General DC Comics Discussion Thread

[Ramasugita11]

If we take account that time is also an abstract concept then yeah. However, time regardless is a property of a dimension of time and lacking it completely seems rather unlikely.

As for the dimensions from Snyder view, yes, he did skip the flat dimension of 0D but that’s not really important.

It's clearly very important, He says "the last thing that WE ever want to be clear is reductive or constraining in OUR cosmology of OUR theology of the DCU"

"You know multiple dimensions, evelen dimensions plus in dcu and the idea that there is beings upon beings"

"I thought the 4th dimension was the deity, the supranatural, those things in the DC cosmology"

OUR [It wasn't just his idea but there were other people involved in the formation of these 6 dimension]
Interview

When he explained the monitor sphere and the 6th dimension, he asked grant Morrison as in the interview below
Interview

In my opinion, the 2 dimensions referred to as lines are 2 geometric coordinate lines, namely X and Y
2Dimensional Line

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

"I thought the 4th dimension was the deity, the supranatural, those things in the DC cosmology"

What exact timestamp? I don’t remember this.

 

[Ramasugita11]

What exact timestamp? I don’t remember this.

As explained yesterday

"The majority of known life operates in four dimensions. Some of these planes, such as various forms of Heaven, Hell, and Dreamland, are fueled by intelligent beings' own spirituality. Such regions generally shape themselves according to the expectations of the believers"

Hypertime is Time, omniverse is Space, so Time and space is 4Dimension/Divine Continuum

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

As explained yesterday

"The majority of known life operates in four dimensions. Some of these planes, such as various forms of Heaven, Hell, and Dreamland, are fueled by intelligent beings' own spirituality. Such regions generally shape themselves according to the expectations of the believers"

Hypertime is Time, omniverse is Space, so Time and space is 4Dimension/Divine Continuum

The majority of life and the realms explanation are not connected.

The Divine Continnum points out the main Multiverse that time is more abstract than a physical dimensions contained with the material plane.

 

[Ramasugita11]

The majority of life and the realms explanation are not connected.

The Divine Continnum points out the main Multiverse that time is more abstract than a physical dimensions contained with the material plane.

The Deities live in the 4-dimensional world, the sphere of the gods is within the Omniverse/hypertime which refers to space/time =4Dimension.
There is nothing wrong, the gods exist in a realm that transcends the material and is revealed many times.

Looks like I will upgrade SOG 1B in this thread, because this is also a cosmology thread, I will apply small tiering changes

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

I don’t think you get my point. So I’ll let the others look at your claim.

 

[Ramasugita11]

The Bleed is said to be a 5-D space and the bulk between the 4-D brane universes, so Low 1-C is fine, as is the Sphere of the Gods.

You said bleed is 5 dimensional space with Mr.mxy's statement, 5D flows like blood throughout the realms and it is similar to bleed.

"IT'S ROTATING THROUGH THE FIFTH DIMENSION AROUND A FIXED POINT IN THE STRUCTURE OF THE MULTIVERSAL ORRERY OF WORLDS!"

It's quite clear if it is said that the bleed rotates through the 5th dimension, not that the bleed is the 5 dimensions rotating around the orrery

•The 5 dimensions rotate throughout the map including the Bleed and it is said that the dimension higher than the 5th dimension is the 6th Dimension.
The multiverse is 4th Dimensions as mentioned by Mr. Mxy

The reason is easy to explain, 4 dimensions is the divine continuum, namely Space and time.

•Bleed is 4D, higher than material realm
•Speed force is 4D
•The Timestream is 4D
•Collective unconsciouns is 4D
•Hypertime is 4D [part of space and time]

However, the 4-D world also has metaphysical layers within it.
The vanishing point is within the Timestream, the Timestream and the vanishing point is in a place beyond space and time [described as a Metaphysical realm]

Speed force, Bleed is referred to as Extra-dimensional. Extra-dimensional in DC comics refers to the Metaphysical realm

Hourman has the ability to transcend the physical world, he can control time at the timestream/vanishing point.
He has the power of a higher dimensional worlogog, not a spatial or temporal dimension but a metaphysical 4th dimension, cause the timestream is not physical space but time that transcends time.
•Hourman has the power of Warlogog [is a physical Manifestation of space and time].
•Time stop in the vanishing point realm.
•Outside of Time [temporal dimension] with Timeship.
•Worlogog is aspect of time and space.
•The worlogog could be used to reshape Creation [physical worlds].

Timestream beyond dimensional space.
•As extant ended the Timestream.
•The worlogog even surpasses new gods like Metron
•Housman gives JSA shields to protect them from Entropic forces.

Also, Time is 4Dimension and 5th Dimension far beyond.
•The Timestream beyond mathematics [Here].
•The Timestream beyond space and time.
•The Timestream isnt a literal Place.

Speed force [extradimensional plane] is within the timestream and the timestream is within the hypertime.
•The timestream does not touch the limbo realm, but limbo within the Hypertime.

Now, 5Dimensions
Scoot Snyder's 5th dimension is described as the physical and non-physical realms.
The physical realm is a higher dimension mathematically with true dimensional axis [a place beyond lenght and width, beyond' depth and Time].

•The 5th Dimension being affected by physical fields [Here].
•Mrs Imps said that dimension was a mathematically higher dimension [Here].
•In another comic, Superman says that 5D is a place outside 3 spatial dimensions and 1 temporal dimension [Here].
•5th dimension is Real time and space.

While the non-physical 5th Dimension is stated as Extra-Dimensional in the hierarchy of existence.
The 5th dimension is outside the map, the map is referred to by Mr Mxy as the 4th Dimensions.
As explained in the Guidebook:
•5D beyond the map/multiverse
•This Map is shown when Explaining the Hierarchy in the Multiverse, the Monitor sphere within it, and other Metaphysical realms. [Here].

•5th dimensional beings have no physical form.
•The 5th dimension is described as a trans-geometric dimension.
•The 5th dimension is outside of creation, that means it is not the physical realm.
•They are able to control physical Time and Metaphysical Time such as Hypertime.
•Stated by Hourman as a world beyond 4 Dimensions, where Houtman is a creature that inhabits the Timestream [Meta-physical realm].

Spatiaal and temporal dimensions/physical realm
•The physical dimension in DC comics is within the Bleed, because the Bleed is Metaspace/Metaphysical realm.
Also stated as pandimensional, which contains higher dimensions.

•Dimensions in DC comics are explained as having 11 spatial dimensions, beyond 3 spatial and 1 temporal.
[11D] + [11 Dimension] + [Higher dimension].

•Wildstorm universe is on earth 50 {The pre-Flashpoint Earth-50 was the home of The Authority} [Sourcebook] + [Wiki].
•Grant Morrison was also involved in writing the Story.
•Connected with Captain Atom [The pre-Flastpoint], the Captain Atom comic is also stated to have 11 spatial dimensions, beyond space and time
•New 52 captain atom [11 Dimension beyond time and space].

so, calculation
Sphere of the gods 1B, beyond the Bleed
The Realm beyond oa far beyond the sphere of the gods, has been explained by Elazio in the cosmology thread.
So, if the monitor sphere beyond the SOG[12D] and the limbo[13D], then the monitor sphere is 14D

Looks good, right?

 

[Averroes1]

How many scans from you guys have already been rejected.

 

[Ramasugita11]

How many scans from you guys have already been rejected.

Actually, my thread yesterday didn't show the statement in the comic that 4D is a metaphysical realm, but now I have shown it.
So actually it can't be denied

 

[Ramasugita11]

I don’t think you get my point. So I’ll let the others look at your claim.

What do you think about it?

4-D world is metaphysical

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

What do you think about it?

Don’t agree. I made my stance clear.

 

[Ramasugita11]

Don’t agree. I made my stance clear.

Time is temporal dimension? 5dimension is physical dimension? 2 dimension is line? 1 dimension is point? Material is 3dimensional space? So, sixth dimension is phsycal dimension? Timestream is 4Dimensional space? Speed force is 4dimensional space? Hypertime is 4dimensional space? 4D green? This your stance?

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Time is temporal dimension? 5dimension is physical dimension? 2 dimension is line? 1 dimension is point? Material is 3dimensional space? So, sixth dimension is phsycal dimension? Timestream is 4Dimensional space? Speed force is 4dimensional space? Hypertime is 4dimensional space? 4D green? This your stance?

No. You mention this and I explained it to you. I never said anything directly about the Cosmology, I simply responded on your points being a little invalid.

 

[Ramasugita11]

No. You mention this and I explained it to you. I never said anything directly about the Cosmology, I simply responded on your points being a little invalid.

Can you explain it to me?

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Can you explain it to me?

I believe the way Elizio presented the tiering should stay as it is.

 

[Deleted member 30746]

Can you explain it to me?

Dude, you're really making everything more complicated. Crisis Cosmology has already been upgraded recently, and it also doesn't make sense to upgrade without seeing the outcome of Ultima's suggestions. If their suggestions are accepted, I can easily say that 1-B is suitable for the God Sphere. The most important thing we need is patience.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Dude, you're really making everything more complicated. Crisis Cosmology has already been upgraded recently, and it also doesn't make sense to upgrade without seeing the outcome of Ultima's suggestions. If their suggestions are accepted, I can easily say that 1-B is suitable for the God Sphere. The most important thing we need is patience.

Elizio believe that it might stay 1-B.

 

[Deleted member 30746]

Elizio believe that it might stay 1-B.

I was just saying about the sphere. There are characters that could qualify for 1-A for Crisis cosmology.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

I was just saying about the sphere. There are characters that could qualify for 1-A for Crisis cosmology.

Eh, with strict interpretation. Most likely not.

 

[Deleted member 30746]

Eh, with strict interpretation. Most likely not.

(in case the ultima's suggestions are accepted)

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

(in case the ultima's suggestions are accepted)

Yes, even with the revision since R>F on that scale is hard to prove unless we take some statements with higher intrepretation.

 

[Ramasugita11]

I believe the way Elizio

If the Bleed is 5D spatial, that claim raises many contradictions

more

You are the one who makes DC cosmology complicated, I have even understood DC cosmology for a long time

I have proof that the timestream is part of 4 dimensions and is expressed as 4 dimensions.

4-dimensional the green, beyond time and space materials.

4th dimensional warlogog, this stone transcends time and space, hourman has metaphysical 4th dimensional powers and the 5th dimension is beyond his abilities.

Speed force is fourth dimensional energy.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

If the Bleed is 5D spatial, that claim raises many contradictions

5D isn’t spatial. It’s 3 spatial dimensions + 1 dimensions of time + 1 hyperspace.

 

[Ramasugita11]

5D isn’t spatial. It’s 3 spatial dimensions + 1 dimensions of time + 1 hyperspace.

So, hyperspace is not spatial dimension beyond time-space?

We know that the explanation of dimensions is said to be 6 dimensions, 1=point, 2=line, 3=material, 4=time, 5=imagination and 6=impossibility.

So, where is the bleed in these 6 dimensions? and where is the sphere of the gods in these 6 dimensions?

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

So, hyperspace is not spatial dimension beyond time-space?

Hyperspace is super compact dimensions after space-time used to quantity the remaining 7 dimensional super gravity of M-Theory. Hence why Grant uses “hyper” a lot as akin to beyond normal/covential.

We know that the explanation of dimensions is said to be 6 dimensions, 1=point, 2=line, 3=material, 4=time, 5=imagination and 6=impossibility.

5th and 6th are levels that permeate reality. They’re not physics based dimensions.

So, where is the bleed in these 6 dimensions? and where is the sphere of the gods in these 6 dimensions?

The bleedspace is contained within the Orrery. The Bleed itself is a bulk and that flows through the connect reality and contains it like a “membrane.” These concepts are similar to the notion of M-Theory.

 

[Ramasugita11]

Hyperspace is super compact dimensions after space-time used to quantity the remaining 7 dimensional super gravity of M-Theory. Hence why Grant uses “hyper” a lot as akin to beyond normal/covential.

Doesn't that explain hyperspace as a physical dimension?

5th and 6th are levels that permeate reality

I know, so those places are in the 4th dimension? Cause there are only 6 dimensions described

The bleedspace is contained within the Orrery. The Bleed itself is a bulk and that flows through the connect reality and contains it like a “membrane.” These concepts are similar to the notion of M-Theory.

Yes, it is described as a brane that holds the physical realms of space and time and the 5th dimension is described as a mathematically higher dimension, so spatial dimension.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Doesn't that explain hyperspace as a physical dimension?

Relatively speaking it’s all mathematical.

I know, so those places are in the 4th dimension? Cause there are only 6 dimensions described

They’re not in the 4th Dimension. They exist within 4 dimensions. This means they experience the linearity of time. It’s not a realm.

Yes, it is described as a brane that holds the physical realms of space and time and the 5th dimension is described as a mathematically higher dimension, so spatial dimension.

Everything is math in the material realm.

 

[Ramasugita11]

Relatively speaking it’s all mathematical

I see what you mean, you say the 5th dimension is bleed, not spatial, but even so, the 5th dimension is mathematically based.
But in the comic the 5th spatial dimension is stated as a mathematical dimension and is influenced by physical fields, isn't this a spatial dimension?

They’re not in the 4th Dimension. They exist within 4 dimensions.

I have explained that the 4 Dimension are dimension that are beyond mathematics, beyond physical dimensions, beyond space and time.

According to old comics, hourman has metaphysical powers [worlogog, objects that
transcend time and space].
But the non-spatial 5th dimension is a place beyond the power of warlogogs and is stated to be trans-geometry.
So 4 dimensions is not the material world [spatial or temporal] in the 6 dimensional cosmology.

[Worlogog's power is a threat to all space, all time]

Everything is math in the material realm

Indirectly, physical space and time are within material dimensions which are said to be 3 dimension
So, my statement is correct

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

I see what you mean, you say the 5th dimension is bleed, not spatial, but even so, the 5th dimension is mathematically based.
But in the comic the 5th spatial dimension is stated as a mathematical dimension and is influenced by physical fields, isn't this a spatial dimension?

The Bleed is fifth dimensional. I never intended it to be the same as the “Fifth” Dimension from which the Imps hail from.

In older Morrison work, it was a mathematically higher realm but now it’s more a level of reality that embodies the concept of imagination and is no longer tied to magic.

As for whether it’s spatial or not would be determined by its position. Math and Physics both agree in the notion that “dimensions” has vector points that occupy space and also can be described in myriads as manifolds. Take V for vector space and M for manifold. Physics based dimensions for the most part has a sort of volume by linear scaling and they are dimensions of length, width, and height but they are consider quality with some degree of freedom. Math are easier to quantify while physics based dimension are more so….well better for measuring out quality.

Either way, it doesn’t matter since the basis is almost identical.

I have explained that the 4 Dimension are dimension that are beyond mathematics, beyond physical dimensions, beyond space and time.

Within physical space that dimensions occupy then no it’s not beyond math nor has DC ever described the 4th dimension which is temporal as above math. You haven’t even explained it correctly with the scan. You just nitpick the information(which does not mention being above math) and claim it is above math.

According to old comics, hourman has metaphysical powers [worlogog, objects that
transcend time and space].
But the non-spatial 5th dimension is a place beyond the power of warlogogs and is stated to be trans-geometry.
So 4 dimensions is not the material world [spatial or temporal] in the 6 dimensional cosmology.

Transcending time and space has little to correlate with being beyond physical dimensions.

Also, that’s not how 4th dimension is defined as the current information treats it as a temporal dimension. It’s “time” as described by Mxy. No one even claimed it was the material world, but the material realm function in four dimensions.

[Worlogog's power is a threat to all space, all time]

Cool. Everything in DC is.

Indirectly, physical space and time are within material dimensions which are said to be 3 dimension
So, my statement is correct

The material realms occupies the same logic as space-time. The “threat” does not specify the quantity of dimensions nor that any of those dimensions even have quality. Being a threat to the material world has no correlation to being a threat to just three dimensions as you try to prove that is the case with the physical world.

So, the statement you made is illogical.

 

[AerrowStorm1]

I'm waiting to see where Conner Kent ends up on the Heralds scaling before I do a big revision for some of his missing powers and abilities

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

I'm waiting to see where Conner Kent ends up on the Heralds scaling before I do a big revision for some of his missing powers and abilities

I believe I should step in on these matters.

 

[AerrowStorm1]

I believe I should step in on these matters.

Oh? I'm sorry. I didn't think I was stepping on any toes. Apologies.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Oh? I'm sorry. I didn't think I was stepping on any toes. Apologies.

Nothing to aplologies for. It was a joke that I take the matters into my own hands.

 

[Ramasugita11]

Wow, that makes DC cosmology messy and nonsensical

In older Morrison work, it was a mathematically higher realm but now it’s more a level of reality

In old comics it is quite clear that the 5th dimension is transgeometry [Here], you have to understand what transgeometry is
It is also stated that beyond creation[Here], creation is space and time.
Even defeating spectre and imps is beyond the capabilities of The Quintessence[Here].
It explains that the 5th dimension has long been applied metaphysically in comics and the physical 5th dimension, explained by Grant Morrison in the 2011 action comic.
The meaning is clear, there are 2 5th dimensions, physical and non-physical.

Within physical space that dimensions occupy then no it’s not beyond math nor has DC ever described the 4th dimension which is temporal as above math. You haven’t even explained it correctly with the scan. You just nitpick the information(which does not mention being above math) and claim it is above math.

A place statement that beyond mathematics huh?
It's in the swamp thing comic, the multiverse nexus [monitor satellite] beyond mathematics when swamp reaches that place[Here] and [Here]
The multiverse nexus is within the timestream, also not bound by the dimensions of space and not bound by time.
Timestream is metaphysical, because it includes speedforce and vanishing points within that realm.
[Read my previous explanation]

Transcending time and space has little to correlate with being beyond physical dimensions.

Also, that’s not how 4th dimension is defined as the current information treats it as a temporal dimension. It’s “time” as described by Mxy. No one even claimed it was the material world, but the material realm function in four dimensions

You obviously didn't read what was explained previously or perhaps, you don't understand.
The power of the worlogog is beyond the comprehension of metaphysical beings such as metron.
With the power of warlogog, hourman is able to stop time at the vanishing point. Vanishing point is a metaphysical realm.
Hourman's abilities beyond 3 dimensions, expressed as time, namely 4 dimensions, but physically and metaphysically about time.

With the feats I gave previously, such as the timestream 4D, the speed force 4D, the green 4D you should understand that 4Dimensions are not spatial/temporal dimensions.

 

[Ramasugita11]

There are only 6 dimensions, the sphere of the gods, the monitor sphere, the limbo, the speed force cannot possibly be in the 5 dimensions of imps, meaning these places are in 4 dimension [time] , time that is not physical like a timestream or hypertime. Time is the 4th dimension in Mr Mxy's explanation.
So 4D is metaphysical

 

[Averroes1]

Actually, my thread yesterday didn't show the statement in the comic that 4D is a metaphysical realm, but now I have shown it.
So actually it can't be denied

You do know they are farming you guys, right?

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Wow, that makes DC cosmology messy and nonsensical

You’re not helping it with these suggestion that no one has agreed to. Especially with Ultima revision going and the recent change that Elizio presented with good evidence of the scaling.

 

[Ramasugita11]

You’re not helping it with these suggestion that no one has agreed to. Especially with Ultima revision going and the recent change that Elizio presented with good evidence of the scaling.

I'm just using common sense, 4 Dimensions is time, time beyond time, time is metaphysical, like statements in comics, according to the author's statements, according to databook/guide

This better than "5D bleed within the 4th dimension plane but 4th domension is temporal dimension"

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

I'm just using common sense, 4 Dimensions is time, time beyond time, time is metaphysical, like statements in comics, according to the author's statements, according to databook/guide

Try not to use author statements not guidebooks.

This better than "5D bleed within the 4th dimension plane but 4th domension is temporal dimension"

We use space-time that’s what consider the “4th dimensional plane.” The Bleed is 5D that would upscale the Orrery to that same logic as well.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler2]

Can anyone explain why we still use the logic that the Presence = Overvoid = Source? This was always a theory and not an actual thing in the comic.