Marvel Comics: Low 1-A Revision (pt. I)

[TrueBK98]

After looking at a few scans I'm convinced that higher realm equals higher infinity. If you guys want to convince Ant, you will need to compile the scan better. Looking at all of them would be a big headache for a mere mortal.

 

[MadHATdancing]

@MadHATdancing
Please read all other comments.

1. You have ignored that divine plans exist infinitely superior to any mortal kingdom, and the mortal kingdom cannot stand higher existence.

2. This scan is saying that the multiverse has infinite higher dimensions (infinite levels of existences), the part that proves that they are transfinitudes is in the shaper scan, and several others that were posted up there.

3. Again that? Up there in driger's comment he made it clear that plans of existence are called of higher dimensions, eternity being the embodiement of the cosmos and LT the judgement of the fate of the universe changes nothing, you're just talking the obvious of what they are, this does not change anything, in the same way as when you said that a multiverse is made by universes as contradiction, and it is just the obvious.

4. This is redundant, this scan is not even being debated here, has hundreds of scans being debated, and the only one being, is the only one that was even used in the post.

read couple posts above, I already debunked the scans posted in OP, you guys just choose to ignore it because you have no argument. I'm not gonna pick out every single scans in the replies to debunk them one at a time. I have no time today, it's deadline day for submitting my master application

I'll compile an arguments with scans later on if this thread isn't closed by the time I come back in 2 days.

 

[Kepekley23]

All your arguments have been refuted in this thread, just look at the above posts.

 

[TrueBK98]

Was MadHAT banned before? His account was created today. I'm not implying anything. Just saying it's something to look at.

 

[MadHATdancing]

All your arguments have been debunked in this thread.

no you didn't, you guys are not interested in a honest discussion, you just want to bully your way through to get your precious marvel to 1-A, either way I don't care because I don't work up to such personal level about fictional characters. But don't even pretend you have any evidence suggesting marvel main multiverse is a infinite smaller compare to the higher realities (which in "reality" is niche realms lol) you claimed. you guys can keep getting mad about someone stating facts about your misinterpreted scans

 

[Kepekley23]

Chill out.

 

[TrueBK98]

And please stop reposting big wall of text.

 

[Antvasima]

Marvel Realms work with "Transfinite levels of power " in existence, transfinite are an form of author work with different levels of infinite power, and exist an infinite number of levels. Superflow is the highest level of existence. Already shown that realms or being of higher realms are much higher than low realms , like divine realms. Lower Dimensions can't support existence higher dimensional being.

All in this interfere in power, because is part of this trasnfinite system, when you have any world with infinite number of dimensional space, you already 1-B, and when exist levels above they, you have Low 1-A

Look, I agree with you that there are higher degrees of infinity in the Marvel multiverse. That much is clearly established, and I think that the multiversal abstract entities are at least somewhere within the 1-C tier. I am just looking for evidence that they embody an infinite hierarchy of higher infinities. That is all.

 

[Antvasima]

@MadHAT

Please calm down. You are making this situation worse if you throw around accusations.

 

[Kepekley23]

As I mentioned, Marvel Comics's composite dream cosmology includes Brane Cosmology, which qualifies as higher infinities in our system.

>Evidence that they embody an infinite hierarchy of higher infinities

The Eighth Omniverse's Eternity is, quite, literally, the concept of existence itself. Literally anything in Marvel that is physical - and non-physical, but still existing, is part of it. We've already proven that there exists an infinite-layered hierarchy in Marvel Comics, so it is undeniable that it scales to him.

There is no reason to be this strict. It's such a straightforward upgrade, really.

 

[Antvasima]

I thought that branes was simply a term for universal spacetime continuums. Please elaborate, and are you certain that this is not what was intended with the reference?

Agreed about Eternity, bur I only remember seeing scans describing infinite dimensions, not an infinite number of infinities as defined by our new tiering system. Please elaborate here as well.

 

[Kepekley23]

Brane Cosmology posits that our space-time continuum is contained within a Higher-Dimensional Brane of vast dimensional scale, which in itself is contained within another construct, and so on.

According to most people I've consulted, it'd fit in with the new Tiering System.

In one instance, a quantum cosmologist analyzing the structure of the Multiverse stated that Brane, Einstenian, and etc. cosmologies fell short of describing the true scale of the Multiverse (in part because it simultaneously encompasses all of those cosmologies and transcends them at the same time)

 

[TrueBK98]

In a few scans that was shown above, the Gods have shown their superior power over lower realms as entities from a higher plane. According to our Higher Dimensional page, that is enough to qualify those higher dimensions as higher infinities.

 

[Antvasima]

@Kepekley23

Okay. Thank you for the explanation. Can you link to the scan(s) in which Brane cosmology was mentioned? Also, does it continue forever to Hilbert Space degrees?

@TrueBK98

A higher plane is not remotely automatically higher-dimensional space.

 

[Driger-God]

@Ant What you want? "Higher Infinite" already posted, in scan about planes of existence like "transfinite levels of existence", existence of infinie levels of existence in an multiverse too. Transfinite is an term used work com different scale of infinite, like an "higher infinite" Higher Plane and higher dimensional space can be the same. In any case, Gods were shown to be higher dimensional being infinite higher than lower being or realms.

 

[Antvasima]

You structure your text in a too messy manner for me to understand properly. Anyway, currently I need scans for the things I mentioned in my last post.

 

[Driger-God]

About gods: Gods are part of world that exist above and beyond our own level of be . Divine(Or Immortal) planes are bigger and mortal realm can't support existence of beings of this realms, gods exist separate of reality by barriers , and when their enter in the lower planes their power starts to diminish . Their divine exist in scale of infinite , even their minds are projected to work with infinite and beyond. Even Thor trade of body when cross theses dimensions.

 

[Antvasima]

@Driger

Okay. I have read the scans in your last post, but do not agree with your interpretations. All that I see is that classic Odin has infinite power, which we already know, and that the gods come from a larger plane of reality, which also makes sense, but not anything more than that.

 

[Kepekley23]

At this point, you should make a Content Revision thread yourself. If we were to even consider your suggestion, we'd need to contemplate downgrading the Multiversal Abstracts, since they're High 1-B precisely because of the assumption that higher dimensions = higher infinities.

But anyway;

• 1.

• 2

Just a few examples.

 

[Driger-God]

@Driger
Okay. I have read the scans in your last post, but do not agree with your interpretations. All that I see is that classic Odin has infinite power, which we already know, and that the gods come from a larger plane of reality, which also makes sense, but not anything more than that.

Not "classic Odin", but all gods exist in this scale of infinite higher, remeber that Seth would destroy the multiverse with power of Egyptian Gods?

Every scan that I posted was about all gods.

Gods Divinity - Gods Mind - Body of Gods

In current system, gods random could be low 2-C in divine realms(Greater than mortal realms, and exist beyond mortal measure of space and time, and infinite higher by his divinity), and Skyfather at least 1-C|1-B(Scaling to all planes of existence).

Like New Gods that exist in an world higher than normal universe|multiverse. But this scale is valid only in divine realms or abstract form(True Form). In mortal plane or interacting with mortal being, or using avatars they would be weaker.

 

[Antvasima]

At this point, you should make a Content Revision thread yourself. If we were to even consider your suggestion, we'd need to contemplate downgrading the Multiversal Abstracts, since they're High 1-B precisely because of the assumption that higher dimensions = higher infinities.

But anyway;

Unfortunately, I don't have the time to organise any complicated content revision threads on my own. I barely get enough rest as it is.

I just don't think that there seems to be sufficient explicit non-speculative proof of higher dimensions being equivalent to higher infinities according to our new tiering system, but it is possible that your scans above involve physics that I am not familiar with that do in fact prove this for all that I know. I would much prefer if you ask DontTalkDT and Ultima Reality to come here and confirm this though.

 

[ParadoxIndifferent]

He already has.

 

[Antvasima]

@Driger

We would need much more explicit and consistent proof to consider all deities of a Low 2-C scale, much less a 1-B scale for Odin and the like. It would be far too inconsistent with their general portrayals. Sorry.

 

[Kepekley23]

Marvel Comics has recently reaffirmed its "dream" cosmology where the power of every God, arguably even the One Above All's, is shaped by imagination/stories. For example, once Nyx entered the House of Ideas and gained 1-A power, it was clarified that she had not received any amp, but rather merely restored her power to what it once was when the Greek Gods were at their peak - prior to their fall from prominence.

This is pretty insane, all things considered.

 

[Driger-God]

@Driger
We would need much more explicit and consistent proof to consider all deities of a Low 2-C scale, much less a 1-B scale for Odin and the like. It would be far too inconsistent with their gsneral portrayals. Sorry.

But there's much more about deities being Low 2-C, or simply Higher Dimensional, and sincerely, I posted at least 20 scans about this. Much of the scaling is only about the abstract state of the gods, or their interaction within the Divine Realms.

There's a lot of characters that have a lot less than this, and have a higher tier.

When you say that this is inconsistent, because this is wrong since many of these characters are represented like they are much less than this. Thor and Loki can affect Surtur, Ymir, and other divines beings in these levels, proving that the scale between the divine entities is coherent in their divine scales.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

@Kep … That actually ... makes a lot of sense. It takes into account a lot of the things in the newer comics that seemed highly inconsistent, such as Odin being the Writer of Stories or something akin to that when he showed his true nature .

I don't know where to begin with the implications, but they are pretty huge, as you stated.

 

[Ultima_Reality]

@Ant

You are having the wrong idea of the Tiering System. A verse doesn't need to explicitly spell out that higher dimensions are equal to higher infinities; a character just has to showcase the ability to affect entire Universes or Multiverses which are themselves higher-dimensional in nature, in which case they would indeed allow one to jump to higher tiers.

The exception to this are characters who are simply randomly stated to be higher-dimensional with no further context because rating them at any higher tier would be the equivalent of rating any 3-dimensional entity at 3-A or High 3-A even though it doesn't showcase the ability to affect 3-dimensional space as a whole.

 

[Antvasima]

Marvel Comics has recently reaffirmed its "dream" cosmology where the power of every God, arguably even the One Above All's, is shaped by imagination/stories. For example, once Nyx entered the House of Ideas and gained 1-A power, it was clarified that she had not received any amp, but rather merely restored her power to what it once was when the Greek Gods were at their peak - prior to their fall from prominence.

This is pretty insane, all things considered.

Well, we would need further explicit evidence before we can rate them as such in any case, given how massive changes this would bring. Also, I interpreted Nyx as being empowered by the OAA at the time.

 

[Antvasima]

@Ultima

Hmm. I thought that much of the entire point of the new system was to separate verses that do not treat higher dimensions as higher infinities from the ones that do, in order to turn the wiki more reliable.

 

[Kepekley23]

Well, we would need further explicit evidence before we can rate them as such in any case, given how massive changes this would bring. Also, I interpreted Nyx as being empowered by the OAA at the time.

She wasn't, though.

 

[Antvasima]

Wasn't that the entire point? That she wanted access to the OAA's power/The House of Ideas in order to rewrite the multiverse?

 

[Ultima_Reality]

@Ultima

Hmm. I thought that much of the entire point of the new system was to separate verses that do not treat higher dimensions as higher infinities from the ones that do, in order to turn the wiki more reliable.

I believe I had already clarified that higher dimensions could indeed lead to higher tiers when they are referred to in relation to a sufficiently large scale, multiple times at that; It's even on the Tiering System page. Although I suppose I wasn't clear enough for you

 

[Antvasima]

Well, that is very unfortunate. Then our system has not become as reliable as I would have preferred.

 

[Zensum]

At this point, you should make a Content Revision thread yourself. If we were to even consider your suggestion, we'd need to contemplate downgrading the Multiversal Abstracts, since they're High 1-B precisely because of the assumption that higher dimensions = higher infinities.
But anyway;

• 1.

• 2

Just a few examples.

"High 1-B precisely because of the assumption that higher dimensions = higher infinities."

This isn't always true though. Regarding Branes, Branes and Brane cosmology are two different things, mentioning one doesn't mean the other is true. Brane cosmology uses branes obviously but branes are also used in other cosmologies.

"Brane Cosmology posits that our space-time continuum is contained within a Higher-Dimensional Brane of vast dimensional scale, which in itself is contained within another construct, and so on."

This isn't really true either. Scientists aren't saying "Yeah the universe is apart of an infinite multiverse which is transcendentally and conceptually infinitely outstripped by an outerverse which itself is...etc". String theory has no evidence for it, meaning there's a myriad of different interpretations of how that'd work. Brane cosmology being one of them. Within brane cosmology itself, there's many different interpretations of how that'd work. The basic premise of brane cosmology is gravity is weak because most of it leaks into another extra dimension that is of vague size. It's "big", big enough for gravity to leak into it. How big though? No one knows. Some people say it's infinite some people say it's finite. String theory and theories that come from it are just "this might be true, the math checks out within an extremely wide range of numbers". A brane is basically to make math easier. Like we got point particles right which are like the equivalent of "assume a frictionless world" for particles where we just model them like they have 0 dimensions. Branes are that but for dimensions higher than 0. So a string is a "brane" because it's an idealized 1D object.

Anyways, the first scan here just confirms branes exist but that doesn't mean anything. Branes existing doesn't mean anything because branes exist in like every theory that spawns from string theory, and string theory doesn't necessitate ""big"" dimensions. In fact, the original theory says the reason we don't see any higher dimensions is because they're small.

The second scan dialogue is basically a word salad that doesn't really mean anything Especially the Einstein-Rosen, Mortis-Throne bit which is referring to bridging theory so literally just 'from a wormhole perspective'. "From a wormhole, wormhole string theory standpoint" is just technobabble. Plus "An Einstein-Rosen standpoint" isn't a thing. It's like saying "from a double a battery standpoint". It mentions brane cosmological which has higher dimensions but like brane cosmology itself is such a wide field that there's no real claims you can make from that, other than that higher dimensions exist and they're probably a size bigger than an atom.

 

[Kepekley23]

Wasn't that the entire point? That she wanted access to the OAA's power/The House of Ideas in order to rewrite the multiverse?

The House of Ideas embodies the dark and good/villain and heroic sides of any story. Once Nyx entered it, she managed to regain the power she once had at the Golden Age of the Greek Gods, since she represents the "dark" side of the "light" embodied by Zeus and the other Gods. This is reinforced by multiple scans. She was never amped by the One Above All himself, no.

 

[Antvasima]

@Zensum

Thank you for helping out.

 

[Antvasima]

@Kepekley23

Well, I prefer to have such things explicitly spelled out rather than relying on interpretation, given how drastic the consequences would be for our tiering.

 

[Kepekley23]

As I told Ant, our Marvel Abstract Profiles are High 1-B precisely because we're already assuming that to be the case, so if you want to make a downgrade attempt, make another thread so we can counter/bring the counter-arguments to table. I am not interested in derailing this one with this discussion any longer.

Concerning the first scan, the Chaos Wave was being explicitly treated as a threat to the entirety of the multiverse and its layers in that specific storyline. Roma even stated that it would destroy the concepts of Order and Chaos down to the omniversal scale, and that all of Creation would merge into an amorphous, conceptual blob of confusion. The Branes breaking down is part of that.

Additionally, you're incorrectly mixing Bosonic superstring theory with Branes. They are different models of the same theory. Brane Cosmology is considerably more impressive in comparison to most other models.

As for the second scan, it was explicitly talking about the nature of the "true form" of the Yggdrasil. I can dig up the context later, but the statement was pretty much a manner of saying that the Multiverse can not be pinned down by any specific cosmology.

 

[Kepekley23]

@Kepekley23

Well, I prefer to have such things explicitly spelled out rather than relying on interpretation, given how drastic the consequences would be for our tiering.

It is explicitly spelled out.

DC Comics has the exact same cosmology with Sandman, except Marvel's is undeniably far more defined. I am planning to make a Respect Thread with all the relevant scans once this upgrade concludes, as well.

 

[Kepekley23]

Lastly, this Brane discussion is honestly irrelevant.