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One Piece God Tiers and Top Tiers Revision

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@KingTempest; So you're saying Whitebeard physically is equal to the 6-B power of his Devil Fruit?

His Devil Fruit makes him no stronger?

Or should we say that Akainu's durability is actually double the result of the Tsunami calc? Since he did after all survive Whitebeard physically hitting him as well as Whitebeard's quake.

EDIT: I'll focus on a different part that doesn't have to do with the Admirals. This line:

Shanks fought Kaido, he scales.
Click to expand...

We don't know that they fought. All we know is that Shanks stopped Kaido from interfering. That doesn't mean that Kaido scales to 6-B through Shanks.
 
Damage3245 said:
@KingTempest; So you're saying Whitebeard physically is equal to the 6-B power of his Devil Fruit?

His Devil Fruit makes him no stronger?

Or should we say that Akainu's durability is actually double the result of the Tsunami calc? Since he did after all survive Whitebeard physically hitting him as well as Whitebeard's quake.
Click to expand...
I doubt he's physically equal, he should be at least half as strong as it since he can fight those who scale to him with his pure strength.

Whitebeard slapped Blackbeard who took his Gura attacks.
Whitebeard swiped Akainu's Red Dog without using his devil fruit.
Whitebeard stabbed Aokiji where he needed to dodge to not get harmed.
Whitebeard matched Oden who cut Kaido.

Or actually, Roger, by this thread, scales to Whitebeard's Devil fruit. Roger has no other abilities shown, and Whitebeard clashed with the same Roger with pure Physical strength and Haki. Would that not cause relativity?
 
Damage3245 said:
We don't know that they fought. All we know is that Shanks stopped Kaido from interfering. That doesn't mean that Kaido scales to 6-B through Shanks.
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To be fair you started it by scaling Shanks that way for doing something. Not very reliable. Kaido should scale to the highest calc since he is the strongest in verse atm.
 
Dr.Fix said:
To be fair you started it by scaling Shanks that way for doing something. Not very reliable. Kaido should scale to the highest calc since he is the strongest in verse atm.
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I don't remember being the one who decided Shanks' rating. Maybe that was a mistake I did a long while ago.

As for Kaido, being strongest in the verse at the moment doesn't mean he's the strongest of all time.

Or actually, Roger, by this thread, scales to Whitebeard's Devil fruit. Roger has no other abilities shown, and Whitebeard clashed with the same Roger with pure Physical strength and Haki. Would that not cause relativity?
Click to expand...

Wouldn't it be the other way around? Wouldn't Roger get his scaling from clashing with Whitebeard, rather than Whitebeard scaling from clashing with Roger?
 
Dr.Fix said:
This is what I mean. No one mentioned comes before Kaito's time as World's strongest.
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Ah, I see what you mean. Well, scratch that bit. I shouldn't have listed it because it shouldn't count as any kind of proper powerscaling.
 
KingTempest said:
Whitebeard clashed with Oden. He scales.

Angered Whitebeard hurt Akainu who can fight Aokiji and they both can bruise each other, they scale.

Shanks blocked an angry Akainu punch, he scales.

Shanks fought Kaido, he scales.

Kaido clashed with Big Mom, she scales.

Garp and Roger fought Primebeard with the other Yonko and Rocks, those 2 scale.

Sengoku's current profile reasoning, he scales

Literally everyone of them scale.
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I think that this seems to make sense, and Mihawk is a sparring partner to Shanks.
 
UchihaSlayer96 said:
If I may add another point, I think the Admirals being incomparable to the Yonko in terms of strength also makes no sense narratively.
By necessity, they must be at least close to the Yonko in terms of strength because they are the World Government's "official" last line of defense against the Yonko and their crews. If they were so much weaker than even a single Yonko individually, then literally any Yonko crew could've just stormed Marineford and defeated the Marines LONG ago. And let's be honest, the 100k or so fodder marines won't make a difference at all.
It just makes no sense at all imo.
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There's this as well. Good point.
 
If we're just going by "character X fought character Y", then a few dozen more characters would end up scaling to 6-B too.

Sanji clashed with Big Mom too, should we scale him to Big Mom and make him 6-B?
 
Damage3245 said:
Wouldn't it be the other way around? Wouldn't Roger get his scaling from clashing with Whitebeard, rather than Whitebeard scaling from clashing with Roger?
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Roger has a bunch of statements of being comparable to Whitebeard.
Fought him to a standstill by someone who travelled around with Roger and knows his full power.
Roger and Garp fought Whitebeard, Rocks (his captain), Big Mom, Kaido, Shiki, and more with only the two of them.
Roger defeated Shiki who fought Garp.

I doubt Roger's physical wouldn't scale to the full power of Whitebeard, which means Whitebeard's physical should be similar in potency to his fruit
 
Okay. My apologies. I will shut up then.
 
Damage3245 said:
If we're just going by "character X fought character Y", then a few dozen more characters would end up scaling to 6-B too.

Sanji clashed with Big Mom too, should we scale him to Big Mom and make him 6-B?
Click to expand...
The clashed was hit with Luffy at his side, if I'm not mistaken
 
Damage3245 said:
If we're just going by "character X fought character Y", then a few dozen more characters would end up scaling to 6-B too.

Sanji clashed with Big Mom too, should we scale him to Big Mom and make him 6-B?
Click to expand...
These are the God tiers of the verse. Every time it's stated that they fight, literally the entire world goes on hold.

Sanji didn't even clash with her, he just kicked her and ran away. There's like 4 scaling chains I can think of off the top of my head that could prove that Big Mom slaps.
 
It's just my biggest issue with this is that this calc, which is by far the strongest attack from the strongest character in the verse at the time, isn't being treated like it is the pinnacle of the verse. Rather, it is the minimum standard that every character remotely comparable to Whitebeard is being scaled to.

It being multiple tiers above everything else in the verse, including being multiple tiers above every other feat from these other God Tiers only exacerbates the issue. Anyone see where I'm coming from with this?
 
If there are a lot of characters that are presented in confrontation with character X and these characters are immeasurably stronger than the rest of the characters the verse, but, still below character X, I believe a "Likely 6-B" would be good.
 
The same thing happens with Kizaru and speed stats, no? Anyway, i am in the side which agrees with removing 6B from everyone.
 
Damage3245 said:
It being multiple tiers above everything else in the verse, including being multiple tiers above every other feat from these other God Tiers only exacerbates the issue. Anyone see where I'm coming from with this?
Click to expand...
We all understand where you're coming from, but it comes with the flaws of scaling One Piece.

Fujitora is a High-Tier who casually does 6-C meteors (even though it doesn't scale to his regular AP, but it's fine).
Kaido just pulled off a casual 6-C feat while heavily injured (I know the calc has some ehhs, but my point makes sense).
Doflamingo is a Mid-High tier who's Birdcage chopped up 6-C meteors.

Every other feat we see that's calcable is a casual feat that's strictly meant for AP instead of DC. That's why some feats can be calced as 7-B when in all reality they're 6-C off of scaling.

The high tiers we see are Garp (who has yet to show a DC feat), Sengoku (same as Garp), Roger (same as before), and so on.

In the Words of Oda, he says he's a Paramecia that's as powerful as the Logia types.
As powerful means relativity, and the strongest Logias are the admirals.

I know we're not supposed to talk about the Admirals in this thread, but let's be honest. Even the creator of the manga says his fruit is on par with theirs, and the old OG admirals should be at least on par with them (since Garp was about to body Akainu).
The fandom says
D: Hello, Oda-sensei! I have a question. Is Whitebeard, Edward Newgate, a Logia or a Paramecia? I personally think he's Logia, since he took Aokiji's attack without turning to ice, but...? P.N. NY

O: I guess that's difficult. The answer is Paramecia. "Gura Gura no Mi" is said to be the most powerful of the many paramecia fruits. It's easy to think that he's an "Earthquake Human" and must be Logia, but if that was so, he'd have to become an earthquake himself. Whitebeard creates earthquakes, in other words he's a "Vibration Human". That means he's a Paramecia who isn't any weaker than the Logias.
Click to expand...
Both translations say "he", which means Whitebeard, not the fruit. So they're referring to the people, not the power. They're flat out confirming that they all scale.

I understand your viewpoint, but there's so much confirmation that others should scale that it's unwise to say otherwise.
 
This might be me thinking the wrong way about this, but the wording of Oda's SBS statement there is interesting.

"In other words he can cause tremors or shaking that start these earthquakes."

What if the reason why the tsunami-causing earthquaking is so powerful compared to Whitebeard's other feats (aside from AOE argument), is that because his usual feats are done through the tremors he himself creates and nothing more, whereas the tsunami was caused by an earthquake that Whitebeard only helped start in the seafloor?

In other words Whitebeard was the catalyst for the tsunami-causing earthquake, but his usual AP is not equal to that entire earthquake. Which is why most of the other times when he uses his Devil Fruit during the war, there isn't a massive new tsunami created each time?
 
I doubt it.
Whitebeard's attacks have been shown to travel in the direction that Whitebeard attacks.
For him to hit sideways to cause a vibration downwards, it wouldn't make sense.

The wave is shown to be formed in the direction of the technique. Plus, it happened almost instantly.

Not including the fact that Doflamingo refers to it as his power. So regardless, it would work for him.

Also, Mihawk saw two things, the Tsunamis and his quake to Aokiji. The latter really isn't impressive at all, as literally almost every high tier did something to Aokiji. Mihawk sees a huge ass Tsunami and says that Whitebeard doesn't seem that much stronger than him.
This is merely conjecture... but the true distance between us and that man... seems rather small...
Click to expand...
Another translation says
I"m just going to measure... so I can see it with my own eyes the difference in actual strength between that man and I.
Click to expand...
Yeah nah, they scale.
 
Whitebeard's attacks have been shown to travel in the direction that Whitebeard attacks.
For him to hit sideways to cause a vibration downwards, it wouldn't make sense.
Click to expand...

But isn't the basis for the calc in the first place? That he caused an earthquake in the seafloor which is how a tsunami was formed?

Elsewise how would a quake that happens at the top of sea-level cause all of that water to rise up into the air?

Mihawk sees a huge ass Tsunami and says that Whitebeard doesn't seem that much stronger than him.
Click to expand...

That's not what the official translation says.
 
Damage3245 said:
But isn't the basis for the calc in the first place? That he caused an earthquake in the seafloor which is how a tsunami was formed?

Elsewise how would a quake that happens at the top of sea-level cause all of that water to rise up into the air?
Click to expand...
That's a good point.
Just checked that Sengoku talked about a seaquake, so it's valid.
I'm not an expert on the science behind earthquakes, but don't you need a similar force to cause an earthquake? You can't just throw any vibration downwards to cause an earthquake, or else anybody who plays music and aims a speaker downwards could just cause a magnitude 2 earthquake.
Damage3245 said:
That's not what the official translation says.
Click to expand...
I'm not gonna pull the "Viz is weird" card since that's what everybody uses, but I used the other translations to show that strength was a factor in the statement.
 
Damage3245 said:
It's just my biggest issue with this is that this calc, which is by far the strongest attack from the strongest character in the verse at the time, isn't being treated like it is the pinnacle of the verse. Rather, it is the minimum standard that every character remotely comparable to Whitebeard is being scaled to.
Click to expand...
I already said as much yesterday and many times in the past. The only ones who scale are the Great Pirates and Prime Garp. It is only the denial of Whiteboard's weakening that keeps coming up and exaggerating the issue. So for the upteenth time and as @The_Calaca has said before me, we need a discussion rule.
 
I also do kinda agree with Gin, but I forget the justification behind the 1/3, wasn't the idea that it took the 3 Admirals to stop Whitebeard's Quake, but there where issues, like we didn't count it since it was a Haki Barrier or something?
 
Yes, they stopped Whitebeard's quake by collaborating, and Akainu also briefly stood up to him.
 
Bit late, and in not sure exactly what was going on before but Whirebeard was also called the "strongest pirate" similar to how Kaido is now, don't know if that's relevant but I believe it was being mentioned.

Regarding Mihawk and what he says about the tsunami, the official English translation somewhere prior to punk hazzard although official is poorly translated which is why the change in translators was made. What Mihawk says in that scene I believe the translation KingTempest provided was accurate.

But regarding him referring too the actual Tsunami feat may be incorrect sinve according to his Vivre Card he's able to tell how strong a person is just from looking at them.
 
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Dr.Fix said:
@CinCameron20 @The_Calaca have we not discussed Mihawk to death already and why he doesn't scale to Shanks yet?
Click to expand...
Mihawk has the issue of last dueling against Shanks LONG before the latter became a Yonko. People need to get it through their heads the following points: a) Mihawk implies he stopped fighting Shanks after the latter lost his arm, b) Shanks lost his arm over half a decade before becoming a Yonko, and c) We have 0 information on Mihawk's background and why he is regarded as the WSS in the first place.

Not to mention Oden shouldn't scale to WB or Roger when he "clashed" with an even younger Whitebeard than what clashed with Roger, and Roger slapped him aside quite casually. Oden even mentions how WB's power (after joining his crew) is beyond anything he had ever expected of the world before.

@UchihaSlayer96 - I hate to say it, but just like how WB survived against Dura-negating attacks, Akainu's endurance can be thanked for that since the 1st took him from 100% to being a bloody mess, and the 2nd dropped him temporarily.

Also, I'm not particularly interested in this scaling argument until the whole Doflamingo->Meteorite discussion comes to light since, you know, Doflamingo's literally the pillar for all high/top tier scaling. I fail to see how @Damage3245 regards this as an unrelated topic despite the topic of this thread literally being "God and Top tiers revision" and there's a feat right there that would put Doflamingo, and literally everyone who scales comparable/above him at 6-C or 6-C+.

But to put it simply, since the threads of the cage are NOT isolated (Due to all of them meeting at one point), they are all taking the reverberations of the meteorite's impact directly, and this means each thread (at least directly hit by the meteorite), is absorbing a tremendous amount of the energy--especially since the meteorite stopped, slid through (via being cut), and didn't have a massive impact with the ground. All of the energy was expended through the cage, which took 0 damage.
 
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Between kaido's 6-C+, his and Linlin's High 6-C, and Maybe Doflamingo's 6-C, It seems we should probably set aside the God Tiers (Whitebeard, Shanks, Big Mom, Kaito, Prime Garp, Roger, Shiki) until at least the top tiers are upgraded.

At which point we should have have a more accurate reading than just somewhere between 4.3 gigaton and 9 Teratons.
 
That's a good idea.

Edit: I say we should scale the High/Top tiers before we can finish this
 
Threads have no limit now iirc, is there any reason to not discuss everything from high to god tiers here?
 
Touché, but i don't think it will have less than 5 pages after combining this one and a second thread for the high tiers. Whatever we do, i am with Tempest, we should scale the high/top tiers first.
 
Wait for the OP, I doubt Damage would appreciate his thread getting flipped around to a topic we were trying to avoid while he's not here
 
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