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Dragon Ball Super Episode 123 Upgrades

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I mean there are enough evidence for Low 2-C Post-Kefla SSB Goku and anybody that scales now. Goku even states that after Jiren got serious his attacks hurt way more than anything he has ever faced which would most likely include even SS Berserker 2 Kefla. And even after this he was still able to just barely keep up with Jiren in SSB. And after he went SSBKKx20 alongside Vegeta with his new form they managed to gain the upper hand against Jiren who at this point is stated to be stronger than SS Berserker 2 Kefla.
 
Wait wouldn't SSJBKKX20 Goku be the only one getting Low 2-C apart from Vegeta? I mean he seemed to be relativistic to Vegeta's new form and helped him knock back Jiren.

Although if you guys think regular SSJB Goku should be Low 2-C then im fine with that.
 
Before we do any upgrades I'd like to wait until next week, by then the battle will be picking up speed.
 
i can agree to this cause Jiren seems to use more power than when he fought UIO it seems as stated. Goku got a lot of zenkai boost pushing his limits throughout the tournament so it makes sense his times 20 now is far stronger than initially against jiren the first time and Vegeta's new form gave him the needed boost to keep up with Jiren releasing more power than before.
 
@Super Saiyan God Julian

Well Post-Kefla SSB Goku was able to keep up with a causal Jiren and somewhat trade blows with a serious Jiren who's attacks were stated to be stronger than anything that has ever hit him before which most likely includes Kefla's attacks. So it is possible for him to be Low 2-C in SSB.
 
2:11 They say that Jiren hasn't been using his full strength in his fight with SSB Goku and Vegeta.

DBS EPISODE 123 FULL ENGLISH SUBBED HD - YouTube

Even in this state he's way stronger than Goku, smashing apart his destructo disks.

14:09 Belmod says he hasn't seen Jiren power up so much in a long time, Goku powers up and fights him, so Blue is stronger than Goku's UI now.

15:42 He did power up when surprising Goku, Belmod confirms this, and says "he's finally using a hint of his true power", Goku confirms this again at 16:42.

Jiren further powers up (Db characters can do it at FTE speed) fighting with both at the same time.
 
Goku still took Jiren's Consecutive Simple Punches while in base, which was stronger than Jiren fighting him the first time, or stronger then SSJ2 Berserk Kefla. But yeah, if SSBK20 Goku scales to Jiren, Blue Goku must also scale, it's a times 20 gap.
 
Jiren not powering up that much in such a long time implies that he's used even less power than original UIO Goku.
 
I think if we really need upgrades, Goku and Vegeta should be the only ones FOR NOW that get it.

Otherwise, Anilaza, Kefla and possibly 17 (I don't necessarily agree with this, though) could receive At least 3-A, possibly Low 2-C, to signify the closing of the gap.

Also, Akreious, that's not how the context was used, especially when right after, Goku says Jiren's attack was the strongest he had ever experienced from anyone.

Sometimes I don't think people even read the beginning clauses and arguments to these threads.
 
Bruh... It said " I haven't seen him use that much power in a while " which would mean that is superior to Ui Goku Omen. SSB Goku proceeded to stalemate that Jiren for awhile.
 
The gap between universe and U+ hasn't changed, just Goku and Vegeta's power gap between Jiren, so 17 doesn't need an upgrade.

Kefla's SS needs an upgrade due to being relative with the same Jiren who was stated to be stronger than Infinite Zamasu.
 
I've already addressed that the show and most fiction don't treat the distance between 3-A and Low 2-C as different, only this wiki does. Our rules don't apply to the rules of how they scale characters in the show.
 
Basically to sum it up if this upgrade goes through (Which it most likely will) than Low 2-C for Post-Kefla SSB Goku, New Form Vegeta, Anilaza and Android 17's Barrier. Only these four though nobody else scales.
 
Like said above, we can't enforce our "Universe and Universe+ are infinite in gap" when talking about DBS where there IS a finite gap between those tiers, so Goku and Vegeta powering up to that level isn't a stretch.

The theory that Goku retains some power after leaving UIO form is basically confirmed here, with normal SSB being able to stalemate a casual Jiren that's still stated to have used even more power than in his fight against UIO Goku. SSB Kaiokenx20 Goku got stomped easily before IIRC. I think this is enough evidence to give Vegeta and Goku "Likely Low 2-C" at the very least.
 
Fankid said:
Why Anilaza?
Click to expand...
He overpowered Post-Kefla SSB Goku, SSB Vegeta, Ultimate Gohan, Golden Frieza and Android 17 at the same time with an energy ball that was slowly growing in power.
 
I don't think they need a likely. I think being even a portion of Jiren's real power facilitates a straight Low 2-C. I would quicker support a likely or possibly rating for the other characters that people are saying should scale.
 
Goku did destroy Hit's pocket dimension while far weaker, so much so that his SSG form now surpassed his SSB form when doing so (which surpassed Blue x 10)
 
Well considering that DB is a pretty popular and controversial verse then they will probably be commenting soon.
 
The only reason I don't think this should be put off is that it already has been for several weeks now, and these discussions will continue to happen until a precedent is set.
 
I don't think they'll kill the thread. They didn't kill the other ones, they were just pushed down the line until more evidence presented itself, and the evidence finally has.
 
I think no one except Goku ssj blue and Vegeta Royal blue should scale from Jiren, because Goku clearly power up in the episode 122.
 
Personally, I'm fine with Goku and Vegeta getting Low 2-C as of now.
 
I agree. Others I think we should wait for, but there is enough demonstrable evidence to support Low 2-C Goku and Vegeta. Thus, Vegeta would gain a Low 2-C tier for his latest form, and Goku would get this: 3-A. Low 2-C after achieving Ultra Instinct | Low 2-C
 
Facts:

Base Goku could take Jiren's ki punches, as could blue.

Kaioken = x2 unless the multiplier is actually stated.

Royal SSB Vegeta is comparable to Kaioken SSB Goku (For now at least)

Statements:

Goku was never hit by such powerful attacks (Shame Kefla never hit Goku, but he gets stronger each time he achieves UIO, so he's > Kefla anyway)

Piccolo says Vegeta's energy is boundless (running theme, Kefla was stated to have limitless energy by Goku)

Jiren is still casual folks

He's also stronger than we've ever seen him now

Goku could keep up with him

Goku should be a Low 2-C profile. Vegeta should be Low 2-C in his Royal SSB form.
 
Also, it should be noted that their power isn't pushing Jiren at all, rather it's their uncoordinated, simultaneous attacks.
 
Agree with UMR. It makes sense that his base would be able to retain the upgrade from UI as well, as that was shown when achieved SSJG for the first time, as well.

So what you're suggesting is just making the second key TOP+? I was suggesting a 3-A. Low 2-C | Low 2-C due to UI being in its own range of power, but maybe the other way would be easier.
 
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