Kama's stats and skills/Big Fate 3-A to Low 2-C Revision

[RegisNex1232]

Kingprotea is gimped by the fact that RL doesn't let her reach that. So at best you have Type Jupiter (????) who we know nothing about, while missing some possible incredibly obvious ones, if you are inclined to take their statements seriously.

 

[Heavens_Feel]

The entire point of near end of the event is that you and your team practically rob her of that right to reform it due to her arrogance. Yagyuu was cutting her and her domain, and the more he kept doing it, the outer space goes back into a room more and more. Reality start becoming back to normal until eventually it's just a normal room again. The plan by lady kasuga requires yagyuu and his sword as one of its biggest crutch to make kama/mara eject ooku and tokugawa from herself, causing her to lose her authorities and eventually to her downfall. Afterward kasuga use it herself to expel kama/mara and parvati shot her with her NP

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

You aren't paying that much attention. Not to mention that that argument will not be counterargument at all, since they'll be using Mcguffin to defeat her, meaning that the argument of "but Yagyuu cut her and it worked argument".

One of the primary reason she lost is because of the fact that the rule of "Humans can't fight against the universe" is flipped because of Katsuga. Hence it turned back to normal. Thus was able to fight back.

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

Kingprotea is gimped by the fact that RL doesn't let her reach that. So at best you have Type Jupiter (????) who we know nothing about, while missing some possible incredibly obvious ones, if you are inclined to take their statements seriously.

She needs to be intentionally nerfed to stop her last I checked, so it's still valid. We know about as much about type Jupiter as we do most of the other types other than Arc, but that is beside the point, since having not much info doesn't disqualify the feat/ability. I picked those two becaus they are the most overt

 

[Heavens_Feel]

Hell, Kama's universe is said to be infinite at one time. It's just that High 3-A is getting kicked out.

The wording on the text said regarding the matter was that she utilized the ideation that universe is infinite, hence she apply it to make an endless iterations of herself, with each individual iterations repurposed to satisfy a particular fetish a human might have. and since there are an endless number of her, she can satisfy just about every type of fetishes there is. Not that the universe within herself is actually infinite in scale

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Okay, what the hell are you talking about, that's not the sentence I'm referring to.

 

[RegisNex1232]

She needs to be intentionally nerfed to stop her last I checked, so it's still valid. We know about as much about type Jupiter as we do most of the other types other than Arc, but that is beside the point, since having not much info doesn't disqualify the feat/ability. I picked those two becaus they are the most overt

Kingprotea at best has a potentially by size rating, Types have not been elaborated upon beyond being top dogs of X place, meanwhile the actual Buddha and Amaterasu have potential 3-A statements if you pay attention.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Just focus on Mara's feat for now please? It's getting confusing. Plus your statement right contradicts what you said before.

 

[Heavens_Feel]

You aren't paying that much attention. Not to mention that that argument will not be counterargument at all, since they'll be using Mcguffin to defeat her, meaning that the argument of "but Yagyuu cut her and it worked argument".
One of the primary reason she lost is because of the fact that the rule of "Humans can't fight against the universe" is flipped because of Katsuga. Hence it turned back to normal. Thus was able to fight back.

The main crutch here is that i'm saying that's not even a universe. That was just the great interior that has, through kama/mara's authority, redefined into a realm much like that of a space. Hence why there was no oxygen and no foothold to stand on except when kama/mara provides it. That in itself contradict the realm as being a universe as there's an amount of ground suddenly appearing out of nowhere in the middle of outer space, which isn't what outer space/universe is nor how it works. The whole thing about the realm closely resembles a bounded field and/or reality marble where the one who expanded it have a degree of control over it. It's not so much about how "human can't fight the universe" and more of a "human can't live in a vacuum", which isn't even thematic as it is a common sense

You use her great interior then it's not really a universe as it was just a room painted over by her authority that happened to look like an outer space. You use the universe usage on other text, it was given a parenthesis that it was just referring to all of humanity

 

[Iapitus_The_Impaler]

@Regis

Ok? That doesn't disqualify the point. Type Jupiter can also overtly expand infinitely. I know that they do, but we were talking about feats not statements were we not?

 

[The_Prince_of_Counters]

Could I ask why we're assuming that they mean that Kama is the physical Universe rather it just being a metaphor? After all the Nasuverse is known for its hyperbolic statements. Shit if i took a shot every time they threw the word concept around I'd be dead.

 

[Heavens_Feel]

Okay, what the hell are you talking about, that's not the sentence I'm referring to.

Unless you were referring to some other text not her õ©çµÁ┤Õ┐£õ¢ô entry, there were little text that talk about the infinitude of a universe in the event or in her beast III/L profile that directly correlate with kama/mara. The latter is what i was talking about, while the former doesn't really have anything to do with universe itself as it was about her goal and her mean to achieve it

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

There's no Authority for Mara. Give me a scan that she said that. That doesn't contradict anything, she can warp reality. This scan says that humans can't live in the universe. And thus can't defeat Mara, who is the universe itself. This compliments 3-A. No it's not a paint, it's said to be an universe for 12 to 15 times.

She uses it when she tries to love humanity. She uses universe as universe for anything else, her nature as universe already tells that it's not all universe she is talking about. Not to mention others use that word as well and I'm pretty sure it's universe they are talking about.

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

I'm not 100% sure what the counterarguments are, but they seem to be in relation to universe not refering to the literal universe........once, as opposed to the several times it's in relation to the literal universe

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

I agree on the upgrade.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Okay, what the hell are you talking about, that's not the sentence I'm referring to.

Unless you were referring to some other text not her õ©çµÁ┤Õ┐£õ¢ô entry, there were little text that talk about the infinitude of a universe in the event or in her beast III/L profile that directly correlate with kama/mara. The latter is what i was talking about, while the former doesn't really have anything to do with universe itself as it was about her goal and her mean to achieve it

I'm pretty sure there's a line that says:

"This love is infinite. This universe is infinite."

I swear she said it at some point.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Could I ask why we're assuming that they mean that Kama is the physical Universe rather it just being a metaphor? After all the Nasuverse is known for its hyperbolic statements. Shit if i took a shot every time they threw the word concept around I'd be dead.

Does a word that is stated to be true for like 15 times look like metaphor to you?

 

[RegisNex1232]

I'm not 100% sure what the counterarguments are, but they seem to be in relation to universe not refering to the literal universe........once, as opposed to the several times it's in relation to the literal universe

The several all feed off that one line, and the actual feats don't support it as well as you think, given that there's no stars, or planetary bodies in Kama's "Universe", just infinite copies that can get beaten by the likes of Yagyuu.

 

[StrongClick]

I agree with HF and Regis. Looks like hyperbole

 

[Heavens_Feel]

The "tokugawa" she install upon herself at the beginning of the aberration of edo is that authority. Which is what lady kasuga expel from kama/mara at the end of the event. The very act of kama/mara installing the "tokugawa" upon herself was also the same thing that motivate matsudaira and tenkai to hatch their plan to defeat kama/mara

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

There are stars in Kama's universe, Gudao said that. Yagyuu didn't beat her every selves, it's just that they are too slow to cut the main one.

Found it. It's infinite.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

There are multiple scans of it being a universe. How is that a hyperbole?

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

The "tokugawa" she install upon herself at the beginning of the aberration of edo is that authority. Which is what lady kasuga expel from kama/mara at the end of the event. The very act of kama/mara installing the "tokugawa" upon herself was also the same thing that motivate matsudaira and tenkai to hatch their plan to defeat kama/mara

She has Authority-like ability, but it's not Authority. It is just "I own it so I can do whatever I want" ability but it's not. And also what does this discussion leads to.

 

[RegisNex1232]

The stars are all Kama copies, the final boss battle showcases that.

 

[RegisNex1232]

There are multiple scans of it being a universe. How is that a hyperbole?

When they all ignore the context and the exact details of what Kama's "Universe" is, it's pretty clearly hyperbole.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Can you show the stars being Kama's?

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

I give that one. I tried to look at it again and it was Kama selves. Though it's still the size of the universe unless you tell me that Hindu religion has different universe than the rest.

 

[Heavens_Feel]

Found it. It's infinite.

there is no limit to universe, there is no limit to love. Or alternatively universe is infinite, love is infinite. A general descriptor but of what? This scan closely resembles thing that i've said about the correlation between her õ©çµÁ┤Õ┐£õ¢ô and her mean of achieving the goal of the satiation of every human possible. Which in itself doesn't necessarily mean the universe within her to be infinite, more on that in some scans that follow right after it

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

There are multiple scans of it being a universe. How is that a hyperbole?

When they all ignore the context and the exact details of what Kama's "Universe" is, it's pretty clearly hyperbole.

What context? You mean it's humanity? I already said it's not how many times I'll say that. She only uses that if she uses her love. Nothing else.

 

[Heavens_Feel]

Can you show the stars being Kama's?

Õì│ÒüíÒÇüþìúÒüƒÒéïÒé½Òâ╝Òâ×´╝ÅÒâ×Òâ╝Òâ®Òü»Õ¢╝ÕÑ│Òü¿ÒüäÒüåÕ«çÕ«ÖÒü½ÒüèÒüäÒüªþäíÚÖÉÒü½Õ¡ÿÕ£¿ÒüÖÒéïÒÇé

This part on her profile as a beast is one. There might be another on the text in the event dialogue itself

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

Found it. It's infinite.

there is no limit to universe, there is no limit to love. Or alternatively universe is infinite, love is infinite. A general descriptor but of what? This scan closely resembles thing that i've said about the correlation between her õ©çµÁ┤Õ┐£õ¢ô and her mean of achieving the goal of the satiation of every human possible. Which in itself doesn't necessarily mean the universe within her to be infinite, more on that in some scans that follow right after it

No it's not. It's absolutely not that skill, you're looking like an idiot right now. They use different words even.

 

[RegisNex1232]

https://youtu.be/0Dtkj2sDOMc

At 12:00 onwards, all the stars are shown to be Kama copies.

Size is unknown given that we aren't shown any limits, much like some Reality Marbles.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

It's not if it's repeatedly stated to be universe. Again, more than ten times. It looks like universe, there's no denying it.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

It's on you all to prove it isn't a universe. Sure, the stars might be Kama's, but that doesn't mean that the space itself ain't a universe.

 

[RegisNex1232]

The space itself hasn't been stated to be anything like the actual full universe, and it being so is directly contradicted by the various oddities like ground and oxygen manifested for us or the fact that it disappears to reveal a room in a palace. Unless you have anything that isn't already rejected by the ratings for Reality Marbles, this part is pointless.

 

[Jackythejack]

This seems fine.

 

[Heavens_Feel]

It's on you all to prove it isn't a universe. Sure, the stars might be Kama's, but that doesn't mean that the space itself ain't a universe.

µÖéÚûôÒü«µªéÕ┐ÁÒü«Õ£¿Òéèµû╣ÒüîÒÇîÞ¬ìÞ¡ÿÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûôÒÇìÒüºÒüéÒéïõ©ûþòîÒÇüÒééÒüùÒüÅÒü»Þªûþé╣Òü«ÒüôÒü¿ÒÇéÒÇîÞ¬ìÞ¡ÿÒüòÒéîÒéïÒÇìÒü¿Òü»ÒÇüÚüÄÕÄ╗Òâ╗þÅ¥Õ£¿Òâ╗µ£¬µØÑÒü«õ©ëµºÿÒüîÕÉîµÖéÒü½þƒÑÞªÜÒüòÒéîÒüªÒüäÒü¬ÒüäÒüôÒü¿ÒéƵäÅÕæ│ÒüÖÒéïÒÇé

^The descriptor for the term universe under fate context. Rather than a case of scale, it's more of a nature about something.

 

[StrongClick]

Had a friend look into the term Þª│µ©¼Õ«çÕ«Ö, and it doesn't seem to refer to the actual universe.

µÖéÚûôÒü«µªéÕ┐ÁÒü«Õ£¿Òéèµû╣ÒüîÒÇîÞ¬ìÞ¡ÿÒüòÒéîÒéïµÖéÚûôÒÇìÒüºÒüéÒéïõ©ûþòîÒÇüÒééÒüùÒüÅÒü»Þªûþé╣Òü«ÒüôÒü¿ÒÇéÒÇîÞ¬ìÞ¡ÿÒüòÒéîÒéïÒÇìÒü¿Òü»ÒÇüÚüÄÕÄ╗Òâ╗þÅ¥Õ£¿Òâ╗µ£¬µØÑÒü«õ©ëµºÿÒüîÕÉîµÖéÒü½þƒÑÞªÜÒüòÒéîÒüªÒüäÒü¬ÒüäÒüôÒü¿ÒéƵäÅÕæ│ÒüÖÒéïÒÇé

It doesn't say anything about scale nor how it's an actual universe, but more of a category that something might fall into.

 

[ShiroyashaGinSan]

The space itself hasn't been stated to be anything like the actual full universe, and it being so is directly contradicted by the various oddities like ground and oxygen manifested for us or the fact that it disappears to reveal a room in a palace. Unless you have anything that isn't already rejected by the ratings for Reality Marbles, this part is pointless.

It's because Kama warps reality and concepts in her universe? That's why ground is there, oxygen was conceptually given by her and the rooms aren't part of the universe, they're in the maze. Reality Marbles aren't both stated and looked like an universe before.

 

[Heavens_Feel]

snip

No it's not. It's absolutely not that skill, you're looking like an idiot right now. They use different words even.
It is correlated with that skill though. The exposition about her burning love and how she will fill humanity with love as the beast of lapse is further elaborated upon that skill entry, at the very least on how it works