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Keiji Mogami vs Kakine Teitoku

SpookyShadow

SpookyShadow

10,462
1,520
Incon or not... Why not? Seems like a sick fight and better than my previous incon (Accel vs Mogami)

Here we go:

  • Post Revival Kakine and Spirit Mogami (no evil spirits for him, only himself)
  • Speed is equalized
  • Both have some prior knowledge on their abilities, but mainly offensive ones
  • Both can't kill each other, so win by any other means, especially incapacitation
  • Fight takes place in Novigrad, both 30 meters apart
  • In character
Who wins?

Keiji Mogami:

Kakine Teitoku:

Inconclusive: 3
 
Incon. He can't put down Kakine. And if he posesses a clone, he gets ganged up on by the rest of the network immediately and bullied or Kakine just dissolves the clones body. If being mentally assaulted is enough for Mogami to get incapped then I'd vote DM Kakine, especially if dissolving the body Mogami is posessing hurts him, because Mogami certaintly isn't putting this guy down or incaping a guy whose body doesn't really need stamina anymore.
 
Epiccheev said:
Mogami is >>> Base Mob who resists Mind manip/Emphatic manip up to at least City Level.
Click to expand...
I don't understand this. Those are two completely different things.

also why can't Kakine kill him? I looked at the profile and nothing stood out.
 
He can't negate Regenerationn, plus would being able to stop Regenerationn really help kakine since Mogami still has types 6 and 7 immortality to?
 
doesn't need it. Kakine's dark matter simply operates at a much smaller scale and can therefore bypass the regen by damaging it at a level beyond it's limits. Quantum level matter manip >>>>Molecular


@scrlk i'm assuming they can at the very least interact with eachother here. Theres no intangibility as far as I can see.
 
Hey what's stopping Mogami from using mind-hax anyway? Kakine doesn't resist as far as his profile goes. Nor does he have Non Physical Interaction on his page.
 
I was mostly referring to Mogami being Non-Corporeal. You're right about the former though, my bad.
 
SpookyShadow said:
Then do a CRT with Kakine's profile saying "Immunity to Mind Manipulation"
Click to expand...
I mean, I mostly just agreed with their former point since I'm not an expert on Kakine.
 
Kakine isn't immune to mind control but he could overcome it via the DM network as it will filter anything that shouldn't be there.
 
@Spooky No. Some people have demonstrated to be able to control conciousnesses within inanimate objects. that's not conventional mind control but still.

Also it's really just common sense. Honestly I have dwindling levels of patience/appreciation for this site partly due to stonewalling that can occur because 1 or 2 people don't respond to a thread. I would hate to think how long such a simple addition could take. Like literally, just add "Immunity to conventional mind control" to his profile right now. Hes literally a inanimate object.

@Planck69 my god. that was on the other tab and I was looking for noncorporeal also. If I had known this I wouldn't of even bothered to respond to this thread since it's another pointless match. Probably the worst one yet because one person cannot, if I understand this correctly, even interact with the other. Just, dumb.
 
Scrlk666777 said:
Kakine isn't immune to mind control but he could overcome it via the DM network as it will filter anything that shouldn't be there.
Click to expand...
How effective has this been shown to be against mind control? Mogami's is at least city-wide via being able to get past Mob's defenses and generally being more powerful than God Dimple (Who has city-wide mind-hax).

Edit: nvm this match doesn't look like it will go anywhere.
 
I'm not talking even about that. You don't understand the point. Wouldn't it be better to add that for later matches? For example, Mercer's immunity for soul manipulation was added, because he DOESN'T have soul. Same with TF2 characters. It would be useful to add it for people to know. You don't need to be upset because of that, jeez.
 
I am kinda skeptical about immunity to mind-hax now that I think about it. Kakine still being sentient aside, I'm pretty sure there multiple characters on the wiki that aren't conventional animate objects nor are they immune to mind control.

Perhaps you can clarify on Kakine's nature.
 
Planck69 said:
I am kinda skeptical about immunity to mind-hax now that I think about it. Kakine still being sentient aside, I'm pretty sure there multiple characters on the wiki that aren't conventional animate objects nor are they immune to mind control.
Perhaps you can clarify on Kakine's nature.
Click to expand...
I think we had a discussion like this a long time ago, but TLDR you would have to have feats of mind haxing inanimate objects for it to work on Post Revival Kakine.

But to clarify, Kakine's "sentience" comes from each subatomic particle containing Kakine's "information" or imprint. It's compared to a planarian, where their memories are somehow stored in cells rather than a brain or mind. An easier example is a tree that has the "information" on a cellular level to know how to regrow a lost branch. With Dark Matter, Kakine's data is stored in each elementary particle and these pieces together create a sort of network. This is why everything created by Kakine still carries his presence, as seen when Dark Matter started to overwrite Kihara's Byouri's mind after she incorporated it into her body, the more she activated it's power. It also carries a layer of abstraction like a Möbius Strip with the mathematical property of being un-orientable, the fused the idea of (DM producing Kakine's personal reality/Kakine's personal reality producing DM). It's similar to how his residual thought ability works by running Dark Matter over objects and reading their microscopic information like a CD. The Dark Matter network is not powered by brainwaves like the Misaka Network since a brain doesn't exist, but Kakine's personality is spliced throughout it with the "outermost personality" setting the goal of the network. Which is why blocks that go rogue are promptly expunged. All the ejection point block's or constructs are just objects that produce AIM and personal reality and function at the level of a cyborg. Each carrying an implementation of the Dark Matter ability as they are designated "Kakine". Since each block is its own closed system affecting one cant effect the whole. Information is exchanged between the different blocks in the Dark Matter system via internal lines which produce an unknown pulse signal that functions like bioelecticity, but there is no actual direct connection. Dark Matter is produced from the "brain" and the "brain" is also Dark Matter.
 
I'm due for a re-read of NT6 then, thanks for clarifing. Kakine should be able to produce an incap then so long as they're both interactable with eachother. But if not, then...what's the point of the fight?
 
Well seeing as how neither can affect each other, I'm gonna go for inconclusive if possible.
 
I don't even think Incon is needed at that point if they can't interact. It's just a dead match. With Accelerator his vector change could at least interact with him but Kakine is different.
 
I will go Incon as well although a Accelerate420 has said, this is more of a dead match than an inconclusive.

I just don't see how either could harm the other.

NT Kakine kind of has the same problems as Accelerator does as his battles tend to tend up either stomps or most times inconclusive, Actually I'm tempted to do a PW Accel vs. NT Kakine just to see what happens.
 
Scrlk666777 said:
I will go Incon as well although a Accelerate420 has said, this is more of a dead match than an inconclusive.
I just don't see how either could harm the other.

NT Kakine kind of has the same problems as Accelerator does as his battles tend to tend up either stomps or most times inconclusive, Actually I'm tempted to do a PW Accel vs. NT Kakine just to see what happens.
Click to expand...
That would either go a stomp or incon. Assuming the soul resides in the body, Accel would need to know where kakine's freezer is and pop off in there. Which, with Accel to AC...well...but then again I'm not too sure if that would change anything unless he removed all clones at that point after the fact. We'd need to ask ourselves: Does Kakine's organs still contain his soul? Since the DM bodies are just inanimate information.
 
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