Nasuverse Discussion Board (New Forum)

[Tdjwo]

Yeah, she had it, but:
"That is why I can do anything..hmm like restructuring the laws governing atomic matter, or go back in time to change the evolution and development of all life, to reconstruct the orders and laws of this world is easy for me too. Not making change to the existing world, but rather annihilate the old world with a new world."

Now, remember the bit about how Worlds, when they "end", from the inside/layer below, don't just disappear, but have a process by which they end, but from outside/new world, the old world just pops out of existence, bye bye.

Ngl, I don't understand what you mean here. If Shiki erased the verse, she erases everything plain and simple. The root doesn't care about what rules are set in place when a world ends. It literally created the rules itself so it can break it whenever it wants to.

The wearing a Kimono and using a Katana, the form she has a Saber, is kinda the doing of the thing in itself. It's like what Waver said about angels, that Thrones are not Wheels because they carry power, but carry power because they are Wheels.
Amalavijnnana/Kara no Kyoukai/Boundary of Emptiness is "The sword stroke of the afterlife released from nirvana bestows peace to all existences."

You could compare it to it being the passage between Large and Heavy things to a Large and Light, in a way.

I also don't understand what you mean here. All I'm going to say is;

Shiki vs Arc= Shiki using self suggestion while wearing Kimono.
Shiki vs Araya=Shiki using self suggestion while wearing Kimono.
Shiki in FGO= is a vessel for Void Shiki in servant from/vessel aka nerfed.
Melty blood Shiki cannot interact or summon Void Shiki because;

Void only appeared because Shiki herself was in coma. It had nothing to do with male SHIKI. That one was long gone and dead. If SHIKI dies along with Ryougi Shiki, what's left is the final personality which is Void Shiki. That's the reason she appeared. And that's the reason she would never appear again as long as at least 1 of the two personalities still exist. This means Void Shiki has never and would never interact with Ryougi Shiki.

 

[Tdjwo]

she's literally talking to shiki when making those statements and addressing "her" directly.

For the last time, Arc knows who Shiki Ryougi is BUT Arc didn't fight Void Shiki. She only fought Shiki with self suggestion. I'm tired of this debate so imma stop replying this.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

For the last time, Arc knows who Shiki Ryougi is BUT Arc didn't fight Void Shiki. She only fought Shiki with self suggestion. I'm tired of this debate so imma stop replying this.

there's literally no evidence that suggests this

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

male personality is dead, leavin female shiki and void as the 2 remaining personalities. shiki alludes to this 2nd personality wanting to fight arcueid. male shiki and shiki with suggestion would not know who arcueid is, as she isnt even active in their timeline..

 

[LehenDuo]

Ngl, I don't understand what you mean here. If Shiki erased the verse, she erases everything plain and simple. The root doesn't care about what rules are set in place when a world ends. It literally created the rules itself so it can break it whenever it wants to.

Yeah, but things have a beginning and an end. The thing called process does exist. But the Root express itself as Origins in the beginning, that are directionalities, and if it has direction, it moves, and as it returns to the Root, it's either a straight line, orit has to be directed there - Either way, there's a process, it doesn't matter if it has a set conclusion or not. Beginning and End being one, there has to be a middle. The middle of the old world doesn't just pop out of existence, it reaches the Root - even if it appears to just vanish away to the new world.

Shiki vs Arc= Shiki using self suggestion while wearing Kimono.
Shiki vs Araya=Shiki using self suggestion while wearing Kimono.
Shiki in FGO= is a vessel for Void Shiki in servant from/vessel aka nerfed.
Melty blood Shiki cannot interact or summon Void Shiki because;

Yeah, but the Self-Suggestion is:

Her most notable ability, self-suggestion, restructures her body starting from the brain to become purely for combat; her muscles act in a way unbefitting that of a living being and her blood vessels adjust themselves so that Shiki does not even have to breathe. All functions of the body needed as a "human" are removed in favor of functions needed to be a weapon.

"Ryougi Shiki", the Saber, not Ryougi Shiki, the Assassin. When Ryougi Shiki does the Self-Suggestion, the restructuing itself is the Void. The beginning is Ryougi Shiki, the Void is the midman/process, the output is the "Saber"/swordman form.

To the astonishment of Araya, Shiki ceases being Shiki and there is a change in her "vessel" once Shiki uses her autosuggestion, implying a personality swap to that of 「Shiki Ryougi」

It's not VOID, as it is when it talks with Kokutou, but it can only exist because the Void is in between.

Araya notes that in this sense she's not a knife-fighter, but a swordsman; and whereas she can only strike within three meters with a knife, her range triples to nine meters with a katana.

VOID doesn't need the Ryougi Shiki persona to do anything, but Ryougi Shiki does absolutely need VOID to express the swordman form, and therefore, do Amala-Vijnnana. And, as said by Araya, she IS A SWORDMAN, in this sense.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

male personality is dead, leavin female shiki and void as the 2 remaining personalities. shiki alludes to this 2nd personality wanting to fight arcueid. male shiki and shiki with suggestion would not know who arcueid is, as she isnt even active in their timeline..

and how is shiki hopping worlds in the first place? i dont think "self suggestion" is cutting it.

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

and how is shiki hopping worlds in the first place? i dont think "self suggestion" is cutting it.

dude, i think you should talk to the person who sent me the scans to begin with. Apparently the arguments i sent you were only like 50% of the whole argument and he sent only a part of it. He is an old nasuverse fan although he is not available 90% of time. Dm me.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

dude, i think you should talk to the person who sent me the scans to begin with. Apparently the arguments i sent you were only like 50% of the whole argument and he sent only a part of it. He is an old nasuverse fan although he is not available 90% of time. Dm me.

thats useful to know, but that was a rhetorical question, there's literally no way for shiki to end up in th etsukihime/melty universe without some root fuckery going on, add my discord, its in my signature

 

[LehenDuo]

thats useful to know, but that was a rhetorical question, there's literally no way for shiki to end up in th etsukihime/melty universe without some root fuckery going on, add my discord, its in my signature

Why?
Kara no Kyoukai has Touko, Touko is in both worlds... There's no reason for there not being Kara no Kyoukai characters in world A ou B.

 

[LehenDuo]

Void only appeared because Shiki herself was in coma. It had nothing to do with male SHIKI. That one was long gone and dead. If SHIKI dies along with Ryougi Shiki, what's left is the final personality which is Void Shiki. That's the reason she appeared. And that's the reason she would never appear again as long as at least 1 of the two personalities still exist. This means Void Shiki has never and would never interact with Ryougi Shiki.

Also - VOID is the personality of the Body. Even if it doesn't express/show itself, it's always there, just sleeping...

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Why?
Kara no Kyoukai has Touko, Touko is in both worlds... There's no reason for there not being Kara no Kyoukai characters in world A ou B.

this is true, but there's 2 problems with this.
knk is a "fate" type world, a shiki ryougi may or may not exist, but not the one we know.
shiki is directly stated to have come to the world of melty from a different one

 

[LehenDuo]

KNK takes place in the timeline of Fate-type, El-Melloi Case FIles specifically

But yeah, not the one you know from KNK story specifically, like is the case for example for the different cases of Gilgamesh.
What's the problem?

If there's one thing Nasuverse has made clear is that we really lost the capacity to discern "who's who" between the so called layers of the World.

 

[Violatas]

But yeah, not the one you know from KNK story specifically, like is the case for example for the different cases of Gilgamesh.
What's the problem?

She directly mentions how she already defeated Araya when she fights Nero Chaos.
I'd say its pretty clear that's meant to be KNK Ryougi.

 

[LehenDuo]

She directly mentions how she already defeated Araya when she fights Nero Chaos.
I'd say its pretty clear that's meant to be KNK Ryougi.

If you take Kaleid as something that's true, they wouldn't be the same "person", only the same representation

 

[Violatas]

If you take Kaleid as something that's true, they wouldn't be the same "person", only the same representation

I'm not sure what Prillya has to do with this when yes, that blatantly is a different timeline with the characters being vastly different than how they act in FSN. Ryougi in Melty acts the same as her KNK self and mentions things KNK Ryougi went through

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

KNK takes place in the timeline of Fate-type, El-Melloi Case FIles specifically

But yeah, not the one you know from KNK story specifically, like is the case for example for the different cases of Gilgamesh.
What's the problem?

If there's one thing Nasuverse has made clear is that we really lost the capacity to discern "who's who" between the so called layers of the World.

melty shiki is stated or at least implied to come from knk. at the very least melty shiki is confirmed to come from a different world. normal shiki definitely does not have the second magic

 

[LehenDuo]

I mean, it's hard to really do the one to one correlation (kind of the point) but Illya 3rei + Fate opposite to Denial of Human History kind of points to the fact that whatever this thing called History and whatever the so called characters are, it really is just the use of whatever is previous for the construction of the new - and you don't even notice what really is the so called thing being used.

So, even if following a "proper" Timeaxis, and therefore, the same Person, even if they "did" something, it's really hard to say if it was actually the same "Person", the same thing as Body, the same thing as Soul, the same thing as Mind, as another.

Hell, 3Rei kinda of says that every second is actully you dying and becoming someone new, but by the so called continuity of whatever you are calling you, you wouldn't even notice.

 

[Violatas]

I mean, it's hard to really do the one to one correlation (kind of the point) but Illya 3rei + Fate opposite to Denial of Human History kind of points to the fact that whatever this thing called History and whatever the so called characters are, it really is just the use of whatever is previous for the construction of the new - and you don't even notice what really is the so called thing being used.

So, even if following a "proper" Timeaxis, and therefore, the same Person, even if they "did" something, it's really hard to say if it was actually the same "Person", the same thing as Body, the same thing as Soul, the same thing as Mind, as another

Your claim about the Ryougi seen in Melty not being the same as KNK requires proof. Yes, we know theres alt timelines. And going by the implications of Ryougi's dialogue and the fact she still acts the same as KNK Ryougi, the claim she isn't the same requires more proof than saying vice versa, and noticeably nothing has been posted indicating this. And I'm not sure why it'd be a different Ryougi anyways with no indicators pointing towards this being a version no one knows.

And yes, the Ryougi in Melty is from a different "world." Its not a Ryougi specifically from the Melty timeline.

And none of the stuff about Prillya is making a case either.

 

[LehenDuo]

Read the chapters of 3Rei, as in, payng attention to the chapters, numbers and what's happening. The level of "meaning"/references just thrown in the most dumb way possible,

The very first chapter, Irya and Miyu being separated by light, Irya in a crater in a place that is cold, the city now a crater with the water farther than it should, her house now gone, with snow falling. The very first chapter could be said to literally represent the entirety of the arc, that literally repeats itself cyclically.

The characters, some are dolls, some install HS, some include cards, Gilgamesh Ko appears from no ******* where, HS literally transform in the middle of the process, Pandora, the box, has no ******* idea what is a person in the sense of the "Timeline" we are following, saying that it's either the Body or the Mind that is important, this same Pandora, as a box, becomes the foundation for Darius to become a giant with 3 pupils in each eye and arms in two directions that have a opposing layer in between, the giants that are generated by that are of "the species" that Darius becomes the King, while having their legs on water and their heads literally inverted, in the place of their torso/heart.

In the middle of it, Pandora lets the Mud enter one of the sides, and there's basically a mirroring of the scene happening the other side, but with diferent characters, while Kaleidostick talk and the "doll" Angelica asks who she's talking to. Shinji, donning the same Card as Illya, but instead of having the mask in the side, having it in the front, kills Sakura with a 3 petalled hole, that is equal to the corner spilling mud inside the other World.

I mean, you really ******* can't argue the story isn't about time and it's passage. And rephrasing the theme that man is the "doll" of Kami, while Kami are the dolls of Man. Kingu is Enkidu, the thing meant to anchor the Gods to Men is the thing that separates it, etc etc.
Literally everybody becomes a doll, merely controlled, a mind, the interplay of Body and Mind, and the origin of something as a Soul, hidden inside de Pandora Box that in the end isn't so hidden.

And to end it all, the very act of Darius becoming the Creator is him a puppet of his own tablets and crown of thorns, the so called King of Giants that he assumes control a puppet of himself, that can even notive that the "creatures" invading and his own sense of touch are the same thing, inverted, that dries and is just overthrown by Illya/Gil-ko/Tanaka.

And all Darius and Pandora can say is Pantha Rhei, everything flows, Pandora affirming "the Fire in his heart was gone", and therefore, the very process of life, of "output". He has 6 eyes but can't see a thing, cn't even differenciate Heaven from Earth, and said to have seen "a World where there were trees, evreyone was united" - the World where he himself is just headless "giants" that dry and die.

And them there's the reversion of meaning by Darius and basically everyone, everytime. Just for Darius to become dried mud - Earth, without nerves without heads or legs. And they will be them used as Earth Element, by someone else. Even the "incarnated Emiya Shirou" becomes oath bound, with his left arm covered, only seeing one way - the one Path. And probably this is the "Emiya Shirou" that becomes EMIYA, as he is the result of the Yumi and the Yari, the Crater that becames the Blade through his Blaze, while he is merely the receptor of the wishes of others.

And finally - Tanaka's Arm, shot - it becomes a Sword to be used through the Kaleidosticks, and is the Wings of a Dragon that cuts 90 degrees the attacks of others before (Yumi/Arc or Saber/Yari/Miya from will result in EMIYA A-3 letters-E, the family name of Emiya Shirou and the only meaning of EMIYA HS, because he lost all meaning he had)

From EMIYA side, as the HS that was thrown into a new World - Soul is definitely the same as Shirou's, but Mind and Body are really different. He won, actually, and now "He was always alone, intoxicated with victory in a hill of swords. Thus, his life has no meaning. That body was certainly made out of Sword." The body made of Sword is the Kansho and Bakuya held in the arm hidden, the arm is his life, he can only pray, as his hair, white, is the blade, always alone because the Shirou of before oathed and had only one path, trying to reconnect with the other side, his heart, the black sword, that became the torso clothing, the hair of previous Emiya becoming the Red shroud protecting him from the World. He was only EA, only air. It wasn't only Pandora that didn't understood "personhood", as she only new Mind, the thing coming out, and Body, the thing that is the touch.

 

[Violatas]

Read the chapters of 3Rei, as in, payng attention to the chapters, numbers and what's happening. The level of "meaning"/references just thrown in the most dumb way possible,

The very first chapter, Irya and Miyu being separated by light, Irya in a crater in a place that is cold, the city now a crater with the water farther than it should, her house now gone, with snow falling. The very first chapter could be said to literally represent the entirety of the arc, that literally repeats itself cyclically.

The characters, some are dolls, some install HS, some include cards, Gilgamesh Ko appears from no ***** where, HS literally transform in the middle of the process, Pandora, the box, has no ***** idea what is a person in the sense of the "Timeline" we are following, saying that it's either the Body or the Mind that is important, this same Pandora, as a box, becomes the foundation for Darius to become a giant with 3 pupils in each eye and arms in two directions that have a opposing layer in between, the giants that are generated by that are of "the species" that Darius becomes the King, while having their legs on water and their heads literally inverted, in the place of their torso/heart.

In the middle of it, Pandora lets the Mud enter one of the sides, and there's basically a mirroring of the scene happening the other side, but with diferent characters, while Kaleidostick talk and the "doll" Angelica asks who she's talking to. Shinji, donning the same Card as Illya, but instead of having the mask in the side, having it in the front, kills Sakura with a 3 petalled hole, that is equal to the corner spilling mud inside the other World.

I mean, you really ***** can't argue the story isn't about time and it's passage. And rephrasing the theme that man is the "doll" of Kami, while Kami are the dolls of Man. Kingu is Enkidu, the thing meant to anchor the Gods to Men is the thing that separates it, etc etc.
Literally everybody becomes a doll, merely controlled, a mind, the interplay of Body and Mind, and the origin of something as a Soul, hidden inside de Pandora Box that in the end isn't so hidden.

And to end it all, the very act of Darius becoming the Creator is him a puppet of his own tablets and crown of thorns, the so called King of Giants that he assumes control a puppet of himself, that can even notive that the "creatures" invading and his own sense of touch are the same thing, inverted, that dries and is just overthrown by Illya/Gil-ko/Tanaka.

And all Darius and Pandora can say is Pantha Rhei, everything flows, Pandora affirming "the Fire in his heart was gone", and therefore, the very process of life, of "output". He has 6 eyes but can't see a thing, cn't even differenciate Heaven from Earth, and said to have seen "a World where there were trees, evreyone was united" - the World where he himself is just headless "giants" that dry and die.

And them there's the reversion of meaning by Darius and basically everyone, everytime. Just for Darius to become dried mud - Earth, without nerves without heads or legs. And they will be them used as Earth Element, by someone else.

Again, none of this has to do with Melty or Ryougi's role in it. You've yet to post proof suggesting it isn't the one from KNK outside of just posting Prillya passages, when I've already said that yes, its blatantly clear the Prillya versions of the cast are different from FSN. The Ryougi seen in Melty at least has evidence saying its the same, and I would think its weird its some "close-ish but not" alt despite nothing indicating it. This is quite literally a case of "saying its KNK Ryougi requires less hurdles than saying she's different "

 

[LehenDuo]

Shiki "Will of Heavens" can't be VOID Shiki because it literally is a contradiction. VOID Shiki has no Will. She only wants to Sleep.

Whatever the thing called "Will of Heavens" is, it's not the Law/Principle of the Universe that VOID Shiki is. And thats the point - Humans as everyone knows is 3 Factors, Body, Mind and Soul, , but really, each step just spirals into Infinity. The Origin of the Body, generating the Personality called VOID, that becomes the MIND in the Self-Suggestion. Really, any of the 3 things does any of the functions, because they are not "Laws" in reality, the appear so because the mid, the "Fourth" linking is tethered and concealed.

The Emiya-Chloe that hits the bridge "Darius" is standing from the undersize is the Will that becomes Emiya "Card" stab Assassin in his back, which is done by the arrow armament. The very idea of the "Boundary of Nothingness" that is the black box of the Soul is just a rotate axis of meaning.

Or, if one idea that may seem dumb - the very idea of the Will of the Heavens claiming the life of Arcueid through the use of the ME is literally the reenactment of Ciel using the Bounded Field Grand Cathedral / Tower of Confinement with the Principle of the 22th, Chromclay Petastructure's Preceptual Boundary Blood "Castle, ergo, Kingdom. The precepts are the study of Death, of D-A-A, the principle is Large and Heavy only to them, to arcueid it's a lie that she literally bursts from because she wanted to. The 140m Cathedral Wall was mere air to her, as she is the W"A"N that the Shito study, and one instead of 27 that they see. She isn't Smal and Heavy, she's for all effects, large and infinite mass, the large becomes Heavy, and the infinite mass cannot be obversed, 90 degrees shifted, so it seems she is small.

 

[Violatas]

Shiki "Will of Heavens" can't be VOID Shiki because it literally is a contradiction. VOID Shiki has no Will. She only wants to Sleep.

There actually isn't a contraction here? In fact that lines up with Ryougi saying its the first time "I" am urging myself on. And Heaven likely refers to the Root actually, looking at the connection between True Magic and how it's the closest thing to a Heaven in Nasuverse

Also ngl, saying Void has no will isn't true either. Sure sleeping that's what she likes to do, but that doesn't correlate with someone having no will of their own to do anything.

 

[LehenDuo]

There actually isn't a contraction here? In fact that lines up with Ryougi saying its the first time "I" am urging myself on. And Heaven likely refers to the Root actually, looking at the connection between True Magic and how it's the closest thing to a Heaven in Nasuverse

Also ngl, saying Void has no will isn't true either. Sure sleeping that's what she likes to do, but that doesn't correlate with someone having no will of their own to do anything.

Let me correct it. She's a personality of the Body. Normally this would never even have self-awareness. But she "wake" and felt the outside/inside. To her, that was the Body, not the Mind and therefore the Brain -> Output (she even says she has to use everything from her other personality because she wouldn't be able of speech without.) The outside is the inside. And the inside outside. And both nothing. She created the Ryougi because she just wanted to not see that shitty thing.

She knows herself the outside and inside are the same and both Void. Either she is the "hole" things go through to get anywhere, therefore LAW/PRINCIPLE, or there's something from the Void/Nothingness interacting and projecting Will. So, therefore, it's not Void, its "Shiki Ryougi" - and I would say it's the Male, that is, the scene is basically Shiki male reason for killing himself.

 

[KingNanaya]

I just think Shiki looks cool

 

[Violatas]

She knows herself the outside and inside are the same and both Void. Either she is the "hole" things go through to get anywhere, therefore LAW/PRINCIPLE, or there's something from the Void/Nothingness interacting and projecting Will. So, therefore, it's not Void, its "Shiki Ryougi" - and I would say it's the Male, that is, the scene is basically Shiki male reason for killing himself.

It takes place after the male personality is dead though lmao. Hence why Ryougi mentions how she already beat Araya. It can only be referring to Void.

 

[Violatas]

Literally what are all these hoops trying to say its not Void? The male personality is dead, it can't be a 'self suggestion' she's referring to either because why would she refer to herself in the third person despite never doing this while under self suggestion before, and then Ryougi and Archetype's dialogue regarding the Earth and Universe is so clearly AE speaking to Void through Ryougi. Whether or not Void herself was doing the taking in that conversation (doesn't seem like she was) is mostly irrelevant.

 

[LehenDuo]

Does she ever talk in the fight with Araya while in Self-Suggestion?
Because, truly, why would she use masculine pronounces and etc in her post self-killing of one of her halfs?

If the origin is ( ) and it is Self-Suggesting something, it would go ( ) Shiki ( ), from the half left to the body, og course it would seem as if in the third person, because it would be an echo origin - origin. The same way she talks as if a male when talking to others, because it goes Shiki - "Shiki (dead)"( )

 

[ArkhamDC06]

I'm not sure what Prillya has to do with this when yes, that blatantly is a different timeline with the characters being vastly different than how they act in FSN. Ryougi in Melty acts the same as her KNK self and mentions things KNK Ryougi went through

In all honesty, it doesn't necessarily means the events transpired exactly as they did in KNK. Waver Velvet is the perfect example of this, no matter the timeline, somehow Waver always ends up taking part in a Grail War, summons Iskandar and becomes a jaded magus and Lord of the Association, even though the events of Fate Zero are not canon to all Fate timelines. Apocrypha is the most blatant example since Waver followed the same path despite the specific circumstances of this timeline making it clear Fate Zero never happened (since the Grail was stolen from Zouken by Darnic during the Third War). It's likely that in many universes, characters go through the same experiences on a global idea, probably because they're major events that define who they are, it's just that the details aren't the same

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

In all honesty, it doesn't necessarily means the events transpired exactly as they did in KNK. Waver Velvet is the perfect example of this, no matter the timeline, somehow Waver always ends up taking part in a Grail War, summons Iskandar and becomes a jaded magus and Lord of the Association, even though the events of Fate Zero are not canon to all Fate timelines. Apocrypha is the most blatant example since Waver followed the same path despite the specific circumstances of this timeline making it clear Fate Zero never happened (since the Grail was stolen to Zouken by Darnic during the Third War). It's likely that in many universes, characters go through the same experiences on a global idea, probably because they're major events that definie who they are, it's just that the details aren't the same

that's literally debunked by the fact melty ryougi comes from another world. the events of knk cannot happen in tsukihime, as knk is a fate world, which is incompatible to melty's world, which is a continuation of og tsukihime

 

[ArkhamDC06]

that's literally debunked by the fact melty ryougi comes from another world. the events of knk cannot happen in tsukihime, as knk is a fate world, which is incompatible to melty's world, which is a continuation of og tsukihime

Maybe she fought Araya anyway in that timeline. Honestly, with how absurdly inconsistent the Nasuverse is, it wouldn't be surprising

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Maybe she fought Araya anyway in that timeline. Honestly, with how absurdly inconsistent the Nasuverse is, it wouldn't be surprising

either way, parallel world travel/2nd is not in ryougi's normal arsenal, which is the main thing being argued here. it is however, not beyond void's capabilities at all.

 

[Tdjwo]

Regarding this parallel world you guys keep using as an evidence to claim Melty Shiki is Void, can you also say that extra Shiki who killed 99 servants is also Void?You know, they both traveled across parallel universes via the same method.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Regarding this parallel world you guys keep using as an evidence to claim Melty Shiki is Void, can you also say that extra Shiki who killed 99 servants is also Void?You know, they both traveled across parallel universes via the same method.

void doesnt have to be active at all times, but obviously ryougi cant know the second magic because zelretch already knows it.

 

[Tdjwo]

void doesnt have to be active at all times, but obviously ryougi cant know the second magic because zelretch already knows it.

So how do you think Ryougi traveled to parallel worlds in Melty blood and Extra?

 

[LehenDuo]

Regarding this parallel world you guys keep using as an evidence to claim Melty Shiki is Void, can you also say that extra Shiki who killed 99 servants is also Void?You know, they both traveled across parallel universes via the same method.

The thing is that Void is Shiki, with an extra step in-between. It's like saying Excalbur isn't Saber Artoria, while it's literally the very symbol of her existence.

Like, Ergo using Divine Arms things
Divine Core Loading - Loaded / Bullet in the name of God
Divine Case Deployment - Deployed / Barrel changed
Divine Chaff Entanglement - Entangled / My hands represent a God

It's not a simpel "Is or Isn't" - he needed six phantom hands, a bullet a barrel and the entanglement, for them de two hands (which are divine arms) to represent a God

 

[Tdjwo]

The thing is that Void is Shiki, with an extra step in-between. It's like saying Excalbur isn't Saber Artoria, while it's literally the very symbol of her existence.

Void is not Shiki. Void is the Root itself.

 

[LehenDuo]

Void is not Shiki. Void is the Root itself.

Or merely a very ******* muddled process/Past - Future
Both, truly.
The only thing Gilgamesh did with his Clairvoyance was turn it off and be tormented in life by it. If VOID is anything similar to human in psyche, the World itself is like her owne body, and she's locked in it - Doesn't seem any funny.

Wouldn't she be like EMIYA, literally doing dirty work without ever getting to experience the future?

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Void is not Shiki. Void is the Root itself.

void is both. melty shiki recognizes her as herself

 

[Violatas]

In all honesty, it doesn't necessarily means the events transpired exactly as they did in KNK. Waver Velvet is the perfect example of this, no matter the timeline, somehow Waver always ends up taking part in a Grail War, summons Iskandar and becomes a jaded magus and Lord of the Association, even though the events of Fate Zero are not canon to all Fate timelines. Apocrypha is the most blatant example since Waver followed the same path despite the specific circumstances of this timeline making it clear Fate Zero never happened (since the Grail was stolen from Zouken by Darnic during the Third War). It's likely that in many universes, characters go through the same experiences on a global idea, probably because they're major events that define who they are, it's just that the details aren't the same

that's literally debunked by the fact melty ryougi comes from another world. the events of knk cannot happen in tsukihime, as knk is a fate world, which is incompatible to melty's world, which is a continuation of og tsukihime

^

Regarding this parallel world you guys keep using as an evidence to claim Melty Shiki is Void, can you also say that extra Shiki who killed 99 servants is also Void?You know, they both traveled across parallel universes via the same method.

That's Ryougi herself, and she had no idea how she ended up in EXTRA.
Dunno why the sass

 

[LehenDuo]

By the way: The body, which should be only a receptor, acquiring sensibility - becomes a human, or at least, human-like "人". The way of being human is to exist between "ni", the future and the past, therefore, between two Jin rotated, one eye because you only see the future that has become the past, not defining it while analyzing like the gods. But strangely , you can say that, from the "ni" of Human that the Gods are birthed and achieve the "Jin" rabbit way of life. as Kami kanji has one beginning and end in each "stalk", above and below.

Shiki is called Decaptating Rabbit, a similar title is shared by Arcueid as Moon Cancer - she hoops on the Moon like a Rabbit, and by Gilgamesh, that is called out by Enkidu to stop "decaptating" things, and he says he acquired a "Harebrained Habit"

Shiki is probably in reference to events, "the longevity of things", so she cuts the future of them, aka, decaptates them. I say this in reference to "reaching a dream in the future" being compared to diving headfirst without any fear of anything in some works. Gilgamesh collects the Hogu, the prototypes of all the future NPs, the storage house of the very creations of Man - which by hiding them in Gate of Babylon, hidden in the very air in a way, "lose" a part of them, the future. Also, strangely enough, Harebrained Habit = HH = Human History. Which, again, references the "fourth", that was tethered as the linking part of the previous Magic(s).
Archtype problably references the Moon being the "outside" limit, and the Eye of Moon in a way the One Eyed God that sees in the future.