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Introductio
Hello. The vast majority of you have probably already seen the group of threads that ended re-upgrading Devil May Cry's God-Tiers to 3-A. This is not a thread made with the intention to downgrade them back to any lower rating, nor to upgrade them any further. My contention here is that the last thread on this subject was concluded with the assumption that there were only one or two feats on the 3-A level in the Devil May Cry franchise; both relating to Argosax, whose feat of merging the Human World and the Demon World together landed him in 3-A and scaled everyone else in the verse.
However, I believe that our claim that this is the only feat on that level in the franchise is false. Just to make this clear right off the bat, I will NOT' be dealing with the feat of Mundus creating a dimension that has been alleged as universal by Kamiya - because I think this wiki is so fed up with this topic having been brought up by previous posters not willing to defend it that a different decision on its authenticity is likely impossible - , but a set of different feats that I think are severely mishandled in the wiki. Let's start with the longest, loftiest ones and go down from there.
The Feats
Conclusion
With all I wrote above taken into account, I personally conclude that, in total, Devil May Cry has 8 3-A feats that can be safely scaled from.
Hello. The vast majority of you have probably already seen the group of threads that ended re-upgrading Devil May Cry's God-Tiers to 3-A. This is not a thread made with the intention to downgrade them back to any lower rating, nor to upgrade them any further. My contention here is that the last thread on this subject was concluded with the assumption that there were only one or two feats on the 3-A level in the Devil May Cry franchise; both relating to Argosax, whose feat of merging the Human World and the Demon World together landed him in 3-A and scaled everyone else in the verse.
However, I believe that our claim that this is the only feat on that level in the franchise is false. Just to make this clear right off the bat, I will NOT' be dealing with the feat of Mundus creating a dimension that has been alleged as universal by Kamiya - because I think this wiki is so fed up with this topic having been brought up by previous posters not willing to defend it that a different decision on its authenticity is likely impossible - , but a set of different feats that I think are severely mishandled in the wiki. Let's start with the longest, loftiest ones and go down from there.
The Feats
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1: The Legendary Conflict Everyone who follows DMC knows of the basic lore that sets the scene for the series. Mundus, wanting to govern the Human World and the Demon World as one, prepares to unite them together. Just as humanity is about to fall from Demon assault, Sparda, siding with humanity, appears and then proceeds to defeat and seal Mundus, before going on to separate the Human World and the Demon World, and then sealing the latter to prevent such an event from ever occurring again. Under the interpretation I will propose, this would entail on two separate Universal feats already. One feat attributed to Mundus, for merging the Human World and the Demon World together, and Sparda, for separating them again and then sealing the Demon World. And there are plenty of scans that support my point of view strongly, but before I go on to mention those scans, I have to address the arguments that have been put forth against the feat specifically on the original Devil May Cry downgrade thread, by our excellent Matthew Schroeder. In order to make this easier, I will divide this in two sections - one where I will analyze the counter-arguments proposed against the feat, and one where I will give my own analysis, dissecting the feat with scans. Analysis of the Counter Arguments Our currently accepted theory for the invasion of the Human World is that Mundus and the Devil Army used the Temen-ni-Gru, a huge tower in the Human World serving as a gateway to the Demon World, in order to traverse between both worlds and invade the Human World. Under this point of view then, Mundus would have utilized this portal before being beaten by Sparda and sealed. Sparda's feat would be less of a literal universal separation, but more of Sparda merely sealing a portal. Are the scans used to justify this satisfying? Take a look yourself. > Twenty years ago, Mundus the emperor of the underworld resurrected. (...) His powers were sealed by Sparda, he's attempting to take control of the human world again. He has been preparing to open the gate on Mallet Island." The scan above is the first to be presented in this thread, being a quote from Trish on Devil May Cry 1, recounting that Mundus's powers had been sealed by Sparda and that's he attempting to take control of the Human World, preparing to open the gate on Mallet Island. Notice any discrepancies with this scan? If we are supposed to justify Mundus's usage of the Temen-ni-Gru, then the very first scan already fails on a basic technical level, as the Temen-ni-Gru, as a tower, had been sealed underground by Sparda, and was not located on Mallet Island, thus making it impossible for Mundus to try to emerge into the Human World by using such a gate; a gate that we, as the player, see being opened with our eyes at the end of the game, when Mundus rips it open and emerges from it in order to try to fight Dante one last time, having decidedly nothing to do with a huge tower located far from Mallet Island and sealed underground. Therefore, this scan actually succeeds in demolishing the argument it is trying to support right away. Mundus using the Temen ni Gru for travel can be safely dismissed based on the above. Not only that, an important point and distinction to be made here is the fact that the Temen ni Gru was built by humans who worshipped demons and wanted their power.. It was not built by demons, nor controlled by them, and thus can't possibly fit in the label of a portal opened or created by Mundus himself 2,000 years ago. Not only that, the Temen ni Gru is not the only portal connecting the Human World and the Demon World on the Devil May Cry franchise, nor the only one which had been sealed by Sparda. On Devil May Cry 4, we're introduced to the Hell Gate at Fortuna Island, a gate sealed using Yamato, also by Sparda himself. We have, aside from Fortuna's Hell Gate, the portal that Arius opens with his ritual, in order to travel to the Demon World, unseal Argosax and absorb his energy, and etcetera. So the Temen ni Gru is far from the only gate between the two worlds in the series. One might then say that my points above would still suggest that Mundus was going to use another portal to dominate the Human World and that it still debunks him merging the Human World and the Demon World in the literal sense, but this too is false. Note again that Trish immediately notes that Mundus's powers were sealed by Sparda, as anyone who has played the game can discern. Mundus was sealed by a magical vault, unable to do anything but send projections of himself to the Human World or soldiers. Mundus only recovers his full power and is fully unsealed at the end of the game, when he breaks out of the vault surrounding him and emerges from the statue into his Godly Form. Continuing further: > "Long ago, in ancient times, a demon rebelled against his own kind for the sake of the human race. With his sword, he shut the portal to the demonic realm and sealed the evil entity off from our human world."' This line could be indeed referring to either the Temen ni Gru or the Hell Gate on Fortuna Island, both of which were sealed using swords owned by Sparda, or many other portals that Sparda himself sealed. The point is, lines like this by themselves do not prove that much regarding Mundus requiring those portals, specifically, to travel by himself while his power is unsealed. All of those are merely general statements about Sparda sealing a portal after defeating and sealing Mundus - and they don't actually serve as evidence against a literal union of the two worlds, since, under the assumption the feat would take a little bit of time, then Mundus's minions using portals or other means to travel to the Human World while the feat isn't completed makes perfect sense. In fact, this is the exact same thing that happens on Devil May Cry 2, with the Devil Army taking advantage of the fact that the Demon World is steadily approaching the Human World to open rifts leading into the Human World with more ease. But, tell me, even if Mundus did need portals to travel around, how would that disprove him to be a Reality Warper capable of merging universes? The only way anyone, be their Attack Potency 8-C or 2-C or higher, could travel between universes would be with cross-dimensional Teleportation, something that Mundus hasn't shown (or might have shown, depending on your interpretation of the infamous DMC1 fight), or by the usage portals, and in fact, one could expect that a character capable of dimensional merging would be far more likely to use portals to travel between these two dimensions since they could open those rifts quite easily by themselves with the usage of their Reality Warping. Why the Feat(s) are Valid Having put up my reasoning for why the scans used against this feat aren't valid, I will now present to you the many scans I obtained during my long research while making this thread, which are the reason why I do believe the feat involves a literal merging of the two worlds and Sparda then separating them by himself. First of all, we have the official Lore for Mundus on the canon Devil May Cry 1 guidebook, which mentions, among other things, Mundus planning to break through the veil separating both worlds, uniting them together: And, once again, the Devil May Cry 3 manga, recounting the same event, tells us of Mundus's plan, with added context, since the previous page tells us about how the Human World came into existence, being born from the energy of the Demon World, and then being separated from it a long, long time ago (something I will talk about later), with Mundus wanting to undo the separation and rule them as one again:
Let's use a more recent scan, from the Devil May Cry 5 History itself. Sparda defeats Mundus, and seals the Demon World off. Then we are told the following: So, the seal Sparda placed on the Underworld is starting to weaken, and, as a result, Mundus sends his minions after Sparda's wife, or, as described in the DMC1 guidebook, he dispatches them into our own reality. If this "seal" were merely the Temen ni Gru or the Hell Gate, or any other human-made portal, then it would make absolutely no sense for Mundus to be able to send his minions into our own reality, as both of those portals are still sealed on DMC3 and DMC1's campaign, and, in fact, the Temen ni Gru was still completely sealed when Mundus first sent his minions after Sparda, with Arkham only starting to reopen it after the event where Dante loses his closer family. History of DMC only continues further: This statement completely removes any chance of the seal talked about here being the Temen-ni-Gru or any other portal. Arkham and Vergil unsealed and opened the Temen-ni-Gru in order to obtain Sparda's power for themselves. When Arkham fulfilled his goal and obtained a fraction of Sparda's power, the Temen-ni-Gru had already been unsealed and opened. If said "seal on the Underworld" referred to the Temen-ni-Gru, then why would obtaining Sparda's power weake the Temen-ni-Gru's seal, when Sparda's power was only obtained after it had already been unsealed? This statement cements that said seal is a literal seal encasing the Underworld, instead of being a mere portal that Sparda closed. Rather, the Temen-ni-Gru, and all other portals we see in the series, are actually portals that Sparda sealed after separating the Demon World and sealing it off, in order to prevent the remnants of Mundus's army and other rogue Demons to use the opportunity born out of the ingenuity and lack of knowledge of the human worshippers to travel between both worlds. Touching on what I said earlier, among other things that should be common sense when you take this topic into account is the following contention:
The Devil May Cry 5: Before the Nightmare novel [prntscr.com/nek9op has a passage mentioning that rifts leading directly into the Demon World appear frequently on small port cities, such as Dumary Island and Fortuna Island, due to the barrier separating the worlds being at its weakest there] - this being most likely a result of the seal itself losing strength overall. This is, once again, completely inconsistent with Sparda only taking his time to seal the Temen-ni-Gru and the Hell Gate, as those are specific portals, while it is consistent with the interpretation that Sparda sealed the entire Demon World away, in order to prevent demons from passing into our world at any given point in the Demon World, and with this seal slowly losing strength, it resulting on rifts opening randomly on random locations. It also mentions an interesting tidbit - when Demons enter the Human World, they transfer their consciousness to another body. If they want to enter the Human World with their true powers and bodies, then the portal needs to be massive and stable enough to handle them. The Devil May Cry 2 guidebook recounts the lore once again on Mundus's plans to invade the Human World through Mallet Island on Devil May Cry 1. It reveals to us that Mundus dispatched his lieutenants to prepare a portal for him so he could pass through, something that had already been implied heavily by both the game itself and the DMC1 guidebook: Let's recall the passage on the Devil May Cry 5 history video regarding the seal: And then, let's take another excerpt of the screenshotted I posted earlier, regarding Mundus on the DMC1 guidebook: Taking all lore information we've listed so far together, then we can easily come up with how and why Mundus planned to use the gateway on Mallet Island to return. Mundus and the rest of the Demon World were sealed by Sparda. With the seal weakening, Mundus manages to send minions to the Human World personally, due to them and other lower Demons being sufficiently lower in energy in comparison to himself that they could phase through the cracks in the seal. Mundus himself, however, is still affected by seal, and would be unable to emerge on the Human World by himself or to use his powers. Thus, he sends his lieutenants to prepare a gate that is large enough and stable enough to support his passage through, as Sparda's seal on him and the rest of the Demon World at large continues to weaken. Mundus's situation can be compared to Argosax's situation on Devil May Cry 2. Upon the unsealing of the Arcana, Argosax's seal starts to weaken, which is why the Demon World and the Human World begin to merge with each other. Then Arius's final ritual manages to unseal Argosax and opens a portal connecting the Human World and the Demon World, large enough that he may pass through, absorb Argosax's power and return (due to him messing up the ritual, the portal ends up being unstable, but you get the point). The final nail on the coffin in this subject is Devil May Cry 5 itself, specifically when it talks about the Qliphoth's lore and how it functions, which blatantly reveals to us what happened to prevent the Qliphoth from ever bearing fruit again: So, the Qliphoth uses human blood in order to produce its fruits. Mundus consumes one of the fruits and rises to become the King of the Demon World. Sparda defeats him, and separates the Human World and the Demon World, making the tree never bear fruit again. Then, the seal on the Demon World is shattered, leading to the tree appearing on the surface and starting to produce another fruit. We know that, in the context of DMC5, the border refers to the seal that Sparda placed, due to the Before the Nightmare novel implying as much. In conclusion, this leads to two new feats:
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2: After the Battle with Mundus The next one I will propose is a feat displayed after Dante beats Mundus, and after the infamous "dimension" scene. It is much shorter and straightforward, so I will deal with it all in the same section Upon Mundus's defeat at Dante's hands, the Demon World begins to collapse. This is shown not only by our own eyesight, but it is also stated to happening by both the DMC1 Bradygames guidebook, and by the DMC4 Prima guidebook, both of which have heavy input from the developer team. The main counterpoint that some people use against this feat is the fact that the Demon World is fine and intact in other games. However, the Demon World was collapsing while a weakened and dying Mundus tried to drag himself off the ground, but Mundus did not die - Dante sealed him just after he escaped the Demon World, which would have prevented it from collapsing. Sparda also sealed Mundus away back in their legendary battle, which is why the Underworld still existed after Mundus's demise. Another counter that some people use against the legitimacy of this feat (including our very own Matthew) is the fact that Kamiya rejected its legitimacy on Twitter. However, Kamiya was only involved with the creation of Devil May Cry 1, and after that, Itsuno took the series's reins. Therefore, Kamiya has no authority to reject information given to us on Devil May Cry 4, and his word here is automatically discarded by default. Since this would showcase Mundus as being able to stabilize and maintain the existence universe that is much larger in size than our own passively, it is by default a '''3-A''' feat. |
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3: Alternate Universe This is a feat from Void Mundus that, as far as I'm aware, hasn't been noticed and has never been discussed yet, from the Volume 2 novel. In the novel, Mundus is shown to be the embodiment of a void. Said void explodes upon his death. The void that Void Mundus embodied was stated to be the nexus of all of the demonic energy in the Underworld, as well as its heart, with it intensifying extremely the more Dante and co. approached it. The reason why this feat is impressive is because the demonic energy contained within the Underworld has two 3-A feats in and out of itself. The first one is the fact that our universe was created from the dark energy contained in the Demon World. The second is the fact that, down the line, the Demon World's energy was distorting our universe upon its approach by Argosax's hands on Devil May Cry 2. To exemplify that the two concepts are the same, it is mentioned in the novels that the demonic energy in the air could drive people insane, the same concept that was mentioned in the DMC2 guidebook, which stated that the dark energy of the Demon World "warps the minds of men" So, bottom line is - Void Mundus's death explodes a void that is described as the nexus of the demonic energy contained within the Demon World, the same energy that has two separate 3-A feats. |
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4: Creation of the Universe This one is widely known already. On the Devil May Cry 3 manga intro, the narrator tells us of how the universe was conceived. It recounts what I said earlier about the Demon World's dark energy birthing our universe, the Human World, before noting that, eventually, the Demon World and the Human World were split in two. Now, the demon who performs the feat of initially separating the worlds is unknown, but Devil May Cry 1 gives us a hint, recounting an old prophecy about a demon called Pluto coming on the promised date, to separate Heaven and Earth:
Now, Pluto is indicated to be Mundus, since he is betrayed by someone with "black wings of treachery", a likely reference to Sparda, whose design is well-known for his black wings, and who betrayed Mundus and defeated him for the sake of mankind. However, Mundus's goal is to merge the two worlds, not separate them, so there is something missing here. Using both the DMC3 manga and the DMC1 guidebook, we can reach a conclusion ourselves. Given the importance of names and titles in the Devil May Cry franchise, Pluto might not be a name, but a title instead. "Pluto", in fact, is a title for the King of the Underworld in Ancient Mythology. The DMC1 guidebook tells us that Mundus grew an army and killed the former God of Evil (ie. the former Demon King) before planning to merge the two worlds. The DMC3 manga intro tells us that, some unspecified time after the separation between the Human World and the Demon World, Mundus rose up and, knowing of the fact that they were once one, planned to reunite them. Therefore, with all of this, we can conclude the following possibilities:
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With all I wrote above taken into account, I personally conclude that, in total, Devil May Cry has 8 3-A feats that can be safely scaled from.
- Argosax merging the two worlds
- Argosax's death undoing the merger between the two worlds
- Mundus merging the two worlds
- Sparda separating the two worlds and sealing the Demon World
- Mundus's defeat leading to the Demon World almost collapsing
- Void Mundus's defeat leading to the destruction of a void that is the nexus of all the dark energy within the Underworld, with said energy having 2 3-A feats to scale from
- The original separation of the universe listed in the DMC3 manga intro, performed by a character that would scale to the known God-Tiers
