Marvel Comics: Possible Yggdrasil Upgrade - Part 3

[Matthew_Schroeder]

The Marvel Multiverse is still alive despite Yggdrasil dying. This proves that Alonik's interpretation of Yggdrasil is bull.

 

[Overlord775]

Eight Multiverse Eternity is a LOT bigger then Seventh, so he could have just expanded to cover all of Ygg

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Please provide actual evidence of that beyond your speculation.

 

[Kepekley23]

Yggdrasil just withered and died as a result of the Black Winter. RIP.

The Black Winter was said to have killed the Sixth Multiverse, and even then, this is irrelevant to the current subject.

 

[Overlord775]

what is there to prove ?

Eight Eternity works clearly differently from Seventh, with it now containing the Living Tribunal and even the Far Shore laying within it

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

The Black Winter was said to have killed the Sixth Multiverse, and even then, this is irrelevant to the current subject.

This is meaningless to my argument. The Black Winter has yet to still kill the current cosmos, and yet it destroying Yggdrasil didn't bring down the whole multiverse with it. Because Yggdrasil is nowhere near as big as y'all say it is.

 

[Kepekley23]

Okay, sure, but that doesn't matter.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Okay, sure, but that doesn't matter.

It absolutely matters when this is the crux of this whole discussion. Please, don't poison the well and be consistent.

 

[Kepekley23]

Perhaps the two months you spent away from the thread have made some of the key points slip from your memory, but Yggdrasil has long since left the "crux" of the discussion.

So no, that stuff doesn't really matter.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I am reminded quite clearly of the points, but the truth of the matter is that absolutely people tried to lie about Yggdrasil to create an invented cosmology for Marvel that has never been true, and with it try to back up the notion of RKT and TWSAIS being Low 1-A or 1-A or whatever it is now.

The only other argument are TWSAIS being from outside the multiverse arguably which isn't a feat for anything and informs us nothing but where they live.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that Matthew makes sense. Thank you for helping out.

 

[Kepekley23]

The focus on Yggdrasil was centered around the first two threads only.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

The focus on Yggdrasil was centered around the first two threads only.

That's not the point I'm making, Kep, can you read my posts? Either Yggdrasil' size and role in the Marvel Multiverse matters or it doesn't, or for the longest time you were all more than eager to suggest that Yggdrasil was actually a High 1-B / Low 1-A / 1-A / Whatever Cosmic Axis that binded the whole omniverse together as an argument for Thor being as strong as he was, but now that we have irrefutable evidence for that not being the case you are more than happy to drop the issue as if it never matter.

So which one is it? Please, be consistent in your arguments.

 

[Kepekley23]

It can be whichever one you want, because it doesn't matter, hasn't mattered for two threads (this one & the last), and doesn't need to matter. You can argue that Yggdrasil is only Tier 2 or whatever; that's perfectly fine by me. It doesn't really change anything I have argued in this thread.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

It can be whichever one you want, because it doesn't matter, hasn't mattered for two threads, and doesn't need to matter. You can argue that Yggdrasil is only Tier 2 or whatever; that's fine. It doesn't change anything we have argued in this thread or the last.

It actually does but okay. Yggdrasil only containing the 10 realms as it always has puts extreme doubts on the absurd hyperbolic interpretations of TWSAIS as being 1-A when they exclusively feed out of Yggdrasil's cycle.

 

[AshenCrow777]

Yggdrasil is only dying it isn't destroyed or even dead yet so I don't see what you are trying to say.

 

[Kepekley23]

It would cast doubt on it, were it not for the fact that the current argument has nothing to do wit it. As detailed here, and in my other rebuttal post further down the line. The main focus of the argument is the 1-A Ginnungagap and the TWSAIS scaling to it, with some secondary explanations about Al Ewing's 'stories' thrown in.

It'd be better off if we got back to that instead of going on about stuff from two threads ago as if it still affected the current discussion.

 

[AshenCrow777]

Also if it was officially dead Sif would have told on the spot and she wouldn't have been able to use the bifrost.

 

[AshenCrow777]

It'd be better off if we got back to that instead of going on about stuff from two threads ago as if it still affected the current discussion.

Also didn't Ant and Matthew said we couldn't use any future issues to support 1-A or whatever but they are literally trying to use something outside of Al's run to refute our claims.


Isn't that a bit of double standards? I thought the whole point was to ignore all recent issues and just focus the things that came out around and before Ragnarok.

 

[Alonik]

What Matthew said about Black Winter was just a bluff, yggdrasil hasn't even died yet, and even the dying universes aren't even the tenth realms, it has universes even that are reference to the justice league being erased from existence by black winter, then it already shows how wrong Matthew is in stating without any proof that Yggdrasil is limited only to 10 universes, but this is just a matter of verbal evasion for not answering @Kepekley23's text.


Just a cool thing if anyone pretends to take this bluff even further:

The Marvel Multiverse is still alive despite Yggdrasil dying. This proves that Alonik's interpretation of Yggdrasil is bull.

In the comic itself is said that the Black winter consume entire realities, and the story make our sure that the entire multiverse will be erased from existence.

Please provide actual evidence of that beyond your speculation.

The only person who has to provide evidence here is you, including the evidence that Black winter isn't destroying the multiverse when history shows something different of your interpretation.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

You speak irrelevancies, Alonik, my point was that Yggdrasil is dying and this doesn't affect the wider multiverse in the slightest, which utterly refutes your false claims that Yggdrasil encompasses the entire multiverse.

Don't poison the well and try to strawman my argument, as you're so accostumed to doing, thank you.

 

[Alonik]

No one is poison or strawman your argue, is just the sintax of your placement. And Every time when someone brings a rebuttal to your brief position, you just accuse that person of being poison or Strawman, please, could you argue like a responsible content moderator?

• "The Marvel Multiverse is still alive despite Yggdrasil dying."

Is pretty clear that you said yggdrasil was dying and the multiverse was not. And just think how vague is to said that yggdrasil not encompasses the entire multiverse just by that she's dying. You have some valid argument? Because that's nothing relevant and reliable.

"my point was that Yggdrasil is dying and this doesn't affect the wider multiverse in the slightest"

Plus, the question is being reversed. If parts of something starts to be broken, what needs to be affected is this something. The entire multiverse is dying, and just by Black Winter bring the destruction of countless universes is affecting yggrasil and slowly is killing her. So it's pretty clear what she encompasses.

Also, you had more than a month, when you will stop the verbal evasion, and answer kepekley's text without jokes or anything else not reliable?

 

[Antvasima]

Stop with the personal attacks please. He likely misremembered or misunderstood.

 

[Alonik]

Nobody made a personal attack, i'm just demanding his position.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

You personally attack me all the time, Alonik, and I take offense from it.

And you conflate length with quality of debate. Your arguments are neither concise nor are they comprehensive, they rely solely on fillibusters and whataboutisms to make people agree with you solely through the length of your posts when they contain nothing of substance. I don't need to write a post as big as yours of Kep's to disprove your claims since they are incredibly weak and easy to debunk when they're not being carried together with literal novellas' worth of paragraphs.

 

[Malomtek]

Stop with the personal attacks please. He likely misremembered or misunderstood.

Why are you acting like part of Matt's personal defense force? He misrepresented an event, then flatly contradicted himself in order to win an internet argument, with no admission of wrong. That's a clear display of lying, and it's not wrong to call it out as such.

 

[Alonik]

I am not attacking anyone, if you are offended, it is for your own personal reasons. Also, I didn't even attack you, and you accused me of whataboutisms when you're making one.

People are agreeing because it is comprehensive and have a huge material quality, if you are not able to express this positivity, i'm sorry. And if our statements are so weak and too easy to debunk, how come you haven't deconstructed any so far? I mean it would be intriguing if you stopped verbal evasion and answered the subject, instead of having these texts with personal things, stop the appeal to emotion.

Let's stop the drama, this is a thread and i'm just demanding your position as a member against the upgrade, if you have nothing to add on your part besides "I don't accept", it's irrelevant, since this will not be taken into consideration because it is neither reliable nor responsible.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

To be honest, both sides have been fairly hostile. And it would be good if that stopped completely.

 

[DarkGrath]

To be honest, both sides have been fairly hostile. And it would be good if that stopped completely.

Frankly, not just "fairly" hostile. Both sides have been extremely hostile, far more than any regular heated thread. I made a comment about this before; if you aren't in a position where you feel you can calmly debate about this, then don't debate about it.

 

[Antvasima]

Nobody made a personal attack, i'm just demanding his position.

I deleted the post with a personal attack. It wasn't from you.

 

[Antvasima]

To be honest, both sides have been fairly hostile. And it would be good if that stopped completely.

Agreed.

 

[AshenCrow777]

Let's get this thread over with already, its been around for wayyyy too long

 

[Antvasima]

I am also tired of this. Can somebody summarise the remaining justification for Low 1-A RKT, with Yggdrasil proven to be of a far more limited scale, in an easy to understand manner?

 

[AshenCrow777]

I am also tired of this. Can somebody summarise the remaining justification for Low 1-A RKT, with Yggdrasil proven to be of a far more limited scale, in an easy to understand manner?

I rather cut to the chase and say most people had agree to a 2-A|possiby 1-C|1-C RKT. Even Matt entertained the thought and was more willing to go with that.

Aside from this I know some people still supports 1-A just like some still oppose it, so at this point it's better to get all staff in and directly ask them what would be better.

I just feel like giving this CRT any chance to continue will make us go on and on in circles.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes. We will likely never agree, so a compromise solution may be best.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I take offense to the idea of giving a compromise just to appease people who will never shut up.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

I do agree we need to get this revision over with, but I'm still really not seeing Low 1-A for Rune King Thor. This statement does appear to be legit 2-A or Low 1-C, but Low 1-A feels too stretchy.

 

[Alonik]

I mean, we was arguing Thor 1-A scalling from TWSAS, not low 1-A from a 2-A statement Yggdrasil, if you see the original OP, this is scan is lined in a 2-A justification. Since my original thread, no one has tried to scale 1-A through it.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that we should go by the power level that TWSAIS have actually demonstrated, which is just to feed on the life cycles of Yggdrasil.

It doesn't seem like a Low 1-A or 1-A Thor will ever be agreed to be accepted, so a compromise solution is the best that you can aim for.

 

[Malomtek]

I take offense to the idea of giving a compromise just to appease people who will never shut up.

This isn't "Matt's way or the highway" wiki. Stop acting like it is.