First Baby, THEN Infinite Zamasu.

[omegabronic]

Omega, he had more than 24 hours to comment and he didn't comment, he had more than a week to reopen the topic and he didn't ask, he never even commented after we argued against it

real life business, everyone has their own busy lives and real life issues, the topic wasn't rejected, so i asked it to be opened so then i can be evaluated by staff

, you were the only one who reopened this topic because of nothing, when you mentioned him on your wall, he didn't reply to you about it and he didn't want you to open it, thanks for opening something for nothing, and a topic doesn't have to be just rejected by the team, seeing that many disagreed and a supportive member.

dude, that is not how it works here, support memebers don't have enough power to decide when a thread is over and should be closed, that relies on staff to decide, this is how always worked here, again, if this thread did had a proper evaluation by staff, i wouldn't have done anything

Omega, not only because I disagree with you, everyone already understands that you hate DB excessively

again, personal belief on what i feel is not an argument

, you don't accept the arguments of others

except when i agreed with arguments before, regardless, me disagreeing with argument is extremely normal for everyone to do in everything, this is how arguments work

you can very well go there and report me if you want, but that will cause me nothing in relation to what what others think of you, even Nullflower already mentioned that you hate DB in an old thread.

you are the only one who ever accused me of being a hater, your word is not everyone's, and relax, i will not, i just said that because you said you would, but rest assured, i know that this stuff is not report worthy, neither is being a """"hater""""

Not a boast it’s a explanation because Goku thought he’d go to the afterlife

i was talking about the matter manipulation part, whatever other hax you are proposing would likely required another thread

that doesn’t seem report worthy but I agree that they don’t help

yeah i got a little heated there, sorry for that

 

[Duedate8898]

I'm going to be honest, this reads more like hyperbole than an actual thing being possible for baby. The OP actually does show a great example of how what baby is talking about falls in league with normal hyping up ones attack or how in dragon ball (Gohan and Trunks) enough energy just allows you to destroy your opponent on such a level. Especially since his explanation as to why the attack would stop goku from resurrecting doesn't really line up with how resurrection has worked since Z. Being destroyed on the atomic level as we've seen done with the likes of Cell and Frieza who were resurrected in GT, clearly doesn't stop people from going to the other world and Baby lacks any other none means to prevent such a thing. Without greater feats or explanation I fail to see why this would be accepted as matter manipulation, much more anything else.

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Being destroyed on the atomic level as we've seen done with the likes of Cell and Frieza who were resurrected in GT, clearly doesn't stop people from going to the other world and Baby lacks any other none means to prevent such a thing.

That just further proves that Baby was going to destroy Goku's soul

 

[pineappleman]

The OP actually does show a great example of how what baby is talking about falls in league with normal hyping up ones attack or how in dragon ball (Gohan and Trunks) enough energy just allows you to destroy your opponent on such a level.

I disagree, the examples listed in the OP do not correlate with Baby's statements. Because the examples are outright boasts. 'I will do yadi yadi yada.' Baby's statements are thorough explanations, incomparable to the statements of Piccolo and Vegeta.
'No, you won't see the afterlife because my attack will hax your atoms so much you won't be able to return to life' is not the same as 'I'm gonna vaporize your ass', not at all.

Especially since his explanation as to why the attack would stop goku from resurrecting doesn't really line up with how resurrection has worked since Z. Being destroyed on the atomic level as we've seen done with the likes of Cell and Frieza who were resurrected in GT, clearly doesn't stop people from going to the other world and Baby lacks any other none means to prevent such a thing. Without greater feats or explanation I fail to see why this would be accepted as matter manipulation, much more anything else.

This is actually a point in our favor. Being destroyed on an atomic level has no hax in DB, but Baby's Revenge Death Ball does.

 

[omegabronic]

I disagree, the examples listed in the OP do not correlate with Baby's statements. Because the examples are outright boasts. 'I will do yadi yadi yada.' Baby's statements are thorough explanations, incomparable to the statements of Piccolo and Vegeta.
'No, you won't see the afterlife because my attack will hax your atoms so much you won't be able to return to life' is not the same as 'I'm gonna vaporize your ass', not at all.

goku wouldn't even have a body to see things in the afterlife if his body gets destroyed, as shown with chiaotzu in the sayan saga

This is actually a point in our favor. Being destroyed on an atomic level has no hax in DB, but Baby's Revenge Death Ball does.

completely destroying a body will prevent goku from coming back to life

 

[pineappleman]

goku wouldn't even have a body to see things in the afterlife if his body gets destroyed, as shown with chiaotzu in the sayan saga


completely destroying a body will prevent goku from coming back to life

Come on now, you know well that that's been retconned. Do I really have to bring up examples?

 

[Duedate8898]

That just further proves that Baby was going to destroy Goku's soul

No it doesn't, he does not mention destroying the soul any in his rant. He in-fact specifies the destruction of Goku's body and nothing about the soul in as to why Goku wouldn't return.

I disagree, the examples listed in the OP do not correlate with Baby's statements. Because the examples are outright boasts. 'I will do yadi yadi yada.' Baby's statements are thorough explanations, incomparable to the statements of Piccolo and Vegeta.
'No, you won't see the afterlife because my attack will hax your atoms so much you won't be able to return to life' is not the same as 'I'm gonna vaporize your ass', not at all.

I would actually say its the exact same cause its done under the same pretense. Cause its not really a thorough explanation, he's like I'll destroy your molecules-no your atoms! Stuff like that isn't being thorough but doing the best to sound as menacing as possible.

This is actually a point in our favor. Being destroyed on an atomic level has no hax in DB, but Baby's Revenge Death Ball does.

Again, no it isn't. Atomic destruction before this never stopped resurrection and after still doesn't, so with the explanation he gave it's incongruent. He's just hyping himself up.

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

No it doesn't, he does not mention destroying the soul any in his rant. He in-fact specifies the destruction of Goku's body and nothing about the soul in as to why Goku wouldn't return.

Not going to the afterlife, the place of souls, sure as hell sounds like Soul destruction

 

[Nullflowerblush]

Baby never claimed to be able to prevent his ascension to Other World, he claimed to prevent his resurrection.

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Kid Buu was destroyed by Goku's Spirit Bomb attack, which reduced him to nothing but a cloud of atoms. Despite this, Kid Buu was still able to move on to the afterlife, indicating that even if a character's body is completely destroyed, their spirit or soul can still move on to the afterlife.

This suggests that Baby's statement about Goku not being able to go to the afterlife after being hit with the Revenge Death Ball was not simply a matter of physical destruction, but rather a statement about the nature of the attack itself, and its ability to destroy body and soul

Baby never claimed to be able to prevent his ascension to Other World, he claimed to prevent his resurrection.

Nah, he said "Don't be absurd, Saiyan!" to Goku saying "This really may turn out to be the last sight I take with me to into the next world (Otherworld)"
So he's most likely talking about how Goku wouldn't even get "revived" in the Otherworld

While it's possible to interpret Baby's statement in different ways, the most straightforward interpretation is that he was referring to the destruction of both Goku's body and soul, which would prevent him from ascending to Other World after death AND his resurrection.

 

[Duedate8898]

I would agree if his explanation for as to why Goku wouldn't go to the afterlife doesn't work within the setting of dragon ball.

Set me as agree with the OP

 

[omegabronic]

Come on now, you know well that that's been retconned. Do I really have to bring up examples?

yes you do, with scans if possible

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

Plus, even if we take it as him simply preventing his resurrection, it still would have to destroy him beyond what Cell and Frieza got (Which would be atomization)

 

[omegabronic]

Plus, even if we take it as him simply preventing his resurrection, it still would have to destroy him beyond what Cell and Frieza got (Which would be atomization)

it wouldn't, that would only be resurrection negation

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

it wouldn't, that would only be resurrection negation

I'm going off you saying this

Completely destroying a body will prevent goku from coming back to life

 

[God900]

it wouldn't, that would only be resurrection negation

You never give up, right?.........


Man, your guts and determination are to admire

 

[pineappleman]

yes you do, with scans if possible

no scans needed, kid buu nuked the entire earth destroying all of the earthling's bodies and they were still revived

No it doesn't, he does not mention destroying the soul any in his rant. He in-fact specifies the destruction of Goku's body and nothing about the soul in as to why Goku wouldn't return.

I would actually say its the exact same cause its done under the same pretense. Cause its not really a thorough explanation, he's like I'll destroy your molecules-no your atoms! Stuff like that isn't being thorough but doing the best to sound as menacing as possible.

Again, no it isn't. Atomic destruction before this never stopped resurrection and after still doesn't, so with the explanation he gave it's incongruent. He's just hyping himself up.

The argument of 'no it's just him hyping himself up' and that it's similar to the examples in the OP literally only works if you disregard the context.
Which is exactly what you're doing, quoting just the 'I'll destroy your molecules!' part and disregarding the context of the conversation that I already showcased in my post before this thread got locked the first time around.

 

[omegabronic]

I'm going off you saying this

oh, that is saying that the state of body matters for the resurrection to work, if you get resurrection to work, if your body doesn't have an arm, then you will be revived without an arm, if your body is atomized, well, your body will not have the nescesary things to be alive and thus the resurrection will not work

You never give up, right?.........


Man, your guts and determination are to admire

playing undertale and sonic gave me the highest level of supernatural willpower, determination is my middle name

 

[omegabronic]

no scans needed, kid buu nuked the entire earth destroying all of the earthling's bodies and they were still revived

give me scans for context dude, that is important, also wasn't that with the stronger dragon balls of namek?

 

[Nullflowerblush]

Porunga explicitly recreates the bodies of the dead, as was the case with the Z-Fighters following the War on Namek.

During the King Piccolo Saga, the bodies of the warriors murdered by the Demon Clan had to be preserved for when Shenron was revived, as a wish to resurrect them would have been useless otherwise.

 

[God900]

playing undertale and sonic gave me the highest level of supernatural willpower, determination is my middle name

No cap

You have an inmense Willpower.

Like, 1-A at least

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

I mean, didn't that guy that died to Tao Pai Pai have a spear rupture his chest, but was revived without any wounds?

 

[Duedate8898]

no scans needed, kid buu nuked the entire earth destroying all of the earthling's bodies and they were still revived

The argument of 'no it's just him hyping himself up' and that it's similar to the examples in the OP literally only works if you disregard the context.
Which is exactly what you're doing, quoting just the 'I'll destroy your molecules!' part and disregarding the context of the conversation that I already showcased in my post before this thread got locked the first time around.

I read the context, the context just doesn't give enough credence to make me believe that baby is doing anything more than hyping up how he's about to kill Goku.

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

Why is all the context being ignored when it’s Baby responding to Goku saying this will be the last thing he sees before he dies and Baby corrects him that’ll he’ll scatter his atoms and turn him back to the space dust he originally was I don’t see any boasting here he just explains how his attack works and why he won’t go to the afterlife

I disagree on the basis that it is not a boast, but an explanation.
Baby Vegeta in that scene was not just exclaiming how hard he'd pwn Goku with his attack and stroking his ego, he was explaining why Goku would not be sent to the Afterlife after he'd said the following:

Now that we're on the subject however, what could Baby's attacks denying rebirth/being sent to the Afterlife add to his profile?

 

[Nullflowerblush]

turn him back to the space dust he originally was

He was space dust?

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

I read the context, the context just doesn't give enough credence to make me believe that baby is doing anything more than hyping up how he's about to kill Goku.

How? Goku says Baby's attack will be the last thing he sees before going to the afterlife, and Baby responds by saying tha he won't be going to the afterlife, and that his attack will destroy Goku beyond the point of resurrection
Edit: Ninjaed

 

[omegabronic]

How? Goku says Baby's attack will be the last thing he sees before going to the afterlife, and Baby responds by saying tha he won't be going to the afterlife, and that his attack will destroy Goku beyond the point of resurrection
Edit: Ninjaed

he doesn't say that he will not be going to the afterlife, he says that he will not be able to come back to life

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

he doesn't say that he will not be going to the afterlife, he says that he will not be able to come back to life

"Don't be absurd" is basically a "no"
Which means Goku's first statement was false, a.k.a he's not going to the "next world"

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

He was space dust?

Planetary scientist and stardust expert Dr Ashley King explains. 'It is totally 100% true: nearly all the elements in the human body were made in a star and many have come through several supernovas.

 

[Nullflowerblush]

If this means anything, neither the GT Perfect File nor the Chouzenshuu 4 (allegedly) make mention of or reference to Baby"s "I'll break you down to your molecules- no, wait, I meant your atoms" spiel, which would be strange to omit if said spiel was a thorough, accurate, and not a boastful, threatening taunt perpetuated by endless hatred description of the technique's ability. Then again, they are supplementary information.

 

[omegabronic]

"Don't be absurd" is basically a "no"
Which means Goku's first statement was false, a.k.a he's not going to the "next world"

or its just him being annoyed and mocking goku for seemingly mocking him by not taking the situation seriously

 

[pineappleman]

give me scans for context dude, that is important, also wasn't that with the stronger dragon balls of namek?

Baby is aware of Black Star Shenron's existence, which is an even more powerful Dragon

 

[omegabronic]

Baby is aware of Black Star Shenron's existence, which is an even more powerful Dragon

proof of that?

 

[pineappleman]

If this means anything, neither the GT Perfect File nor the Chouzenshuu 4 (allegedly) make mention of or reference to Baby"s "I'll break you down to your molecules- no, wait, I meant your atoms" spiel, which would be strange to omit if said spiel was a thorough, accurate, and not a boastful, threatening taunt perpetuated by endless hatred description of the technique's ability. Then again, they are supplementary information.

Those aren't the full GT Perfect Files vol. 1 translations, a full translation doesn't exist so unless you can provide that with proper scans your point is moot.

 

[pineappleman]

proof of that?

Black Star Shenron can grant any wish, as opposed to the others that have limitations.

 

[Golden_Void]

I think its just an AP gap. This is base, beat-up, Kid Goku. Frieza said he did the same thing to Krillin and the only different ability Frieza has compared to most of the cast is telekinesis.

 

[Ped2018]

I think its just an AP gap. This is base, beat-up, Kid Goku. Frieza said he did the same thing to Krillin and the only different ability Frieza has compared to most of the cast is telekinesis.

This would still grant him this ability

 

[Adem_Warlock69]

I think its just an AP gap. This is base, beat-up, Kid Goku. Frieza said he did the same thing to Krillin and the only different ability Frieza has compared to most of the cast is telekinesis.

Krillin was revived tho

 

[omegabronic]

Krillin was revived tho

with the stronger namek dragon balls

 

[Nullflowerblush]

Those aren't the full GT Perfect Files vol. 1 translations, a full translation doesn't exist so unless you can provide that with proper scans your point is moot.

Doesn't look like there is anything for special attacks at all ¯\(ツ)/¯