haki.
The only reason we know it's utilized haki once is because the vivre cards said so

against usopp and luffy, the only notable times it was used...
yeah the vivre cards and actually looking at her use it.

 

[Tetsucabrah]

did Queen have blood on his weapon? I don’t remember that.