High School DxD Universe Discussion Thread

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Mind you, I truly do not care about Boost and whether it’s used for stats or not. All I’m saying is that we shouldn’t **** up everything else to accommodate the Boost multipliers.

lol

You can address my claims progressively. Let’s not rush. It’s actually better to do this here than a CRT where we shout over each other and staff will get confused. I will provide quotes for my own claims too. Let’s just make it as simple as possible.

For now, let’s start with the claim that the rankings are based on “skill, leadership, or ability to gather servants, technique.”

Is there any examples where someone is ranked as a certain class because they have good leadership qualities, or because they can gather servants?

As I remember, every instance where someone is described as X-class is when they can fight someone on that level. I also provided a quote confirming that it’s based on ranking power levels above.

Lest we forget, power is the single most important thing in the Underworld and supersedes bloodline. Like, no ranking is going to preclude power at all.

There’s a chance that a Devil nurtured among them will be more powerful than the High-class Devils when their potential comes out. If that happens, such Devils will take the place of the noble Devils that represents the Underworld since what’s important in the current Devil’s world is strength.

Any devil stronger than a pure blood of a certain rank will simply overtake them if they become more powerful. That’s it. Power level is the single most important thing.

That’s literally how the Old Maou bloodline were removed from the system.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

They don't matter

Neither does the inconsistent Boost then.

again the first CxC is Ultimate Class, his Fullpower is Maou Class.

After Volume 21? Yes. Before that? No.

oh come on, you're still clinging to the same nonsense? I prefer to rely on the scale supported by the events seen in several volumes than a single statement that is inconsistent with history itself. The fact that the narrative takes 10 volumes (and an increase in power) to make a clear fact only proves that the narrative has problems.

What scale? I’m genuinely not sure what you’re talking about.

You’re also basing it on Boost, which itself is not the most consistent thing in the world.

I don't agree with leaving DX, Slashdog and Junior aside unless there is a good reason for it.

Okay, at least we can agree with this. Please tell @MasqueTLDF how ridiculous it is.

Unless we want to call Volume 8, 13 and 15 “secondary sources” too.

They already have it and you're the only one complaining because the scale shows that the narrative is inconsistent, something everyone else already knew.

I’m the only one complaining because I’m not swayed by the huge numbers you want from the Boost multipliers.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

I'll respond to the long text walls soon, just gotta add scans to the sandbox. I just smell a bit of bias lol.

I almost want to use that pot and kettle analogy but I will refrain, because I don’t want us to get heated here. Aren’t you the one who advocates for politeness and not resorting to personal attacks? Bias is uncalled for. But anyway. I’m simply pointing out obvious flaws with this whole process. Let’s continue amicably.

Masque, look at the original thread where this entire argument originated from. Every single one of your new adjustments has been as a result of me pointing out several problems with the proposed scaling. You are now simply trying to change everything because of Boost alone.

That’s the entire reason why you now want to adjust class rankings, Pawn values, wings, and even the canonicity of Junior and Slash Dog. No, the DX volumes are not of lower precedence. Ishibumi gives the timeline for every story and says they show what happens between volumes.

Volume 8, 13 and 15 are no different from a DX volume. They are the same short story compilations.

You’ve literally just done this because I proved that Kuroka was High class in DX 2. That’s why you’re saying DX volumes are of lower precedence, which makes no sense at all.

Am I really the biased one? I’m not the one literally changing the rules of the world building and canon structure now because of a single dragon’s ability. Even @TotalMasterInfinity seems to agree that this part is wrong.

Edit: But damn, I have cert exams, lol. Might not respond for at least ~20 hours but I’ll be back to discuss further.

 

[TotalMasterInfinity]

After Volume 21? Yes. Before that? No.

Since volume 16 CxC surpasses the Old Maou, just give up.

What scale? I’m genuinely not sure what you’re talking about.

You’re also basing it on Boost

Now you just confirmed to me that you didn't even see the comment I made in the Masque cast thread or the new thread you made which continues to explain why you keep clinging to something that is wrong, or maybe it's just simple denial or disbelief.

The only way Kokabiel would be stronger than Mirana would be if Isse transferred between 49 to 55 Boost to Rias

The only way the Old Maou wouldn't have been surpassed by the Fullpower of the first CxC, is if we assume that the Ophis snake enhances Shalba's power more than 100 thousand times or if we directly say that Shalba was wrong when he said that his power with the Ophis snake equaled the Old Maou

 

[Dragongod224]

@Burning_Full_Fingers you sey wings is matter in power scaling

No, it's don't matter I proof this

During first volume we see that Raynare has two wings and a low rank angle

Akeno promoted to Middle-Class, with Azazel stating that she now rivals High-Class
But she still has 2 wing that time and it's happened in volume 11

And during volume 12 She then reveals a bracelet given to her by her father and Azazel that strengthens her Holy Lightning, giving her six black wings


If wings matter than azazel not sey that akeno is rivals high class when she have 2 wings

If it's not enough

there is Irina who also has power of mid class if not high class during volumes 11and 12
But she still has 2 wings

 

[Dragongod224]

And also I just remember @Burning_Full_Fingers

You also sey that super Devil is a rank made for issei and vali in shin volume

It's true but not true

Because of this

Azazel-sensei asked Beelzebub-sama.
“For now, this is how it is. On the surface, it’s just a political front that they’re pretending to actively deal with, but if they act rashly, the balance of the Underworld will collapse. With the issues related to the survival of the race and internal strife on top of that, both the young and old are in a heated situation where everything could collapse in a single instant. Moreover, the opponents are the numerous cunning old Devils; for their own interests and the sake of their aristocratic society, they’ll do anything. To some extent, they’re even more troublesome than the Old Maou faction as they harbour an even deeper darkness than them. Even for Sirzechs and I who are known as Super Devils, we can only appear to push back and forth on the surface politically.”


In volume 20


Now I proof two things and searching for other things

 

[Dragongod224]

For now, let’s start with the claim that the rankings are based on “skill, leadership, or ability to gather servants, technique.”

Is there any examples where someone is ranked as a certain class because they have good leadership qualities, or because they can gather servants?

Sona Sitri promoted to ultimate class because of skills

Now before you sey something gave me a proof she can fight saji BxB or cxc issei or BxB Sairaorg Bael (you think sairaorg Bael ultimate class so) or has power to fight ultimate class devil


Same goes for angles

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Added scans and fixed some minor issues in the sandbox.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

The Boost multipliers are now being used to override everything in the novel. To summarize, these are the things that override for the sake of Boost alone:

• Class rankings

Only overridden when contradictions arise, we don't use false information here.

• Pawn values in the world tournament
• Wings correlating to strength for angels and fallen angels

Both of these are extremely insignificant and mostly inaccurate. I won't deny that they, in theory, should correlate to strength and sometimes do, however, most of the time, feats outweigh their intended purpose as others have pointed out.

• Characters being explicitly stated as Ultimate class being upgraded above a Maou because of the multipliers

Its not just because of the multipliers, and you're a little too stuck on the idea that because X is a higher class than Y, that Y has to be stronger when that's not the case. And idk who you're even referring to in this case.

• A character explicitly below a Cadre is now being scaled thousands of times above a Cadre

Cadres differ in strength, you can be above or below one without being above or below another. Like in DB, because Krillin is below a Saiyan (Goku), can he not be scales thousands of times (or more) above someone like Raditz?

• DX volumes are now somehow lower than the main volumes, even though Volume 8 and 13 are literally compilations of short stories.

Because of their nature of being comedic.

• Now I’m hearing that Slash Dog and Junior DxD are somehow below in precedence compared to DxD

Because they're both spin-offs and clearly only meant to be supplementary to the main story, and obviously Ishibumi's word is above Shinonome's.

I’m sure there are others, but I’m too tired to check. At this point, I think I’ll make my own thread and I’m not sure how Boost is going to be handled per se - because I don’t think it should take precedence over everything else.

Boost has been handled and it's accepted.

I don't agree with leaving DX, Slashdog and Junior aside unless there is a good reason for it.

Not leaving them aside, they're still being used, just if anything contradicts between them and the main story, the main story takes precedence. (Hypothetically, if Junior's next volume revealed that Issei's CxC is actually Middle Class or that he never actually owned the Boosted Gear. The Main Story which goes against that would be what's accepted rather than the statement from Junior.

Mind you, I truly do not care about Boost and whether it’s used for stats or not. All I’m saying is that we shouldn’t **** up everything else to accommodate the Boost multipliers.

Same could be said about the class system.

For now, let’s start with the claim that the rankings are based on “skill, leadership, or ability to gather servants, technique.”

Is there any examples where someone is ranked as a certain class because they have good leadership qualities, or because they can gather servants?

All will be shown in the CRT.

As I remember, every instance where someone is described as X-class is when they can fight someone on that level. I also provided a quote confirming that it’s based on ranking power levels above.

Contradictory information in the CRT.

Lest we forget, power is the single most important thing in the Underworld and supersedes bloodline. Like, no ranking is going to preclude power at all.

Any devil stronger than a pure blood of a certain rank will simply overtake them if they become more powerful. That’s it. Power level is the single most important thing.

That’s literally how the Old Maou bloodline were removed from the system.

Doesn't mean that everything else is discounted, the President is the most important man in the USA but does that mean that all of the citizens are worthless?

Neither does the inconsistent Boost then.


After Volume 21? Yes. Before that? No.


What scale? I’m genuinely not sure what you’re talking about.

You’re also basing it on Boost, which itself is not the most consistent thing in the world.

Love how everyone loves to call Boosts Inconsistent but can never actually prove that they are. I can only think of two (Dulio and Cao Cao Fights (maybe three, Baraqiel Fight)) examples where they could be even considered that, and even then I could still find reasons for them to not be inconsistent.

Unless we want to call Volume 8, 13 and 15 “secondary sources” too.

Those are all part of the main story, aside from them containing short stories, I don't see why we would.

I’m the only one complaining because I’m not swayed by the huge numbers you want from the Boost multipliers.

The big numbers won't hurt you brodie.

I almost want to use that pot and kettle analogy but I will refrain, because I don’t want us to get heated here. Aren’t you the one who advocates for politeness and not resorting to personal attacks? Bias is uncalled for. But anyway. I’m simply pointing out obvious flaws with this whole process. Let’s continue amicably.

Saying that someone or something is biased isn't even an insult though, at a subconscious level, we all have bias so I don't see the harm in pointing it out. I'd admit with heart that I have bias for DxD, but it doesn't mean that I'll let that dictate my decisions and I'm not implying that you, or anyone else does either. Imo, it's the same as saying "You have skin" or "You're a human", it's just a fact, not meant to be hurtful and I apologize if it came off that way,

Masque, look at the original thread where this entire argument originated from. Every single one of your new adjustments has been as a result of me pointing out several problems with the proposed scaling. You are now simply trying to change everything because of Boost alone.

Wdym by adjusments? If you mean the Azazel/Saji stuff, then nah, I just reread a few scenes and thought TMI had the right idea, if you mean the new discussion rule, uh yeah, that's kinda how all discussion rules start. And no, it's not just because of Boosts that I'm doing this, it's because the scaling would otherwise be inconsistent.

That’s the entire reason why you now want to adjust class rankings, Pawn values, wings, and even the canonicity of Junior and Slash Dog. No, the DX volumes are not of lower precedence. Ishibumi gives the timeline for every story and says they show what happens between volumes.

I'm not saying they aren't canon, their content just have a slightly smaller degree of validity. Like the Naruto Novels.

Volume 8, 13 and 15 are no different from a DX volume. They are the same short story compilations.

They are, Ishibumi made several statements (shown in the CRT) that he never made about any of those three Volumes.

You’ve literally just done this because I proved that Kuroka was High class in DX 2. That’s why you’re saying DX volumes are of lower precedence, which makes no sense at all.

Ngl, that's definitely part of it. But is wanting to clear out inconsistencies a bad thing? Plus, that particular statement will still be used anyway with what I'm proposing so again, Idk what you're so upset about. All I'm doing is setting some guidelines that we have to follow so that RandomUser#1062 doesn't claim that Mittelt is Chief God Class bases off of a scan from a book that no one's seen before.

Am I really the biased one? I’m not the one literally changing the rules of the world building and canon structure now because of a single dragon’s ability. Even @TotalMasterInfinity seems to agree that this part is wrong.

It's not just "a single dragon's ability", it is THE main ability of THE Main Character, and it's used hundreds of times throughout the story and by other cast members as well. Underselling the importance of my arguments doesn't make yours stronger.

Edit: But damn, I have cert exams, lol. Might not respond for at least ~20 hours but I’ll be back to discuss further.

Hope you do well, hope these discussions don't make you think that I hate you or anything, we're cool.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

DxD Rule addition: Class Scaling

This CRT is to get a general rule added to the verse page that should be followed when scaling the series, and or get this added to the discussion rules page for DxD. 1. In comparison to Boosts, the class system has been very inconsistent throughout the series despite having equal importance...

vsbattles.com

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Before I come back to continue my arguments.

1. It seems like the Juggernaut Drive scaling is wrong.

https://www.reddit.com/r/HighschoolDxD/s/YJzyv2KZE3

Should be adjusted if that’s true.

2. I just looked at the Boosted Gear blog again, and why is it not being used for Dragon Deification?

Darkness gathered in Erebus’ hand and became something like a barrier, but I punched it with all my might without paying any heed!

"<<[D∞D!! D∞DD∞D!! D∞DD∞DD∞D!!!! D∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞D!!!!!! D∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞D!!!!!!!!]>>"

From the jewels on my armor, this sound echoed and my power increased explosively with [Boost].

It’s explicitly using Boost. Issei says the same thing in volume 25.

 

[TotalMasterInfinity]

I don't understand it either, I always thought that D∞D, D and Answer were the Boost versions of DxD G and AxA.

But Masque decided not to use them because both of them are said to channel the power of the Dragon Gods.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Before I come back to continue my arguments.

1. It seems like the Juggernaut Drive scaling is wrong.

https://www.reddit.com/r/HighschoolDxD/s/YJzyv2KZE3

Should be adjusted if that’s true.

31 Boosts is already being used? This doesn't change anything.

2. I just looked at the Boosted Gear blog again, and why is it not being used for Dragon Deification?


It’s explicitly using Boost. Issei says the same thing in volume 25.

D∞D if just the sound that comes from Issei's armor when he's using DxD. It's kinda a symbol that issei is using Infinity. (Although I get that you may believe that he didn't have access to Infinity after V21 until TV4, however the power of infinity was only reduced until Issei could handle. If it was removed entirely, Issei would be able to awaken it in TV4 since it wouldn't be there in the first place.)

I clenched my right fist, and punched him straight in the face. At this time, a voice rang out.

“ <<[ D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D !!!!!!!!]>> ”

Rizevim intended to use his left hand to grab my fist! The wings of Lucifer on his back all expanded, and increased his strength. In order to block my fist, Rizevim used his Canceller…. I didn’t use [Penetrate], but the momentum of my fist didn’t weaken, and the aura enveloping it wasn’t eliminated; Rizevim cried out in surprise ‘what is this!?’

“First is a punch!”

Using my fist’s momentum, I drove a direct punch towards Rizevim! Struck by that single blow, that bastard was flung onto the ground. Despite that, Rizevim immediately stood back up, and felt the part of his face that had been hit. From the looks of it, that blow just now was pretty good; his nasal bridge had been knocked crooked, and he had an incessant nosebleed. After Rizevim forcefully pushed his nose back into place and stopped the bleeding, he glared at me.

“……What the **** was that just then? Why wasn’t it invalidated!? Did my ability not work!? How is that possible!?”

In response to Rizevim who was in pure disbelief, Ddraig began to speak

[No, son of Lucifer. Your ability did work.]

“Well, why wasn’t it cancelled then!? Even if that power has a share of Ophis’ power, as long as it’s the power of a Sacred Gear, my Sacred Gear Canceller should still be able to disable it, right!?”

[It’s extremely simple. Your ability to cancel is limited. Over here, the power of the Sekiryuutei’s ability is infinite. Since it’s a power which can’t entirely be cancelled — that would make things different, wouldn’t it?]

“[<<D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D !!!!!!!!>>]”

A [∞] symbol emerged on every one of my gems, and they alternated with flashes of red and black light. DOOOO…the cannons were charging up. Ophis — The Dragon God of Infinity’s power was being focused.

“GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!”

“<<[∞ Blaster !!!!!!]>>”

After we each finished speaking, I instantly charged out, and directly threw a punch at Apophis’ enormous face!

“[<<D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D!!!!!!!!>>]”

The fist which was carrying the power of infinity — this direct attack knocked Apophis backwards substantially. Apophis was unable to nullify my punch.

<<Even my darkness cannot cancel out this power! How interesting!>>

“[<<D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D D∞D !!!!!!!!>>]”

An [∞] symbol appeared on all of the gems of my armour, as the colours of red and black flashed alternatingly.

“Goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!”

“[<< ∞ Blaster!!!!!! >>]”[60]

“Lodged inside your body was the power of infinity, that is, the power of Dragon Deification, and even with the flesh of Great Red, you were originally a human, so it is impossible for you to withstand it. It was then that Ophis came to adjust it, no, it should be said that she received it on your behalf. She stabilised that power to a level that your body and mind could withstand.”

Infinity is DxD, and as Issei is still able to use it, he has access to Infinity.

So that’s how it is. Originally, after suffering from the repercussions of Dragon Deification a second time, even if my body…was destroyed, it would not be surprising.

“Well, I can’t use Dragon Deification again huh.”

“If you’re talking about the power output you had during the time when you fought against Rizevim or Trihexa, you won’t be able to use it again unless you become a god. Even my lifespan has been reduced by a lot. But, I also received a blessing from the Dragon God.”

Blessing? A question mark floated above my head. Ophis, who had turned into a beauty answered that question for me

“At that time, you awakened the armour with my power, and you can continue to use that form. But, its power has been decreased by a great extent. However, there is also room for improvement.”

Oh, so I can still change into that red and black streaked armour. However, it won’t have abilities of infinity,

Contradicted later on by Issei still using D∞D and Infinity Blaster.

and its immense strength has also been decreased. But that is still enough. Even if that power has been reduced, it’s still incredibly strong. At the very least, it’s far above that of my [True Queen] form. And there’s also room for improvement. So it’ll be fine if I just do more training.

“Pseudo Dragon Deification?”

<<—What!? I cut you with my scythe, but I can’t cut your soul!? Could it be that even your soul has the power of Ophis!?>>

…That’s right, my strength is an manifestation of Ophis’ power. Since Ophis represents the infinite, I suppose it isn’t surprising that her power can provide this level of protection. Moreover, my body itself exists thanks to Great Red and Ophis, and it was formed from a combination of their powers.

Infinity protecting Issei in PDxD V24.

I don't understand it either, I always thought that D∞D, D and Answer were the Boost versions of DxD G and AxA.

Answer is just the sound made when Issei materializes weapons or a new ability in AxA uding Great Red's "Dream". They are the 'Answer' to what Issei needs at that moment.

“— Great Red’s power, it’s the manifestation of that answer.”

—.

…Great Red’s power… The one that resides within me, it’s answer, manifestation…?

...Yes. Information was flowing. Above all, I understood the real identity of this Ryuuteimaru. What Ophis was saying, the power of Great Red, the manifestation of that answer... Using my body as a medium, Ryuuteimaru scooped it out and embodied the part which otherwise would be limited by my body. And by connecting with that, this form — the manifestation of Great Red's power was complete!

It was not yet complete! After all, it just came out of the cocoon! Wait, Seekvaira-san's voice sounded really excited! W-Well, that’s fine! Anyway, if I didn’t do something, everyone would be thrown into the Abyss! In my mind — I thought about going ahead! Then, Ryuuteimaru, the huge flying object, also advanced. ...It works! If I think, this guy answers! I put the target on the sphere full of eyeballs in front of me and increased the speed! A booster connected to Ryuuteimaru spurted aura greatly and bounced forward with great impulse! Seeing this, Tartarus opened all eyes.

[Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!]

[Revelation Barrier!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!]

[Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!]

[Revelation All-Range Blaster!!!!!!!!!!!!!]

[Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer! Answer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!]

[Revelation All-Range Blaster!!!!!!!!!!!!!]

The sound resonated and I thought about letting it blow all out at once!

Tartarus was flying over here! The huge eyeball God had aura overflowing in his countless hands! The countless hands stretched out! Did he intend to pierce Ryuuteimaru's body with his hands covered in aura? Hand-to-hand combat! I also — had the means for that! I thought of the information that flowed into my head! Then, Ryuuteimaru's upper and lower body parts slid, and two arms appeared from each of them! Four arms grew! He even had four arms!

[Revelation Blade!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!]

And I dunno why y'al; thin it would change only for these forms when it was "Boost" for every other form. Other calls like Divide and Bust exist and we don't consider them the same as Boost.

But Masque decided not to use them because both of them are said to channel the power of the Dragon Gods.

yup

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

I don't understand it either, I always thought that D∞D, D and Answer were the Boost versions of DxD G and AxA.

But Masque decided not to use them because both of them are said to channel the power of the Dragon Gods.

Initially I was confused but they should be the Boost versions. Issei explicitly says he used Boost in the Erebus and Vidar fights. @MasqueTLDF

The channeling Dragon Gid powers thing is not contradictory. Issei channels Boost to his fists alone several times before unlocking the Dragon God powers. It also makes no sense for Issei to suddenly be incapable of using Boost, or surely we would have been told by now if he couldn’t use his main ability.

This quote puts it to bed.

<<[D∞D!! D∞DD∞D!! D∞DD∞DD∞D!!!! D∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞D!!!!!! D∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞DD∞D!!!!!!!!]>>"

From the jewels on my armor, this sound echoed and my power increased explosively with [Boost].

It’s very explicitly Boost. And with the Angra Mainyu fight.
As the voice of Angra Mainyu said, he tried to distance himself. I followed with extreme speed and raised an immense amount of aura in my hand!

"[[D ∞ D!! D ∞ D D ∞ D!! D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D!!! D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D!!!! D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D!!!!! D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D D ∞ D!!!!!!!!"]]

[[D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D D!!!!!!!!!!!!!]]

From the jewels, the error-like sound was gradually becoming stronger.

Gathering the boosted aura that was being piled up, as well as compressed and condensed into an enormous mass of aura, I instantly enhanced it with the [Penetrate] ability and released it at Angra Mainyu.

Explicitly called boosted strength. It’s also no different from how CxC Issei gathers boosted aura into his fists sometimes.

But also, with True Dragon Deification, is the Boost effect being stacked with these two different announcements?

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Initially I was confused but they should be the Boost versions. Issei explicitly says he used Boost in the Erebus and Vidar fights. @MasqueTLDF

The channeling Dragon Gid powers thing is not contradictory. Issei channels Boost to his fists alone several times before unlocking the Dragon God powers. It also makes no sense for Issei to suddenly be incapable of using Boost, or surely we would have been told by now if he couldn’t use his main ability.

This quote puts it to bed.

It’s very explicitly Boost. And with the Angra Mainyu fight.
As the voice of Angra Mainyu said, he tried to distance himself. I followed with extreme speed and raised an immense amount of aura in my hand!


Explicitly called boosted strength. It’s also no different from how CxC Issei gathers boosted aura into his fists sometimes.

But also, with True Dragon Deification, is the Boost effect being stacked with these two different announcements?

Boost has been used previously without the reader seeing the sound effect so I dont think "it says he boost when this sound effect played" when the sound effect is shown to be something else matters. Its just saying that Issei also used Boost at the same time.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

Boost has been used previously without the reader seeing the sound effect so I dont think "it says he boost when this sound effect played" when the sound effect is shown to be something else matters. Its just saying that Issei also used Boost at the same time.

Every now and then, yeah. But it’s almost always mentioned.

That would be saying Ishi just now decides not to show Boost when Issei uses DxD or AxA every time, conveniently and only for those transformations. He still does it for CxC, so it would be odd if he conveniently left it out for DxD and AxA if you get what I’m saying. It’s just off.

But nothing states those ‘D D D’ or ‘Answer’ announcements are not the replacements for Boosts as well. It’s like an assumption that’s no longer needed because it seems straightforward now with Issei saying the “boosted power piled up” or his power “increased explosively with Boost” as the announcements rang out.

I’d say they should get the multipliers too. But eh, we should have discussed this before now.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Every now and then, yeah. But it’s almost always mentioned.

That would be saying Ishi just now decides not to show Boost when Issei uses DxD or AxA every time, conveniently and only for those transformations. He still does it for CxC, so it would be odd if he conveniently left it out for DxD and AxA if you get what I’m saying. It’s just off.

But nothing states those ‘D D D’ or ‘Answer’ announcements are not the replacements for Boosts as well. It’s like an assumption that’s no longer needed because it seems straightforward now with Issei saying the “boosted power piled up” or his power “increased explosively with Boost” as the announcements rang out.

I literally showed proof that they are completely different lol, and literally showed examples of offscreen Boosts. And we've literally seen Issei with DxD use Boosts before and it literally is just the "Boost" sound, not D D D or anything else.

I’d say they should get the multipliers too. But eh, we should have discussed this before now.

Unfortunately, we don't use headcanon to try to get characters higher than they otherwise should be.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

I literally showed proof that they are completely different

You didn’t? Issei quite explicitly says he uses Boost when those announcements ring out.

There’s also no contradictions to this idea, as far as I remember. It’s likely Boost simply got replaced since the BG got influenced by the Dragon God auras in those specific transformations.

And we've literally seen Issei with DxD use Boosts before and it literally is just the "Boost" sound, not D D D or anything else

Huh..? You’ve just shown me a quote of Issei in True Queen. He only used a partial DxD and he’s effectively still in True Queen.

Unfortunately, we don't use headcanon to try to get characters higher than they otherwise should be.

(Let’s make sure to apply that with the current Boost multipliers scaling then, so Mirana shouldn’t be scaling above Kokabiel)

It’s not really headcanon as Issei explicitly says his power increases explosively with Boost as the announcements ring out. That seems enough of an indication to me.

You’ve also not considered:

That would be saying Ishi just now decides not to show Boost when Issei uses DxD or AxA every time, conveniently and only for those transformations. He still does it for CxC, so it would be odd if he conveniently left it out for DxD and AxA if you get what I’m saying. It’s just off.

Which makes no sense.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

You didn’t? Issei quite explicitly says he uses Boost when those announcements ring out.

There’s also no contradictions to this idea, as far as I remember. It’s likely Boost simply got replaced since the BG got influenced by the Dragon God auras in those specific transformations.

It's literally stated and shown that it's something completely different, D∞D is explicitly stated to and shown to be Issei using Infinity and Answer is explicitly shown and stated to be Issei using Dream. Idk what to tell you if you cant see ghat but refusing ti acknowledge it doesn't count as a refutation whereas my evidence showing otherwise is a refutation.

Huh..? You’ve just shown me a quote of Issei in True Queen. He only used a partial DxD and he’s effectively still in True Queen.

Still DxD, and the sound literally comes from Issei's gauntlet (which was the part that was affected by DxD)

(Let’s make sure to apply that with the current Boost multipliers scaling then, so Mirana shouldn’t be scaling above Kokabiel)

"Erm, I'm right and you're wrong, but I won't prove why though."

It’s not really headcanon as Issei explicitly says his power increases explosively with Boost as the announcements ring out. That seems enough of an indication to me.

And it's shown that Issei's Boost is used without the reader seeing the sound effect. Plus, has there ever been an instance of two BG sounds playing at the same time? It's only logical the Ishibumi would illustrate Issei using Boosts outside of the D∞D calls since he's never intertwined them before, and he's literally been shown using them offscreen before so the absence of the sound wouldn't mean anything anyway. We don't see "explosion" or "reset" everytime boost is used, but we know they are still used. Its literally just common sense based on what is shown.

You’ve also not considered:

FRA

Which makes no sense.

"It's not true because I can't believe the author would do that." isn't an argument.
Also, I'll be a lil inactive for the next 17-ish hours. Maybe longer for mental health reasons so I'll just comment on the CRTs if I'm ever able to, my arguments are clear and known.

 

[TotalMasterInfinity]

(Let’s make sure to apply that with the current Boost multipliers scaling then, so Mirana shouldn’t be scaling above Kokabiel)

are you going to continue with this? Enough, it's already become tiring, that statement is inconsistent with the scale.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

are you going to continue with this? Enough, it's already become tiring, that statement is inconsistent with the scale.

Literally. IIRC, wasn't it stated that Mirana could "vaporise/kill an Ultimate Class with one attack"? Why would that imply she caps at Ult class? Especially when there's statements implying that she's Cadre Level and Kokabiel (weakest Cadre) was comparable to the Maou and the other Cadres are stronger than him/have Maou Class feats. Impyling that she's below Koks is kinda insane.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

The air shook, and there was a buzzing in my ears. Kokabiel emitted an air wave from his other hand and made Xenovia’s body float. Then Kokabiel kicked Xenovia’s stomach.

Air manip for Koks

However, I had activated the Red Dragon Emperor’s armor, Boosted Gear Scale Mail. Even with a punch filled with demonic aura, I wouldn’t take any damage! Well, the shockwave from the punch still transmitted through the armor though! While having a close-range brawl with Yura, I struck a conversation with her.

Duraneg Tsubasa

 

[MasqueTLDF]

If anyone has AP/DC feats for Slash Dog Tobio (Either Manga or LN), please feel free to share.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Issei vs Gojo

Base Issei is used SBA Speed Equal

vsbattles.com

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

If anyone has AP/DC feats for Slash Dog Tobio (Either Manga or LN), please feel free to share.

Solidly above Dragon King class. He beat someone comparable to Yasaka.

Although why does it matter?

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Solidly above Dragon King class. He beat someone comparable to Yasaka.

Although why does it matter?

I'm slowly continuing my work on revising the rest of the cast and I'm planning to give Tobio keys from before DxD.

 

[Burning_Full_Fingers]

I'm slowly continuing my work on revising the rest of the cast and I'm planning to give Tobio keys from before DxD.

He could have at least two keys then, but I don’t know how strong his base form is. He mostly has feats against fodders iirc. Not sure how to scale that.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Small Steps, I'll clean this up and add scans tomorrow. After the current CRT, I'll roll out more small ones covering small groups of characters like this. Any advice/criticism is welcome.

Almost half way done, thoughts? Implemented some stuff that y'all have been mentioning.
I've also got another Issei revision + an ability revision planned. Might be able to finish all this by March/April? (Hopefully sooner.)

 

[TotalMasterInfinity]

Small Steps

...so far so good, you even showed me things I hadn't noticed before.

 

[MasqueTLDF]

DxD Cast Stat Revision 2

Hey everyone, back with another CRT. (

vsbattles.com

 

[Dragongod224]

Please keep off-topic discussion in the General Discussion Thread, thank you.

Okay

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Okay

wait sorry nvm, im dumb, thought this was my crt, you're good

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Thoughts?

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Going off of the illustration spoilers for JDxD V2, Grayfia will be getting a fight. Praying for some good feats.

 

[Dragongod224]

What do you guys think which Tier anime issei ranked

 

[MasqueTLDF]

What do you guys think which Tier anime issei ranked

I could see him being placed anywhere in the latter half of Tier 7 based on the consistency of DC Feats and usage of the Tannin Multiplier. Late Tier 6 - Mid Tier 5 if Boost Multipliers are used. (Issei Boosts way more in the anime than the LN.) 4-A or 2-C if the Higher End feats are used (Rating Game Creation and Dimension Lost for 4-A (maybe 3-A), Shaking the Dimensional Gap for 2-C) Scaling the characters to these creation feats in particular would require a bit of extra evidence that I'm not the most aware of currently. (Something to confirm a UES would apply to the anime maybe?) Maybe you could use the energy output of creation / second for Dimension Lost and scale Rossweisse (and subsequently Issei and Sairaorg) to being able to dispel/push back the mist while it's actively being produced. I personally think the Tier 4 range would be most accurate because it could factor in Boosts (and other multipliers) as well as the Creation Feats. And the statement from Ishibumi of Anime Issei being stronger than LN Issei could probably be used as well for Mid-High end interpretations.

 

[Dragongod224]

If anime key are used than almost all characters get 2-C rating who could fight balance breaker issei

 

[MasqueTLDF]

If anime key are used than almost all characters get 2-C rating who could fight balance breaker issei

If we used the high end yeah but I'm fairly certain it'd end up being treated as an outlier unless there's more feats around that level.

 

[Dragongod224]

If we used the high end yeah but I'm fairly certain it'd end up being treated as an outlier unless there's more feats around that level.

Yeh
I think it's good to go with mid

 

[MasqueTLDF]

Wow, the newest JDxD 2 side story 2 had a pretty crazy reveal. Shinonome is definitely very knowledgeable about the series, even the side stories. He referenced the Miyama 0 style summoning technique that was the cause of the crossover in DX 6. I think there's a bit more evidence that it could be used for scaling/canon to DxD now. Now, I'm hoping we get a JDxD DX series. Shinonome's short stories are all connected (according to the volume they were released in) so the first set would roughly be equivalent to one from DX. Maybe around the time when JDxD 5-6 releases, we'll get a compilation volume, because his stories have some decent lore too.