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Low-1C doom slayer isn't joke!

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How is it the Flowery language when it is the narrator's own words about the events that happened between the Main Story and the DLC? And doom quite hates to use flowery language, like engines of creation
"The engines of creation are not metaphors or poetic words, but structures that lay just on the other side of reality itself. Under the Luminarium they breach the void's walls to touch the physical world."
 
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@Rabbit2002 Doom has used a lot of flowery language before and is littered with it even in Ancient Gods DLC expansions not just in Doom Eternal. One could make the false claim that engines of creation would be Outerversal if we would take hell transcending Space, Time, Dimension, as in higher dimensions as literal then in that case all almost all characters from franchise would be Outerversal from start which is simply not true at all.

@KieranH10 if we are to be realistic I have to agree with you because you are our foremost expert. Sometimes I like to explain that we should not take everything literarily but research the statements and everything carefully and find evidence that proves this or that before we jump to conclusions but while most of us do research before saying this or that others like to jump to conclusions, if there is anyone who knows about Doom please give us more input as knowledge is greatly appreciated.
 
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I agree with Kieran and Marius, there is too much flowery language to be taken too seriously here. And Dimension often refers to simply alternate universes or universes being more advanced rather than a plane of higher infinity above every other universe put together.

Also, it's generally preferred to leave spaces between paragraphs so that it is easier to read. And also meant to use proper punctuation and such, and separate paragraphs through multiple sentences rather than usage of run on sentences.
 
Yeah while Davoth is the creator of the multiverse there is something beyond Davoth.

We have to discover more when the next game comes as Hugo Martin is making updates to the lore of Doom Eternal so we will discover even more and there is a possibillity that Doomguy may not be the protagonist of the next game but that's up to Hugo Martin and Marty Stratton to decide.
 
Sorry for the late reply, I'm too lazy (and a bit busy, mostly at school) but I'll try to settle these arguments.
Kieran does come up with great and sensible opinions, however I can feel that he (and everyone else) ignored me and misunderstood me. A dimension called "Higher dimension" and inaccessible for entities that can travel through space and time of countless (possibly infinite) universes is not really enough to be considered as Low-1C and I know that from the very beginning of the CRT, I'm sorry for forgetting to include the freaks of The Holt and a few other things in the conclusion. I will split the sections as follows and note Very Long!
1 / I mean even if we ignore Urdak stuff and take it as a metaphor or flower language for their advanced high-level technology for other universes like what Kieran said (Urdak is a machine universe literally, made from the body of The Father and the Maykr created by Davoth) the dimensions that the Sentinels traveled by using Argent Energy should be considered equivalent to the higher dimension of the tierning vs battle, the Sentinels that travel to it are described by words such as "Reach farther into", "Immersuable capacity", "Endless power"
and these dimensions were dimensions once thought to be beyond their grasp before the Argent energy was discovered, extremely heavily these dimensions were truly transcendent and larger than space and time (including countless universes) rather than simply separate universes from ordinary Spacetime like Hell. Before they even traveled to those dimensions, they easily found their way into Hell with "cleft in creation" without taking any "transcendence" elements to them (instead, words gnawed and scorned like "cursed land" or something like that) and even this wiki used that "separate" as the reason for Hell 2B (and Low-1C before). Urdak should also be scaled, not because it is inaccessible but the demon invading it is considered a threat to All of creation / All of existence by narrator, Khan Maykr and HUGO himself.
2 / Kieran practically did not deny crumbling Earth in The Holt (India can be easily seen on it) in any way in his opinion, this combined with Urdak's Higher dimension would favor since the lower dimension universes exist as finite and "insignificant" objects in the higher dimension, this is not a compressed universe as Hayden literally said that the Slayer cannot leave Urdak to return to the earth dimension without using Portal gates (similar Maykr), nor a random planet that looks like Earth or a parallel version of the earth due to reasons outlined in the CRT.
3 / It will not explain why this "The Higher dimension" is the Interdimensional Highway which allows access to all the universe of the lower dimension, of course it does not conflict with (2) because Hell can reach any dimension with the smallest relation (they reached earth dimension because of the last Argentic energy /Crucible that Hayden used) so it will reinforce the Urdak to be the higher dimension that connects and contains all dimensions / universes , planets like the crumbling earth would be the five or six-dimensional form of the four-dimensional universe (separate spacetime)
4 / Khan Maykr and the Maykr while outside Urdak (different from the declaration of invulnerability of Khan in Urdak by Hayden for her extreme durability) are declared indestructible by all accounts and confirmed by VEGA - 1 AI with the intelligence of an entity with super genius and near omniscient intelligence (The Father - who is the collective consciousness of the Maykr race, suervys infinite possibilities and timelines branching) because it was his consciousness while losing his memories when he was The Father. This was also supported by the claim that the maykr "seem unbound by Mortality" so the weapons of the Night sentinels had no effect on them. Considering creatures from the Higher dimension are invulnerability and immortal due to their nature when it comes to the lower dimension. Although other creatures from Urdak like the Maykr drone cannot leave Urdak, this is that they are not durable enough to resist the pressure "between" dimensions when crossing them rather
Also some scan about some intelligent of VEGA and others



5 / The term "Space and time" in the codex Night of sentinels in particular and Doom eternal is generally used in many different meanings depending on the context. Literally all the known and unknown dimensions (including the dimensions that the Sentinels reach when they use the Argent energy and Urdak itself) are limited to the concept of "space and time" using. all encompassing description as outlined in Codex Night sentinels Part II, since the Maykr only needs Argent energy to stop the Transfiguration instead of conquering and filling other dimensions and universes, Hell is something else because of it. is "unlimited by boundaries of space, time, dimension" and "transcending space and time" but this just says that Hell is not limited by the boundaries of space and time, not complete transcendence. , like the term "Animal" unlimited by "mammal" but not "animal" completely transcendent "mammal", almost similar to Hell, just contain space and time and "beyond" because it apparently there exists some form of space and time but rather strange because of Icon of sin's Black hole devour universe into hell and destroys their space-time and everything in them such as planets, stars,.. And itself a Dimension / universe (it is declared by nearly every source as a dimension literally), it was also possible because of this that it could devour universes without being limited by the boundary of its own space-time or any other universe, so Khan Maykr completely don't know its existence from the very beginning until demons actively infiltrated the Argent d'nur though she and the Maykr race ruled all known and unknown dimensions due to they can move through space and time according to all encompassing description. As for the usage of "across dimensions across Space and time" and "true balance over space and time, in this world and all others" to describe their empire during the King Novik period and the first time they discovered energy. Argent and using it to enhance their society to "Higher pleatu of existence" could imply a certain spacetime containing universes, quite similar to Blazkowicz's claim that universes are separate. Because of the vastness of space and time in Wolfenstein Youngblood although I only used this as a comparison because Doomguy is only a descendant of Blazkowickz from the old games, not the reboot Machinegame. All of this proves that the Higher dimensions of Doom are transcendent spacetime for the lower dimension spacetime, the hell is the dimension / spacetime that is not bound or limited by its own boundary, thus it absorbs the universes, breakdown their spacetime and assimilate its "transcending space and time" nature with them. This would be the most plausible interpretation to explain the nature of Hell when considering the broader context instead of just ascribing "flowery language" to everything. In addition, the word dimension is used to be synonymous with "spacetime", aka universe
 
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The whole thing with: endless power; unlimited by boundaries of space, time, dimension; transcending space and time; true balance over space and time, in this world and all others, etc....
Still flowery language to me
 
Planck69 said:
Can you properly format your replies with paragraphs? No one will take you seriously if they can't even read what you're proposing and honestly, I feel like you're trying to pass a revision through Argument ad Verbosity.
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i am so sorry for this i used my phone to enter these and it took 5 hours to complete, partly because my phone's keypad is so damn damn it that it adds the accents on its own sentences that I don't want and I'm too tired to check them out, I will fix them later, thank you for your comments
 
Vietthai96 said:
The whole thing with: endless power; unlimited by boundaries of space, time, dimension; transcending space and time; true balance over space and time, in this world and all others, etc....
Still flowery language to me
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Vietthai96 said:
The whole thing with: endless power; unlimited by boundaries of space, time, dimension; transcending space and time; true balance over space and time, in this world and all others, etc....
Still flowery language to me
Click to expand...
Actually, there are quite a many things to consider as a flowery language rather than this one. Can you tell me why they are flowery language ?
Of course full context is always better and you can check them out here
doom.fandom.com

Codex/Story of the Sentinels

Translation from the 'Ligra Sultagenta' (Book of Kings) What treachery comes from our darkest selves, driven by greed and want; for I have been deceived by the Deag. They came North with I, the priests, as allies to our cause against the Khan Maykr and her unscrupulous methods. Their silvery...
doom.fandom.com doom.fandom.com
 
Rabbit2002 said:
i am so sorry for this i used my phone to enter these and it took 5 hours to complete, partly because my phone's keypad is so damn damn it that it adds the accents on its own sentences that I don't want and I'm too tired to check them out, I will fix them later, thank you for your comments
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5 hours is a lot... well it's better if you summarize stuffs you wanted to point out.
 
uhmm this guy is famous for long and confusing writing in my place,even with his native language no one can truly understand his words at all
 
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1:
- The Sentinels should not be considered Higher Dimensional since they only have statements of their empire being across time and space, etc. They have no statements indicating that they can affect any higher spatial dimension.
The Dimensions being beyond their grasp before Argent simply means they were out of reach of their technology, that would likely be a range rating, not anything Higher Dimensional
  • Yes, the wiki used the Beyond Space, Time, and Dimensions statement for Hell to be Low 1-C at one point, but since then it was deemed wrong, so this point isn't worth much.
  • Urdak should not scale to 2-B unless it's proven on a similar scale to Hell, or has other evidence of being such.

2:
  • Yes, I did not deny that there is a planet in Urdak. That does not mean that it is another entire infinite Universe though? It's a planet and nothing more without evidence.
  • Once again, the Maykrs were so much more advanced than the rest of the multiverse that we know, it's trivial. So it would stand to reason that the Slayer couldn't return because his tech is Sentinel technology, not Maykr. Their tech would be capable of taking him much further than his own.

3:
- This is essentially the same point so I'll leave it brief, Urdak can reach other universes with their tech because they're a more advanced race than anyone else. Doomguy couldn't reach places Urdak could because his tech is from the Sentinels and Earth. Them being capable of travelling to other universes does not mean they're higher dimensional.

4:
  • VEGA did not unlock his knowledge until he was inserted into the Maykr console/panel.
  • As you said yourself, "the collective consiousness of the Maykr race", yes, the Maykrs are going to assume that their most powerful individual, one who controls all of them and has the ego of a god, is invulnerable.
  • Higher Dimensional beings are not invulnerable by any means, they simply exist on another spatial axis so cannot be affected by lower dimensional beings, think how we can move forward and back, side to side, and up and down, and higher dimensional being would be able to move in some unimaginable fourth direction.
Being Invulnerable and "Unbound by Mortality" do not equate to Higher Dimensional Existence, they equate to Invulnerability and Immortality. The former being questionable to begin with because the Slayer was able to harm her just fine.

5:
- The word Dimension in Doom equates to Universe or another realm. Hell is a Dimension, Universes are Dimensions, and Urdak is a dimension via statements from the Codex. Hell is also just a conglomeration of other universes that it has consumed, not spatial or temporal, just another realm. Urdak has little to no evidence of being superior dimensionally to a regular Universe.
 
GreatIskandar14045 said:
5 hours is a lot... well it's better if you summarize stuffs you wanted to point out.
Click to expand...
Summarizing the points that I make to prove Urdak is indeed the Higher dimension includes
1 / It is the interdimensional highway and the devils that invade it can access every universe of lower dimensions threatening all of existence / all of creation.
2 / It contains the very lower dimensions universes in the form of finite and visible planets
3 / Entities in Urdak when entering the lower dimension, they will be literally indestrucible, even if they are people who could easily kill them (while in Urdak) like Doom slayer, there is a claim that they are exempt. infected with weapons such as the swords and spears of the Night sentinels do "seem unbound by mortality"
4. The words "dimension", "spacetime" and "universe" are interchangeable. All known and unknown dimensions are completely bound and limited by their own "space and time" and "dimension" boundaries, whether higher or lower dimensions and thus Khan Maykr can dominate them due to travel. through space and time
5 / Hell is the dimension of continuously devouring the universe, breakdown their space-time in the process and assimilate them with it. The explanation for "unlimited by boundaries of space, time, dimension" and "transcending space and time" is not flowery language but about it is not limited by its own boundaries, so it can devour other realities. It also was completely out of Khan Maykr's influence and she didn't know what it was at first
6 / The dimensions accessed by Sentinels JUST by Argent energy / Essence of Hell are dimensions "beyond their grasp before" and reach farther into it is declared "Immersuable capacity", "endless power" to them previously. whose Empire prior to the discovery of the Argent energy was declared "Across universes across space and time" and they always developed technology to ensure more conquest across the universe, even at peace. And Urdak is completely inaccessible for them even at its peak. All of these dimensions are not "separate" from Space and time, but rather transcendence.
7 / Urdak is declared The higher dimension and 6th dimension, denying it is advanced technology that will not deal with the above
 
Rabbit2002 said:
Summarizing the points that I make to prove Urdak is indeed the Higher dimension includes
1 / It is the interdimensional highway and the devils that invade it can access every universe of lower dimensions threatening all of existence / all of creation.
2 / It contains the very lower dimensions universes in the form of finite and visible planets
3 / Entities in Urdak when entering the lower dimension, they will be literally indestrucible, even if they are people who could easily kill them (while in Urdak) like Doom slayer, there is a claim that they are exempt. infected with weapons such as the swords and spears of the Night sentinels do "seem unbound by mortality"
4. The words "dimension", "spacetime" and "universe" are interchangeable. All known and unknown dimensions are completely bound and limited by their own "space and time" and "dimension" boundaries, whether higher or lower dimensions and thus Khan Maykr can dominate them due to travel. through space and time
5 / Hell is the dimension of continuously devouring the universe, breakdown their space-time in the process and assimilate them with it. The explanation for "unlimited by boundaries of space, time, dimension" and "transcending space and time" is not flowery language but about it is not limited by its own boundaries, so it can devour other realities. It also was completely out of Khan Maykr's influence and she didn't know what it was at first
6 / The dimensions accessed by Sentinels JUST by Argent energy / Essence of Hell are dimensions "beyond their grasp before" and reach farther into it is declared "Immersuable capacity", "endless power" to them previously. whose Empire prior to the discovery of the Argent energy was declared "Across universes across space and time" and they always developed technology to ensure more conquest across the universe, even at peace. And Urdak is completely inaccessible for them even at its peak. All of these dimensions are not "separate" from Space and time, but rather transcendence.
7 / Urdak is declared The higher dimension and 6th dimension, denying it is advanced technology that will not deal with the above
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1. still mean not thing, can access every universe/dimension doesn't mean it higher dimensional
2. again still doesn't prove anything
3. Kill or can't not be killed are not equal to higher dimensional
4. flowery language
5. again flowery language. Hell absorb universes also doesn't equal to being higher dimensional. Khan Maykr can't influence it also doesn't equal to Hell being higher dimensional, this is just a result of your own interpretation
6. flowery language, being inaccessible also doesn't equal higher dimensional, an enclosed pocket dimension which can't be accessible = higher dimension -> no
7. higher dimension here could be interpreted in many way, make it meaning vague thus not reliable. 6th dimension could just mean 6th in count order number, not 6th as a mean of being 6d higher
 
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I am going to agree with KieranH10, Vietthai96, and Planck, because Doom is just full of Flowery Language from A to Z and nothing changes that no matter what.

Rabbit There is absolutely nothing to prove that Hell/Jekkad and Urdak are higher dimensional by any means, because if we are to take to take the flowery language literal. Then it would result in Doomguy alongside every demon he ever fought in doom 1 2 and 64 being at least Complex Multiversal because he comes from 7th dimension as said by a unused voice line. which would make him 1-c from the very start while all characters in Doom 2016 and eternal would be 1-A from scaling to each other just like I mentioned before which is completely and utterly fallacious argument from Get go.

so trying to make Doomguy Low 1-C now is just as ridiculous as making him 1-C for the first doom games and 1-A from 2016 onwards.
 
hard disagree with this upgrade, if that DOOM comic shows us something good then i would consider an upgrade, but these reasons are all statements and no evidence.
 
Yeah.

Fr though, the night sentinel Doom Slayer might be able to be upgraded to scale to titans depending on the feats he has. I mean, he fought The Dreadnaught and killed it, though he did have The Crucible at the time.
 
yeah we have to see the comic to explain what happened between the original doom games and 2016 to see whenever we will get upgrades or not.
 
KieranH10 said:
1:
- The Sentinels should not be considered Higher Dimensional since they only have statements of their empire being across time and space, etc. They have no statements indicating that they can affect any higher spatial dimension.
The Dimensions being beyond their grasp before Argent simply means they were out of reach of their technology, that would likely be a range rating, not anything Higher Dimensional
  • Yes, the wiki used the Beyond Space, Time, and Dimensions statement for Hell to be Low 1-C at one point, but since then it was deemed wrong, so this point isn't worth much.
  • Urdak should not scale to 2-B unless it's proven on a similar scale to Hell, or has other evidence of being such.

2:
  • Yes, I did not deny that there is a planet in Urdak. That does not mean that it is another entire infinite Universe though? It's a planet and nothing more without evidence.
  • Once again, the Maykrs were so much more advanced than the rest of the multiverse that we know, it's trivial. So it would stand to reason that the Slayer couldn't return because his tech is Sentinel technology, not Maykr. Their tech would be capable of taking him much further than his own.

3:
- This is essentially the same point so I'll leave it brief, Urdak can reach other universes with their tech because they're a more advanced race than anyone else. Doomguy couldn't reach places Urdak could because his tech is from the Sentinels and Earth. Them being capable of travelling to other universes does not mean they're higher dimensional.

4:
  • VEGA did not unlock his knowledge until he was inserted into the Maykr console/panel.
  • As you said yourself, "the collective consiousness of the Maykr race", yes, the Maykrs are going to assume that their most powerful individual, one who controls all of them and has the ego of a god, is invulnerable.
  • Higher Dimensional beings are not invulnerable by any means, they simply exist on another spatial axis so cannot be affected by lower dimensional beings, think how we can move forward and back, side to side, and up and down, and higher dimensional being would be able to move in some unimaginable fourth direction.
Being Invulnerable and "Unbound by Mortality" do not equate to Higher Dimensional Existence, they equate to Invulnerability and Immortality. The former being questionable to begin with because the Slayer was able to harm her just fine.

5:
- The word Dimension in Doom equates to Universe or another realm. Hell is a Dimension, Universes are Dimensions, and Urdak is a dimension via statements from the Codex. Hell is also just a conglomeration of other universes that it has consumed, not spatial or temporal, just another realm. Urdak has little to no evidence of being superior dimensionally to a regular Universe.
Click to expand...
1/
- So why don't the Maykrs help them to reach those dimensions? As you told yourself, the Maykrs can access all other universes with their tech (the exception is Hell), why they don't help the Sentinels while they are responsible for the entire conquests and scope of empires, technology and knowledge,... literally, they need the Sentinels to be able to give their words to other worlds to rule mortal races, unlike Urdak, where considered their own sanctuary, they don't care about fate of other universes. So why don't they give them access? Proving the nature of transcendence Higher dimension rather than just outside range of technology, and the Night sentinels entered places beyond space and time like Hell, even Immora (Father could not go. There is no Gate of divium with Wraith Shards, similar to Doom slayer) as we see in DLC 2 (they don't even need a Gate lol!) before they can reach farther into those dimensions
2 /
- I don't know you misunderstood me or tried to pretend. But in response to your "it's just a planet and nothing more" opinion, Hugo seems unhappy. He replied on the official discord it was a "shattered realm", as you tell yourself, realm / dimension / universe is synonymous. My main arguments for Urdak's Low-1C rating is Higher dimension (5D possibly 6D) and contains the Lower dimension"s universes as much smaller finite objects (planets) and cannot access to those accessible with all those universes like Night sentinels and beyond like Hell and Immora

(41th minute)

3 /
- Do you know what the whole content of DLC 1 is? That is, we must BANISHED the demons from Urdak in order to save all of existence and Reseal Urdak to the demons can't return Urdak anymore (as they cannot go to it before holy seal was broken by Doom slayer"s action) by restoring The Father's physical body through his Life sphere
About Father, his physical body is entirely Urdak, his control over it must go beyond Khan Maykr in tech. As we see in Eternal,
and it was accepted by wiki (hack ability), Khan Maykr was able to easily shut off all the power of Fortess of Doom, due to Maykr's technology, The Father could literally easily turn off the power or lock, ... the only thing that gives Maykrs access to all other universes and and Doom slayer to leave Urdak is the Portal Gates, making it impossible for demons to harm all other universes. But he didn't and instead forced them to banish them, it simply wouldn't make sense lol. Because the demons use the Urdak's Higher dimension rather than its tech, which disables the argument that it is "higher dimension" which is just flowery language for their advenc technology. to access the other dimensions (ridiculously they need a Portal gate to do so.) As for the Doom slayer, he also needs this (before replacing it with kill Dark Lord in physic form in order to all demons outside Hell being earsed.) Also, Singularity aka The Father's mind and soul (and his extensions Maykrs) are both power and govern Urdak




4 The Father is literally the supreme ruler, the only god and the ancestor of all the Maykrs, he is responsible for creating all Khan Maykrs and for preventing their Transfiguration. What are the Maykrs including Khan nothing but his extensions? And you know, all the Maykr were unable to against Khan's will biologically and physically, The Father literally instructed Samur to remove his Life sphere from Urdak, contrary to Khan's will and all the other Maykrs, in terms of the hierarchy, Khan completely under The Father, his being a collective consciousness proves that Khan is nothing more than the head in it.
 
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Delta333 said:
Bump
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Why are you bumping this? The CRT is a massive bust because there are no current feats backing these statements, if that DOOM comic gives us feats this CRT can continue, until then Low 1-C Doom Slayer is indeed a joke.
 
DaReaperMan said:
Why are you bumping this? The CRT is a massive bust because there are no current feats backing these statements, if that DOOM comic gives us feats this CRT can continue, until then Low 1-C Doom Slayer is indeed a joke.
Click to expand...
Because rabbit still continues it?he already explained that's those statements are not flowery language and higher dimension here trivializes universes in lower dimension as finite objects,also being inaccessible by any form
 
Rabbit2002 said:
1/
- So why don't the Maykrs help them to reach those dimensions? As you told yourself, the Maykrs can access all other universes with their tech (the exception is Hell), why they don't help the Sentinels while they are responsible for the entire conquests and scope of empires, technology and knowledge,... literally, they need the Sentinels to be able to give their words to other worlds to rule mortal races, unlike Urdak, where considered their own sanctuary, they don't care about fate of other universes. So why don't they give them access? Proving the nature of transcendence Higher dimension rather than just outside range of technology, and the Night sentinels entered places beyond space and time like Hell, even Immora (Father could not go. There is no Gate of divium with Wraith Shards, similar to Doom slayer) as we see in DLC 2 (they don't even need a Gate lol!) before they can reach farther into those dimensions
2 /
- I don't know you misunderstood me or tried to pretend. But in response to your "it's just a planet and nothing more" opinion, Hugo seems unhappy. He replied on the official discord it was a "shattered realm", as you tell yourself, realm / dimension / universe is synonymous. My main arguments for Urdak's Low-1C rating is Higher dimension (5D possibly 6D) and contains the Lower dimension"s universes as much smaller finite objects (planets) and cannot access to those accessible with all those universes like Night sentinels and beyond like Hell and Immora

(41th minute)

3 /
- Do you know what the whole content of DLC 1 is? That is, we must BANISHED the demons from Urdak in order to save all of existence and Reseal Urdak to the demons can't return Urdak anymore (as they cannot go to it before holy seal was broken by Doom slayer"s action) by restoring The Father's physical body through his Life sphere
About Father, his physical body is entirely Urdak, his control over it must go beyond Khan Maykr in tech. As we see in Eternal,
and it was accepted by wiki (hack ability), Khan Maykr was able to easily shut off all the power of Fortess of Doom, due to Maykr's technology, The Father could literally easily turn off the power or lock it, ... the only thing that gives Maykrs and Doom slayer access to all other universes is the Portal Gates, making it impossible for demons to harm all other universes. But he didn't and instead forced them to banish them, it simply wouldn't make sense lol. Because the demons use the Urdak's Higher dimension rather than its tech, which disables the argument that it is "higher dimension" which is just flowery language for their advenc technology. to access the other dimensions (ridiculously they need a Portal gate to do so.) As for the Doom slayer, he also needs this (before replacing it with kill Dark Lord in physic form in order to all demons outside Hell being earsed.) Also, Singularity aka The Father's mind and soul (and his extensions Maykrs) are both power and govern Urdak




4 / WTF? Father is literally the supreme ruler, the only god and the ancestor of all the Maykrs, he is responsible for creating all Khan Maykrs and for preventing their Transfiguration. What are the Maykrs including Khan nothing but his extensions? And you know, all the Maykr were unable to against Khan's will biologically and physically, The Father literally instructed Samur to remove his Life sphere from Urdak, contrary to Khan's will and all the other Maykrs, in terms of the hierarchy, Khan completely under The Father, his being a collective consciousness proves that Khan is nothing more than the head in it.
Click to expand...


DaReaperMan said:
Why are you bumping this? The CRT is a massive bust because there are no current feats backing these statements, if that DOOM comic gives us feats this CRT can continue, until then Low 1-C Doom Slayer is indeed a joke.
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Are you kidding me? Everything I give, from the Story development book itself, the voice lines and the content of the DLC and even Hugo himself, I have completely extracted what it says most bluntly and clearly, you certainly don't even bother reading it just skimming it and treating it like a joke? Kieran didn't even answer why Urdak's Planet wasn't a complete universe and disproved any scans I gave that, all confirmed by Hugo, I even included Story development written by Emerson Tung, he also confirmed that everything in it has been posted to official Lore and it is quite certain that no one Doom specialist here knows of its existence.
 
Marius_the_grey said:
I am going to agree with KieranH10, Vietthai96, and Planck, because Doom is just full of Flowery Language from A to Z and nothing changes that no matter what.

Rabbit There is absolutely nothing to prove that Hell/Jekkad and Urdak are higher dimensional by any means, because if we are to take to take the flowery language literal. Then it would result in Doomguy alongside every demon he ever fought in doom 1 2 and 64 being at least Complex Multiversal because he comes from 7th dimension as said by a unused voice line. which would make him 1-c from the very start while all characters in Doom 2016 and eternal would be 1-A from scaling to each other just like I mentioned before which is completely and utterly fallacious argument from Get go.

so trying to make Doomguy Low 1-C now is just as ridiculous as making him 1-C for the first doom games and 1-A from 2016 onwards.
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I'm sure you don't even know how the wiki's tierning works and even the most basic of readability. "Ulimited by boundaries of space, time, dimension" is not at all 1A, it is like saying animals are not limited to tigers ie all animals are big and transcendent, stronger than tigers. Even if it's 1A, doesn't mean anyone inside or originating it is 1A, regardless of whether it's the old or new tier system, look 40K's Magnus guy and he's only 2C
 
We will see what Antvasima thinks about this CRT, at the end of the day he has dealt with tier 1 quite a lot, so do please hold your accusations, it is unprofessional and immature. Being nice and actually open on the other hand can get things with discussion rules AGAINST them to go through.

at this point you may as well take that random ass 7-D statement and make the entire cast 1-C from my point of view.
 
Fair warning: if Ant says this ain't Low 1-C then pretty much everyone else is going to say it ain't either, because A LOT of people, myself included trust his judgment.
 
I tried to be as kind as I could, but it seems that most of the people here except Kieran and Delta don't really respect CRT and see it as nothing more than a joke now. That's what I have to say, my lack of professionalism could be my shortcoming, I wouldn't mind or be angry if this was denied as long as there was good reason and good argument. If possible, I can ignore my rudeness and be willing to cooperate and apologize for my behavior.
 
Even without Ant judgement, i can't see anything that logically make Doom Low 1-C, aside from trying to picking word like lower dimension and higher dimension and then exaggerated the thing up
 
Antvasima has stated multiple times he isn't particularly the best person to ask when it comes to debating tiers, more so he manages, indexes and views threads when he has time. And he's often multitasking and stuff like that, so it can feel overworked at often times. People like Ultima Reality and DontTalkDT are experts on tier 1 stuff, but they're often busy and overworked too.

But yeah, I'm not really buying anything Tier 1 here tbh. Keiran basically covered most if not all the details
 
Don't sweat it! A lot of us get heated and unprofessional at times, frankly I've done so three times. So don't worry about it too much, just take breaks when you need to and keep yourself reasonable, which you seem to understand, keeping my admittedly short temper in check is my biggest difficulty in debating.
 
Vietthai96 said:
Even without Ant judgement, i can't see anything that logically make Doom Low 1-C, aside from trying to picking word like lower dimension and higher dimension and then exaggerated the thing up
Click to expand...
So for you what will cause the low-1C rating ?? Things like yggdrasil (GOw) and archie sonic, ... are literally more vague
So why are they Low-1C?
 
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