Final Fantasy Discussion Thread

[TartaChocholate]

What is Jenova doing here? Does she teleport the party or is she messing with Barret's mind? And is that strong gust of wind her doing?

Jenova is actually messing with Barret's perceptions. She knocked out the rest of the party and made Barret unable to see them or his surroundings clearly before appearing as Tifa, possibly to make him panic. The winds doesn't really seem to be there as much as part of the illusion Barret fell into.

This is less ambiguous with the explanation given in the Kids Are Alright novel where Jenova's abilities are more clearly detailed: while she can shapeshift, the way she tricks other people is by tricking their mind to make others see her as someone that can be found in their memory.

 

[Quibster]

Should we specify the number of people Meteor Survivor summons through Azem's Crystal, and the job composition of those who come to aid him?

Generally it's,

2 Tanks, 2 Healers, 4 DPS... all of which are 2-A.

 

[Hypertornado099]

Should we specify the number of people Meteor Survivor summons through Azem's Crystal, and the job composition of those who come to aid him?

Generally it's,

2 Tanks, 2 Healers, 4 DPS... all of which are 2-A.

Yeah but say that the roles they have are unknown

 

[Hypertornado099]

Jenova is actually messing with Barret's perceptions. She knocked out the rest of the party and made Barret unable to see them or his surroundings clearly before appearing as Tifa, possibly to make him panic. The winds doesn't really seem to be there as much as part of the illusion Barret fell into.

This is less ambiguous with the explanation given in the Kids Are Alright novel where Jenova's abilities are more clearly detailed: while she can shapeshift

Okay

the way she tricks other people is by tricking their mind to make others see her as someone that can be found in their memory.

Isn't this referencing her ability to read memories and shapeshift?

 

[Hypertornado099]

Peeking in here to ask

Any progress or word of Endwalker revisions? Emet needs a profile... I'd love to help out!

I finished watching all of the MSQs, I've gathered every feat for Emet. I'll list some of them here

• Immortality (Type 6, Is able to possess other bodies after death)
• Shapeshifting (Can change his form and appearance)
• Illusion Creation (Spoke with the Scions using an illusion. Created a projection of Ryne)
• Teleportation (Can teleport. Has the ability to teleport before he became an Ascian too)
• Extrasensory Perception (Sensed a change in the Lifestream after Y'shtola used Flow to enter it. Created an aetherial lamp which glowed at spots closer to the Lifestream)
• Soul Manipulation (Plucked Y'shtola's spirit out of the Lifestream. He had to do this at a location closer to the Lifestream, however)
• Power Bestowal, Light Manipulation (Gave Vauthry his powers by doing something to his pregnant mother)
• BFR (Teleports G'raha away)

For Themis

• Energy Manipulation, Power Bestowal (Created a protective spell over Pandaemonium. It will break if he loses concentration. Gave power to Erichthonios)
• Power Mimicry, Soul Manipulation, Duplication (Created 7 warriors using the Warrior of Light's aether as a basis, who have similar powers to the Warriors of Light. Made it so the Warrior of Light could summon these warriors anytime he needed)
• Likely BFR (Possibly teleported the Warrior of Light away, though it might have been the work of Erichthonios)
• Light Manipulation (Generates light in order to blind Hesperos)
• Extrasensory Perception (Senses a disturbance in Abyssos)
• Energy Projection (Uses a magic spell which broke a telekinesis spell which restrained Erichthonios)
• Other feats: Broke Hesperos' spell by punching it

 

[TartaChocholate]

Isn't this referencing her ability to read memories and shapeshift?

It's a bit different actually. You see, in the story we have a girl named Kyrie casually talking with Kadaj (we find out that Kadaj took his name from this old friend of Kyrie) and when Tseng arrives he sees Kadaj as silver haired boy in black and with Jenova eyes, immediately recognizing a connection with Sephiroth, but he decides to stay casual and avoid trouble. When Kadaj leaves, he questions Kyrie about her connection to the boy and she mentions he's an old friend and describes him as a man with orange hair, a hooked nose and an earring (IIRC), a completely different physical appearance from what Tseng saw. Tseng then concludes that since he didn't know the original Kadaj he saw the boy as he truly was, while Kyrie was tricked as seeing the old friend from her memories.

If it had been straightforward shapeshifting, Tseng would have seen the orange haired man too instead of the silver haired boy.

 

[Dust_Collector]

Spoiler

It seemed pretty obvious in the final boss fight itself, but now we have confirmation from the Ultimania that Sephiroth can transcend worlds to exist and fight in several timelines at once

.

 

[Hypertornado099]

It seemed pretty obvious in the final boss fight itself

Spoilers man wtf

 

[Dust_Collector]

Oh shit I thought I put that in a spoiler tag didn't mean to have it all out like that

 

[Quibster]

New JP Livestream for Dawntrail;



Nothing super noteworthy in regards to site stuff beyond an updated map of the planet with the Collector's Edition (it looks really nice, actually..)

Early access also begins on June 28th. Finish your MSQ oomfies!!

 

[Quibster]

I finished watching all of the MSQs, I've gathered every feat for Emet. I'll list some of them here

• Immortality (Type 6, Is able to possess other bodies after death)
• Shapeshifting (Can change his form and appearance)
• Illusion Creation (Spoke with the Scions using an illusion. Created a projection of Ryne)
• Teleportation (Can teleport. Has the ability to teleport before he became an Ascian too)
• Extrasensory Perception (Sensed a change in the Lifestream after Y'shtola used Flow to enter it. Created an aetherial lamp which glowed at spots closer to the Lifestream)
• Soul Manipulation (Plucked Y'shtola's spirit out of the Lifestream. He had to do this at a location closer to the Lifestream, however)
• Power Bestowal, Light Manipulation (Gave Vauthry his powers by doing something to his pregnant mother)
• BFR (Teleports G'raha away)

For Themis

• Energy Manipulation, Power Bestowal (Created a protective spell over Pandaemonium. It will break if he loses concentration. Gave power to Erichthonios)
• Power Mimicry, Soul Manipulation, Duplication (Created 7 warriors using the Warrior of Light's aether as a basis, who have similar powers to the Warriors of Light. Made it so the Warrior of Light could summon these warriors anytime he needed)
• Likely BFR (Possibly teleported the Warrior of Light away, though it might have been the work of Erichthonios)
• Light Manipulation (Generates light in order to blind Hesperos)
• Extrasensory Perception (Senses a disturbance in Abyssos)
• Energy Projection (Uses a magic spell which broke a telekinesis spell which restrained Erichthonios)
• Other feats: Broke Hesperos' spell by punching it

Ty for compiling this!

 

[Cyberblader90]

Some ultimania stuff is out for rebirth

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Spoiler

It seemed pretty obvious in the final boss fight itself, but now we have confirmation from the Ultimania that Sephiroth can transcend worlds to exist and fight in several timelines at once

.

Spoiler

Tier 1 Sephiroth, when?

 

[TartaChocholate]

Spoiler

It seemed pretty obvious in the final boss fight itself, but now we have confirmation from the Ultimania that Sephiroth can transcend worlds to exist and fight in several timelines at once

.

Spoiler

Does this amount to anything? I am guessing Immortality Type 9, given IIRC Digimon Demon Lords had a similar justification for them.

Say, actually went ahead and spoiled myself the final battle and a couple of things, so some thoughts:

The final boss is actually Bizarro Sephiroth (Sephiroth Reborn is a more accurate translation of Rebirth Sephiroth, his name in Japanese both in Rebirth and the original game) and unlike Remake where the final cutscene duel against Cloud made it clear that he was just screwing around all the time, he didn't seem to be doing so this time around, actually he seemed to be defeated after the round against Cloud and Aerith. What prevents the party scaling to Sephiroth this time around? There's also the can of worms that is how much more powerful Sephiroth is this time around.

Even if we ignore the above, there's Cloud fighting alongside Zack as an equal during the very first round of the fight. The banter and their Synergy attack put emphasis on the good chemistry they both have and in no moment comes that Zack's carrying the fight.

Gilgamesh is an absolute riot. Though he doesn't use magic proper, he does use magical weaponry like the Excalibur or the Rune Axe.

Is there any more translated info on the Rebirth Ultimania, I don't have Twitter so I no longer can check Aitai's most recent translations.

 

[Theglassman12]

@TartaChocholate

Spoiler

More type 3 Acausality and some potential tier 1 stuff.

 

[TartaChocholate]

@TartaChocholate

Spoiler

More type 3 Acausality and some potential tier 1 stuff.

Spoiler

Type 3 makes a lot of sense.

Tier 1 stuff would be interesting, especially since otherwise Gilgamesh would mean that's pretty much the peak Remake can aspire to and we're surprisingly lacking feats to break from the Summon scaling.

EDIT: There's also this. After Remake Cloud and Survivor Zack's timelines converged, Sephiroth split them back with swing of the Masamune. Does that amount to anything?

EDIT 2: Confirmed it, it's a 2-C feat.

 

[TartaChocholate]

So, was looking arount at Rebirth and I actually did found an interesting feat:

Spoiler

There's this. After Remake Cloud and Survivor Zack's timelines converged, Sephiroth split them back with swing of the Masamune. I asked around and was told that splitting timelines is a 2-C feat. I may be missing context, but this could be a good one for Remake to stay apart from the original game.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

So, was looking arount at Rebirth and I actually did found an interesting feat:

Spoiler

There's this. After Remake Cloud and Survivor Zack's timelines converged, Sephiroth split them back with swing of the Masamune. I asked around and was told that splitting timelines is a 2-C feat. I may be missing context, but this could be a good one for Remake to stay apart from the original game.

Dang, that seems pretty legit. Wait, that means we can do a Sephiroth vs Vergil thread!

 

[TartaChocholate]

Dang, that seems pretty legit. Wait, that means can do a Sephiroth vs Vergil thread!

Spoiler

Devil Physiology go brrrr

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Spoiler

Devil Physiology go brrrr

Hey, it might still work out.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Hey everyone, I found this compilation of summaries/translations of stuff from the Final Fantasy VII Rebirth Ultimania. Read at your own risk, for there are big spoilers ahead.

Spoiler

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFVIIRemake/s/A7ty2pYc7g

 

[CrackerVolley]

Hey, should FF1 Garland and Jack Garland be given an "Articles About" box on the top of their pages since they're just two different iterations of the same character?

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Hey, should FF1 Garland and Jack Garland be given an "Articles About" box on the top of their pages since they're just two different iterations of the same character?

Probably. We do that for characters with similar situations, so that makes sense to me.

 

[Hypertornado099]

You can request that on that one thread in wiki management

 

[TartaChocholate]

Hey everyone, I found this compilation of summaries/translations of stuff from the Final Fantasy VII Rebirth Ultimania. Read at your own risk, for there are big spoilers ahead.

Spoiler

https://www.reddit.com/r/FFVIIRemake/s/A7ty2pYc7g

Pretty nice find, dude. Though it's mostly developers' thoughts on creating the key scenes of the game and stuff Dust brought up. We'll have to wait a bit longer for more info.

Spoiler

Funny how Cloud and Zack fighting Sephiroth together was almost pure fanservice on Nomura's part. It was still a pretty sweet scene.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Pretty nice find, dude. Though it's mostly developers' thoughts on creating the key scenes of the game and stuff Dust brought up. We'll have to wait a bit longer for more info.

Thanks. I just kind of found it randomly. Though, barely any of the book is summarized, which is understandable since it's over 750 pages long.

Spoiler

Funny how Cloud and Zack fighting Sephiroth together was almost pure fanservice on Nomura's part. It was still a pretty sweet scene.

That was pretty funny to read.

 

[TartaChocholate]

In all honesty, while I don't disagree with Gil being an outlier, even if he wasn't I'd still rather to scale the Remake continuity to their own feats and lore and slap "likely"/"possibly" like it was done for the original game for the crossover scaling. Just to not invalidate the stuff from the games themselves.

 

[TartaChocholate]

The Final Fantasy Tactics revision was accepted. I'm going to move to make a CRT for the stats and if everything goes well I'll update Ramza and Ultima's profiles and work on Zodiark's

 

[TartaChocholate]

CRT for Tactics' stats is up if anyone is curious:

Final Fantasy Tactics: Ye Olde Statistics Update (and a few Resistances)

Second part of the revision for Final Fantasy Tactics, this time tackling stats. I really wanted to split it by the game's chapters but the process was being too slow between finding proper feats and getting the calculations (maybe in the future), so I'll just be adding the endgame statistics...

vsbattles.com

 

[LazerDim8000]

Do y’all agree that the creator made all the crystals from 1-6 ? Because a more recent source categorizes each world as dimensions and iirc the crystals have been consistently said to be formed inside the void and him being the creator is vague and has plot holes imo. Might make a downgrade soon.

 

[Theglassman12]

He literally states he’s the one who sent the crystals across 1-6’s worlds. You’d have to ignore the entire background of After Years to claim he wouldn’t scale to the crystals.

 

[LazerDim8000]

Can I see the scans where he specifically says so ? Whatever claims he made in after years has been retconned by stranger of paradise. The Crystals are intricately tied to darkness, light, harmony and chaos. unless you’re claiming he scales above these forces I cannot see how he created them.

 

[Theglassman12]

2:45 of this video he talks about this. Plus the darkness and light stuff in SoP doesn’t retcon anything when he has the crystals from FF3 in his disposal when the darkness monsters shows up from them, the same game that talks about the balance of light and darkness with the crystals.

 

[LazerDim8000]

Again, the notion that ff1-6 are in the same universe has been retconned which in turn disqualifies any prior statement he made. And sure he created the crystals of his world or universe, but the same can be said for every other character who did so e.g Ultima from ff16. Doesn’t mean they created literally all the crystals, the appearance of other world monsters isn’t something uncommon. Most likely unplanned homages

 

[Theglassman12]

FF1-6 being separate worlds doesn’t really retcon shit, that’s been a thing for a while. The creator still created and sent the crystals to their respective worlds, plus his technology and wisdom are beyond stuff even the 4 crew have any comprehension of, and they’re fully aware of spaceships that can go to the moon and worlds with distorted flows of time

 

[LazerDim8000]

No, it wouldn’t make sense because stranger of paradise treats all the worlds including 4 as entirely separate dimensions. Ff 1 already has a solid background for how the Crystal was formed something that was even resounded in stranger of paradise with no mention of the creator at all . I’m literally not seeing how the creator comes into place with these new sources. you’re indirectly suggesting he’s more knowledgeable and superior to lufenians ? The people who literally monitor the entire multiverse ?

 

[Hypertornado099]

Do y’all agree that the creator made all the crystals from 1-6 ? Because a more recent source categorizes each world as dimensions and iirc the crystals have been consistently said to be formed inside the void and him being the creator is vague and has plot holes imo. Might make a downgrade soon.

Its entirely possible he sent them through different dimensions. Some of the characters the crystals recreated in the after years are from other dimensions, (bosses from FFIII and FFII's alternate world)

 

[Hypertornado099]

you’re indirectly suggesting he’s more knowledgeable and superior to lufenians

I don't understand why this would mean he's more knowledgeable than them and why that would contradict a thing

 

[LazerDim8000]

Its entirely possible he sent them through different dimensions. Some of the characters the crystals recreated in the after years are from other dimensions, (bosses from FFIII and FFII's alternate world)

And how exactly did he do so ? What scan proves he sent them through different dimensions ? The existence of different monsters is something the devs do literally most if not all the time. It’s simply paying homage

 

[LazerDim8000]

I don't understand why this would mean he's more knowledgeable than them and why that would contradict a thing

Right now the ff1-6 worlds are treated as being in the same universe which the lufenians in SOP contradict