Gotta Revise 'Em All, Part 2: Getting to work

[TheKingStrategist13]

By that logic all statements would be wrong

No, you are taking it to the extreme. There are a large plethora of statements that just flat out state something, or are much more believable. The wording and believability of a statement are key. This statement both has shaky wording and can be difficult to believe with beings like Arceus out there. If you just take every statement and believe it to be 100% true, that can lead to so many problems in so many verses. For example, in a Naruto databook, Kakashi had a ludicrous omniscience statement. Obviously though, we wouldn't have him as such. It's a more drastic example, but still conveys the point. A statement of this size should be held up with a bit of scrutiny.

 

[Emerald]

That'd prolly have to depend on the Sw/Sh dex

The Sw/Sh dex has like the Regis, Silvally, Eternatus, the two legendary dogs and Urshifu line
I guess if we use the strongest Pokemon in SwSh, Melmetal might be Tier 3 cause Silvally

 

[TheKingStrategist13]

It having a stronger punch than Regigas and Silvally is... Interesting. Not quite impossible, just interesting to note. I have no qualms or counters to Tier 3 Mel, then.

 

[Spinoirr]

Anyways we need a blog listing all the feats we have so far

 

[Thelastmlg]

That's not impossible. If you think Arceus being omnipresent means no Pokemon can be stronger than it, you would also have to believe Palkia is stronger than Arceus' avatar because he's a part of space

Idk how we place the true forms of CT vs arceus' avatar but omnipresence has nothing to do with it, the "no pokemon is stronger than it" is due to it's true self embodying all of them, not just because it is everywhere, also pretty sure it was his avatar that brought the true CT so they'd be weaker, omnipresence or not

 

[Thelastmlg]

For example, in a Naruto databook, Kakashi had a ludicrous omniscience statement.

Small correction, it was omnipotence...which is even worse

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

massively downgrade? isnt this mostly a massive upgrade for most character except some that relied on manga scaling

that's honestly the funniest part

 

[Thelastmlg]

Task failed successfully

Well it will be in the millennium this even gets implemented

 

[TheKingStrategist13]

Small correction, it was omnipotence...which is even worse

Oop, you're right, It's been a while since I last saw it, lol.

 

[Emerald]

i guess i’ll try to calc some feats

 

[Spinoirr]

i guess i’ll try to calc some feats

Yeah we already have some pokedex feats listed in the other pages here

 

[Emerald]

Do we have a calc for G-Max Copperajah blowing up a mountain?

 

[Sniper670]

You don't really need fists to punch in Pokemon, pokemon without them can learn punching moves

Which is why Ayewale using game mechanics to prove the anime is different was hilarious

GF won't animate most moves properly even if their lives depended on it.

But hey, it's in the past. Carry on

 

[Pikaman]

Which is why Ayewale using game mechanics to prove the anime is different was hilarious

GF won't animate most moves properly even if their lives depended on it.

But hey, it's in the past. Carry on

Let. It. Go.

Barging in on an Application CRT to try and bring up the same circular and debunked points we discussed for 10 whole pages in what I can only assume is a desperate attempt to derail an already slow-moving thread is poor form

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

How long would binging the anime be? I wonder

 

[Thelastmlg]

Probably a full day or 2

 

[Gaaraofthedesert801]

I just learned about the revisions the other day. And there is 1,216 episodes. It would take far more than 2 days, even if you fought the urge to sleep, work, go anywhere or do anything else, it would take days lol.

 

[TheKingStrategist13]

Aren't there like, over at least 800 episodes, plus the movies? I could be wrong but, that'd take some time, admittedly. It'd be a good idea to split the work up by Season's between multiple people tbh

 

[Pikaman]

In September 2021 there was just shy of 427 hours of content, so we’ll just say for now there is >427 hours to be watched

Split that among 5 people who each binge an hour a day on average and you’d be done in somewhere a little over 3 months, which would be pretty decent time for covering and indexing an entire anime series that’s been running for decades

 

[Spinoirr]

It would take months, I say let's split up this crt from the games, anime and manga

Frist let's start with the easiest one, the games

 

[Thelastmlg]

I mean't to say weeks but i confused myself when remembering it, probably a full month of nothing but anime watching

 

[Emerald]

The anime will be a pain

 

[XXKINGXX69]

No, you are taking it to the extreme. There are a large plethora of statements that just flat out state something, or are much more believable. The wording and believability of a statement are key. This statement both has shaky wording and can be difficult to believe with beings like Arceus out there. If you just take every statement and believe it to be 100% true, that can lead to so many problems in so many verses. For example, in a Naruto databook, Kakashi had a ludicrous omniscience statement. Obviously though, we wouldn't have him as such. It's a more drastic example, but still conveys the point.

Why is it shaky wording? Why does Arceus existing make it difficult to believe? I don't care about Kakashi that's not relevant. Its true that accepting every statement can cause problems, but you need a reason for it being hyperbole.

A statement of this size should be held up with a bit of scrutiny.

Not really an argument

Just ignore Sniper btw, he's still not over it

 

[Sniper670]

I won't be over it. which is why I said carry on

 

[Sniper670]

Let. It. Go.

Barging in on an Application CRT to try and bring up the same circular and debunked points we discussed for 10 whole pages in what I can only assume is a desperate attempt to derail an already slow-moving thread is poor form

Pointless talk after I mentioned it's in the past and to carry on

 

[Arceus0x]

Let. It. Go.

Barging in on an Application CRT to try and bring up the same circular and debunked points we discussed for 10 whole pages in what I can only assume is a desperate attempt to derail an already slow-moving thread is poor form

 

[Pikaman]

Fair enough-

 

[Aachintya31]

This has a become a discussion thread.

 

[Thelastmlg]

I feel like the anime could be managed if we divided people to each certain seasons until we see all

 

[XXKINGXX69]

I feel like the anime could be managed if we divided people to each certain seasons until we see all

Make a separate CRT for that

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I will add: My personal priority is the games first (main-line), which is why I've only been discussing pokédex and game-appearances (specially because the Pokédex is accepted to scale across the franchise, which makes everything way easier to scale later)

Which, incidentally, we definitely need a consensus on how to handle the legendary 'mons. Because following my idea on their encounters in-game, it might lead to an abundance of scaling.

Because of the Legendary Birds appearing in Platinum post-game.

My solution to this is to base the scaling depending on the game (legendary birds key for Kanto, another for Sinnoh, and so on), but I'm quite sure many people will be against that.

The Legendary Birds are a problem, because effectively, through them, practically every legendary across generations would scale to late-game sinnoh legendaries. I don't know yet if I could agree to that, so that's why I'm bringing it up.

 

[It_is_i_wyatt]

could just ignore it as an outlier right

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

could just ignore it as an outlier right

I don't know if outlier would be correct here. They practically don't have any other feat (aside for passive stuff in the case of Moltres, who has a 6-C feat purely by existing). Unless you consider their potential fight with Red during Gen 1 (which honestly, is moreso a feat for Red).

However, based on Galar stuff, they might be more consistently tier 6. But I'm no expert on Sword & Shield to properly gauge that.

 

[TheKingStrategist13]

I will add: My personal priority is the games first (main-line), which is why I've only been discussing pokédex and game-appearances (specially because the Pokédex is accepted to scale across the franchise, which makes everything way easier to scale later)

Which, incidentally, we definitely need a consensus on how to handle the legendary 'mons. Because following my idea on their encounters in-game, it might lead to an abundance of scaling.

Because of the Legendary Birds appearing in Platinum post-game.

My solution to this is to base the scaling depending on the game (legendary birds key for Kanto, another for Sinnoh, and so on), but I'm quite sure many people will be against that.

The Legendary Birds are a problem, because effectively, through them, practically every legendary across generations would scale to late-game sinnoh legendaries. I don't know yet if I could agree to that, so that's why I'm bringing it up.

I actually agree with this
While it's typically a rule of thumb that most Legendaries are the same legendary throughout the series, there are multiple cases of this not holding true.
I think that it should be a case by case basis, where the Legendaries who cause most problems and are possibly not the same exact legendary (And yes, the Crown Tundra essentially confirms there can be multiple of the birds), should be split apart by their appearances and treated as different Key's/Entities (For example, Kanto Key, Sinnoh Key, and Galar Key for Birds), and for Pokemon that are more than likely the same but still appear in multiple games that can cause problems for scaling, giving different key's can be a good idea, too.

At the very least, you can argue that the Birds from Kanto and Sinnoh are the same somehow, but that they grew immensely in power over time, and thus deserve multiple key's. And besides, it'd be a bit weird for say, Latias (Just a example, dunno who specifically this would effect) to scale to Dialga because of a Funky little Fire Bird, lol.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

At the very least, you can argue that the Birds from Kanto and Sinnoh are the same somehow, but that they grew immensely in power over time, and thus deserve multiple key's. And besides, it'd be a bit weird for say, Latias (Just a example, dunno who specifically this would effect) to scale to Dialga because of a Funky little Fire Bird, lol.

They also appear in Ultra Space events, which then scales back to the Alola People, which then scale to Zygarde, which then scales to X&Y peeps (where they also appear, incidentally).

Mewtwo directly scale above them in both Gen 1 and Gen 2 (as per being considered the strongest mon in regions where ho-oh, lugia, the birds and beasts exists), and debatable if Suicune scales because of Pokémon Crystal and the Heartgold/Soulsilver Event with it, which then scales the rest of the Legendary Beasts (although they themselves are post-game roaming legendaries in Fire Red/Leaf Green). Ho-Oh then upscales.

And those are from memory, likely a lot more messy stuff could be found through the birds.

 

[TheKingStrategist13]

Yeah, a Ho-Oh sicking a Entei on Dialga and having a chance of winning is just messy lol.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

And people don't believe pkmn approach Marvel and DC levels of everyone can fight everyone

 

[TheKingStrategist13]

And people don't believe pkmn approach Marvel and DC levels of everyone can fight everyone

Jigglypuff gonna pull up on Yveltal

 

[y3p_owo]

Rattata on it's way to piledrive Giratina

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Do Trainers would get some of new abilities for themselves? And do their 9-B rating would change?