Elder Evils CRT

[Qawsedf234]

So I've made some profiles for the Elder Evils

• Pandoyrm
• Dendar
• Atropus
• Zargo

This thread will downgrade Dendar from tier 2-A to 6-B/4-C. The reason is simple, Dendar is currently 2-A based on scaling to a Greater God, but the issue is that she's an Elder Evil. Elder Evils are canonically much weaker than Gods and are only capable of fighting them due to some unique anti-god powers (as shown here ). In other words there's nothing suggesting that she should scale to the AP of the Gods.

If anyone has any criticisms/questions post them here.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

Seems fine.

So Elder Evils are basically smurfs?

 

[Hl3_or_bust]

>Dendar goes from 2-A to tier 6

oof

also i agree

 

[Qawsedf234]

Yeah. They hard counter people with Divine Sparks or draw their powers from Gods. Its why Zargon could fodder an entire Pantheon of Gods but lose to a single Solar/Archdevil. Or why Dendar can cause fear in Gods but challenged by enough Devils/Demons/Angels.

 

[Udlmaster]

Definately interesting, that anti-God hax is interesting, and I wonder how it works and what it does to make 2-As vulnerable to 4-Cs.

The only thing I cannot place is where to put their AP, since in that screenshot it says that their power does little against Gods and their servents, which could mean a lot of things. (INB4 Weaker than lvl 1 Clerics).

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Zargon's regen should probably be bumped to Mid-Godly since he regenerated regardless of Archdevil!Asmodeus killing him- since beings on that level can reasonably kill other beings on their own level and whatnot.

Also, Udl, it's probably a very specific form of Durability Negation vs Holy enemies. Basically any profile with Holy Manipulation of 2-A and below might be sorta clusterfucked by these guys.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I put his Regenerationn at High-Mid since it comes from the horn which is seemingly unbreakable/2-C in durability. So it's not overpowering regen negation rather than regenerating from an object Asmodeus cannot physically damage.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Also, Udl, it's probably a very specific form of Durability Negation vs Holy enemies. Basically any profile with Holy Manipulation of 2-A and below might be sorta clusterfucked by these guys.

To add its durability negation mixed with speed negation, attack power negation, and it automatically drains or nullifies divine magic. So against an Elder Evil a god loses the majority of its speed, strength, durability, and special powers. Now it varies I guess since the Leviathan's thing brings them down to 5-B while Dendar's only brings them down to 4-C. But either way they're meant to equalize the power disparity between the two to the point where Gods are hesitant to directly intervene.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Bump

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Seems okay.

 

[Sigurd_Snake_in_The_Eye]

I agree, this seems to make sense to me.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Mind unlocking the Dendar profile then so the changes can be applied Matt?

 

[Assaltwaffle]

2-A to 6-B. One of the hardest drops in tier I've ever seen.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Yeah. Scaling reasoning was just misunderstood I think when the profile was made forever ago.

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

@Assaltwaffle He'll just be a smurf instead lol.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Okay I got everyone but Dendar. So once that's unlocked I can complete the CRT.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

situational smurf

Also still think Zargon should have Mid-Godly considering he's famed by gods for regenerating and they have Mid-Godly and can't overcome his stuff.

 

[Qawsedf234]

See the main issue I have with that is the same issue Dendar has. I don't know if his regen is Mid-Godly because they can't kill him or that they just can't effect the horn due to his Elder Evil powers. Now Asmodeus can't kill him either, but that was also explictly due to the horn being to durable for him to destroy. So I envision his regen being High-Mid but the source of said regen is a 2-C item that's basically unbreakable.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I mean

Archdevil killed him and his regen still worked too

Immortality Type 8 just explains his regen comes from a source, Mid-Godly is the level he can come back from

 

[Qawsedf234]

But that's because he comes from a horn that's beyond his capacity to destroy rather than pure regen. If others are fine would a "At least High-Mid, likely/possibly Mid-Godly" work?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Didn't see the edit. I don't think his existence is erased though, which is why I don't think Mid-Godly counts. Like if Asmodeus/A sphere of Annihilation hit the body the horn would still remain. To use another example, if Beerus erased everything but Cell's core that wouldn't give Cell Godly regen. Because the thing he regenerates from was left untouched by the attack.

That's how I view it. If I'm wrong and Mid-Godly is the correct one then you have my support to change it.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I mean

I guess it's fine

 

[Qawsedf234]

Okay all the changes are applied. Guess we just wait to see what other say about the Regenerationn thing

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

So


A high 6-A with 2-A power null?


Niiiice

 

[Qawsedf234]

I'll start working on the Abomination pages I guess

 

[Mr. Bambu]

If you want me to chip in I'm happy to.

Next page I wanna work on is Acererak from Tomb of Annihilation, tho.

 

[Qawsedf234]

The Demilich right? Dude is OP with all of the OHKO powers

 

[Udlmaster]

Remember in 3.5 when Demiliches were stronger than Normal Liches and were better in everyway and even had the extra lore value of: "The Lich said 'nah' to his mortal form."

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Yeah. Wasn't Acererak the guy that got the Atropal to start the death curse? Would we classify him as High 6-A or equivalent to a high-level encounter (meaning anywhere from 7-B to At least 6-B to High 6-B)?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Iirc Demiliches being a lesser form of Lich was a 5e retcon. Also going by the ELH a demilich is considered roughly as threatening as the low to mid tier Abominations. He even captured one in Atropus' lore background. Although considering Wizards have like, 2-A to High 2-A feats with enough prep it may not count.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Those may just be outliers. Tier 6 isn't really an outlier.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I don't think they're outliers, just indicative of a lot of prep. Multiple sources state that the more wizards and the more time you have to cast a spell the stronger you can make it.

However I do agree that a Demilich is probably Tier 6, or at least that particular Demilich since he has some high level empowering feats to my memory.

 

[Dragonstitch]

I do not know it is would be an outlier but 4e Acererak is a threat to epic teir characters with the demi-god destiny, so Acererak being High-6A makes sense to me.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Should Elder Evils have Corruption of some kind? We have statements of Father being able to corrupt other creatures with a touch and IIRC Ragnorra had similar statements.

Also Atropus should 100% have Energy Manipulation and Dimensional Travel since he abuses negative energy from the plane of negative energy plane. It'd be pretty beefy energy manip too since it inherently counteracts any living energy

 

[Qawsedf234]

I believe Zargon, Father Llymic, and Ragnorra have corruption statements. Atropus might count as well due to his sign which can corrupt worlds to have extremly negative unholy effects. Pandorym doesn't corrupt as much as mind break people with his extreme psionic power.

As for the Atropus powers, I think those make sense but it should be noted that it can't (or won't) travel to other dimensions. It just channels an extreme amount of those energies.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Pandorym is a bit of an odd one anyways.

Also you never added Power Nullification to Atropus lol.

I've started on Kezef the Chaos Hound's page

 

[Qawsedf234]

I gave Atropus power nullification under the Malefic Properties section. I gave others power nullification only if they have another power that did that, such as Greater Dispel.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I meant in their P&A sectio

 

[Qawsedf234]

Right, for the hound I'll get a passage from a story where he bites off a God's hand. After doing that, the god (forget his rank but I believe it was Greater) was incapable of regenerating it.

Also the P&A section also has a Malefic Properties sectio

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Tyr. The gods trapped him in a forcefield of raw magic in a challenge but Kezef demanded as insurance that Tyr place his hand in front of his mouth. After being trapped, he chewed the hand of Tyr off and feasted on it for hundreds of years.