When they merged after the Merge, they did not share the same space, which is why they did not destroy each other. However, since they are very close now, they sometimes try to share the same space (which will eventually lead to the end of the world), which is the reason why Mergequake occurs. If you close the Mergequake, you simply stop Realms from merging each other.
Nothing implies it is a chain reaction. Also aftershock is an aftereffect of a distressing or traumatic event
Also keep in mind that mergequakes are aftershocks of an ORIGINAL Merge, which is stated by Lloyd. It is very similar to real earthquakes: aftershock in earthquake’s case is a smaller earthquake following the main shock of a large earthquake.
Chain reaction to what?
Idk why this is still a debate, Qawsef, Meudeus and Finepoint approved Tier 2, I think we should simply close that thread again
This is fundamentally incoherent, so I'm going to doubt that the series actually said that until I see evidence of it.
Yeah, it happens afterwards. So they were already merged. So it's not an entire merge of two entire timelines being undone, it's relatively minor spatial anomalies, that would not reach tier 2.
To destroy the timeline.
I disagree, and they haven't acknowledged my arguments. Perhaps they'll read it and come along to my side, or provide better evidence.
it seems you don't understand what Lloyd says. He says they are aftershocks of ORIGINAL Merge, which affected 17 Realms. It is the same as earthquakes work
Are you trying to say that 17 timelines merged into one, and now two timelines that weren't part of that 17 are risking being merged into one?
1) 17 Realms merged in a way that they crashed into each other;
1) 17 Realms merged in a way that they crashed into each other;
2) if left unchecked, Mergequakes destroy the world;
3) they are still merging, merging = significantly affecting, hence preventing them from doing so is significantly affecting too;
4) 5 mods agreed on Tier 2
The Realms aren't sharing the same space after the Merge. After the Merge, they simply expanded the Realm of Ninjago. They were just brought closer to each other. But then the Realms try to occupy a same space, which is what they call "Mergequake".
Yes
Indeed. So you agree or you're neutral then
?
Alright
Heavily disagree with almost all of this.
Star Level Feat - Star Creation
This is based off of one Ninjago creator twitter statement that has been contradicted in the primary canon of the show. I'm tired of going through this with people around the place lol. The person who made that statement has also said this:
First off: The weapons never made a star. In Season 3: Rebooted, they explicitly landed on the comet Delta V. Quotes from the show:
There is never mention of a star in the show. Not one. You may point to the light in the sky after the Golden Weapons were shot into space, but we have no confirmation that it comes from a star. The Golden Weapons together can create blasts of energy and send beams of light into the sky (Battle Between Brothers mini-movie), so that could be what it happening here. Or it was retconned by Season 3, which is the more likely option. Regardless, the only statement regarding the creation of a star comes from one Twitter statement that the creator explicitly says in other tweets isn't canon. This should be disregarded.
Furthermore, it can't scale to anyone. The image above shows that the weapons that 'supposedly' created a star was made of both the Golden Weapons and the Mega Weapon (which is a combination of the Golden Weapons), it's essentially two sets of Golden Weapons. It shouldn't scale to anyone, regardless of if Lloyd has the powers of the Golden Weapons (which i'll get to in a minute). I've seen the response here being that the creator only said the Mega Weapon did it, which is contradicted by all the above images. Garmadon explicitly says the GW and the MW collided and were shot into space. Disregard this point on all accounts, it's wrong. You are picking and choosing tweets from Tommy to support your arguments while ignoring everything else he has said.
Scaling the Ninja to this through Lloyd is weird. Zane touching them explicitly dies and can not hold their power. In Crystalized, the Dragon Form Ninja explicitly say that they do not stand a chance against the Overlord's forces without the Golden Weapons. I won't disagree with scaling Lloyd to it, but he's explicitly been called more powerful than all original 4 Ninja combined in Season 5 and even in the twitter statements have been called '20% stronger'.
Sensei Wu
Simply put, this point is wrong. In the Virtues of Spinjitzu short 'Courage' (), we see the Ninja attack dragons Wu created in his illusion, and they sail through without touching them. They clearly aren't physically there in the sense that Wu created an entire dragon, why would he do this with a star in the sky? They also are not pocket dimensions, they are illusions. This is obvious.
'But they can affect objects physically'
Can either be explained as part of the illusion. Wu clearly didn't create an entire dragon and would have no reason to do so with a star. This is a baffling point.
MergeQuakes
First off, your point about MergeQuakes resulting in destroying the universe is all off. If you watch the season, it's very clearly demonstrated that, left unchecked, the MergeQuakes would increase in frequency until they reach a tipping point and would then destroy the Merged Realms. One MergeQuake doesn't do this. This is explicit in Dragons Rising.
Also, yes, MergeQuakes are a result of Realms trying to share the same area and are cracks in reality, but that does not mean literal two universes are colliding, considering the Ninja can't actually stop the MergeQuakes on their own, and can only prevent it with their powers, it shouldn't scale, and also, I think it should just be hax instead of scaling to attack potency. They aren't preventing the destruction of two Realms by shutting down an individual MergeQuake, that's never stated.
The Merge is a mystical thing that caused Realms to crash together. Regular citizens and children survived the Merge of all 17 Realms. The Merge wasn't an explosion or anything. A MergeQuake storm could destroy the Merged Realms by making them more unstable, but that's just it. A regular Merge doesn't scale to any AP or Durability, so why would an aftershock of it? It's a weird, shaky thing to scale to. I'm admittedly not sure what hax this would fall under, but it feels strange and baffling to scale it to AP when it's clearly something else and something mystical. Regular MergeQuakes aren't destroying two universes, it's as simple as that.
Merged Nya
I'm just- so confused by this point.
This is the evidence provided by a sea Merge Nya being 42x as strong as Wojira. Now, disregarding the fact that all he said was a number, and the replier had to ask clarification, Tommy says this to every power-level related question, here are a few examples:
It's disingenous and wrong to guage Wojira or Nya's scaling or power level from Tommy's reply. It's clearly not meant to be taken seriously.
Doesn't deny anything
The GWs clearly made the Star and it was clearly shown in the show (it litteraly shines at the end of the episode). Bro really watched the show with a blindfold
It's astounding how you can't read your own scans. Let's read them again, shall we? "MergeQuakes are like aftershocks...places where the realms are unstable, trying to share the same area. Like cracks in reality."
I'll reply later, but first: the GWs destroyed the MW, which made a star and later on fell in the comet, so it doesn't contradict this being a Star level feat, and that scan from Tommy u sent supports the argument.I've addressed this. You clearly have not read my post thoroughly. Maybe it was supposed to have created a star in Season 2, I don't know the production of the episode. But the fact of the matter is that when Season 3 was made, it was retconned into the GWs landing on the comet. That is a retcon that is incredibly plot relevant (the golden armour returns in Season 10). The retcon is much more important than the star creation, happens afterwards, and is shown in show more. It takes higher priority than a single tweet and a retconned dot in the sky. Sorry if you don't like it. But this is true.
Again, already addressed. Destruction was retconned in Season 3. If you need any more proof of the matter, here's a lego.com description of the Mega Weapon: 'Extremely powerful force for creation made by Lord Garmadon using all four Golden Weapons of Spinjitzu. Garmadon journeyed to the Golden Peaks, the birthplace of the Four Golden Weapons, in order to forge the Mega Weapon. He used it to recreate Destiny’s Bounty as the pirate ship Black Bounty and bring Captain Soto and its crew back to life. He also used it to create evil duplicates of the ninja and to revive the prehistoric Grundle. In his most ambitious effort, Garmadon used the Mega Weapon to send himself back in time so he could stop the ninja team from forming. The ninja of the past sent the Mega Weapon hurtling into space using the power of the Four Golden Weapons.
This, alongside Garmadon's statement, clearly paints the picture that even if the Mega Weapon was supposed to be destroyed in S2's production, they went back on it in Season 3 and made it so instead of being destroyed, the Mega Weapon merged with the Golden Weapons and were shot into deep space. In terms of all the time paradoxes, look, even the creator admits to there being not a lot of logic in that episode.
Regardless, what happened is clear. MW and GWs collided, and were shot into deep space. Even lego themselves acknowledged this in 2016.
Well, like, if you read it again? 'He used it to help form the continents that exist on Ninjago today'
The scythe didn't create continents out of its own power. The FSM used all of them to create Ninjago. Ignoring there isn't a northern and southern frozen part of the Ninjago map in show, aside from a single glacier somewhere, the scan obviously implies the FSM used all of them to create Ninjago. The weapons are consistently portrayed as being way more than the sum of their parts, considering you can hold three just fine, but you die when you hold four. If they were each, say, as quarter as strong as the GWs together, as you seem to imply, then why would this be the case?
The Overlord only needed Golden Power to create a body for himself, not the mech, plus they are wearing armour that protects them from Golden Power in that scene. Regardless, he held a part made from the GW and MW, so it's fair enough to disregard anyway, that's my bad.
I'm not, but keep telling yourself that. A regular MergeQuake is a rift in reality when two Realms try to share the same area. That's it. They increase in intensity and frequency if left unchecked because of the instability of the Merged Realms, which would lead to a MergeQuake Storm that would destroy the Merged Realms. This is what I said before.
It's astounding how you can't read your own scans. Let's read them again, shall we? "MergeQuakes are like aftershocks...places where the realms are unstable, trying to share the same area. Like cracks in reality."
Now, again. There is nothing that says literally two universes are colliding in a MergeQuake. Hell, like I said, the original Merge was a mystical event that magically merged them all together. The Realms never physically crashed together, despite what flowery language the Spirit of the Temple may have you believe. It's not a durability feat to survive the Merge because it wasn't physical, not an explosion or a physical collision or anything like that. It's just that, a crack in reality as its warped to merge Realms. That's what it is. A MergeQuake is an aftershock of an event that wasn't physical and didn't physically have any Realms collide to merge. It's the same case here, considering MergeQuakes are literally aftershocks of the Merge. I don't know how I can make this any plainer.
He's keeping the world from destroying itself by shutting down the MergeQuakes that are happening, to prevent them from being unchecked. Lloyd has no idea about the MergeQuake tipping point until Zane tells him about it. He only knows that MergeQuakes are cracks in reality and closes them up, which, yes, would count as preventing the world from destroying itself. I've already addressed the first half of your quote with the whole Merge thing.
Good argument. Really, killer point. Anyway, Yes. The Ninja can stop a single MergeQuake with their powers. They cannot stop multiple, or use their own powers to prevent the MergeQuakes from reaching the tipping point, which is what I said in that first quote you didn't bother to actually rebut. I did watch the show, and I did read your post. The Merge is a mystical event, a worldwide hax that displaced everyone randomly, and magically fused the realms together. The MergeQuakes are an aftershock of this. It shouldn't scale to AP or Dura because the regular Merge didn't. It's a mystical event, not physical. I have made this clear. The only way to scale MergeQuakes to physicality is if you argue that regular children should be Low Multi because they survived the original Merge.
Yes. I'll ignore the first question since I never said that. I also never said the second. MergeQuakes threaten the Realms if left unchecked, but a single MergeQuake can easily be shut down. And yes, nobody has the power to stop the MergeQuakes. Lloyd needed the power of a Source Dragon to do this, as well as the three Dragon Cores. The Merge wasn't able to be prevented by anyone, and is irreversible. The Dragon Cores prevented the original Merge, artifacts by Source Dragons, who are well above anyone else in power.
Again, killer argument. Really, ripper of a closing statement. I'm defeated by your genius level comebacks. Clearly, I didn't, since there is no defence for the Nya/Wojira 42 thing, which is why you haven't tried. Clearly didn't fail there! Regardless, it's baffling to me how someone who is clearly a big fan of Ninjago fails to understand it. You are picking and choosing elements of your scenario that help you, rather than the whole picture, the Tommy Andreasen tweets paint this picture clearly. You are letting your own biases for the series get in the way of your VS debating. I love the series too, but all the evidence for this stuff is repeatedly contradicted or does not hold up under scrutiny.
Please, respond if you want. But take a moment to rewatch the show first, you might understand it more.
No idea what you mean by this but the Merge magically displaced people.
Firstly, if it landed onto comet, it doesn’t mean it didn’t create a Star. There is no contradiction. Additionally, they had a very huge amount of time between Season Two and Season Three, so that is not debunking anything. Also, Tommy’s tweet about star thing is posted in 2016, meanwhile Ninjago: Rebooted season was in 2014.I've addressed this. You clearly have not read my post thoroughly. Maybe it was supposed to have created a star in Season 2, I don't know the production of the episode. But the fact of the matter is that when Season 3 was made, it was retconned into the GWs landing on the comet. That is a retcon that is incredibly plot relevant (the golden armour returns in Season 10). The retcon is much more important than the star creation, happens afterwards, and is shown in show more. It takes higher priority than a single tweet and a retconned dot in the sky. Sorry if you don't like it. But this is true.
Again, already addressed. Destruction was retconned in Season 3. If you need any more proof of the matter, here's a lego.com description of the Mega Weapon: 'Extremely powerful force for creation made by Lord Garmadon using all four Golden Weapons of Spinjitzu. Garmadon journeyed to the Golden Peaks, the birthplace of the Four Golden Weapons, in order to forge the Mega Weapon. He used it to recreate Destiny’s Bounty as the pirate ship Black Bounty and bring Captain Soto and its crew back to life. He also used it to create evil duplicates of the ninja and to revive the prehistoric Grundle. In his most ambitious effort, Garmadon used the Mega Weapon to send himself back in time so he could stop the ninja team from forming. The ninja of the past sent the Mega Weapon hurtling into space using the power of the Four Golden Weapons.
This, alongside Garmadon's statement, clearly paints the picture that even if the Mega Weapon was supposed to be destroyed in S2's production, they went back on it in Season 3 and made it so instead of being destroyed, the Mega Weapon merged with the Golden Weapons and were shot into deep space. In terms of all the time paradoxes, look, even the creator admits to there being not a lot of logic in that episode.
Regardless, what happened is clear. MW and GWs collided, and were shot into deep space. Even lego themselves acknowledged this in 2016.
Well, like, if you read it again? 'He used it to help form the continents that exist on Ninjago today'
The scythe didn't create continents out of its own power. The FSM used all of them to create Ninjago. Ignoring there isn't a northern and southern frozen part of the Ninjago map in show, aside from a single glacier somewhere, the scan obviously implies the FSM used all of them to create Ninjago. The weapons are consistently portrayed as being way more than the sum of their parts, considering you can hold three just fine, but you die when you hold four. If they were each, say, as quarter as strong as the GWs together, as you seem to imply, then why would this be the case?
The Overlord only needed Golden Power to create a body for himself, not the mech, plus they are wearing armour that protects them from Golden Power in that scene. Regardless, he held a part made from the GW and MW, so it's fair enough to disregard anyway, that's my bad.
I'm not, but keep telling yourself that. A regular MergeQuake is a rift in reality when two Realms try to share the same area. That's it. They increase in intensity and frequency if left unchecked because of the instability of the Merged Realms, which would lead to a MergeQuake Storm that would destroy the Merged Realms. This is what I said before.
It's astounding how you can't read your own scans. Let's read them again, shall we? "MergeQuakes are like aftershocks...places where the realms are unstable, trying to share the same area. Like cracks in reality."
Now, again. There is nothing that says literally two universes are colliding in a MergeQuake. Hell, like I said, the original Merge was a mystical event that magically merged them all together. The Realms never physically crashed together, despite what flowery language the Spirit of the Temple may have you believe. It's not a durability feat to survive the Merge because it wasn't physical, not an explosion or a physical collision or anything like that. It's just that, a crack in reality as its warped to merge Realms. That's what it is. A MergeQuake is an aftershock of an event that wasn't physical and didn't physically have any Realms collide to merge. It's the same case here, considering MergeQuakes are literally aftershocks of the Merge. I don't know how I can make this any plainer.
He's keeping the world from destroying itself by shutting down the MergeQuakes that are happening, to prevent them from being unchecked. Lloyd has no idea about the MergeQuake tipping point until Zane tells him about it. He only knows that MergeQuakes are cracks in reality and closes them up, which, yes, would count as preventing the world from destroying itself. I've already addressed the first half of your quote with the whole Merge thing.
Good argument. Really, killer point. Anyway, Yes. The Ninja can stop a single MergeQuake with their powers. They cannot stop multiple, or use their own powers to prevent the MergeQuakes from reaching the tipping point, which is what I said in that first quote you didn't bother to actually rebut. I did watch the show, and I did read your post. The Merge is a mystical event, a worldwide hax that displaced everyone randomly, and magically fused the realms together. The MergeQuakes are an aftershock of this. It shouldn't scale to AP or Dura because the regular Merge didn't. It's a mystical event, not physical. I have made this clear. The only way to scale MergeQuakes to physicality is if you argue that regular children should be Low Multi because they survived the original Merge.
Yes. I'll ignore the first question since I never said that. I also never said the second. MergeQuakes threaten the Realms if left unchecked, but a single MergeQuake can easily be shut down. And yes, nobody has the power to stop the MergeQuakes. Lloyd needed the power of a Source Dragon to do this, as well as the three Dragon Cores. The Merge wasn't able to be prevented by anyone, and is irreversible. The Dragon Cores prevented the original Merge, artifacts by Source Dragons, who are well above anyone else in power.
Again, killer argument. Really, ripper of a closing statement. I'm defeated by your genius level comebacks. Clearly, I didn't, since there is no defence for the Nya/Wojira 42 thing, which is why you haven't tried. Clearly didn't fail there! Regardless, it's baffling to me how someone who is clearly a big fan of Ninjago fails to understand it. You are picking and choosing elements of your scenario that help you, rather than the whole picture, the Tommy Andreasen tweets paint this picture clearly. You are letting your own biases for the series get in the way of your VS debating. I love the series too, but all the evidence for this stuff is repeatedly contradicted or does not hold up under scrutiny.
Please, respond if you want. But take a moment to rewatch the show first, you might understand it more.
Made up? We visually see the GWs form a star when blowing up the GWs in the sky and the episode zoom in the star it created at the end of the episode...
Check the statement from Garmadon. The statement that YOU are using to “debunk” the verse.
Notice the Star statement was made in 2016 (3 years after S2, 2 years after S3), so it doesn't recton anything
Again, Tommy’s post is literally in 2016, meanwhile Rebooted is in 2014; Garmadon’s statement does not contradict anything but even SUPPORTS our point. Landing on a comet ≠ didn’t create anything; these two actions are completely unrelated. That’s just like saying that if you run, you can’t sing. Two completely unrelated things. Garmadon’s statement says Golden Weapons destroy the Megaweapon. Star was show in Season 2, and was never contradicted (I already debunked your points twice). You also ignored the entire paragraph I wrote to you above. Sorry that the verse “you like” got upgraded. Really-really sorry about that. That should have been such a tragedy for someone who likes the series.
Kai mentionned that if they didn't stop them, they would eventually destroy the world, so he did known
Did you read it? The Mega Weapon was destroyed, by fusing with the Golden Weapons, being melted down, and shot into space. This can clearly be inferred. Garmadon says destroyed. But we're shown that it's not, an instead in a golden ball on a comet. I'd say melting a weapon down = destroying it.
The Merge was a magical event. Obviously the Realms were combined, but through magical means. What I mean by this is universes didn't literally slam into each other.
No. I agree it's not true. Your friend tried to question my argument of people being unable to stop the Merge.
And TV show implies nothing to contradict Tommy’s statement regarding to Star. It literally shines in the end of the episode, and it being “shot into space” changes nothing, it was even showed in the Season 2 episode. Also, even if at times that episode may appear illogical, its main significance was the fact that Garmadon no longer has the Megaweapon, and you need to take an account HOW and WHY. Zane states that in order to fix everything, they need to destroy the Megaweapon (aka make it powerless); Garmadon in Season 3 says the same. If Megaweapon did not lose its power, the timeline wouldn’t be fixed. Also we know that melting ≠ destruction, the true destruction of the Megaweapons is seen in the Crystallized, and it is not just “melting”. By that logic, Kai destroyed the Megaweapon and recreated it again? All of this was pointed out previously in the thread by the way, you genuinely just waste our time for the things that have already been discussed. Please bother to read the CRT.
Firstly, Zane’s feat is a large outlier and makes no sense, pretty much the whole Ninjago community agrees on this. Like, Zane who can’t even do Spinjitzu by himself with half of the heart defeated the literal embodiment of evil who had both 90%+ of Golden Power and the Darkness + Golden Armor. Sure. Also everyone else was already not immune to the Golden Power, because the time was over, which immediately debunks your point. Zane had half of the heart and couldn’t barely do Spinjitzu, of course he would die to the Golden Armor.
Uh, by virtue of the Golden Weapons landing on a comet, and there being no mention of a star? Kai states in the episode 'The Void' that Delta V is where the weapons landed.
It doesn't. The feat isn't a Tier 4 creation feat in my view and the new arguments only reinforces my view on that subject.
