• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

DC upgrade 1A, likely H1A

Status
Not open for further replies.
Let's separate the cosmology but without reducing respect for other writers and make it logical according to the dc storyline.

So at first it was just darkness, then light appeared and gave birth to creation. [here]
Darkness itself is great darkness, light is the overvoid [original presence, original source, true god [god beyond the gods].
The original presence, ordered the hands race as the creator of the multiverse, the first hands race to create the multiverse was perpetua. [Here] [Here] [Here]
In the 6th dimension, Perpetua created the multiverse with connecting energy provided directly by the aspect of presence, namely the invisible hand.[Here] [Here] [Here]
It was from this energy that the first multiverse was formed. The Multiverse is not just a collection of infinite universes, but rather the entire creation from the 5th dimension to the 1st dimension.[Here] [Here]

Dimensions in DC are applied differently, 6 plane of dc
[Here] [Here]
The first dimension contains 0 dimensions
The 2nd dimension contains 1 dimension and 2 dimensions
The 3rd dimension contains the material of space and time in infinite layers.
The 4th dimension is not the physical realm, but the metaphysical realm. [Contains bleed, sphere of the gods, monitor sphere, etc.] [Here] [Here] and [Here]
The 5th dimension is imagination itself, the creator's imagination, the blood that flows throughout the 4th dimensional map.
The 6th dimension is the realm of creation monitors.
[Here]

My explanation about Yahweh's creation and the 5th dimension has 2 variants below ↓


The gods in the sphere of the gods are formed by the minds of living beings

I dispute yahweh as the creator of the dc omniverse here ↓

Gods are formed by beliefs/archetypes↓

Again, Mr. Mxy said that the multiverse map is 4 dimensional and the 5th dimension exists throughout realms, not bleed. If it was really bleed, he would say that the 5th dimension in the bleed. Moreover, expressed as the blood that flows throughout the realms, the 5th dimension will cover the map with its dimensional existence. [Here] [Here]

The original presence entered the multiverse in the form of an avatar to monitor creation, he had many aspects like Yahweh.

The presence itself manifests itself in the form of an avatar using the power of connective energy originating from itself, waiting for living creatures to form their avatars in the multiverse.
[Here] [Here]
[Here] [Here] [Here] [Here]

Gods are created by human thoughts and gods exist. Avatar The source exists because god believes in him and he exists. But the original form of the source is the overvoid, the form of god in the multiverse was originally raw material/connective energy. This means they are shaped by beliefs.

To combine cosmology, just what is applied in comics is enough. Namely the greater multiverse/divine continuum.[Here] [Here] [Here]
The divine coontinum is a place that contains the omniverse [multiverse, dark multiverse, sphere of the gods] and hypertime [limbo, vashising point].

the multiverse is separate from the greater omniverse
[Here] [Here] [Here]
The form of multiverse
that sphere is the greater multiverse/divine continuum.↑

Multiverse/omniverse in the void
The multiverse drifts in the 6th dimension to an unknown place↑

The hand race was created by the original presence to create its own multiverse.
The multiverse has an infinite number of separate creations. In the greater omniverse, there is an infinite multiverse.
Here the writers are free to create their own stories freely
[Infinite multiverse/infinite omniverse]
Greater omniverse with infinite multiverse within.
[Perpetua multiverse separated from other multiverses by the source wall]

•With so many authors in DC comics and various stories and not participating in the main dc such as infinite crisis, we can separate them based on omniverse/greater multiverse.
Because DC writers are not just Scott, Morrison, Dmatheis. So respect other writers.

The First Omniverse corresponding to DC's first creation, Perpetua.
Writers who took part in the first omniverse story, such as Scott, Grant Morrison, must be separated from other writers/stories who did not take part in the main story. Because the story is different from other omniverses

The Second Omniverse, Matheis has its own omniverse, where the mahapralaya precedes the creator and it is stated that the presence is a god who surpasses the gods.
Not all omniverses implement monitor nil, from overwhelming evidence.
Note: The monitor nil is only the main/main omniverse in DC [Here]
[Bleed in Mattheis' story is different from the main omniverse, so just separate it based on omniverse].
[Here]

The Third Omniverse is Mike Carey vertigo, where Yahweh[avatar of the original presence] seems to have a different cosmology from DC Main, Lucifer has a scar on his face.

The 4th Omniverse
Lucifer
/the dreaming universe [black label] It has a different story, where the sphere of the gods is starving for worshippers, causing the realm of the gods in the 4th omniverse to experience a different story than before.
Even Lucifer here doesn't have a scar on his face.

Main DC has different versions of Lucifer, but still Lucifer is just one creature in The Hand's creation, doesn't make him any more powerful.
The presence is present throughout the multiverses/omniverse by manifesting himself in the form of avatars such as smile, yahweh, the presence and others.

separating cosmologies based on the omniverse makes sense, because it is impossible for 1 realm in the sphere of the gods to have several different variants, except for the avatar.
Cause there is only one god [Singular in the infinite universes].
The gods exist outside the orrery, outside the bleed and speed force. [Here]
So, there is no unified cosmology, only separate cosmologies based on the Omniverse/Greater Multiverse/Divine Coontinum.

DIMENSIONAL SPACE

•DC has 2 fifth dimensions, called the dimensions of space and time/mathematics and the dimension which is the energy throughout the realm of the multiverse.

•DC has 11 or more higher spatial dimensions. [Here]

•DC has infinite layers of dimensions, a world beyond the worlds..beyond worlds [Here] and the databook says that the microverse has infinite higher dimensions [Here we go].

Btw, Bleed is void space, not a spatial dimension, bleed is the substance of the story. Physical dimensions only exist on earth. Each Earth has its Own multiverse.
[Earth-2 = Multiverse-2] and below this about the bleed is void.
[Here] [Here] [Here] [Here].

SCALING TIERING:
•Third Dimension [material]
Infinite higher dimension [H1B]

•Four Dimensions
Bleed [L1A]
Sphere of the gods [1A]
Monitor sphere [1A 2x abovebaseline]

•Fifth Dimension [1A 3x abovebaseline].

•Sixth Dimension [1A 4x abovebaseline]
•Overvoid/The Great darksness [likely 1A 5x abovebaseline].

SCALING TIERING PART 2:
Because the metaphysical dimension also has layers, dreams within dreams, dreams that are more real
Where it is said that every layer of reality has a spiritual realm. However, the spiritual/dream realm transcends the material realm completely.
Making it 1A+ because there are an infinite number of physical realms. [Here]

•H1A sphere of the gods because this hierarchical layer is within the sphere of the gods.
•Monitor nil [H1A 2x above baseline]
•Fifth Dimension [H1A 3x above baseline].
•Sixth Dimension [H1A 4x above baseline].
•The overvoid/TGD [likely 5x above baseline].

Since the metaphysical realm has a layers above the normal realm in the sphere of the gods, we will discuss it together in a general discussion.

Agree DC 1A:
Disagree DC 1A:

Agree DC H1A:
Disagree DC H1A:
 
I made an update based on a DC story, so I don't need a link about DC's cosmology division. Here I put it together in a different way
 
The first dimension contains 0 dimensions
The 2nd dimension contains 1 dimension and 2 dimensions
The 3rd dimension contains the material of space and time in infinite layers.
The 4th dimension is not the physical realm, but the metaphysical realm.
This really doesn't make any sense at all.

The first dimension is just the first spatial dimension. The second is the second, the third is the third. The third dimension doesn't contain time or "infinite layers" and the fourth dimension is explicitly just time, and the fifth dimension is imagination.

Anyways, for various reasons that have been discussed in the many many other attempts at upgrading the cosmology, I do not agree. I am beginning to think we will need a discussion rule for this.
 
This really doesn't make any sense at all.

The first dimension is just the first spatial dimension. The second is the second, the third is the third. The third dimension doesn't contain time or "infinite layers" and the fourth dimension is explicitly just time, and the fifth dimension is imagination.

Anyways, for various reasons that have been discussed in the many many other attempts at upgrading the cosmology, I do not agree. I am beginning to think we will need a discussion rule for this.
Can't you digest the story? the first dimension in dc is the point, the normal point is 0 dimension, think again
 
It was explained in Infinite Frontier that the Empty Hand saw of the carcass of Multiverse-2 also known as the Pre-Crisis Multiverse. Each Earth does not “contain” a Multiverse.
 
I don't agree with the dimensions part. I do no mind for a 1-A Great Darkness and Overvoid for the Crisis Cosmology, but not without concrete proofs.
Doesn't that make sense? The first dimension is a point, points in the real world are dimension 0. and the 3rd dimension is material. materials also have higher dimensions, plus the explanation of the 4th dimension is metaphysical. For me it should be like this
 
The scan said the first dimension is a point, the second dimension is a line, the third is matter. Snyder almost certainly made a minor mistake there, and meant to say the first dimension is a line, the second dimension is a plane. Given the progression follows the natural geometric progression of dimensionality his intentions, IMO, were very clear.
 
Doesn't that make sense? The first dimension is a point, points in the real world are dimension 0. and the 3rd dimension is material. materials also have higher dimensions, plus the explanation of the 4th dimension is metaphysical. For me it should be like this
There’s no arbitrary rule that states the 3rd dimension especially a spatial one is “material.” Sure, you can use a very uncanny reasoning because the DCU isn’t science savvy but that’s kinda stretching the realm of logic just to strengthen your OP.
 
It was explained in Infinite Frontier that the Empty Hand saw of the carcass of Multiverse-2 also known as the Pre-Crisis Multiverse. Each Earth does not “contain” a Multiverse.
Indeed. Each Earth produces infinite timelines but does not contain them as their own type of multiverse. The Pre-Crisis Multiverse was existing separately from the New 52 Multiverse with barriers as boundaries.
 
A discussion rule might be a good idea at this point, yes. Let Elizio33 and all of his collaborators take their time to investigate proper scaling for the DC Comics cosmology in private instead. 🙏

Should we close this thread?
 
I really think you guys should read more threads and try to do what they do in terms of what is more likely to convince others on this wiki, and in terms of a good structuring of the OP itself.

For example, this quote down here is asserts something that changes a pretty big perception of what the Fifth Dimension is. It is not justified

DC has 2 fifth dimensions, called the dimensions of space and time/mathematics and the dimension which is the energy throughout the realm of the multiverse.
Another example. OPs generally don't just link to arguments that one made somewhere in a thread.

Unless that is something accepted, you can then link to where it was accepted and progress with your arguments.

I dispute yahweh as the creator of the dc omniverse here ↓
Gods are formed by beliefs/archetypes↓
 
A discussion rule might be a good idea at this point, yes. Let Elizio33 and all of his collaborators take their time to investigate proper scaling for the DC Comics cosmology in private instead. 🙏

Should we close this thread?
Isn't my way the best?
 
Indeed. Each Earth produces infinite timelines but does not contain them as their own type of multiverse. The Pre-Crisis Multiverse was existing separately from the New 52 Multiverse with barriers as boundaries.
I mean like this bro 1 omniverse contains infinite multiverse[earth] without boundaries, and there are other omniverses outside the source walls
 
Very humble question. We needn’t to question that type of modesty.
The problem is only in the dimensional layer which is not a dimension in general but a layer of existence, the first dimension is dimension 0, there is no dimension 0 layer in those 6 layers, only 1, 2, 3 and so on.
 
I mean like this bro 1 omniverse contains infinite multiverse[earth] without boundaries, and there are other omniverses outside the source walls
No? An Omniverse does contain infinite Multiverses but those “multiverses” are not interchangeably with Earth. Firstly, that doesn’t even make sense and the Omniverse in question is talking about Metal depiction of the Greater Omniverse/Overvoid. The expanding Orrery was pointing out that each Earth from a Multiverse is expanding in branches that creates a sort of “Omniverse.”
 
No? An Omniverse does contain infinite Multiverses but those “multiverses” are not interchangeably with Earth. Firstly, that doesn’t even make sense and the Omniverse in question is talking about Metal depiction of the Greater Omniverse/Overvoid. The expanding Orrery was pointing out that each Earth from a Multiverse is expanding in branches that creates a sort of “Omniverse.”
You misunderstood, 1 omniverse/hypertime contains infinite earths/multiverse. Outside the 6th dimension there is another omniverse with hypertime and multiverse, read my thread. You can read it yourself
 
The problem is only in the dimensional layer which is not a dimension in general but a layer of existence, the first dimension is dimension 0, there is no dimension 0 layer in those 6 layers, only 1, 2, 3 and so on.
There’s no “layers” in the aforementioned “dimensions.” Not with how Snyder intended each one to be. Now the Multiverse is layered with dimensions and separated after the 4th which leads to two levels of reality: Fifth Dimension and Sixth Dimension.
 
You misunderstood, 1 omniverse/hypertime contains infinite earths/multiverse. Outside the 6th dimension there is another omniverse with hypertime and multiverse, read my thread. You can read it yourself
1. It’s not stated one Omniverse(Orrery without boundaries) contains an infinite Multiverse. If you’re talking about Flashpoint, it literally adhere to the main Multiverse as a subsection of an all encompassing space called an Omniverse.

2. The Greater Omniverse does have infinite Multiverse but they weren’t used interchangeably with Earths. The Last 52 is symbolic not an actual mention of how Earth’s are a Multiverse.
 
There’s no “layers” in the aforementioned “dimensions.” Not with how Snyder intended each one to be. Now the Multiverse is layered with dimensions and separated after the 4th which leads to two levels of reality: Fifth Dimension and Sixth Dimension.
But Mr Mxy said that if the multiverse map is 4 dimensional, bleed is seen in 4 dimensions which is not spatial. Material has infinite higher spatial dimensions. mr mxy says, look!! There are several dimensions around you
 
1. It’s not stated one Omniverse(Orrery without boundaries) contains an infinite Multiverse. If you’re talking about Flashpoint, it literally adhere to the main Multiverse as a subsection of an all encompassing space called an Omniverse.

2. The Greater Omniverse does have infinite Multiverse but they weren’t used interchangeably with Earths. The Last 52 is symbolic not an actual mention of how Earth’s are a Multiverse.
Infinite earths, Infinite earths, Earth in the dark crisis on infinite earth event, the creator of the earth became infinite.
Perpetua's initial creation was said to have a countless multiverse in it, based on the databook
 

Dimensional Space​

•DC has 11 or more higher spatial dimensions. [Here]
Energy, mass, and volume are scalar quantities, which means they have no dimensioned value, and can be applied and permeate through all spatial dimensional axes. In other words, higher dimensions need qualitative superiority to qualify as higher infinities, and the fact that higher dimensions are constructed from uncountably infinite slices of lower ones doesn't mean higher dimensions require infinitely more power to affect inherently. To quote Ultima:

For contrast, DontTalk's construction ultimately involved the positions of each universe in 5-dimensional space being represented by a discrete set with a countable number of elements, namely {1, 2, 3, 4, 5... 12}, which, when taken as an element of the cartesian product representing an n-dimensional object, would have a size of size of 0 in the fifth dimension, since, as explained in here, constructing higher-dimensional objects requires cartesian products between continuous sets, which have uncountably-many elements instead.
•DC has infinite layers of dimensions, a world beyond the worlds..beyond worlds [Here]
Uh... are these not just parallel universes?
and the databook says that the microverse has infinite higher dimensions [Here we go].
No, it states that the microverse is an "infinite higher-dimensional region," which is different from "a higher infinite-dimensional region." At best, this means the Microverse is a significantly large dimensional space for holding infinite higher dimensional size.

Metaphysical Realms​

Because the metaphysical dimension also has layers, dreams within dreams, dreams that are more real
Where it is said that every layer of reality has a spiritual realm. However, the spiritual/dream realm transcends the material realm completely.
Making it 1A+ because there are an infinite number of physical realms. [Here]
Weren't all of these scans rejected here and here? You are not providing new evidence or responding to counterpoints in this post, so I feel like it's disorganized to push repeated topics like this.
A discussion rule might be a good idea at this point, yes. Let Elizio33 and all of his collaborators take their time to investigate proper scaling for the DC Comics cosmology in private instead. 🙏

Should we close this thread?
Begging you man... please do it.
 

Dimensional Space​


Energy, mass, and volume are scalar quantities, which means they have no dimensioned value, and can be applied and permeate through all spatial dimensional axes. In other words, higher dimensions need qualitative superiority to qualify as higher infinities, and the fact that higher dimensions are constructed from uncountably infinite slices of lower ones doesn't mean higher dimensions require infinitely more power to affect inherently. To quote Ultima:

For contrast, DontTalk's construction ultimately involved the positions of each universe in 5-dimensional space being represented by a discrete set with a countable number of elements, namely {1, 2, 3, 4, 5... 12}, which, when taken as an element of the cartesian product representing an n-dimensional object, would have a size of size of 0 in the fifth dimension, since, as explained in here, constructing higher-dimensional objects requires cartesian products between continuous sets, which have uncountably-many elements instead.

Uh... are these not just parallel universes?

No, it states that the microverse is an "infinite higher-dimensional region," which is different from "a higher infinite-dimensional region." At best, this means the Microverse is a significantly large dimensional space for holding infinite higher dimensional size.

Metaphysical Realms​


Weren't all of these scans rejected here and here? You are not providing new evidence or responding to counterpoints in this post, so I feel like it's disorganized to push repeated topics like this.

Begging you man... please do it.
Since when does the infinite higher dimension work like that? Marvel has that too
Here

Metaphysics is rejected because it is not a physical dimension, stop being like a child
 

Multiverse-2/Earth 2 in 52 orrery of worlds.
The proof is clear Perpetua's creation first produced countless multiverses [do you know about Perpetua's creation?] also there was multiverse 2 in the 52 orrery of worlds when empty hands destroyed it
It’s Orrery of 52 Worlds not that there are 52 orrerys’. Perpetua at the time only for my eh structure of the coming Multiverse. She made clear that World Forger made the worlds which amounted to 52 again after Infinite Crisis and Zero Hour.

Multiverse-2 was a previous Multiverse. How would a single world contain something that has finite/infinite amount of worlds? Again no that Multiverse was it’s own. Earth-2 is not Multiverse-2.
 
It’s Orrery of 52 Worlds not that there are 52 orrerys’. Perpetua at the time only for my eh structure of the coming Multiverse. She made clear that World Forger made the worlds which amounted to 52 again after Infinite Crisis and Zero Hour.

Multiverse-2 was a previous Multiverse. How would a single world contain something that has finite/infinite amount of worlds? Again no that Multiverse was it’s own. Earth-2 is not Multiverse-2.
Do you think DC only has 52 multiverses? Earth 1 and 2 have different heroes, different shapes and Earth has infinite parallels/reflections of themselves

Read multiversity Guidebook
 
Do you think DC only has 52 multiverses? Earth 1 and 2 have different heroes, different shapes and Earth has infinite parallels/reflections of themselves
A parallel universes is not a Multiverse. It’s one hero from one Universe, not one hero of infinite variants because of infinite parallels in a Multiverse. All 52 worlds are contained within the Orrery which is contained within one Multiverse.
Read multiversity Guidebook
I have and several times at that!
 
A parallel universes is not a Multiverse. It’s one hero from one Universe, not one hero of infinite variants because of infinite parallels in a Multiverse. All 52 worlds are contained within the Orrery which is contained within one Multiverse.

I have and several times at that!
OK, but what about the 1A dc upgrade?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top