In Marvel Comics, would the power of the Flames of the Faltine scale equally for all who use them?

[Eseseso]

Dormammu stated that he could wipe out the Celestials using the Flames of the Faltine, and other Faltines (who also happen to be on Dormammu's level) like Clea and Umar possess the ability to use Flames of the Faltine, but would other non-Faltine users of the Flames of the Faltines scale equally?

Like Dr. Strange and such.

 

[Scathan_The_Celestial]

I don't really trust this statement for a few reasons

He lost to Galactus who's not even strong enough to beat every celestial
He's more consistently around skyfathers like Odin and Zeus in power (Odin even being shown to be far more reasonable about his power than dormammu who's often very arrogant about his power to the point he got mad about strange having shuma above him

 

[Eseseso]

I don't really trust this statement for a few reasons

1. His modern self that lost to Galactus is entirely different from his 2-A to Low 1-C Classic self. His classic self was stated twice (once in the link above, and once by Strange himself) to be capable of wiping out the entire Celestial Race.

2. He also scales to Eternity-level people, like how he one-shot a Phoenix Force host who wounded Eternity.

 

[Scathan_The_Celestial]

1. His modern self that lost to Galactus is entirely different from his 2-A to Low 1-C Classic self. His classic self was stated twice (once in the link above, and once by Strange himself) to be capable of wiping out the entire Celestial Race.

2. He also scales to Eternity-level people, like how he one-shot a Phoenix Force host who wounded Eternity.

There are also numerous other statements by even Odin himself that they are equal, I don't think wounding eternity is even remotely consistent for dormammu for numerous reasons tbh, Dr strange literally couldn't do shit against in-betweener (which takes place LATER than his fights with dormammu) and in-betweener is equal to Galactus,

The scaling chain seems straight forward tbh,
Galactus=in-betweener>dormammu=odin

I also don't think wounding eternity means much since several cosmics have done this feat in the past

 

[ByAsura]

That wasn't by Odin, that was by Dormammu once in the 90s.

 

[Scathan_The_Celestial]

That wasn't by Odin, that was by Dormammu once in the 90s.

He said it but Odin also said it once (I'll have to find the scan) but given the portrayal of both I think the statement is more reasonable tbh, it'd be pretty weird if Dormammu was eternity tier aswell tbh, considering strange had a far worse time dealing with in-betweener who's equal to galactus

 

[ByAsura]

Strange isn't even on par with Dormammu, and it's explained in the same comic where he calls him equal that Dormammu was never really at full power during their confrontations, hence why his power was growing in this scan.

Also, Dormammu fought against Agamotto.

Edit: Also I forgot to mention that In-Betweener's realm is literally magick, and he's straight up immune to most magic and can **** with Strange's perception of reality/reality itself.

 

[Scathan_The_Celestial]

Strange isn't even on par with Dormammu, and it's explained in the same comic where he calls him equal that Dormammu was never really at full power during their confrontations.

Also, Dormammu fought against Agamotto.

I don't think strange is anywhere near as strong as dormammu, shuma etc (he never really beats them with power) Im just saying he had far greater issue dealing with in-betweener then with dormammu

I just don't think this celestial scale is very good

 

[Scathan_The_Celestial]

It's mainly due to how untrustworthy dormammu seems to be about his own power due to his arrogance

 

[ByAsura]

You kind of missed the point I was actually trying to make. This Dormammu > the Dormammu you're trying to make a comparison of.

Anyway, given that Dormammu actually has feats on par with Eternity and stuff like that, it's more like an inconsistency on both sides rather than him mainly being portrayed as equal to Odin and Zeus.

 

[Scathan_The_Celestial]

Oh you mean classic dormammu? Personally I don't see the difference between the two but it's fair

 

[Scathan_The_Celestial]

I think we should probably also scale shuma around Dormmamu range, Dr strange made it clear Shuma is a bigger threat

 

[ByAsura]

Modern Dormammu doesn't even have a page.

 

[Eseseso]

Now that the Classic vs Modern Dormammu thing has been cleared up, I restate the question in the OP: Does the power to wipe out the Celestials apply to everyone using the Flames of the Faltine?

 

[ByAsura]

It's shown to be a spell that can be used to extremely variable degrees, so I'd say no.

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

the Flames of the Faltine isn't it a spell that works more or less like crimson bands? where they can be broken for example by hulk while another user can retain guys like Nightmare?(but to by fair, Jugg would have a better control with CB that most people)

 

[ByAsura]

Pretty much.

 

[Excellence616]

where they can be broken for example by hulk while another user can retain guys like Nightmare?(but to by fair, Jugg would have a better control with CB that most people)

Hulk>Nightmare

 

[Gasper]

I don't really trust this statement for a few reasons

Galactus is consistently portrayed to be far above any Skyfathers.

The only time he is seen as being hurt by them is when he is hungry.

 

[Scathan_The_Celestial]

Galactus is consistently portrayed to be far above any Skyfathers.

The only time he is seen as being hurt by them is when he is hungry.

Yeah I agree which is why I don't see why dormammu gets this treatment

 

[Eseseso]

It was only modern Dormammu, who is far below his classic self, who got beaten by Galactus.

Classic Dormammu > Goddess w/ Cosmic Egg >> 30 Cosmic Cubes > 1 cosmic Cube > Dozens of Celestials > 1 Celestial > Amped Destroyer Armor Odin > Odin

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

1 Celestial

to be honest it was the fourth host that i would not consider them as normals Celestials

 

[Eseseso]

to be honest it was the fourth host that i would not consider them as normals Celestials

Well, Dormmamu still was said twice to be capable of killing every single Celestial, so he still scales above them.

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

Well, Dormmamu still was said twice to be capable of killing every single Celestial, so he still scales above them.

I know, just saying it for Odin part