First link's first image litterally says the Oni will destroy the entire Realm if his dad doesn't help him stop them. The second scan implies that Garmadon was talking about the entire Realm getting destroyed, since he states he doesn't want be destroyed along with the Ninjas, which he wouldn't be worrying about if only the lands were destroyed, especially taking in account WoG tells his vaporizing a Realm --> bye bye all inhabitant
Realms were proved to be separate universes long time ago. Onis beings able to destroy them is already 2-C. Stop being ifnorant.
I explained why their cases are similar. His justifications are ALL statements meanwhile he himself did not even show much of a destruction.
For her it is a massive outlier with the fact that nothing in the show or other sources support this. With Onis, we’ve got outside sources, the show implications, etc. False equivalence.
Her one seems valid.
True, destruction of several universes should be 11-C!!!
Yes, just like Bill wasn’t actually destroying anything, and was only going to do so after uncertain amount of time via statements. Your logic is simply stupid: character didn’t have time to achieve his goals because he was defeated by main heroes, so let’s ignore the statements!!
Them being seperate universes has nothing to do with anything. For the oni to be 2-C, theyd have to
They arent similar, its called CONTEXT. Theyre different for that simple reason, bill's feats have context behind them, the oni do not. Wu saying they're covering the lands in darkness debunk literally anything related to tier 2
So the oni destroying creation based off of outside statements is fine, but the great devourer using the exact same statement is an outlier?
Stated above. Has to be all at once, you arent gonna get 2-C from going to universes one by one and destroying them
See above. its called CONTEXT. This is a childrens lego show, it isnt that hard to put into context what they mean by destroy the realms, especially when we are GIVEN the context by Wu.
There's no point now that FSM got recently confirmed to be Tier 2 by Doc
If they can destroy Realms which ARE universes, how are your points even relevant? And universe definition is “The Universe is all of space and time and their contents, including planets, stars, galaxies, all forms of matter and energy!
Excuse me? Onis do have context. They invaded the Realms and, if not stopped by Ninjas, would ultimately destroy all of them.
It can be interpreted in two ways:
Onis are CONSISTENT in such statements with no logical contradictions and them being in the top of the verse.
Show me where is it stated that it is going to be one by one. It’s literally your burden of proof. Also it’s funny how it went from “outlier” to “we don’t know how they did it” to “not one by one”, and literally every single one of them can be refuted in a single sentence.
The context is literally on our side, not yours. Their destruction is supposed to oppose Dragons Creation, they are consistently stated to destroy all of the Realms and similar to that, and you just strawman the hell out of Wu statement.
These are also blatant statements they arent destroying entire universes, but rather covering the land of them in darkness, even more so by these statements
With this, Its as simple as putting it into the lore of the series. What did the FSM create? The Ninjago land. This too makes sense as the only thing that stopped the oni was the Golden Power.
Yes, simple invasion in the show, you are correct. But given the statements what they were GOING to do, they would have destroyed all the Realm later. You simply can’t deny that.
Wait, just land? Really, just land?? Damn, I didn’t know. I guess both the show and current head of the verse are incorrect, because we have Minaaaa herself saying that it was just land. Sad times.
FSM created other Realms as well, with Doc saying he didn't only create Islands, but ENTIRE REALMS and that how Ninjago was made doesn't have to be a pattern for the other Realms, meaning his power being present elsewhere as well. This alone contradicts your entire argument
Or they arent destroying them at all, just invading them. The show, episode descriptions, guides, and lego channel all say they arent actually physically destroying anything, just a simple invasion. Youre grasping at straws
Dude, they are clearly referring to ninjago in march of the oni.
You do know they can just... kill garmadon right? especially since he was in a weakened state.
Literally, why would they do this? and you need evidence of this
Again, tier 2 is for a different thread and this doesnt contradict anything.
That’s the truth, they are invading the Realms in the show, you got it correct. Now do a simple 2+2 and guess what will happen after that. Please with no bias.
Nothing ever says “Onis do not physically destroy anything”, they just say that they are invading the Realms and that contradicts none of our arguments. We completely agree with the fact that they were invading the Realms and covering it in the Cloud of Destruction. 100%. But what will happen after that is the destruction of all those Realms.
This sentence has so much irony behind it.
“Dude”, they were going to destroy FSM’s power (and all Realms as stated in other sources) and leave nothing behind. Do a simple 2+2, once again.
His fear was about leaving nothing behind and the fact that the Realm of his father will not survive. He cared about the Realm and himself, not the others.
That’s THEIR THING? BEING OPPOSITE OF THE DRAGONS’ CREATION????
Did… did you… did you literally… you know what, at this point I won’t even care, you just want us to show all of the scans over again while we did that multiple times already.
That’s just half of the reason why we brought this up, the other half is what I mentioned above.
Omega had no intention of killing him at first lol, that's why he asked him why he was allaying himself with the Ninjas
This is what the scans imply, here we have Omega saying he would egulf everything in darkness AND wipe out Creation
This directly concerns and contradict ur current argument
Nothing will happen simple. is it so hard to believe that literally nothing will happen? Do you have to try and stretch every statement to the highest possible outcome?
Again, you need to evidence that theyre going to destroy it after they take over. Theres literally nothing to support that they will do this or even want to do this. It literally makes zero sense for the oni to fully destroy an entire realm after theyve already took over as they have literally no reason to. Also, with this scan posted earlier, it makes even less sense, why would they take over the realms, just to destroy them and die with it? Bill's case is literally different, please stop using example from verses you dont know with profiles you dont read.
Dude, theyre talking about the FSM's power in ninjago. the omega literally says So this is the realm of the First Spinjitzu Master. Soon the power will be gone forever.
Garmadon's entire goal was to rule over ninjago. He cant do that if the oni are there since theyre vastly more powerful than him, he literally says this
See first point
Ignoring all of our arguments is not gonna help
The Onis goal is to destroy everything, the scan doesn't mean anything to the Onis, but to Garmadon, it does. That's not really relevant to their AP tiering
All of the official statements provided do not matter, because Minaaaa herself said nothing will happen, as always.
Are you trying to appeal to emotion?
Highest possible outcome? Straight up “they will destroy all Realms”, “nothing will be left behind” are as straight up as possible. Is assuming that a guy has 4 arms because he is supposed to and stated considered taking the highest possible outcome?
Was earlier in the thread which you ignored under “bUt hOw wiLl thEy dO iT?”
“No reason to”, “zero sense” remind me the name of their power? Remind me what does it oppose to??
You know that there are places beyond the Realms?
DON’T KNOW? DON’T KNOW??? I have rewatched the series and reread all its books multiple times, reread AmA countless times. Literally look at my pfp. Accusing me of not knowing Bill and Gravity Falls is your worst take ever, even surpassing “everybody should be continent level” one.
Headcanon.
Where does it say “power in Ninjago”?
He fears them from leaving nothing and Realm’s survival. He literally even says “If anybody will destroy Ninjago, it will be me, not some Oni with a walking stick”.
Same
The only time it is not true only where it says “one by one” because those statements imply that they do it at the time of the show, meanwhile we clearly see in the show that they are only invading.
Yes, at the time of the series they wouldn’t physically destroy anything. However feats that suggest that they were going to destroy everything cannot be disregarded due to that as nothing contradicts “invade -> destroy” for Onis.
All of the consistent statements and implications are now literal wank. Next time what would you say? That Kai controlling fire is a wank too?
Can I just put here “
” and pretend you never wrote this part?This is again completely ignoring our words. Yes, it is true that there are multiple statements of them invading the Realms, filling it up with the Cloud of Destruction, and yes they were doing it during the show until they were stopped by Ninjas. Does this mean we should disregard statements that suggest literal destruction of all of the Realms? Of course no. All of your evidence only tells us what they are doing in the show, it never refutes the possibility of Onis destroying everything after the invasion.
3-A explosions would leave time behind them. The context is, once again, on our side. All of your evidence refutes none of the implications that suggest Onis being capable of literally destroying all of the Realms.
We are going in circles only due to you being ignorant. If you actually read what we said, we would be done on the very first page of your first 11-pages CRT.
Because there's no reason for them to do that? They already accomplished their goal of filling the realms with darkness.
If theres no evidence of them destroying the realms after, then theres no reason to accept it. and no "destroy the realms" is not evidence
You do know that you'd have to affect space-time to be tier 2 right? Thats kind of why theres a distinction between that and tier 3. if you arent doing that, you arent tier 2. Destroying the universe is not evidence of destroying space time as i pointed out. You can do A without affecting B
See above
The Realms are not 3D, therefore this is unapplicable
They didn't achieved it yet bc the Ninjas stopped them + that wasn't their only goal
Yes, "Nothing will be left" and "Lloyd even acknowledges how father is important to this realm's creation and without him, the Oni will destroy all" most defenetly doesn't refer to the whole Realms
Because they are talking about the destruction of a 4D structure, that invalidates a 3-A rating. And on top of that, the affected area comprise a space-time as well as encompassing a 4D space.
Ye, the whole structure = 4D = Space-Time continuum = A Realm
Re-read both definitions:
Higher Dimensions aren't relevant for this verse, because the Realms are 4D for a different reasons
No, their whole thing is opposing Dragons. Even Mistake says that while Dragons create, Onis destroy and an allegory is like creating a tree and destroying it.
There is tons of evidence.
It is, you are just denying the statements at this point.
Realms are space-continuums. Destroying them is the same as destroying the space-times, unless the context suggests otherwise.
Same
Are you saying right now that eating 2+2 apples is not the same as eating 6-2 apples and it is not the same as eating 4 apples? It’s quite literally what you are doing at this point.
Prove where does it say space only was affected.
No statements that only the spaces were affected, therefore its referring to the whole thing and stays at tier 2
In case you still don’t understand:
Your burden to prove only the space will be affected, especially with the Space-Time, not the Universe, being affected
That's so untrue. Destroying a Space-Time is auto Tier 2
Ninjago and the ED's space-times were affected, this is not 2-C range
Doc confirms that the Merge synched all the Realm's times up with each other, so I'd say time was affected by the Merge as well. I still agree with all the downgrades, but space-time was def affected.
Visuals shows otherwise, read the argument
You cannot, the term “universe” includes both time and space by default on this wiki. I even created Q&A on this.
I can’t know something that isn’t true.
Again, universe is by default a space-time. You overthink everything.
