• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 100

Toyotaro just made it worse. Apparently not only Jiren can attack from 0 to 100 but Granolah , Broly and Moro as well who are among the worst Ki users in terms of ki control skill feats
 
Last edited:
SirAlex09 said:
Toyotaro just made it worse. Apparently not only Jiren can attack from 0 to 100 but Granolah , Broly and Moro as well who are among the worst Ki users in terms of ki control skill feats
Click to expand...
Granolah/Gas makes sense. The wish gave them things like an enhanced IT, a Hakai-like ability and so on. Them having Explosive Power isn't strange to me. I also did predict that Freeza would have gained something like it since he trained for 10 years so I'm not surprised by that either. Broly sounds weird due to his lack of emotional control but the LN does mention that Broly has limitless stamina no matter how much he attacks so it doesn't come completely out of nowhere.

The real problem here is Moro. That man never trained a day in his life and was dependent on copying abilities and absorbing energies. Where did he get that ability from? Is Vegeta referring to Moro post-Merus copy? It's the only thing that'd make any level of sense to me.
 
CryoTheMayo said:
Granolah/Gas makes sense. The wish gave them things like an enhanced IT, a Hakai-like ability and so on. Them having Explosive Power isn't strange to me. I also did predict that Freeza would have gained something like it since he trained for 10 years so I'm not surprised by that either. Broly sounds weird due to his lack of emotional control but the LN does mention that Broly has limitless stamina no matter how much he attacks so it doesn't come completely out of nowhere.

The real problem here is Moro. That man never trained a day in his life and was dependent on copying abilities and absorbing energies. Where did he get that ability from? Is Vegeta referring to Moro post-Merus copy? It's the only thing that'd make any level of sense to me.
Click to expand...
There are several problems with Granolah as well.

First: Goku says that Granolah has to lock onto vital points before attacking them which makes them predictable. Additionally Vegeta tells Granolah that his ki control sucks.

Gathering Ki on point during melee combat is a sign of great ki control. This kinda doesn't fit with Granolah.

Hit would have made more sense because he is all about skill and can fight them on even grounds despite the power difference.

Not to mention this contradicts Goku's development as a martial arts. Popo already taught Goku all the stuff that Toyotaro is forcing on them right now.
 
CryoTheMayo said:
Well to be fair, Vegeta doesn't mention Granolah. He only mentions Gas. So perhaps Granolah is just completely exempt and it's only Gas who would have the ability.
Click to expand...
Oh right. My bad. Just raged at something that didn't exist xD But Broly and Moro is weird af
 
SirAlex09 said:
Oh right. My bad. Just raged at something that didn't exist xD But Broly and Moro is weird af
Click to expand...
Nah I brought him up too because it just made sense that if Gas has it then Granolah would as well. It's just with the logic presented by you and Vegeta's omission that it clearly doesn't work like I thought. It's my bad.

I don't mind Broly exactly because the LN does sort of reference or foreshadow it and I'd just consider it a part of Broly's genius but Moro is just ridiculous as hell. The only time it would make sense is when he copies Merus but he explicitly couldn't wield his power properly and Vegeta never fights that version 1v1.
 
SirAlex09 said:
Not to mention this contradicts Goku's development as a martial arts. Popo already taught Goku all the stuff that Toyotaro is forcing on them right now.
Click to expand...
Popo only taught him to still the heart/mind to increase reaction speed, nothing is contradicted, he made this better than the movie, jiren isnt nerfed anymore, and the stupid goku forgetting meditation shit is gone
 
Oh yeah if Broly always had Explosive Power then that means he always had excellent Ki Control which justifies him not blowing up Earth when going berserk. That straight up confirms that he can instinctively control his Ki properly. Yeah that's obvious but I've seen plenty of people bring it up as an 'anti-feat' so it's nice to have hard evidence we can point to for why Broly didn't destroy the planet or universe.
 
TiltedFN said:
Popo only taught him to still the heart/mind to increase reaction speed, nothing is contradicted, he made this better than the movie, jiren isnt nerfed anymore, and the stupid goku forgetting meditation shit is gone
Click to expand...
It was more of an implicit lesson. When Tien and Goku fought in OG DB, Goku was relaxed while Tien was stiff and getting increasingly tired despite being stronger when Goku had his weights on.

But yeah on the other side you are right. No Jiren nerf which is on second thought much worse than this version
 
CryoTheMayo said:
Oh yeah if Broly always had Explosive Power then that means he always had excellent Ki Control which justifies him not blowing up Earth when going berserk. That straight up confirms that he can instinctively control his Ki properly. Yeah that's obvious but I've seen plenty of people bring it up as an 'anti-feat' so it's nice to have hard evidence we can point to for why Broly didn't destroy the planet or universe.
Click to expand...
Yah I think the whole " he did it instinctively cause he is a genius" kinda works for him
 
Something interesting is how Vegeta states he and Goku have hit their physical limits. I'm sure they'll be shattered eventually but given the current focus on Ki Control and techniques like UI and UE I'm thinking Toyo may be drifting away from raw power levels.

In theory if this physical limit remains then Freeza is already at the endgame because his raw power is already beyond Goku and Vegeta and he likely fully mastered his Explosive Power, he has maximum physical power and maximum power control. Although I'd argue mutants like Freeza and Broly would likely have higher physical limits so maybe they can push their raw baseline power further?

Either way I think this is foreshadowing that we're finally reaching, or are at, Angel-levels of power. The characters have peaked physically, it's all about mental and spiritual control now. Perhaps the next arc will actually give us our first Angel-level antagonist?
 
SirAlex09 said:
Toyotaro just made it worse. Apparently not only Jiren can attack from 0 to 100 but Granolah , Broly and Moro as well who are among the worst Ki users in terms of ki control skill feats
Click to expand...
Granolah was basically all ki control, bro was HIM. Broly was learning as he fought. Meanwhile, Moro was a wizard, and did magic on par with the best Kais.
 
Ok. Piccolo needs to be looked at for his 2-C reasonings:

“Was almost comparable to Frost, who in turn was almost comparable to Super Saiyan Goku”

Um iirc it was was that Piccolo only way of winning was charging his special beam cannon to max and wtf Frost was nowhere near as strong as SSJ Goku during the arc (got trashed around the entire fight) unless this is the manga ver and not toei

“higher with Special Beam Cannon (Pierced through both Pilina and Saonel in a single blast, making it far stronger than Ultimate Gohan's Kamehameha)”

….Wat? PIS is a thing y’all cause no all of a sudden Ultimate Gohan attack is weaker then Piccolo’s? let also not forget Gohan is already known to be WAY stronger then Piccolo so Nani the hell is all this?
 
BlackeJan said:
Wat? PIS is a thing y’all cause no all of a sudden Ultimate Gohan attack is weaker then Piccolo’s? let also not forget Gohan is already known to be WAY stronger then Piccolo so Nani the hell is all this?
Click to expand...
Uhhhh, Gohan charges Kamehameha in two seconds, so is not powerfull to complety overwhelm them.
And Picollo have been charging the Makankosappo for a while, so he should be able to gather enough energy to be more powerfull than Gohan attacks. And Picollo Makankosappo is usually much more powerfull than his base Power.
So Picollo with Makankosappo>>>Gohan>>>>>Picollo is not actually PIS.
 
Fezzih_007 said:
Uhhhh, Gohan charges Kamehameha in two seconds, so is not powerfull to complety overwhelm them.
And Picollo have been charging the Makankosappo for a while, so he should be able to gather enough energy to be more powerfull than Gohan attacks. And Picollo Makankosappo is usually much more powerfull than his base Power.
So Picollo with Makankosappo>>>Gohan>>>>>Picollo is not actually PIS.
Click to expand...
It’s most definitely is PIS. That’s like saying Krillin charging his kamehameha to max > Jiren who barely charged a ki blast. What type of logic is that?
 
BlackeJan said:
….Wat? PIS is a thing y’all cause no all of a sudden Ultimate Gohan attack is weaker then Piccolo’s? let also not forget Gohan is already known to be WAY stronger then Piccolo so Nani the hell is all this?
Click to expand...
SBC is cracked AF, it multiplied his power level by like 3 in the Raditz saga.
 
BlackeJan said:
It’s most definitely is PIS. That’s like saying Krillin charging his kamehameha to max > Jiren who barely charged a ki blast. What type of logic is that?
Click to expand...
Ok First, the difference between Gohan and Picollo is not that big.
Second:
Fezzih_007 said:
Makankosappo is usually much more powerfull than his base Power.
Click to expand...
Scans
Raditz is way more powerfull than Picollo, and Makankosappo could Pierce him regardless.
 
When King Piccolo killed Goku and made sure his "heart stopped beating", why did it start beating again just 3 panels later after Yajirobe put his ear to his chest?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

RedReaper616
  • Locked
God Ki Stuff, Buu Stamina, and Android Thing
Replies
30
Views
3K
SwordLegendz01
SwordLegendz01
Ednaxel2
Dragon Ball: Updates (Planet Vegeta Re-Calc, DBS Manga Downgrade)
3 4 5
Replies
164
Views
9K
Damage3245
Damage3245
BOEGVELD
Uncontroversial Goku CRT (hopefully)
Replies
34
Views
3K
AwkguyDB
AwkguyDB
ProudLearner
Quick Ability Replacement | Son Goku (DB, Toei, DBGT, and Xeno)
Replies
16
Views
4K
OblivionCiffer2202
OblivionCiffer2202
That_moron2
Minor Ki Manipulation Change
Replies
8
Views
704
Emerald
Emerald
Back
Top