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General DC Comics Discussion Thread

IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
It's good. Now, moving on, I wanted to look over the tiers on the cosmology page to see if they're adequately explained.

Grant Morrison's/Scott Snyder's/James Tynion IV's Cosmology​

  1. The Orrery of Worlds is 2-C for containing 52 universes and Hypertime is 2-A for storing infinite universes. This is straightforward with no further elaboration needed.
  2. The Sphere of the Gods is 2-C for containing 8 realms that exist on a higher plane of existence than the Orrery and Hypertime but without evidence for qualitative superiority. Straightforward enough.
  3. The Fifth Dimension is 5D Low 1-C because it transcends the multiverse's 4D axis and the Monitor Sphere is also 5D Low 1-C because it sits slightly higher than the Fifth Dimension. Straightforward enough.
  4. The Sixth Dimension is 6D Low 1-C because it dwarfs everything else in creation, even the Fifth Dimension. Straightforward enough.
  5. Monitor-Mind The Overvoid/The Source/The Presence is 7D 1-C because it entirely transcends the entire DC cosmology and views it as a small "flaw" in its infinite consciousness. Straightforward enough.
Overall, this cosmology is straightforward in its tiers and requires no immediate rewriting.

J.M. DeMatteis' Cosmology​

  1. The multiverse is 2-A because there are infinite universes. No explanation is needed.
  2. Heaven is 5D Low 1-C because it transcends the material realms with days and places that transcend days and places. Simple enough.
  3. The totality of creation is High 1-B. I've already explained why this rating is invalid and is just a holdover from before the discussion finished, so that part of the paragraph should be removed.
  4. Mahapralaya/Pralaya/Sea of Brahma is Low 1-C, possibly 1-C, but I fail to see how its explanation can justify that. It exists as the infinite ocean that dwarfs and birthed creation, which is sufficient justification for 6D Low 1-C if we remove High 1-B from the equation, but I don't see where "possibly 1-C" comes from.
  5. The Divine Presence/The Smile/God is 1-C, possibly High 1-C, but again, I fail to see how its explanation can justify that. It exists as the ultimate reality that transcends even Mahapralaya, which is sufficient justification for 7D 1-C if we accept my interpretation of Mahapralaya, but I don't see where "possibly High 1-C" comes from. Even as it now stands, "possibly High 1-C" doesn't seem warranted, as Mahapralaya's "possibly 1-C" doesn't specify to what degree.
I believe at least three things in this cosmology need a rewrite (Remove High 1-B, make Mahapralaya/Pralaya/Sea of Brahma 6D Low 1-C, make The Divine Presence/The Smile/God 7D 1-C), the first of which staff has already agreed to.

Vertigo's Cosmology​

  1. The Presence's creation is 2-A for having infinite timelines. This section is extremely barebones with no scans displayed on the page, and its justification seems a bit weak (Having infinite possible futures doesn't exactly imply infinite timelines).
  2. Heaven, Silver City, and Hell are 5D Low 1-C because they transcend and dwarf creation. Simple enough, and my gripes with 2-A's justification don't affect this because transcending anything in Tier 2 is Low 1-C.
  3. Beyond this point, Vertigo's cosmology explanation is longer than the other two by a wide margin, so I'll just summarize my gripes quickly. A lot of the characters in this section are Low 1-C, possibly 1-C, and the final entity is 1-C, which seems inadequately explained for just about all of them, so I'll need someone to walk me through the tiers and explain.
This cosmology is probably the least readable of the three on the page right now and needs some major reformatting to make it more understandable, which I don't know where to begin with.
Click to expand...
@Elizio33 @Firestorm808 @Eficiente @PrinceofPein @LuciferDC099

What do you think?
 
IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
The Sphere of the Gods is 2-C for containing 8 realms that exist on a higher plane of existence than the Orrery and Hypertime but without evidence for qualitative superiority. Straightforward enough
Click to expand...
What i want says is not really tier Upgrade, just to say that to reach the sphere you need a range higher than 2-A, I think it should be said on the cosmology page
 
Reality Warping: (Each hit from Diana shakes stars)
On wander woman's page.
I can't make this shit up. Who approved this 💀
 
Please link to the page in question. Perhaps it was vandalised without anybody noticing yet.
 
Antvasima said:
Please link to the page in question. Perhaps it was vandalised without anybody noticing yet.
Click to expand...
vsbattles.fandom.com

Wonder Woman (Post-Flashpoint)

Wonder Woman is a fictional character appearing in American comic books published by DC Comics. The character is a demigoddess and warrior princess of the Amazons (who are based on the Amazons of Greek mythology) and is known in her homeland as Princess Diana of Themyscira. Tier: 4-B | 4-B | 4-B...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com
 
I have handled it.
 
Antvasima said:
Please elaborate.
Click to expand...
the Joker in the episode tried to turn into Batman in a twisted way, but since you know if there is a new Batman, there must be a new Joker, so he created a deadly poison that transforms and kill people by raising their "laughter" levels, and he gave a specific variant to Batman to become the new Joker even if he is dead due the Poison
 
Okay. Perhaps Scott Snyder was inspired by that episode then?
 
Two things:
  1. Power-scaling Rules for Marvel and DC Comics has this example for illogical scaling: "Wonder Woman has been injured by regular bullets, but is stronger than Wonder Girl (Cassandra Sandsmark), who has caused Superboy Prime to spit blood with a kick, who has overpowered The Darkest Knight, who killed Perpetua, who is one of The Hands of Creation. (1-A regular bullets)". DC isn't 1-A anymore, so should this be removed from the list?
  2. DC's verse page says the DC universe in pre-Crisis and post-Crisis were accepted as infinite, but that was rejected in the new cosmology page, so this section should probably be removed. However, the cosmology split only covers Post-Crisis, New 52, and Rebirth, not Earth-Two or Pre-Crisis, so those should still be addressed at some point.
 
IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
Two things:
  1. Power-scaling Rules for Marvel and DC Comics has this example for illogical scaling: "Wonder Woman has been injured by regular bullets, but is stronger than Wonder Girl (Cassandra Sandsmark), who has caused Superboy Prime to spit blood with a kick, who has overpowered The Darkest Knight, who killed Perpetua, who is one of The Hands of Creation. (1-A regular bullets)". DC isn't 1-A anymore, so should this be removed from the list?
Click to expand...
I just updated the statistic to Low 1-C.
IdiosyncraticLawyer said:
  1. DC's verse page says the DC universe in pre-Crisis and post-Crisis were accepted as infinite, but that was rejected in the new cosmology page, so this section should probably be removed. However, the cosmology split only covers Post-Crisis, New 52, and Rebirth, not Earth-Two or Pre-Crisis, so those should still be addressed at some point.
Click to expand...
@Deagonx @Elizio33 @Firestorm808

Are any of you willing to handle that please?
 
Which do yall prefer?​
il_fullxfull.1983216666_az0b.jpg
Fr0_m2zXwAEo8Hn.jpg:large
 
Deagonx said:
We were still implementing the revisions so we decided to hold off at the time. Im not sure what Elizio plans for that.
Click to expand...
These are currently the only 1-A profiles left

John Constantine (Classic)
Swamp Thing (Classic)
The Basanos
The City of Stars
Black Alice (Post-Flashpoint)
Chrysalis (Eternity Girl)
The Writer

And here are the Low 1-C guys who are supposed to be 2-C - 2-A now

Flash (Post-Flashpoint)
Flash (Wally West) (Rebirth)
The Joker (Post-Crisis)
Zoom (Hunter Zolomon) (Rebirth)

Is this it?
 
NHTkenshin2 said:
These are currently the only 1-A profiles left

John Constantine (Classic)
Swamp Thing (Classic)
The Basanos
The City of Stars
Black Alice (Post-Flashpoint)
Chrysalis (Eternity Girl)
The Writer

And here are the Low 1-C guys who are supposed to be 2-C - 2-A now

Flash (Post-Flashpoint)
Flash (Wally West) (Rebirth)
The Joker (Post-Crisis)
Zoom (Hunter Zolomon) (Rebirth)

Is this it?
Click to expand...
Thank you for the summary. 🙏

@Elizio33 @Deagonx @Firestorm808 @Eficiente @PrinceofPein @LuciferDC099

Are any of you willing to handle it please?
 
What are we doing with the Writer now? Its pretty clear he exists in Limbo (far lower actually) so should we just delete the profile?
 
NHTkenshin2 said:
These are currently the only 1-A profiles left

John Constantine (Classic)
Swamp Thing (Classic)
The Basanos
The City of Stars
Black Alice (Post-Flashpoint)
Chrysalis (Eternity Girl)
The Writer

And here are the Low 1-C guys who are supposed to be 2-C - 2-A now

Flash (Post-Flashpoint)
Flash (Wally West) (Rebirth)
The Joker (Post-Crisis)
Zoom (Hunter Zolomon) (Rebirth)

Is this it?
Click to expand...
Has this been handled already? Or opened?
 
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