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Battleboarders trying to read a series to just enjoy the story without looking for things to wank to prove their characters can beat Goku (CHALLENGE LEVEL: IMPOSSIBLE!!!)
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f/sn saber infinite attack speed scaling
- Thread starter BasedNecoScaler69
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No one can beat neco arc
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Because Shirou is not an objectively correct narrator in regards to anything, and consistently utilizes hyperbole even in his thoughts. You know, kinda like a normal human being? Normal people don't constantly try to say everything with 100% accuracy
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- #84
many characters in the nasuverse can clap gokus cheeks, thats not the point of this post
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Definitely not most Servants, who get blitzed and oneshot with any reasonable interpretation
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neither was Goku the actual point of my post.
can you actually reply to my earlier retort to you earlier on? unless you did and I missed it.
@MrBallins come on let's not derail this into Goku. I just used him for the joke.
Vietthai96
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why this suddenly turned from F/SN revision into psuedo-vs Goku thread???
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- #88
which?
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"erm acktually, this is f/ha" but idk
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I am the lord of thread derailment, but anything for you, sweetcheeks.
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post 66.
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- #92
"shirou" in f/ha isnt actually shirou he's angra
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I know that, pointing this out does absolutely nothing. If anything it kinda supports my case, considering Angra's state in HA as a whole
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1. servants are actively nerfed by both the counter force and gaia and 2. commad spells are given power by the holy grail, which has a direct path to the akasha.
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Vietthai96
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Anyway, Command Spell literaly can perform teleportation regard the distance between Master and Servant, so i think the contexts here is refering to teleportation. Also even if we accept this, Command Spell require the present of Master, it is too restricted situation and require outside help, i don't think we can put that into profile, unless you start scaling everyone to Infinite Speed from Saber
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oh my god, Seth's wank actually spread. the Holy Grail is genuinely shit. that was one of its main plot twist. just look how it planned to deal with Kiritsugu's wish. it literally needs seven Servants for fuel. even Enkidu supposedly is a better wish granter. Akasha/Root scaling is not given out like candy. it is a rare and serious thing. the grail has a pathway to it, but it's a very poor one with extremely limited use.
ah yes, please explain to me and provide evidence as to how Gaia and the Counter Force nerf Servants from infinite speed gods with other crazy shit to what they are shown to be? yes, they are nerfed via containers, but we saw Solomon in a Grand Container. ******* Andersen intercepted his attack and survived it, though with great damage.
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Servants are nerfed by their containers, and the level of nerf highly varies from Servant to Servant, depending on their original power.
Command Spells are given by the Grail, but they are ultimately just massive mana tanks. They can let your Servants teleport and do pseudo-true magic shit three times, but you cannot just make your Servant get infinite stats for an instant. Like, the passage of time in this was pretty obviously communicated if you look at the entire scene as opposed to just a few hyperbolic lines
Moreover, even if we use his narration, Shirou mentions that he needs her to jump right after the shot is released. If it was infinite speed then this would not be possible, as her moving any time later than his shot would mean that Shirou would be hit
Moreover, the grail itself is... not really all that it is cranked up to be, most of it was a ******* lie in the first place. It is very heavily limited
No, he is referring to Shirou's narration mentioning that Hrunting took no time to reduce the distance to zero, which is literally textbook hyperbole for "It was really fast", alongside other such examples like "As fast as lightning". Newsflash, most authors utilize literary devices when writing to make the prose more interesting, they are not trying to write a ******* research paper
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- #100
if you've seen the fight, saber still has a path, also nowhere in the vn does it say that she teleported here
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- #101
Im not talking about hrunting here, im talking about sabers jump, which is what the scene means here
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To play a bit of devil's advocate. Just note I still disagree.
Infinite speed would not scale to anyone. It is purely something Saber gets through a specific command spell. This would not scale to regular speed at all. On top of that, this wouldnt be attack speed, merely travel apeed. Saber would have "jumped" the entire distance in 0 seconds. This command spell does not include the attack.
Infinite speed would not scale to anyone. It is purely something Saber gets through a specific command spell. This would not scale to regular speed at all. On top of that, this wouldnt be attack speed, merely travel apeed. Saber would have "jumped" the entire distance in 0 seconds. This command spell does not include the attack.
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Saber still evidently needs time to reach Archer. Hrunting reaches Shirou first and gets blocked, then Saber cuts Archer
Edit: Actually, this entire sequence took 2 seconds
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the guy is explicitly arguing for infinite attack speed. and on top of not actually showing infinite travel speed as the other guy shows, this would massively break the stories considering masters could amp their Servants travel speed to search the entire planet in zero time to find the location of the other masters, appear right next to them and hit them while completely off guard with an attack at point blank among many other potential uses that just **** everything up.
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Imagine if this is how HGWs actually went. The moment someone summons a Servant they instantly use a command seal to make their speed infinite, having them kill every single potential Master in an instant
Wars would not happen if this was possible
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- #106
the distance traveled scales to mana it required a command spell + shirous mana for that scene.. also yes that still qualifies for infinite speed, since saber is still moving a finite distance in 0 time
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Shirou/Manjews mana sucks and it already did that much. and on top off that it's clear she did not travel in zero time. you could literally make her charge Excalibur in zero time. Kirei could use a command spell to make Cu charge Gae Bolg in zero time and so on. the uses are massive and would change how the wars are fought even if we do say distance traveled scales to mana. you could use a command spell to make a Servant instantly close the distance on a master in their field of view and at relatively close range to assure immediately victory. at least for the last two masters since you'd have a command spell left over.
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The lines immediately after are that the instant is the one between releasing bowstrings and the shot being fired.
I posted the scene in both english and japanese as proof. Nothing in it is infinite
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As I proved above, this is not the case in the slightest unless you are unable to distinguish hyperbole from fact. Moreover, command seals have finite mana, you cannot produce an infinite result with finite energy
And, as I said, Servants being able to achieve infinite speed would completely change how HGWs play out
TheKingStrategist13
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Toooooo be fair, this is fiction, what even would be the chances someone ACTUALLY thinks of doing that or even KNOW's they can do that? Usually with Infinite or Greater, crazy level's of speed being involved, there is a bit of Character Stupidity involved for not using it as well or as much as they could.
That said though, I'm mainly just here for the shit storm, prolly would disagree though. Heck, I'd argue there's prolly better arguments for infinite speed elsewhere, but that's neither here nor there.
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fiction does not give us an excuse to accept illogical things that break the story. and if Manjew as Shirou of all people thought of it, much older and smarter mages would have. Servants would also have this knowledge automatically and tell their masters.
and FYI 99% of fiction doesn't qualify for infinite speed. it's just given out like candy by battle boarders for no good reason. it's a type of speed that has to be handled carefully because it's incredibly easy to generate anti-feats.
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You literally cannot discuss anything without logic, there's no difference between arguing for something illogical and typing a random string of symbols, as they both add equally as much to the discussion in question
MaxLevel_King
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I disagree. The statement is simply flowery language at work and here's why;
1. While "in an instant" is used, it's followed up by "not even a fraction of a second", which implies that Saber is merely moving at an extremely fast speed beyond a fraction of a second, not infinite speed.
2. Shirou is a relatively normal human being. His narration shouldn't always be taken at face-value, especially in these cases. From his perspective, Saber really did jump to Archer's position in an instant because he perceives time like a normal human being would.
3. There are multiple servants faster than Saber who consistently move at only high Mach speeds.
4. Command spells are powerful, but they aren't omnipotent. There are certain things that are outside of their capabilities.
5. It's true that some servants are nerfed by their servant containers, but not all of them are. Among the servants that are nerfed, none of them had infinite speed in life. It was treated as a big deal when Romulus Qurinus, a Grand Servant with a container to match meant to oppose the Beast-Class, moved FTL against Chaos.
1. While "in an instant" is used, it's followed up by "not even a fraction of a second", which implies that Saber is merely moving at an extremely fast speed beyond a fraction of a second, not infinite speed.
2. Shirou is a relatively normal human being. His narration shouldn't always be taken at face-value, especially in these cases. From his perspective, Saber really did jump to Archer's position in an instant because he perceives time like a normal human being would.
3. There are multiple servants faster than Saber who consistently move at only high Mach speeds.
4. Command spells are powerful, but they aren't omnipotent. There are certain things that are outside of their capabilities.
5. It's true that some servants are nerfed by their servant containers, but not all of them are. Among the servants that are nerfed, none of them had infinite speed in life. It was treated as a big deal when Romulus Qurinus, a Grand Servant with a container to match meant to oppose the Beast-Class, moved FTL against Chaos.
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