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Ninjago Attack Potency update

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Minaaaa said:
Their original state was destroyed. They were just raw material at that point
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Raw Material that kept all of their power? By that logic, Kai in S10 destroyed the GWs instead of reforging the armor back to the 4 GWs ...

The majority is still favor of the Tier 4 feat, and ur arguments wouldn't even be consistant with what was shown in S10 and later seasons too. Changing shape doesn't mean destroyed.
the full destruction is seen in Crystallized
the melting is seen in both S2 and S10, and they didn't lose their powers after that
 
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Agnaa said:
I don't have the expertise to tell whether Lloydblitzed's recent edits are in line with accepted parts of this thread.

Someone more plugged into things, please evaluate that.
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Tier 2 was accepted multiple times already (by legit 5 mods) and Tier 4 was accepted earlier by Fine Point and Medeus. I added some feats that were based on what was accepted on the CRT too (which is where the Star and Uni+ scaling are from). Only Low 1-C Source Dragon and Nya's Merged with Sea multiplier was actually refused.
 
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Agnaa said:
I don't have the expertise to tell whether Lloydblitzed's recent edits are in line with accepted parts of this thread.

Someone more plugged into things, please evaluate that.
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Personally, I am against Low 2-C for Sora. She may have destroyed the Mergequake Gun, which is capable of creating rifts in space-time, however, I personally do not think that this gives her such a tier. Why? Because gun itself uses power of the Dragon Cores (which makes it Low 2-C in fact) and Sora destroyed technology that used such power. Actually she didn't destroy Dragon Cores, but only technology that used them as a source of power.

I also against Low 2-C tier for Ninjas (except USM Lloyd). Elemental Powers can't destroy the Universe to be Low 2-C. Yea, EP can close Mergequakes, but it seems like Limited Spatial Manipulation because Elemental Powers, in fact, can't actually do something except closing small rifts.
 
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I agree here on everything besides Mergequake feats. Closing them would make one affect two Realms which is Low multi. Other than that, it is good. Either way, I at least agree on this upscale, I just think one feat scales higher than claimed, not lower.
 
MrUnderlord said:
Personally, I am against Low 2-C for Sora. She may have destroyed the Mergequake Gun, which is capable of creating rifts in space-time, however, I personally do not think that this gives her such a tier. Why? Because gun itself uses power of the Dragon Cores (which makes it Low 2-C in fact) and Sora destroyed technology that used such power. Actually she didn't destroy Dragon Cores, but only technology that used them as a source of power.

I also against Low 2-C tier for Ninjas (except USM Lloyd). Elemental Powers can't destroy the Universe to be Low 2-C. Yea, EP can close Mergequakes, but it seems like Limited Spatial Manipulation because Elemental Powers, in fact, can't actually do something except closing small rifts.
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She is reletive to Nya who is herself Low 2-C. (Idk what mergequake gun ur talking about, its not in the profile💀). The Ninjas affect the Realms by stopping Mergequake, this has already been accepted earlier, I don't see why we gotta discuss this again.(Please keep in note affecting the Universe is Low 2-C according to the Tiering System)
image.png
 
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MrUnderlord said:
Yea, SIGNIFICANTLY. Closing spatial rift is not "significantly" affecting space-time. Moreover, EP never shown any spatial manip or Uni+ power in terms of pure Attack Potency
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EP follows a UES, so that purely scales to AP lol. The Mergequake is just 2 Realms trying to share the same space, they are affecting the Realm by stopping them from sharing that same space. They significally affect it by stopping the 2 structures from merging with each other
image.png
 
Lloydblitzed said:
The Mergequake is just 2 Realms trying to share the same space, they are affecting the Realm by stopping them from sharing that same space. They significally affect it by stopping the 2 structures from merging with each other
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In fact, no. As was shown EP affects only small area Realms are trying to share to stabilize this area. It's do not scale them to Low 2-C.
 
Lloydblitzed said:
it affects the whole Realms. The show never mentionned small areas, but specifically the whole Realm
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In the show itself it wasn't said that their Elemental Powers affects directly 2 Realms that are trying to share a same space. It was shown and said that their powers are only closing Mergequake for a short period of time. That's why Ninjas needed a Dragon Cores (they are directly affects realms). So no, Ninjas maximum is 4-C.
 
MrUnderlord said:
In the show itself it wasn't said that their Elemental Powers affects directly 2 Realms that are trying to share a same space. It was shown and said that their powers are only closing Mergequake for a short period of time. That's why Ninjas needed a Dragon Cores (they are directly affects realms). So no, Ninjas maximum is 4-C.II
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This was never said ever, and they never closed one "for a short period of time". They needed a Dragon Core to stop the Mergequake Storm. Stop inventing stuff😭
 
Lloydblitzed said:
This was never said ever, and they never closed one "for a short period of time". They needed a Dragon Core to stop the Mergequake Storm. Stop inventing stuff😭
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In fact no. You can rewatch the show. It was said that Dragon Cores are needed to stop Mergequakes from appearing and, as result, to stabilize Merged Realms. Ninjas EP can't move Realms.
 
MrUnderlord said:
In fact no. You can rewatch the show. It was said that Dragon Cores are needed to stop Mergequakes from appearing and, as result, to stabilize Merged Realms. Ninjas EP can't move Realms.
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When they close one, a new one spawns somewhere else. They aren't closing it temporarily. Dragon Cores were mainly used to stop the tipping point. This has been approved by 5 staff, I don't see why we gotta discuss it again
 
Lloydblitzed said:
I sent all the scans proving why they are Low 2-C, u got debunked by the tiering system 2 times a row...
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All these scans are stating that:
1) Single mergequake is a result of 2 Realms that are trying to share a one area of space (and single Mergequake have radius ~20 meters)
2) Elemental Powers can stabilize that area

How the **** you think Fire, Ice or Energy can move or significantly affect 2 Realms? This is Limited Spatial Manip at best.
There is no evidence that the EP affects directly 2 Universes, and not this small area of space that 2 Realms are trying to occupy.
 
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Agnaa said:
I don't have the expertise to tell whether Lloydblitzed's recent edits are in line with accepted parts of this thread.

Someone more plugged into things, please evaluate that.
Click to expand...
Speaking of which, there are a few feats I forgot to put earlier that I want get approved before I apply them to the website (So people like @Agnaa won't ban me or sum😭)
  • Oni Garmadon
I think a Oni Garmadon key should be added.Wu stated that Oni Form is the highest level of destruction, thus it should be above all his previous form, and likely higher then his Emperor Garmadon form (who was already accepted as 2-C)
  • Ice Emperor
An Ice Emperor key should be added to Zane, and he should scale to Star using his fight with Lloyd via:
Physically harming Lloyd (Scale to his Strength)
Wisthanding 2 blast from Lloyd and knocking them off (Scale to Dura prob. He should comparable to Lloyd in dura since he tanked hits from him)
Pushing back and overpowering Lloyd (Scale to AP)
  • Overlord (Crystal King form here)
Doesn't change much to his scale, but I think we should add this feat where he speedblitzed Wu
  • Kalmaar and Nya related stuff
Sum relevant feats for one of the future profiles I wanted to make. Pretty important for the Pre DR Ninjas and Kalmaar scaling:
Kalmaar could fight on par with Jay and even overpowered him. Would scale to his Strength
Nya's AP should be above Zane by overpowering Zane with her water tornado
Kalmaar trading blows with Nya and tanking her blasts (Scale to his Strength and AP)
Kalmaar tanking blows from Wu (Scale to his dura obviously)
Kai trading blows with Kalmaar (Scale to Kai's strengt)

These feats are (for most of them), based on what was already accepted here. That would be good too or nah @FinePoint @DarkDragonMedeus ?
 
MrUnderlord said:
All these scans are stating that:
1) Single mergequake is a result of 2 Realms that are trying to share a one area of space (and single Mergequake have radius ~20 meters)
2) Elemental Powers can stabilize that area

How the **** you think Fire, Ice or Energy can move or significantly affect 2 Realms? This is Limited Spatial Manip at best.
There is no evidence that the EP affects directly 2 Universes, and not this small area of space that 2 Realms are trying to occupy.
Click to expand...
The Mergequake affects the 2 realms, as they push the whole thing to merge up and share that same area. U are siginifically affecting the Realms by stopping that process. The Elemental Power follow a Universal Energy System as shown earlier, assuming Kai can't affect 2 Realms bc his powers are fire is a fallacy of assumption. No
 
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Grand_Astartes said:
I thought the changes were already made?
Click to expand...
They already are yes
Lloydblitzed said:
Speaking of which, there are a few feats I forgot to put earlier that I want get approved before I apply them to the website (So people like @Agnaa won't ban me or sum😭)
  • Oni Garmadon
I think a Oni Garmadon key should be added.Wu stated that Oni Form is the highest level of destruction, thus it should be above all his previous form, and likely higher then his Emperor Garmadon form (who was already accepted as 2-C)
  • Ice Emperor
An Ice Emperor key should be added to Zane, and he should scale to Star using his fight with Lloyd via:
Physically harming Lloyd (Scale to his Strength)
Wisthanding 2 blast from Lloyd and knocking them off (Scale to Dura prob. He should comparable to Lloyd in dura since he tanked hits from him)
Pushing back and overpowering Lloyd (Scale to AP)
  • Overlord (Crystal King form here)
Doesn't change much to his scale, but I think we should add this feat where he speedblitzed Wu
  • Kalmaar and Nya related stuff
Sum relevant feats for one of the future profiles I wanted to make. Pretty important for the Pre DR Ninjas and Kalmaar scaling:
Kalmaar could fight on par with Jay and even overpowered him. Would scale to his Strength
Nya's AP should be above Zane by overpowering Zane with her water tornado
Kalmaar trading blows with Nya and tanking her blasts (Scale to his Strength and AP)
Kalmaar tanking blows from Wu (Scale to his dura obviously)
Kai trading blows with Kalmaar (Scale to Kai's strengt)

These feats are (for most of them), based on what was already accepted here. That would be good too or nah @FinePoint @DarkDragonMedeus ?
Click to expand...
Tho Im asking permission to add sum other changes cuz Ion wanna get yell at by mods
 
TheOrangeGuy09 said:
It is significantly affecting them both, you prevent them from merging each other
Click to expand...
If you're closing a rift, that prevents two timelines from merging as a chain reaction, then closing that rift does not qualify for tier 2.

This sounds like one of those cases tbh.
 
Agnaa said:
If you're closing a rift, that prevents two timelines from merging as a chain reaction, then closing that rift does not qualify for tier 2.

This sounds like one of those cases tbh.
Click to expand...
They are directly preventing the merging of those timelines, and since the rift isn't even preventing that merge, this isn't a chain reaction
Mergequake is a direct result from two realms merging, and that it is his burden of proof to show it is a chain reaction. Otherwise, we can come up with many “what ifs” (what if Ninjas don’t do anything and it is FSM from Grasslands closing Mergequakes but irl Ninjas don’t do the shit etc)
 
Lloydblitzed said:
Speaking of which, there are a few feats I forgot to put earlier that I want get approved before I apply them to the website (So people like @Agnaa won't ban me or sum😭)
  • Oni Garmadon
I think a Oni Garmadon key should be added.Wu stated that Oni Form is the highest level of destruction, thus it should be above all his previous form, and likely higher then his Emperor Garmadon form (who was already accepted as 2-C)
  • Ice Emperor
An Ice Emperor key should be added to Zane, and he should scale to Star using his fight with Lloyd via:
Physically harming Lloyd (Scale to his Strength)
Wisthanding 2 blast from Lloyd and knocking them off (Scale to Dura prob. He should comparable to Lloyd in dura since he tanked hits from him)
Pushing back and overpowering Lloyd (Scale to AP)
  • Overlord (Crystal King form here)
Doesn't change much to his scale, but I think we should add this feat where he speedblitzed Wu
  • Kalmaar and Nya related stuff
Sum relevant feats for one of the future profiles I wanted to make. Pretty important for the Pre DR Ninjas and Kalmaar scaling:
Kalmaar could fight on par with Jay and even overpowered him. Would scale to his Strength
Nya's AP should be above Zane by overpowering Zane with her water tornado
Kalmaar trading blows with Nya and tanking her blasts (Scale to his Strength and AP)
Kalmaar tanking blows from Wu (Scale to his dura obviously)
Kai trading blows with Kalmaar (Scale to Kai's strengt)

These feats are (for most of them), based on what was already accepted here. That would be good too or nah @FinePoint @DarkDragonMedeus ?
Click to expand...
@Agnaa Also does this look good🤷‍♂️?
 
Lloydblitzed said:
They are directly preventing the merging of those timelines, and since the rift isn't even preventing that merge, this isn't a chain reaction
Mergequake is a direct result from two realms merging, and that it is his burden of proof to show it is a chain reaction. Otherwise, we can come up with many “what ifs” (what if Ninjas don’t do anything and it is FSM from Grasslands closing Mergequakes but irl Ninjas don’t do the shit etc)
Click to expand...
From the stuff I've been told, it sounds like it stabilizes an area, which if unstable, would result in two timelines merging. Which is a textbook chain reaction.

Hell, even the wording of "closing a rift that would have caused them to merge had it been left open" sounds like an obvious chain reaction.
Lloydblitzed said:
@Agnaa Also does this look good?
Click to expand...
idk, I don't have time to evaluate all that stuff
 
Agnaa said:
From the stuff I've been told, it sounds like it stabilizes an area, which if unstable, would result in two timelines merging. Which is a textbook chain reaction.

Hell, even the wording of "closing a rift that would have caused them to merge had it been left open" sounds like an obvious chain reaction.
Click to expand...
Not at all. They are directly preventing those 2 timelines from merging up with each other. The Mergequake is the 2 timelines sharing the same space
 
Agnaa said:
From the stuff I've been told, it sounds like it stabilizes an area, which if unstable, would result in two timelines merging. Which is a textbook chain reaction.

Hell, even the wording of "closing a rift that would have caused them to merge had it been left open" sounds like an obvious chain reaction.

idk, I don't have time to evaluate all that stuff
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The thing is, I have never seen anyone stating that it is destabilized area which makes 2 Realms merge. In fact, all the statements imply that Mergequake occur because of/as a result of two Realms merging, not vice versa. If one closes Mergequake, it means two Realms stopped merging, hence he significantly affected both of them.
 
TheOrangeGuy09 said:
The thing is, I have never seen anyone stating that it is destabilized area which makes 2 Realms merge. In fact, all the statements imply that Mergequake occur because of/as a result of two Realms merging, not vice versa. If one closes Mergequake, it means two Realms stopped merging, hence he significantly affected both of them.
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Idk why the thread is still going if everything was allegedly accepted but that isn't what qualifies as significantly effecting in context of the site or what happened. But I've already stated my disagreement with t2
 
Agnaa said:
Mergequakes are aftershocks of two timelines merging. Doing something to stabilise those does not require tier 2 AP.
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Nope, the Merge merged all the Realms before that already. Mergequakes are simply timelines trying to share that space, not an aftershock of it
 
Lloydblitzed said:
Nope, the Merge merged all the Realms before that already. Mergequakes are simply timelines trying to share that space, not an aftershock of it
Click to expand...
I'm literally quoting the clip you sent me.
 
Agnaa said:
I'm literally quoting the clip you sent me.
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Ye, that clip refer to the aftershock of the original Merge (its what u called 2 timelines merging) which is whole other thing. Basically, the Mergequake would be a visual representatio of the Realms trying sharing a same space. You stop these 2 Realms from merging by "closing the mergequake", so u affect those 2 Realms and stopped them from sharing a same space
 
The stuff you're saying doesn't make sense and seems to go against standards.

You're saying that two timelines are merging once, and then they're trying to merge again (but not finishing), and then you "close that mergequake" which demerges them?

Two timelines can't merge and then merge again.

If two timelines are currently merging, then halting and reversing that partial process is not tier 2, since it's not a complete merge that's being undone, only a partial one, and such small-scale space-time effects aren't tier 2.
 
Agnaa said:
The stuff you're saying doesn't make sense and seems to go against standards.

You're saying that two timelines are merging once, and then they're trying to merge again (but not finishing), and then you "close that mergequake" which demerges them?

Two timelines can't merge and then merge again.

If two timelines are currently merging, then halting and reversing that partial process is not tier 2, since it's not a complete merge that's being undone, only a partial one, and such small-scale space-time effects aren't tier 2.
Click to expand...
It doesn't. The mergequakes are litteraly stated to affect the world (Which here refers to the Merged Realms), so it would still scale to Tier 2
 
Lloydblitzed said:
It doesn't. The mergequakes are litteraly stated to affect the world (Which here refers to the Merged Realms), so it would still scale to Tier 2
Click to expand...
Stopping something which is currently active and that will eventually destroy the world is not tier 2. That's stopping a chain reaction.
TheOrangeGuy09 said:
Aftershock means result. They just occur when two Realms are merging. Closing mergequake -> stopping two Realms from merging.
Click to expand...
Aftershock is a reverberation that occurs after an event has finished.
 
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