Naruto Revisions: High 6-A Downgrade + PS and Kurama Scaling

[M3X_2.0]

Then say goodbye to SM multiplier.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

I don't really care either way, i just want to implement the new calc.

 

[KingTempest]

Being vulnerable doesn’t mean that he’s a water type pokemon facing an electric type pokemon, it just means Senjutsu works on the Juubi jinchuuriki

Mitch.
We see a 7-A character harm him while he is 6-A.
Yes it does. The manga calls it a weakness. You know what weakness means. He even says "I can't believe the ten tails jinchuriki has such a weakness".

because they clashed with him at his peak he got less powerful as the clash went on its simple
1. Naruto+Sasuke and Jubbito clashed
2. Jubbito had flashbacks and his resolve weakened
3. He got overpowered and lost

So if he is weaker than why are you trying to scale them to his full power.
They did not harm him until he lost his will to fight.

 

[StrawHatArslan]

Mitch.
We see a 7-A character harm him while he is 6-A.
Yes it does. The manga calls it a weakness. You know what weakness means. He even says "I can't believe the ten tails jinchuriki has such a weakness".


So if he is weaker than why are you trying to scale them to his full power.
They did not harm him until he lost his will to fight.

I think Tempest is correct here. If the manga itself stated that it's considered a weakness, then his point stands. Also not to mention that he was only harmed after he had lost his will to fight, which also stands.

 

[theultimate5105]

So if he is weaker than why are you trying to scale them to his full power.
They did not harm him until he lost his will to fight.

are you dumb he was trying to kill them with his full power yet they held him back until he had flashbacks
Its literally the easiest thing to understand Naruto and Sasukes combined power was equal to his so they clashed equally for a bit THEN Jubbito had flashbacks which made him lose

 

[StrawHatArslan]

are you dumb he was trying to kill them with his full power yet they held him back until he had flashbacks
Its literally the easiest thing to understand Naruto and Sasukes combined power was equal to his so they clashed equally for a bit THEN Jubbito had flashbacks which made him lose

Chill.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

Wel

Mitch.
We see a 7-A character harm him while he is 6-A.
Yes it does. The manga calls it a weakness. You know what weakness means. He even says "I can't believe the ten tails jinchuriki has such a weakness".


So if he is weaker than why are you trying to scale them to his full power.
They did not harm him until he lost his will to fight.

That’s Durability Based, the fact is the Majestic Attire Susanoo could clash with and contest the Truth Seeking Balls and Sword of Nunoboko

 

[KingTempest]

are you dumb he was trying to kill them with his full power yet they held him back until he had flashbacks
Its literally the easiest thing to understand Naruto and Sasukes combined power was equal to his so they clashed equally for a bit THEN Jubbito had flashbacks which made him lose

Keep asking if I'm dumb.
The moment he said "lemme get serious" he one shot them.
Why did he one shot their avatars with a simple clash? Answer that question.

The whole time he blocked their attacks and then casually one shot them.

Not a single scan except the PIS one shows that they were "equal" to his.

 

[theultimate5105]

Keep asking if I'm dumb.
The moment he said "lemme get serious" he one shot them.
Why did he one shot their avatars with a simple clash? Answer that question.

But what happened to them who were in the middle of their avatars oh wait they survived without too many injuries and if they were knocked out it would have been fine for you but they weren't

The whole time he blocked their attacks and then casually one shot them.

Not a single scan except the PIS one shows that they were "equal" to his.

Oh so now stuff you don't agree with is PIS great
Their Combined Power=Jubbito>>Them individually its not hard

 

[KingTempest]

Well That’s Durability Based, the fact is the Majestic Attire Susanoo could clash with and contest the Truth Seeking Balls and Sword of Nunoboko

And we classified that as CIS since he was in his emotion based BS. He warded off their attacks prior and one shot them, then only lost when he lost willpower and motivation.

 

[KingTempest]

But what happened to them who were in the middle of their avatars oh wait they survived without too many injuries and if they were knocked out it would have been fine for you but they weren't

Lemme knock you out and say you scale.

Oh so now stuff you don't agree with is PIS great
Their Combined Power=Jubbito>>Them individually

Keep ignoring that Obito was crying in his brain

its not hard

You know what else isn't hard? Them not scaling at all

 

[theultimate5105]

Lemme knock you out and say you scale.

All you showed is them tanking a attack

Keep ignoring that Obito was crying in his brain

Keep ignoring what actually happened in the scene the fact that you know they were clashing before that happened

 

[KingTempest]

Everyone please inform me if they tanked that attack even though they had barriers that shattered.

I guess Itachi's body scales to Kirin then, since his Susanoo took the full yield and he didn't die.

 

[BlackeJan]

No they didn't tank the attack. They did survived the attack but took damage

 

[Omimi]

With the truthseeking orbs or the chakra arms?

Idm that it's off guard, they flat out call nature energy a weakness, and the fact that it was 2 nature energy users against him which can close a million x gap says a lot.

No way are you trying to scale them to getting grabbed.
Literally the next page he slams them into the ground and they lose their modes.

If that isn't clear PIS or the fact that truthseeking orbs are vulnerable to nature energy plus the fact that he lost his resolve to fight doesn't say they shouldn't scale, then idk what should

Wrong not whole truthseeking orbs are vulnerable to nature energy
If it was than jubito's tsb wouldnt able to tank sm rasengan
only tsb power null/invulnerability is vunerable to nature energy
since nature energy isnt magic/super natural
sm naruto feat is PIS since hasirama sm seal did nothing to jubito and he brock it easily

if whole truthseeking orbs were realy vulnerable to nature energy then madara's tsb shuldnt able to cut sm minato's arms

u need to read next page to understads what tobirama word meant

https://official-complete-2.eorzea.us/manga/Naruto/0642-014.png

''that senjutsu using mountmyboku toad attack wasnt nullified or erased''
here he clearly meant that senjutsu is effective against tsb power null/ invulnerability not whole tsb
and even if we assume u are right then all nature energy user should be able to hurt each other easily and they shouldnt able to tank it
jubito vs bsm(minato+naruto)
jibito vs cm sasuke/bsm naruto
madara vs sasuke/naruto
kaguya vs s sasuke/naruto
naruto vs sasuke
they all have senjutsu yet they could tank one another

 

[Duedate8898]

Mitch.
We see a 7-A character harm him while he is 6-A.
Yes it does. The manga calls it a weakness. You know what weakness means. He even says "I can't believe the ten tails jinchuriki has such a weakness".

To tackle these two ponts,
A 7-A harming a 6-A points more to a problem with the current scaling than it does with anything else. Especially since we kinda refuse to acknowledge that Base Naruto does get stronger over the course of Shippuden.

And to point towards the weakness bit on Obito's profile and in manga, this very much has to do with the invulnerability that being the Juubi Jinchuriki offers. He is shown immune to standard ninjutsu, however whenever senjutsu is added to this ninjutsu that immunity no longer applies. His invulnerability doesn't cover senjutsu, so his standard durability is really all he has in order to stand against it.

 

[BlackeJan]

Wait so going by what DueDate says, does that mean scene where BSM/Senjutsu Susano Sasuke vs Juubito clash didn’t actually use senjutsu chakra but just rather physical contact?

 

[Kidkinsey]

Weakness are in thats one of the few things that works not that its 2x effective or anything, Ninjutsu legit does not work so yes senjutsu is a "weakness"

 

[TheFinalOrder]

I disagree with this for a fundamental reason. Madara's statement is being attributed to being a comparison of "AP" in this thread. This is false as Hashirama and Madara respectively have feats and scaling (Unless I missed something) that puts them over 100% Kurama. Not only this but Madara's statement is in reference to the "Destructive Capacity" of PS which only the Biju can Rival, not AP. He even emphasizes this by saying the Extent to which the maps will have to be redrawn will be less.

And Iirc, the High 6-A scaling is from Juubi's TPC and Hashirama's feats against Juubi.

 

[TheLastStylebender]

I agree

 

[Kidkinsey]

good point never thought about it from a ap vs dc standpoint

 

[Damage3245]

A 7-A harming a 6-A points more to a problem with the current scaling than it does with anything else. Especially since we kinda refuse to acknowledge that Base Naruto does get stronger over the course of Shippuden.

To add onto this, I don't think this is just a matter of Naruto getting stronger. Rather, we rate Obito as being too high physically at the moment.

His durability feats listed for that key are...:

At least Multi-Continent level (Comparable to his Attack Power)

Pretty lacking, to say the least.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

That's a pretty simple fix.

We just revise it to say "superior to the Ten Tails which can tank it's own Bijuudama" and insert a scan of when it did so.

 

[Damage3245]

We just revise it to say "superior to the Ten Tails which can tank it's own Bijuudama" and insert a scan of when it did so.

The thing is, I don't think his durability is inherently superior to the Ten-Tails just because he's the host. The hosts of other Jinchuriki don't get their Biju's striking strength or durability automatically added to their own.

When he was using the Biju Bombs against the Alliance, he wrapped himself up in the Truthseeking-Orbs, even though the Juubi, like you said, could tank its own Biju Bombs.

I think we need to check against what actual durability feats Obito has in that form.

 

[Slacjow]

Bruh, will there ever be a Naruto CRT without Damage trying to propose yet another controversial downgrade? This may sound rude but it's the truth.
Juubito scales to his AP just like Madara does, just like Naruto and Sasuke, and Hagoromo do, he is stronger than Juubi in a sense that he can focus and control the power better.

When he was using the Biju Bombs against the Alliance, he wrapped himself up in the Truthseeking-Orbs, even though the Juubi, like you said, could tank its own Biju Bombs.

Obito using a shield in that scenario doesn't help your argument, Juubi tanked its BBs with some damage, nonetheless, still tanked.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I'll respond to this later today when I finish my exam. I definitely have a lot to say on this topic.

 

[Damage3245]

Bruh, will there ever be a Naruto CRT without Damage trying to propose yet another controversial downgrade? This may sound rude but it's the truth.

Did you like, completely miss me not raising a complaint on the Sage Mode multiplier thread?

 

[Rocker1189]

When he was using the Biju Bombs against the Alliance, he wrapped himself up in the Truthseeking-Orbs, even though the Juubi, like you said, could tank its own Biju Bombs.

the juubi does not have the brains to defend itself, even if you can tank a grenade you would not willingly do so.

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

IIRC Obito shielded himself against 4 simultaneous TBBs, that were possibly charged, compared to the individual TBBs that the Ten Tails endured

 

[KingTempest]

His current justification
At least Multi-Continent level (Comparable to his Attack Power)
Is severely lacking, since his attack power consists of chakra constructs and dura negation objects (Chakra arms and TSOs). It's not like he has a single dura feat.
Obito has no durability feats that don't consist of nullification in all honesty.

And we don't do that durability stuff for any other Jinchuriki so this isn't an argument.

I'll dig for some feats, and potentially we could backscale from Madara if he has some good durability feats, but as it stands now, he does not have any good durability feats. Look for a feat or a databook statement or something, but as it stands, it's horrible.

 

[Kidkinsey]

did juubito tank hashiramas deity gates? those things are able to hold down the 10 tails
as for base naruto being the same strength ALL of shippuden, Pre rasen shuriken naruto was shown and narraitvely implied to be below hebi sasuke (albiet not a full power) Didnt prove himself to be above sai. Post RS training base naruto was able to BRIEFLY fight pain and intercept then match an attack from 5 kage summit sasuke

 

[Damage3245]

did juubito tank hashiramas deity gates? those things are able to hold down the 10 tails

The Juubi never made a concentrated effort to break them.

 

[Wrath_Of_Itachi]

The Juubi never made a concentrated effort to break them.

They survived a TBB from the Juubi, and Obito survived them falling on top of himself and immediately destroyed them.

 

[KingTempest]

did juubito tank hashiramas deity gates? those things are able to hold down the 10 tails

Those work by inserting Nature energy in the target to seal the user. Obito has a much smaller surface area and he broke the gates using chakra limbs. Even Sai's tigers could destroy the gates, so the Juubi even not breaking out is weird.

as for base naruto being the same strength ALL of shippuden, Pre rasen shuriken naruto was shown and narraitvely implied to be below hebi sasuke (albiet not a full power) Didnt prove himself to be above sai. Post RS training base naruto was able to BRIEFLY fight pain and intercept then match an attack from 5 kage summit sasuke

Pain who has no regular striking feats and 5 kage summit exhausted Sasuke, this isn't an argument

 

[Kidkinsey]

madaras revival is what exploded the gates not sais tiger, the tiger was biting madaras arm, did it show him using chakra limbs? I know he used those to take down the red barrier but the deity gates didnt appear to be broken by chakra arms

That same sasuke fought a fresh kakashi, did they exchange blows in the manga? i know in the anime they did

 

[KingTempest]

madaras revival is what exploded the gates not sais tiger, the tiger was biting madaras arm,

Then that's very weird as well. Madara's revival can destroy gates that can hold down the juubi? That's weird.

did it show him using chakra limbs? I know he used those to take down the red barrier but the deity gates didnt appear to be broken by chakra arms

It shows the chakra coming from his back.

That same sasuke fought a fresh kakashi, did they exchange blows in the manga? i know in the anime they did

He did, then he used Susanoo and went partially blind and couldn't maintain his Susanoo (even though we see people with no eyes use Susanoo)

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

Are the Gates that held down Madara supposed to have the same strength or size as the gates that held down the Juubi?

 

[theultimate5105]

Are the Gates that held down Madara supposed to have the same strength or size as the gates that held down the Juubi?

they have no reason to be weaker its madara who hashirama always goes all out against

 

[LordTracer]

That same sasuke fought a fresh kakashi, did they exchange blows in the manga? i know in the anime they did

They didn’t really trade blows, Kakashi knocked Sasuke back, Sasuke didn’t seem to care, and then he used the Susano’o until he ran out of chakra and went blind.

 

[Damage3245]

Are the Gates that held down Madara supposed to have the same strength or size as the gates that held down the Juubi?

Well, they were significantly smaller which means they'd be easier for him to destroy than destroying the ones that held down the Juubi.