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Donquixote Doflamingo vs Kurama (Kyübi)

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Yeah I think that's why they're getting downgraded to their previous ratings.

Yes, that's the problem. 30 days is too much of a stretch. The highest I've heard for One Piece is Akainu and Aokiji fighting for some days. Five days, I think? I also don't think Kurama would be unable to even muster a shockwave, casual Bijuudama or any meaningful action throughout the entire span of a month.
 
I don't know, Doflamingo is more than cruel enough to wound Kurama to the point where basic functions may be too hard. Restraining him may be out of the question given the time-frame, but Doflamingo holding him long enough to cause severe damage to Kurama (Thread powers... so many creative torture methods). Lower tier regen can only do so much, and Kurama can be put in a state that leaves him unable to fight for more than a month.

I doubt casual attacks from Kurama would do anything significant to Doflamingo even if they can hit him (which would be hard to accomplish due to Doflamingo's Precognition, and pseudo-barriers).

BTW, i'm having trouble finding the blog regarding the Regenerationn for Kurama. There's a lot of Naruto stuff i'm seeing.
 
But like I've said before, he cannot wound Kurama or cause damage to that extent, he has taken attacks from characters stronger than Doflamingo and is not particularly weak to cutting attacks. He would have to do what you're suggesting continuously for a whole month without Kurama fighting back. Doflamingo will also succumb to basic human needs and weaknesses, even if we say he can survive for days. Speaking of which, aren't Akainu and Aokiji superior to Doflamingo? For Kurama to be able to take attacks stronger than what Doflamingo has to offer and only express brief pain before going back to his normal activities, he has to have considerable endurance. Despite all the punishment he's taken from those superior characters, he doesn't have a scratch to show for it. I doubt Doflamingo can do all this to him.

Actually, I never said they would do anything crippling to him. Precognition should only matter for stuff like Kurama trying to impale him. It doesn't help against AoE except Doflamingo wants to hightail it out of there.

Check Gwyn's profile and click on his blog. View the calculations with Project Naruto. I can't remember the exact chapter. Okay, never mind.
 
@Omimi - thank you. That would've taken me 15 hours to find >_>. The difference between High-Low and Low-Mid Regenerationn seems negligible to me. I believe that we need to visit that topic

This may be me just being salty, but Doflamingo only has Mid-Low Regenerationn (it is not actual Regenerationn, but still) despite taking this nonsense, which destroyed his organs, which Doflamingo confirms, and then using his threads to repair the damage. He was on the border of death in the previous page before suddenly being just fine. While he did not actually "heal" those injuries, he did stop himself from dying and could continue fighting, and was still fine after being KO'd and chained up with Sea-stone.

I strayed off topic, but it still does not seem that Kurama has displayed Regenerationn of a level that would keep him from being permanently damaged from attacks that Doflamingo can use.
 
@Burning - But Doflamingo can damage Kurama with his AP, unless we're still saying that Prime Kurama should be listed as Low 6-B due to scaling above 50% Kurama, as that would make Kurama close to 2x Doflamingo's tier if we're saying that Gyuki > CT core.

If that's the case, should I use 50% or Prime?
 
EoS 50% Kurama beats doffy as he is much more skilled combat wise thanks to his experience close to naruto.

Prime Kurama is just a brute.
 
But 50% is drastically weaker and more manageable for Doffy to handle, and if Prime Kurama is indeed technically Small Country level, that may be too much for Doffy, unless i'm mistaken.
 
Lol, Kurama has always been that knowledgeable and wise, it does not make sense to believe that Kurama learned everything he knows about fights and got all the intelligence he has in the 17 years he was with Naruto of which 12 spent or sleeping or Watching as Naruto was clowning around. That superficial disqualification of the Complete Kurama leads nowhere dude.
 
Any clue about Kurama being anything elsw than a brute combat wise prior to meeting naruto? He has been described as a mass of hatred and destruction...
 
Shit is getting real messy here. If Doffy is able to 'destroy' Kurama, ie, reduce him to just chakra trying to reform, then it will count as a win; this process of reforming is implied (I believe) to take at the minimum of months, if not years or centuries. (Is based off the fact that people are usually like 'even when destroyed, they will come back eventually' on tailed beasts).

Kurama will easily outlast Doffy in terms of stamina; even when Naruto drew out most if not all of his chakra (when obtaining 9-tailed mode), Kurama still managed to pull out a huge tailed beast bomb - and this was 1/2 of Kurama. There have also been multiple times showing even when Kurama's expended all of his available chakra, he can pull together more given a few moments. (shown when Naruto's battling vs edo Madara I believe or obito)

While it's never been shown that Kurama can regen due to Kurama never being shown to be 'hurt', based off other tailed beasts (namely the 8-tails), it is reasonable to say that they can be hurt and probably can regen. Time needed is unknown, you're gonna have to look it up yourselves; all I know was that this was shown when Sasuke and his new team tried to capture Hachibi? (8 tails) and its jinjuriki (host, Killer Bee). TDLR/Spoilers, all they got was a octo tentacle transformed into a clone.

Even earlier, a previous raikage was shown to have managed to fight the 8-tails to a standstill; his finger spear was famous for having incredible penetration power (inb4 sex jokes).

Any other concerns here that I might be able to shed light on?
 
If prime kurama was even wise, he wouldn't be defeated by madara *before powerup*?..If he was wise he would had close his eye against Madara after all hes smart right? I mean he already seen the power of Hagomoro and hes descendant..why cant he be smart fighting against Madara? pretty sure he isn't smarter than Gai who manage to find a way how to counter Sharingan user by not looking at their eyes.

Prime Kurama has no host, He would not be able to control hes chakra due to hes size. That why hes Physical strength wasnt even able to break the chain of weakened kushina and that kurama was already unsealed from kushina..

Prime Kurama was never even island level. It did not even destroy the island, best Prime Kurama did was destroy the shore and Mountain. The only Island level Prime Kurama ever showed was after merging with Perfect Susanoo.
 
Oh yeah, Naruto/Kurama's regen.

They are two seperate things.

It's been noted and explained early on that Naruto has a habit of healing off even heavy wounds (lots of cuts, bruises, exaustion - both physical and chakra) over a night's good rest, this was attributed to the Kyubi sealed withi. Hell, once as a kid Naruto stabbed himself with a Kunai, swearing to protect an old bridge builder. When Kakashi inspected the wound shortly after, it was shown to either be healing or already had stopped bleeding (I forgot which).

The only viable way to guesstimate at Kurama's own regen is either consider the rate he can gather chakra (quite fast, see above post) by looking at case studies of other tailed beasts (in particular 8-tails, see above again) because Kurama has never been shown to have sustained physical injuries. Whenever he's full physical, Kurama's usually shown either being mind-controlled via genjitsu or being sealed away.

You gotta feel bad for the guy, especially seeing how 8-tails has so much more freedom.
 
1.) Only reason you see Kurama was never injured because you see only Kurama Chakra and not hes actual body in all fight with exception of flashback of Madara vs Shodaime.

2.) Prime kurama was injured after fighting against Shodaime..Otherwise he would regenerate right away after taking beating from that Buddha punches?

3.) Again you have no proof that prime kurama can regen fast. Its different from being without a jinkurichi. If you look at 8th tail before having a host, he was fighting toe to toe with 3rd Raikage.

4.) Kyuubi cannot Toe to Toe with Hashirama. a Madara EMS + Perfect Susanoo merge with prime kyuubi could not even win against Senjutsu Hashirama.. Kyuubi alone definiately cant win. Senjutsu Hashirama isnt even going to win against Law.

Each String of Doffy was capable of blocking Issho and Law attack. I mean a clone of Doffy was capable of defeating Law.
 
CinCameron20 said:
@Dariel - Knowledgeable and wise? He was never shown as anything like that.
Click to expand...

Actually always was, in the Fourth Ninja War you can see is his facet. As I said, believing that Kurama was like this because of being with Naruto does not make sense, Kurama has hundreds of years of life, is not a gross creature as you want to show here, in fact no Bijuu is.
 
Yet they were all outsmarted and captured by the Akatsuki one-by-one. And the point you brought up was after he spent years with Naruto. Okay~
 
The intelligence is debatable and might be attributed to CIS/PIS, depending on the viewpoint. History might tell the Kyubi that humans are bad and thus avoiding conflict / running away is the best solution, but years of being mistreated and used made it hate humans. Humans usually view the tailed beasts as weapons, not as the intelligent individuals that they are, The arguement could be either for or against.

The same can more or less be said about Doffy, however, who's a mentally unstable individual.

That being said, Kurama's far older than Doffy, and stands a fair chance of outfoxing him.

Will also point out that the tailed beasts mainly use raw power when attacking/defending; that's why Jinjuriki with total mastery is always better than than the tailed beast alone due to being far more flexible. So even with superior intelligence, Kurama's moveset is still far more limited compared to Doffy and his strings.

Kurapicas, please don't wank.

A reminder that the bodies of the tailed beasts are unique and thus probably have different injury/regen rates.

Edit: CinCameron20, you also shouldn't wank.
 
CinCameron20 said:
Yet they were all outsmarted and captured by the Akatsuki one-by-one. And the point you brought up was after he spent years with Naruto. Okay~
Click to expand...
To clarify: years after being seperated from 10-tails, the tailed beasts had grown distant; thus making the one-by-one tactic viable - and besides, not many people liked jinjuriki. Their disappearance was seen as something to be celebrated, not mourned, and it wasn't like the tailed beasts would listen to human news in the first place.

A point was made that the tailed beasts were always sentient, intelligent creatures from the moment they came into existence; it was just that years of being mistreated and used as weapons made them misanthropic. The few jinjuriki that managed to befriend their tailed beast found that they were quite likable; Killer Bee and later Naruto being prime examples.
 
Based on current stat listings, Doffy has the advantage, especially with the multiple uses of his string. This is not a vote, just the facts.
 
CinCameron20 said:
Yet they were all outsmarted and captured by the Akatsuki one-by-one. And the point you brought up was after he spent years with Naruto. Okay~
Click to expand...

Nope, your statement is wrong, actually almost totally wrong. The Akatsuki barely caught some Bijuus and if they did it was in special conditions. They did not catch Shukaku trapped Gaara, Hidan and Kakuzu fought a miniature version of Matatabi and apparently only won thanks to the Hidan ritual, Deidara caught Isobu by a back attack. Of the rest Akatsuki no fought with any Bijuu but with his Jinchuriki. And in fact, several Akatsuki are stronger than Law or Doffy, I would not really say anything if they really had been captured by Akatsuki, but that's not the case.
 
@Dariel - Several Akatsuki stronger than Doffy and Law? Looking at events before the fourth ninja war, almost all of them are around tier 7-C if not even lower while Pain applied a feat of 635 GT. Doffy still tops that and Law has hax. (I'm still trying to come to terms with Itachi being 8-C)
 
@Many of them have that tier by mistake since I've seen a lot of mistaken calculations of their exploits, a clear example Deidara whose C0 is categorized as City Level absurdly when it is a feat that goes around the Large Island Level or Small Country Level and Deidara does not even fit into the 5 most powerful Akatsuki. Itachi, Obito and Nagato would be able to defeat either of them two, you speak of hax but as far as hax Law and Doffy are very far from them three. Then put Law and Doffy against Konan's explosive paper ocean or Kisame's ability to steal energy. The 5 that I mentioned are far from the power of Prime Kurama and even more of Madara and Hashirama, the power of the Narutoverse that they currently place here is quite far from reality, that is why a wave of revisions comes this summer about it.
 
Dariel Senju said:
@Many of them have that tier by mistake since I've seen a lot of mistaken calculations of their exploits, a clear example Deidara whose C0 is categorized as City Level absurdly when it is a feat that goes around the Large Island Level or Small Country Level and Deidara does not even fit into the 5 most powerful Akatsuki. Itachi, Obito and Nagato would be able to defeat either of them two, you speak of hax but as far as hax Law and Doffy are very far from them three. Then put Law and Doffy against Konan's explosive paper ocean or Kisame's ability to steal energy. The 5 that I mentioned are far from the power of Prime Kurama and even more of Madara and Hashirama, the power of the Narutoverse that they currently place here is quite far from reality, that is why a wave of revisions comes this summer about it.
Click to expand...


Then make a revision about them. The calc doesn't mean much if it's not accepted, hell if we are just using any calcs i could find one that placed Doffy at continent level with sub rel reactions and combat speed but that's not the case.
 
Knightofannihilation666 said:
Dariel Senju said:
@Many of them have that tier by mistake since I've seen a lot of mistaken calculations of their exploits, a clear example Deidara whose C0 is categorized as City Level absurdly when it is a feat that goes around the Large Island Level or Small Country Level and Deidara does not even fit into the 5 most powerful Akatsuki. Itachi, Obito and Nagato would be able to defeat either of them two, you speak of hax but as far as hax Law and Doffy are very far from them three. Then put Law and Doffy against Konan's explosive paper ocean or Kisame's ability to steal energy. The 5 that I mentioned are far from the power of Prime Kurama and even more of Madara and Hashirama, the power of the Narutoverse that they currently place here is quite far from reality, that is why a wave of revisions comes this summer about it.
Click to expand...
Then make a revision about them. The calc doesn't mean much if it's not accepted, hell if we are just using any calcs i could find one that placed Doffy at continent level with sub rel reactions and combat speed but that's not the case.
Click to expand...

Of course you are right, obviously relying on a tier put superficially that does not correspond with reality does not mean much that is what saying above, say that Doffy and Law are stronger than the Bijuus that were never caught by Akatsuki that Supposedly they are City Level according to the accepted calculations is a mistake because as well as out there there are extravagant calculations that are not have been approved there are also approved calculations that are a joke and based on that does not make sense.
 
Sorry, I can not repeat that Deidara's C0 is City Level when I checked myself just because someone thought it was like that. However you are right, we continue with Doflamingo vs. Kurama that is the central theme of this versus and we do not deviate on the other hand, excuse me if I introduced a topic that had nothing to do.
 
It's been close to 2 days since the last vote, so I've requested this to be placed as Inconclusive.
 
I vote for Kurama on this. His energy bomb spamming, much greater size and physical attributes, and stamina (able to gather natural energy extremely quickly) would let him outlast and overpower Doflamingo. Doffy's versatile string abilities aren't enough to let him keep up with the 9-Tails.
 
Read the op it says both 'in character, Kurama in character doesn't spam bombs and even if he did doff can tank the weak ones and dodge the powerful ones as it will take Kurama some time to charge the powerful ones and Doffy can just strike Kurama while he's charging them causing him to trip up.

Kurama's stamina is great but spamming his most powerful attack over and over trying to hit Doffy someone who won't waste much energy trying to dodge them. Kurama will eventually run out of chakra.
 
I was under the impression that Kurama could always use Senjutsu. Him being able to absorb nature chakra while Naruto is fighting didn't strike me as something he picked up when Naruto learned Senjutsu. It just seems to be one of his abilities.

Doflamingo has great speed and mobility, but even he can't keep dodging Kurama's attacks forever.

Half of Kurama in Naruto was able to rapidly charge an attack that contributed halfway towards this explosion: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-zcFQEiNUB...fNlQiWbvaoi8NhY3LF3U8QCHM/s16000/0572-002.png

A whole Kurama should produce the same explosion size just as rapidly.
 
@Damage - that attack is High 7-A. Doflamingo doesn't have to dodge if he can bring up barriers at the flip of his wrist.
 
Doflamingo's barriers may be suitable for deflecting a physical attack like a punch or a meteor but I doubt they would work against an energy attack like an exploding Tailed Beast Bomb.
 
His singular strings no but a large group bundled together should. Also if the small biju bomb was just as strong as a charged one then there would be no reason for him to charge them. That's like saying a quick ki blast is as strong as a charged ki blast.

Doffy should be able to dodge as long as he wants since it won't take much effort at all.
 
I don't see how he would be able to dodge them with minimal effort. His speed isn't good enough for dodging something with the size of the explosion that I posted above.
 
It's almost as if Doflamingo has never covered a large distance in a short period of time despite being caught off-guard.
 
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