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Nasuverse Discussion Board (New Forum)

hey guys i only have a certain number of grails

is it best to use it on those who have NP 5?


also


Pokemonfan807 said:
found this on tv tropes regarding abigail williams

As "Abigail Williams" was not a potent enough personage to ascend to the Throne of Heroes, the Abby in the Salem singularity possesses all of Williams' memories and is the "real" Abby in ways that count, but she's also an artificially-constructed Servant purpose-manifested by Räum, and in the Salem narrative that Räum has built and loops, she also fills the roles of several other witchcraft accusers. She's also designed to be the vessel for an Outer God capable of inflicting pain and death on all humans the world over, simultaneously, which the original Williams had no connection to at all.

As one might suspect and Circe confirms in the Salem epilogue, in truth "Abigail Williams" is a person and existence far too minor in inflection and importance to be recorded upon the Throne of Heroes; she's little more than a historical footnote (there's no clear written record of what even happened to her after 1692) and no one person involved in the Salem Witch Trials was that important in the grand sweep of human history and consciousness. The Abigail in the Salem singularity has all of Abigail Williams' memories and feels the guilt of her original actions in the historical trials, but she's an artificially constructed Servant vessel molded to be the host of an Outer God, and will disappear along with Salem upon its collapse... in theory. In actuality, because her connection to "Sut-Typhon" (Yog-Sothoth under a different name) has made her into the Silver Key, upon Räum's defeat she can freely depart Salem in The Gentleman's company and wander the cosmos, and the Chaldea summoning system will someday manage to produce another facsimile of this "Abigail", who exists beyond time and space in her own way.



so does this mean if DW wants to add more servants to the game but they are obscure historical figures. then they might have to be artificially constructed ones? (since they're not too important?)
Click to expand...

this question i had no one has answered yet
 
Bradamante and qin liangyu disobeyed gudao and now they have become his slaves

now they will be forced to make a cake for him or whatever he wants to eat or buy
 
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Ultra_instinct_issei said:
mmmm.....infinite universes solid now?
Click to expand...
The infinity is the chain of transcience of the bubbles that compose the World, so I don't see what you are saying...
This seems more like a complement to Universe of Observation/Record and how both can exist simultaneously, playing around with the concept of planck time, that is the ruby for "an instance", (therefore, referring to information/light speed and therefore observation/perception) and order/entropy/time. That part of Vol. 4 + the time structure should be understood w/ Kara no Kyoukai "metaphysical" topics to make much sense, specially the "drawing borders" part. (And Tsukihime RMK also goes on this a bit).

As much of Nasuverse, there are many references you could make from it, some saying they are just coincidence, some saying they fit the overall philosophy of the verse, that even though is definitely overshadows by "cute waifus", has been a constant work in process.

But, on a tangent - whenever anything about time is a topic in Nasuverse, I always remember about Philosopher's Stone and Time Crystals... The coincidence is so ******* bizarre I can't get aroung it in my head.
 
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will the throne of heroes create servants even if humanity goes the E word?


but as long as humanity exists history will exist and if history exists then there will always be new servants right guys?



also i'm upset that no one has answered my question yet
Pokemonfan807 said:
found this on tv tropes regarding abigail williams

As "Abigail Williams" was not a potent enough personage to ascend to the Throne of Heroes, the Abby in the Salem singularity possesses all of Williams' memories and is the "real" Abby in ways that count, but she's also an artificially-constructed Servant purpose-manifested by Räum, and in the Salem narrative that Räum has built and loops, she also fills the roles of several other witchcraft accusers. She's also designed to be the vessel for an Outer God capable of inflicting pain and death on all humans the world over, simultaneously, which the original Williams had no connection to at all.

As one might suspect and Circe confirms in the Salem epilogue, in truth "Abigail Williams" is a person and existence far too minor in inflection and importance to be recorded upon the Throne of Heroes; she's little more than a historical footnote (there's no clear written record of what even happened to her after 1692) and no one person involved in the Salem Witch Trials was that important in the grand sweep of human history and consciousness. The Abigail in the Salem singularity has all of Abigail Williams' memories and feels the guilt of her original actions in the historical trials, but she's an artificially constructed Servant vessel molded to be the host of an Outer God, and will disappear along with Salem upon its collapse... in theory. In actuality, because her connection to "Sut-Typhon" (Yog-Sothoth under a different name) has made her into the Silver Key, upon Räum's defeat she can freely depart Salem in The Gentleman's company and wander the cosmos, and the Chaldea summoning system will someday manage to produce another facsimile of this "Abigail", who exists beyond time and space in her own way.



so does this mean if DW wants to add more servants to the game but they are obscure historical figures. then they might have to be artificially constructed ones? (since they're not too important?)
Click to expand...


aka my tv tropes question
 
Is it me or is post void musashi closer to matching 1-C character than other servants? It's somewhat explicitly stated that she's stronger than caenis, she fights ivan, says she could sacrifice herself to kill either castor or pollux etc...
 
Pokemonfan807 said:
will the throne of heroes create servants even if humanity goes the E word?


but as long as humanity exists history will exist and if history exists then there will always be new servants right guys?
Click to expand...
Kinda, but not really? Avalon Lostbelt deals with this topic, so it's kind of a big spoiler.

About Abby, it's all in her profile. Abigail Williams, the human, was just a person like any other, without any feat that could generate an heroic figure out of her - in the same way it makes no sense for Taiga herself to be a Servant, it makes no sense for Abigail herself to be a Servant. Abigail the Servant was created by Raum.

TypeOU said:
Is it me or is post void musashi closer to matching 1-C character than other servants? It's somewhat explicitly stated that she's stronger than caenis, she fights ivan, says she could sacrifice herself to kill either castor or pollux etc...
Click to expand...
Doubt she would have the means of actually damaging other 1-C characters. But, if there is any possible future in which she could win, Heavenly Eyes go OP
 
LehenDuo said:
Kinda, but not really? Avalon Lostbelt deals with this topic, so it's kind of a big spoiler.

About Abby, it's all in her profile. Abigail Williams, the human, was just a person like any other, without any feat that could generate an heroic figure out of her - in the same way it makes no sense for Taiga herself to be a Servant, it makes no sense for Abigail herself to be a Servant. Abigail the Servant was created by Raum.
Click to expand...

so how will servants continue to be created? (like will creation theoretically be forever assuming humanity can continue to exist?)


so will DW go the Raum path if they choose to make servants out of obscure figures? (i mean there's tons of historical figures out there in this world but a lot of them can be obscure so i'm wondering if they are going to take the raum path if that happens)
 
TypeOU said:
She could litterally one shot caenis. Slashed ivan too
Click to expand...
Average 1-C is so much stronger and more haxed than Ivan it's not even funny. You could say the fact Musashi could ever win against him is a Plot Induced Stupidity also (as originally she couldn't see any future she would ever possibly win), given the nature of Heavenly Eyes.

Think Shirou vs Gilgamesh. Yeah, Shirou won vs Gilgamesh in FSN, but Nasu has himself said that this alone is like a chain of miracles stacked together for it to even be a possibility and that Shirou lost like a bitch in all other possibilities.
 
LehenDuo said:
Average 1-C is so much stronger and more haxed than Ivan it's not even funny. You could say the fact Musashi could ever win against him is a Plot Induced Stupidity also (as originally she couldn't see any future she would ever possibly win), given the nature of Heavenly Eyes.

Think Shirou vs Gilgamesh. Yeah, Shirou won vs Gilgamesh in FSN, but Nasu has himself said that this alone is like a chain of miracles stacked together for it to even be a possibility and that Shirou lost like a bitch in all other possibilities.
Click to expand...

tell me more about the avalon thing i'm curious. what do you mean by that.

Kinda, but not really? Avalon Lostbelt deals with this topic, so it's kind of a big spoiler.

just put in a spoiler so i can see it without others seeing it.


btw i still want to know if they would take a raum path regarding obscure servants.
 
Pokemonfan807 said:
tell me more about the avalon thing i'm curious. what do you mean by that.
Click to expand...
Search for the Avalon translations, it's just too much to write. The LB had more text than the LotR one book edition if I remember correctly, so... it's just too much to even make a summary,

Welll... they could, but given how many other things they are able to do, like what they did with fake Gogh, why would they?
 
LehenDuo said:
Search for the Avalon translations, it's just too much to write. The LB had more text than the LotR one book edition if I remember correctly, so... it's just too much to even make a summary,

Welll... they could, but given how many other things they are able to do, like what they did with fake Gogh, why would they?
Click to expand...
because the servants were like abigail. nothing notable.
 
LehenDuo said:
Search for the Avalon translations, it's just too much to write. The LB had more text than the LotR one book edition if I remember correctly, so... it's just too much to even make a summary,

Welll... they could, but given how many other things they are able to do, like what they did with fake Gogh, why would they?
Click to expand...

well if you can one day sum it up for me then let me know
 
LehenDuo said:
Average 1-C is so much stronger and more haxed than Ivan it's not even funny. You could say the fact Musashi could ever win against him is a Plot Induced Stupidity also (as originally she couldn't see any future she would ever possibly win), given the nature of Heavenly Eyes.

Think Shirou vs Gilgamesh. Yeah, Shirou won vs Gilgamesh in FSN, but Nasu has himself said that this alone is like a chain of miracles stacked together for it to even be a possibility and that Shirou lost like a bitch in all other possibilities.
Click to expand...
Ivan is still on part with panhuman zeus, sure, it's not like scaling to godjuna or megatron zeus, but it's not that bad either.
 
LehenDuo said:
Kinda, but not really? Avalon Lostbelt deals with this topic, so it's kind of a big spoiler.

About Abby, it's all in her profile. Abigail Williams, the human, was just a person like any other, without any feat that could generate an heroic figure out of her - in the same way it makes no sense for Taiga herself to be a Servant, it makes no sense for Abigail herself to be a Servant. Abigail the Servant was created by Raum.


Doubt she would have the means of actually damaging other 1-C characters. But, if there is any possible future in which she could win, Heavenly Eyes go OP
Click to expand...

all I’m asking is.

will new servants always exist or no. Aka certain point where there will be no more servants
 
Pokemonfan807 said:
all I’m asking is.

will new servants always exist or no. Aka certain point where there will be no more servants
Click to expand...
As long as there is Humanity (and this isn't the same as to say as long as there are humans) it seems there will be Heroic Spirits. New HS seem to be becoming sparse as Humanity has been becoming homogenous, and HS arecreated from those who are able to set themselves apart.
But, the plot that is presented to us in Lostbelt is the deformation of humanity. In Avalon, the Lostbelt Depth (therefore, the amount of "History" lost) goes so far way back that Humanity never began, even though there are humans.
 
LehenDuo said:
As long as there is Humanity (and this isn't the same as to say as long as there are humans) it seems there will be Heroic Spirits. New HS seem to be becoming sparse as Humanity has been becoming homogenous, and HS arecreated from those who are able to set themselves apart.
But, the plot that is presented to us in Lostbelt is the deformation of humanity. In Avalon, the Lostbelt Depth (therefore, the amount of "History" lost) goes so far way back that Humanity never began, even though there are humans.
Click to expand...

so they will completly disappear when humanity becomes completely homogeneous
 
LehenDuo said:
Not enough info to say if that is possible. There's also the Saber Wars route.
Click to expand...

so regardless of homogenous or not.

they will always exist even if the amount produced is small.

i like that lehen because it would be boring if (in-universe they stopped making servants)

Out of universe (technically in the real world we might run out of servants since it will take quite a while (very long time) in order to use 21st century characters)

however in-universe (you can say they can use any servant in the future (i'm not saying masters summoning futuristic servants. i'm saying the masters of the future can use any servant from the 21st century or further) it just can't be shown because of political reasons in the real world))
 
bu6k00in6bi71.jpg
 
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