Natsu Dragneel VS. Meliodas (Mel wins!)

[DragonEmperor23]

@theglassman12 then Natsu would just eat the hellfire with the same method he used with Zancrow for his god flames.

@malikobama12 Of course Natsu would be tired for him not to be tired would be to say that fighting Acnologia was easy. Being tired after you finish a fight doesn't mean you lost the power you had in the fight. It was a hard fight and when it was over Natsu stopped using 7Ds. Your only arguement is that he was tired when he's done the same thing before and could use the element when ever he wanted.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

I mean Natsu's Fire has burned Zeref's instant death that kills immortals magic, so Natsu's flames are pretty stupid and they can even attack the soul as well, anyways I'm jumping out of this convo, since we're just going back and forth, and nobodies gonna change their mind on who wins, plus Natsu vs Meliodas has bean done, like 5 times already, so hopefully this will be the last one

@Dragon

EDIT: Also want to point out that the 7 Flames Natsu might have run out of magic, due to the fact that he just came off of fighting Zeref, where he momentarily died, and then was getting wrecked by Acnologia, so he had this form at a point of extreme tiredness, so maybe it would last longer, if he was at perfect health

 

[Theglassman12]

@Dragon you mean the flames that attack the soul? That's not going to be easy to do.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Demon Mel is resistant to soul manipulation, even with that Friendship stuff it's not going to burn his soul.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

@Demon Mel is resistant to soul manipulation, even with that Friendship stuff it's not going to burn his soul.

Dude, if Friendship power was in this Fight, Natsu would win everytime, because FRIENDSHIP ALWAYS WORKS, its like the Talk no Jutsu of the Fairy Tail verse

 

[DragonEmperor23]

@Theglassman12 Natsu can burn away Mel's flames with his own due to powernull.

 

[TriforcePower1]

Glass, friendship can do everything ovo

 

[AstralKing7]

um really arent even sure if Hellfire is magic tbh..and also he doesnt use hellblaze as energy blasts but instead to cover his blade. Natsu wont have the time to burn his flames when they can get reflected back or disperesed

 

[Theglassman12]

@Dragon Mel can do the same thing to Natsu.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

@Theglassman12 since when did Meliodas have power null on his flames? Natsu's flames will tear right through Meliodas's hellfire.

 

[Malikobama1]

@Dragon I don't know what kind of argument you're trying to make exactly. Even if you were right and Natsu could stay in the form longer than two attacks, he'd still be extremely exhausted after two attacks.

No matter which way you look at it, all Mel has to do in this fight is use Full Counter/Counter Vanish/flight to avoid a couple attacks from Natsu, and then Natsu will be extremely exhausted or leave his form. Either way, Natsu is at a huge disadvantage here.

@Demon

That argument loses water since Natsu was given energy from all the other Dragon Slayers. Either using that energy is extremely draining for him, or he runs out of it extremely quickly.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Dragon he can disperse magical attacks. Natsu's power null is inconsistent AF as it sometimes works and sometimes doesn't.

 

[IMadeThisOn8-1-2017]

I would agree that Natsu could eat Hellfire, but I see that as a moot point since Meliodas doesn't abuse Hellfire all that much really. If he sees Natsu eat it without issue, Mel would stop using it right there and then.

On top of it, Full Counter essentially makes all of Natsu's attacks with magic useless leaving Natsu solely to physicals (and no, Natsu can't eat his redirected fire thrown back at him, it's a point in the manga).

Counter Vanish and Revenge Counter make it a handed win for Mel if and when he chooses to use them whenever in the fight.

Plus the regen is a nice touch for Mel.

I'd vote Meliodas.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

@Malikobama my point is that Natsu was tired and beaten before he went into the mode so you can't say he can only use two attacks because he was already in bad shape. Natsu can just follow Mel into the air with his flight via flames and hit him head on while powernulling Meliodas's hellfire. It would be a repeat of Natsu v. Zeref where Natsu punched Zeref while burning away his magic. So in this case Natsu would burn away Mel's fire and punch him.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Dragon you do know that Mel can still reflect his attacks right? Or even better, dodge his punches.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

@Theglassman12 his power null is pretty consistent, whenever he is in a threatening moment and none of his attacks are working he burns away the enemie's powers. @IMadeThisOn Meliodas's regen retains the damage though and Full Counter is useless because Natsu's own attacks aren't going to hurt himself since a dragonslayer is immune to their element. Natsu would just eat Revenge Counter since it is white.

 

[AstralKing7]

Full counter is not useless lmao The point is that Mel wont get hurt by any of Natsu's attacks with full counter. Vanish Counter and even if he were to get hurt he has revenge counter. He cant eat revenge counter bruh. Thats literally can be a close ranged attack and its AOE is too huge and its spreads really fast.

s

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Full Counter would be good as a defense but it wouldn't do any damage to Natsu. White Dragon Slayers can eat and aren't damaged by white things which is what Revenge Counter is. Revenge Counter has a charging time and Natsu would notice and either attack him or eat it.

 

[Theglassman12]

Natsu has never shown to eat white magic.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

This is Natsu in his 7DragonSlayer form one of which white dragonslayer magic is. White Dragonslayers eat white magic.

 

[Enryu_The_Red_Tower]

@Maliko

People have been saying time limits do not apply in versus threads. And besides, it does not make sense for it to be some seconds or some minutes in a thread versus with someone on the same lvl as its power up transformation, and its base is so inferior.

For example: If we follow this logic, then BM Naruto should neither be used in Versus Threads, which has a time limit of 5 minutes.

 

[AstralKing7]

you do realize revenge counter charges up as he takes more damage right??? White magic or you mean white light lol. Mel's revenge counter is pure magical energy being absorbed, it could have been any color. We just cant say it has the attribute of light magic because its white. Thats like sayihg Mel is a angel because the color of Holy magic is white. Also revenge counter gives off huge amounts of energy, if Natsu senses that he would most likely flee instead of trying to face something that is above his tier. Thats going off the logic that revenge counter has to be charged while he is attacking which is proven wrong in the 10commandments fight

 

[Malikobama1]

@Dragon

- Natsu was given the energy of the other Dragon Slayers. Like I said in my reply to Demon's point above, either using that energy severely drains Natsu or it runs out extremely quickly. Either way, Natsu is at a huge disadvantage.

- Natsu is not anywhere near as maneuverable in the air with flame propulsion as Meliodas is with legit flight.

- Like others have said, Natsu's power null is extremely inconsistent. He literally failed to nullify Acnologia's first attack.

- You seem to be under the impression that Hellblaze is some integral part of Meliodas' fighting style and that if Natsu could get rid of it Mel is severely disadvantaged. It doesn't matter, Meliodas just uses it to enhance his attacks sometimes.

- Since when is Revenge Counter white magic? In the manga you can't tell what color it is, and in the anime it's yellow.

Seriously, the following scenario is what is most likely to play out:

Natsu yells and charges at Meliodas just like he did against Acno. If Mel judges Natsu has a power advantage he'll fly away. Natsu sends his big magic fist at Mel, who nullifies it or counters it. Natsu is getting super drained. Meanwhile Mel can make Lostvayne clones to have an omni-directional Full Counter defense and to distract Natsu. Mel gets in sword slashes when he has a chance. Natsu falls first, out of energy long before Mel is even sweating.

@Enryu

"People have been saying" means nothing and is not evidence of anything. You can make a request to change the standard battle assumptions if you want, but like I said above it wouldn't matter. Natsu gets drained really quickly in this form, it doesn't matter if he stays in it or not. Unless you want to make the argument that stamina be ignored.

 

[TriforcePower1]

White dragon slayers can eat everything white, its element doesn't matter. Sting even ate an arrow just because it was white ovo

 

[DragonEmperor23]

what Tri said @AstralKing

It just has to be white for a white dragonslayer to be unaffected or for them to eat it.

 

[Malikobama1]

The point about eating RC shouldn't even be a discussion. The manga is black and white, you can't just assume it's white. And the anime, well here it is.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

@malik Natsu is maneuverable in the air, he can literally go in all directions it's like superman's flight but covered in fire while he does it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCHP8liOOvA 4:05 Meliodas is covered in pure white energy while he uses revenge counter which is pure white. What is your arguement with the power null flames? Are you saying that they won't power null because he's only power nulled with it three times before? Again you keep talking about Natsu's low stamina when he was beaten up and weakened before he went into the form. Natsu would not be weakened in this fight and would have as much stamina as he does normally.

 

[AstralKing7]

Revenge counter in the anime has it as yellow tho

 

[DragonEmperor23]

That's not the Revenge Counter that's yellow that's the dust infront of it. You can see the Revenge Counter being white behind it.

 

[AstralKing7]

no its not dude lol. Last i remembered dust isnt yellow from the ground. I

 

[Malikobama1]

I linked the anime to humor you, and what is this "yellow dust" lol the energy itself is swirling around him and it's yellow.

Like I said, why are you even arguing based on the anime? It's non-canon and several aspects of it differ in color from the canon manga. What point are you trying to make, that Natsu could eat Anime!Meliodas' Revenge Counter if you took the yellow bits out and left it white?

You cannot assume Revenge Counter's color because you want it to be white.

As for your other points:

- "Superman flight"...What? Natsu does not have remotely as much maneuverability in the air as Meliodas, let alone Superman. Because his "flight" is not actually flight.

- You keep ignoring the fact that Natsu was given oodles of energy from his fellow Dragon Slayers. Remember when Natsu was tired vs Hades, but Laxus gave him energy and he started moving around fine again? Same case here. Natsu showed no signs of being exhausted after he was given energy. He just burned through that energy extremely quickly. It'll be the same case vs. Meliodas. He'll burn through the form's energy extremely quickly. It is NOT like LFD where he's shown to make the form his own; all he has access to is what energy he was given.

- My argument with the power null flames is that in this form, Natsu has not power nulled. The ability is inconsistent af in his usual forms, let alone this one where it noticeably did not activate against Acnologia's attack.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

You were the one that brought up the anime and since when was it non canon? In the picture you posted the dust is swirling around the Revenge Counter in a spiral. @Malik in the video I linked you see Meliodas build up the white revenge counter.

Clearly the color white.

 

[Enryu_The_Red_Tower]

"- My argument with the power null flames is that in this form, Natsu has not power nulled. The ability is inconsistent af in his usual forms, let alone this one where it noticeably did not activate against Acnologia's attack."

Incorrect, Natsu DF (Pre Second Origin) and Natsu Base (Post Second Origin) show themselves to be able to use Power Nullification as in the fight against Sting stigma or Natsu burned the Existence Erasure magic of Zero, that is to say that Natsu also has Power Nullification only in a much greater scale than the other two forms of it that I quoted.

 

[Malikobama1]

Do you read the manga? The anime changed and cut several events and many things were altered, including several colors.

As for your picture: if we were using the anime, it's a good thing that the most current depiction of Revenge Counter is yellow, as seen above. You're using an outdated version. But we're not using non-canon versions, so the entire argument is moot.

Canon Revenge Counter cannot be eaten by Natsu just because you wish to assume its color.

@Enryu

...Did you read the bolded bits? I said "in this form" and then you replied talking about other forms. If Natsu had nullification on a scale that worked against comparable enemies in his Seven Dragon Form, Acnologia's magic attack would have been nullified. It wasn't.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2yeTmykfvc 0:17 This is Natsu flying around with flames, I was off with my superman comparison but he still has around the same if not better movement in the air than Meliodas who needs to turn his arms into wings. "Ability to perform independent movement in a gaseous atmosphere or vacuum. This movement can be carried out by the use of jet thrust propulsion, other similar means, or without any means at all (using inertia). In fiction, there are other possible ways of moving (by magic, telekinesis, etc.)." Natsu fits this so he has flight. With your scenario Natsu would stop using his magic after he noticed that the guy he's fighting can just make it disappear and just use his fists. He isn't going to keep attacking with magic against the guy who can nullify it. Natsu's flames wouldn't lose their power null ability because he hasn't used power null in the form, that doesn't make any sense. All the form does is give him multiple types of Dragon Slayer magic.

 

[Malikobama1]

First of all, you're linking the non-canon anime as evidence. Second, your video shows Natsu moving in a straight line like a rocket, which doesn't do anything for the point you're trying to make.

"than Meliodas who needs to turn his arms into wings"

Why are you under this impression? There's even a picture of Meliodas making back wings on his profile.

- Natsu not using magic is extremely advantageous for Meliodas. He has less maneuverability and Meliodas will have clones to continually distract him with.

- Power null has never been portrayed as a conscious ability Natsu uses, it's been shown as an innate part of his magic when he gets really worked up. It didn't happen against Acnologia. Seven Dragon Natsu has not displayed power null that works against a comparable enemy. That's why people including me were calling it inconsistent.

_______________

This argument is going nowhere and I've stated my reasons for giving Mel the win, so I'll summarize them here and leave off with this:

Natsu's magic attacks are useless due to Mel's abilities, Natsu can't eat Revenge Counter, and Mel has superior maneuverability and flight and can stay out of range indefinitely, distracting with clones until he has an opening to move in and slash. Finally, Natsu only has access to the energy given to him (since this form is NOT like LFD and was never shown to be made into an innate transformation Natsu has) and he is shown to get severely drained in the form after a couple attacks. I vote Meliodas.

 

[HST_Master]

The thing with Full Counter is fellas is that if Mel tries to reflect Natsu's attacks they stop being his in which Natsu can simply eat it again

This is evident when Natsu's fighting the Wolf Mercenaries in Eberlue's mansion, they reflect his flame back at him and he eats it no problem

It's exactly like LFDM, in which he took the other slayers magic. It's just like Yhwach never showing use of the Schrifts but still having access to them via in-verse mechanics. We've seen the same situation with several other dual modes, Black Flame Dragon Mode, White Shadow Dragon Mode, and Iron Shadow Dragon Mode which all have the same result.

 

[Enryu_The_Red_Tower]

"- Power null has never been portrayed as a conscious ability Natsu uses, it's been shown as an innate part of his magic when he gets really worked up. It didn't happen against Acnologia. Seven Dragon Natsu has not displayed power null that works against a comparable enemy. That's why people including me were calling it inconsistent."

Incorrect again. Literally these two feats Natsu's Power Nullification were done by his Base (Post Second Origin) and its DF (Pre Second Origin), I do not understand why its form with powers amplified in a much greater scale also can not have Power Nullification, Natsu consciously literally burned the stigma of Sting that was preventing him from moving, this is NLF saying that this form of Natsu does not have Power Nullification just because it did not show, it would be like saying that Erza (Post Second Timeskip) does not have Fairy Armor because she did not use it on Arc Spriggan.

For example against Zero, Natsu Power Nullification it worked against an enemy of the same level.

 

[Malikobama1]

@Enryu

You keep not reading what I say and then putting words in my mouth. I'm not denying Natsu has power nullification. I said that Natsu, in his Seven Dragon Form, did not show the ability to power nullify against an opponent comparable to him, as in a High 6-B level opponent

@Hst

People always seem to completely miss the point with Full Counter, not just you but I notice it a lot. It doesn't need to hurt Natsu, it only needs to stop magic attacks from hurting him. And 7D is absolutely different from the others. Everything you listed is a dual mode. You can't assume Natsu makes every form his, for example Etherion Dragon Force. To assume further is headcanon.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

" First of all, you're linking the non-canon anime as evidence. Second, your video shows Natsu moving in a straight line like a rocket, which doesn't do anything for the point you're trying to make." Natsu flying happenend in both the manga and the anime I just showed you that because then I would have the find the exact page where he did it. How does it not make my point? Natsu can fly in the air directly at Mel and when Mel dodges he can just turn in that direction.