- 3,267
- 1,094
Well?
Can we go ahead and apply everything now?
Can we go ahead and apply everything now?
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So far all we had was derailing other things that were supposed to be brought up in the og thread, like whether or not some feats are fineIf there's no large pushback against the ratings we could. But afaik we still have enough to sort some stuff out.
Or at least Firestorm wants to make a comment about it.
Could you unlock pages for post crisis and post flashpoint Barry and Wally? There seems to be no contention for the Speedsters and I've already applied for the villain speedsters.If there's no large pushback against the ratings we could. But afaik we still have enough to sort some stuff out.
Or at least Firestorm wants to make a comment about it.
They're unlocked.Could you unlock pages for post crisis and post flashpoint Barry and Wally? There seems to be no contention for the Speedsters and I've already applied for the villain speedsters.
While my initial post is still being updated as I go along, can those available address my current list of comments.If there's no large pushback against the ratings we could. But afaik we still have enough to sort some stuff out.
Or at least Firestorm wants to make a comment about it.
Driq and Flodo performed the galaxy feat together I'm fairly sure1
Will eventually go over the entire sandbox.
It was not Driq who performed the alleged feat. It was Flodo Span.
Additionally, I argued in the previous feats thread that the feat was not really physical.
2
According to the prior thread, you agreed with my sentiment that:
The scaling chain would be better described as:
3
I have concerns regarding scaling Pre-Absorption Superman to Darkseid. Following the Action Comics Vol 1 #586 encounter, the writers have since depicted that Darkseid is actually stronger than the Pre-Absorption Era Superman.
- Action Comics Vol 1 #586 | March 1987
- According to Darkseid, Superman’s unlocked power is weaker than his.
- Darkseid sends out omega beams with the intent to wipe Superman out in one blast. Superman guides the beams into Darkseid, resulting in a bright pink aura. Superman didn’t expect Darkseid to survive. Darkseid is still hurt by his full-power Omega Beams
- Darkseid fires his Omega Beams with the intent to kill at Superman, resulting in a dimmer Red Aura. This does not kill Superman. Darkseid says his Omega Force is spent, not at full power. Instead, he alters his current Omega Beams to attack Superman’s molecules.
- Superman resists and punches Darkseid a few times.
- Darkseid says that Superman won a fair fight.
- Action Comics Vol 1 #638 | February 1989 | The Power Within
- Darkseid incapacitates Superman with a single, casual blast. One casual blast left Superman on the ground, too weak to even try stopping Darkseid from leaving.
- Darkseid calls himself True Power in comparison to Superman.
- Cosmic Odyssey Vol 1 #1 | December 1989
- On New Genesis, Darkseid easily bats away Superman.
- New Gods Vol 3 #15 | April 1990
- It's retconned that Superman fought Desaad disguised as Darkseid back in Action Comics Vol 1 #586
4
We're using a space cop statement to scale how strong Mongul was about 10 years prior?
- Superman Vol. 2 #32, June 1989
- Mongul and Superman fight twice.
- In round 1, Superman says that even at peak power, he's not sure he could defeat Mongul.
- Superman wins round 2.
- Hardcore Station Vol. 1 #5, November 1998
- A recording of Hardcore's police band officer Dolly, says that Mongul and Darkseid are in the same League.
5
For Orion, you have the following justification for Low Multiverse level
Isn't this a 3-A to Low 2-C feat for his peak power?
On another note, Orion should have a Varies Rating.
6
Sorry, but who is Titus and why is this scaled to Low Multiverse level in relation to Martian Manhunter?
7
The justification for scaling Superman to Hank Hall Monarch seems lacking. Here's a summary of their interaction:
It very much seems that Hank Hall Monarch is much more powerful in comparison for any proper scaling.
- Monarch zaps Superman
- Superman punches Monarch.
- Monarch tanks Superman's heat vision.
- Monarch incapacitates Superman, Guy Gardner, Martian Manhunter, Mon-El, Waverider, and more.
I'm actually seconding Firestorms opinion here. There seems to be only one instance of Superman overpowering Darkseid pre-Absorption -- and even that was a weakened Darkseid.3
I have concerns regarding scaling Pre-Absorption Superman to Darkseid. Following the Action Comics Vol 1 #586 encounter, the writers have since depicted that Darkseid is actually stronger than the Pre-Absorption Era Superman.
Firestorm has a list of concerns we are waiting to go over.Didn't we already accept most of these changes? What is left to do here?
Didn't we already accept most of these changes? What is left to do here?
Well, let's take a look at that.It was not Driq who performed the alleged feat. It was Flodo Span.
I'm not sure where this reading comes from. What we see is that when Driq is outside of Flodo, a green construct forms, seemingly what the text on Driq's ring pulling a form together refers to, and this construct is present when the Galaxy is contracting, as well as contracting alongside. I'm not sure why restricting Flodo would restore his sanity if the cause is that he's merged with the whole sector, as he would still be merged with it, and take up that space until he has contracted. The more sensible reading is that Driq restricts and contracts Flodo Span, and with that, Flodo regains sanity.Like MadGod, Flodo Span went mad with his omniscience, but when Driq's body was scattered across the cosmos, Driq's power ring pulled the dead Green Lantern's form together and also constricted Flodo Span, restoring the Green Lantern's sanity. The Green Lantern had compressed it into a ball.
Despite this argument, the feat was still largely accepted. Any discussion on those feats should either be handled later or in private rather then derailing this thread.Additionally, I argued in the previous feats thread that the feat was not really physical.
I'm not sure why both can't be true at the same time, as in, Krona is both getting their power and scales to them beforehand, but true, it could be phrased better to note of both.The proposed scaling here relies less upon Krona getting power from the entities, but that Krona was already as powerful as the entities to begin with.
This is already accounted for in the current drafts:Atrocitus Tier 2 Peak (Via Butcher Encounter) < Krona (Feels pain from Atrocitus' Napalm breath and bite to his neck) < Peak Hal (Blew through Krona's chest)
defeated Krona[204], who had the power of the Emotional Entities[205], even when neither Atrocitus[206] nor the Guardians of the Universe could[207]
Untrue.I have concerns regarding scaling Pre-Absorption Superman to Darkseid. Following the Action Comics Vol 1 #586 encounter, the writers have since depicted that Darkseid is actually stronger than the Pre-Absorption Era Superman.
Darkseid's statement isn't all too relevant in my opinion. He's quite the arrogant character and considering the later events of the comic, I wouldn't value the statement much. Superman straight up beats Darkseid an admitted fair fight, as you note.
- Action Comics Vol 1 #586 | March 1987
- According to Darkseid, Superman’s unlocked power is weaker than his.
- Darkseid sends out omega beams with the intent to wipe Superman out in one blast. Superman guides the beams into Darkseid, resulting in a bright pink aura. Superman didn’t expect Darkseid to survive. Darkseid is still hurt by his full-power Omega Beams
- Darkseid fires his Omega Beams with the intent to kill at Superman, resulting in a dimmer Red Aura. This does not kill Superman. Darkseid says his Omega Force is spent, not at full power. Instead, he alters his current Omega Beams to attack Superman’s molecules.
- Superman resists and punches Darkseid a few times.
- Darkseid says that Superman won a fair fight.
This is out of context. Leading up to this, Superman gets noticeably battle damaged, and then has to stop Darkseid's machine, which was explicitly a great cost to him.
- Action Comics Vol 1 #638 | February 1989 | The Power Within
- Darkseid incapacitates Superman with a single, casual blast. One casual blast left Superman on the ground, too weak to even try stopping Darkseid from leaving.
- Darkseid calls himself True Power in comparison to Superman.
And despite this, Superman is still ready and confident to continue.
- Cosmic Odyssey Vol 1 #1 | December 1989
- On New Genesis, Darkseid easily bats away Superman.
This is literally impossible. Darkseid banished Desaad to Skartaris during the Legends #4, with this directly leading in to the arc with Superman. DC seems to maintain it being Darkseid as well, including it in a Superman vs Darkseid compilation described by their website as battles with the Dark Lord of Apokolips. This scan, which isn't even explicit in what it's referring to, is very weak in comparison to this.
- New Gods Vol 3 #15 | April 1990
- It's retconned that Superman fought Desaad disguised as Darkseid back in Action Comics Vol 1 #586
Starfire comes to the same conclusion Rann-Thanagar: Holy War #4, and it's not just one space cop, but a consensus between them.
We're using a space cop statement to scale how strong Mongul was about 10 years prior?
- Superman Vol. 2 #32, June 1989
- Mongul and Superman fight twice.
- In round 1, Superman says that even at peak power, he's not sure he could defeat Mongul.
- Superman wins round 2.
- Hardcore Station Vol. 1 #5, November 1998
- A recording of Hardcore's police band officer Dolly, says that Mongul and Darkseid are in the same League.
That is part of his justification alongside his scaling to Darkseid and others. A 2-C character performing a 3-A or Low 2-C feat can be a supporting feat in their justification.For Orion, you have the following justification for Low Multiverse level
Isn't this a 3-A to Low 2-C feat for his peak power?
Why so?On another note, Orion should have a Varies Rating.
A character who shows up between JLA: Classified #50 and #54.Sorry, but who is Titus and why is this scaled to Low Multiverse level in relation to Martian Manhunter?
Superman scaling to Hank Hall Monarch was already accepted on the prior thread, so I don't want to get too deep into this topic, but just to restate the reason he scales, it's because he took an attack from him, staggered him while pulling his punch, shattered his armor (Armageddon #2), and was stated to be capable of defeating him (Adventures of Superman Annual #3). I'm also unaware how you came to the conclusion that Superman was incapacitated, while we do see him get blasted back, he is not among the characters Monarch restrains, nor is he shown to be damaged from the blast.The justification for scaling Superman to Hank Hall Monarch seems lacking. Here's a summary of their interaction:
It very much seems that Hank Hall Monarch is much more powerful in comparison for any proper scaling.
- Monarch zaps Superman
- Superman punches Monarch.
- Monarch tanks Superman's heat vision.
- Monarch incapacitates Superman, Guy Gardner, Martian Manhunter, Mon-El, Waverider, and more.
Yes. The plan is to get he dudes on the drafts over and done with first, as they're the main basis for scaling.Also, question for Emirp, is the plan that once the discussion for the characters who currently have drafts is over, we can start covering characters like Wonder Woman, Martian Manhunter, etc?
After we're done with all of this. We are planning to handle New 52 at some point. Those guys might probably stay the same or receive big downgrades.When will New 52 profiles be revamped?
I guess.Are we waiting for Firestorm's reply, or did Ehnk cover everything well enough that we can move on with the upgrades for the rest of the characters?
Which one is it?I guess.
Latter, didn't clarify my bad.Which one is it?
Gotcha.Latter, didn't clarify my bad.
E2B called dibs on Hal and the Superman profiles fyiGotcha.
If you're too busy, I actually wouldn't mind setting in the upgrades for Post-Crisis' profile at least.
SureWould I be okay to update both Darkseid and Captain Marvel's profiles?
How do I citate references again?Sure
ig, but you don't need to citate anything, just copy and pasteHow do I citate references again?
Like the miniature [480] on Marvel's profile?
I have handled it. Tell us here when you are done.Done.
Darkseid's profile needs to be unlocked.
Pre Crisis would scale off Earth Two and the Anti Monitor.Tbh isn’t there a dozens of universe statement for Pre-Crisis Superman and those who scale
Wouldn't Pre-Crisis Superman scale off preventing the destruction of all possible futures?Pre Crisis would scale off Earth Two and the Anti Monitor.